WAMT....what annoyed me today!

ancient_mariner said:
Your hatred of faith has blinded you to your selfishness and demand for personal satisfaction regardless of the cost to others.
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Without pretending to speak for John, I think what he complains about is the hypocrisy of many "believers".

All religions, with the possible exception of some tribal groups, claim to promote kindness and care for one another. Unfortunately, the actions of many adherents, most obviously the leadership, are at odds with that claim. The reality is that most faiths have promoted or at least, supported, vicious and gendocidal violence, The two most obvious culprits have been Christianity and Islam, although even Bhudists have got in on the act from time to time. In America, Christianity now seems to stand entirely for the burning cross and the oppression of women. :(

This does not mean that there are no decent people among them; I have met several from all faiths. Unfortunately, such people are almost always modest and unwilling to call their religious fellows to account. I have sometimes wondered whether the solution is for all religions to demand that their followers be their leaders' keepers, rather than follow blindly.
 
JohnC6 said:
21st century secular Britain..
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As an aside, according to all the complaints, on the local FB news hub, the local taxi's are adding at least £2 per journey, because its Ramadan month.
( the Muslim community seem to have gained something of a monopoly in that service)
 
I have some friends who are religious which is rare now. They do not understand their own religion, related history or humanity. They seriously said to my wife and I, as you are non-believers, what is holding your back, why do you not go out and steal, rob or kill people. They did not accept that humans treating others how they would wish to be treated and cooperating is built-in thought evolution. In fact, over the centuries religious groups have shown far less tolerance than atheists or Agnostics.

Dave
 
If religion (whatever genre it is) is meant to be about love and peace, then why have so many conflicts and wars been started through the years in its name? Far more wars are the result of religious differences than are not.
 
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Three years of Covid, lockdowns, mask wearing, avoiding people and ...... nothing! New normal and.......... I have a stinker of a cold which has passed along the whole family, most of their work and schoolmates! Happy to report that I am still battling on............ despite being annoyed.......... and very grumpy. As to the other five dwarves??????
 
My shopping is due from Sainsbury's tomorrow morning but it won't let me checkout.

Screenshot 2023-04-10 at 13.59.25.png

Looking online, it seems to be a wider issue but, according to twitter, Sainsbury's don't appear to be aware of any problems, but I've tried with my Barclays card and my wife's Santander one and get the same result
 
I checked out of Sainsburys OK at 11:36 today but now I get the same Payment Failed message.
 
ancient_mariner said:
I won't say exactly what I think of you and your rant here John, because it would get me a ban. Your hatred of faith has blinded you to your selfishness and demand for personal satisfaction regardless of the cost to others. Yes, there's a religious origin to the holiday, but now it's just a holiday - like Bastille Day in France - where people have time off together.

WAMT? You.
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I need to apologise - John, that was a bit strong, and I'm sorry.

I had just read this https://www.aljazeera.com/features/2023/4/9/how-death-and-despair-haunt-pakistans-christian-minority and this https://www.aljazeera.com/features/...olence-against-christians-is-being-normalised and your post made me see red. As is usual, the problem isn't any kind of faith, but rather very ordinary politics and human-centric tribal behaviour wrapped in a covering of religion to justify the actions.
 
Suvv said:
I checked out of Sainsburys OK at 11:36 today but now I get the same Payment Failed message.
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Just tried renewing my driving license and got the same result, on 2 different cards. Just hope it keeps all the info I entered so far
 
I can't help but wonder if someone thought the Easter break was a good time to do some maintenance and updates, because "everyone's on holiday".

When I was in IT that was an all too common syndrome. :headbang:
 
seaodyssey said:
When workers would pop into the local pub for a pint or two, Some of the places I worked had onsite bars open at lunch time!
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Carlsberg brewery workers in Denmark used to be allowed to enjoy up to 3 beers in their canteen during the working day, but that is now restricted to one beer and only during their lunchbreak...
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
I can't help but wonder if someone thought the Easter break was a good time to do some maintenance and updates, because "everyone's on holiday".

When I was in IT that was an all too common syndrome. :headbang:
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I worked with several high street banks during my time in IT too, I was never impressed by the cavalier attitude they had towards customer accounts & service delivery. I think a lot of them had lost sight of who they were there to serve.
 
Cobra said:
Sunday closing and half day Wednesdays, life was much simpler then.
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I'm not sure but I assume when you say you 'life was simpler then" because all shops must be closed..period..because the 1994 Sunday Trading Act introduced area dimensions which governed their opening hours. Small shops, defined as those up to and including 280 square metres (3000 square ft) can open whenever they want to.Shops over 280 square metres can open on Sundays but only for 6 consecutive hours between 10am and 6pm and must close on Easter Sunday and Christmas Day. There are exceptions and one is a registered pharmacy selling only medicinal products, medical and surgical appliances

Also.. if a retailer has a large shop (ie over 280 square metres) a check will have to made with the LA to see if permission is required from the council to load and unload goods before 9am on Sunday. The mind boggles.
 
JohnC6 said:
Also.. if a retailer has a large shop (ie over 280 square metres) a check will have to made with the LA to see if permission is required from the council to load and unload goods before 9am on Sunday. The mind boggles.
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You really do have a thing about this, don't you? The most likely reason regarding loading is noise, ensuring that people having time off on a Sunday (something you apparently oppose strongly) aren't disturbed before 9am. Even systematically secular France has laws preventing people making noise on Sundays (linky) recognising that day as a day when people spend time at home.
 
JohnC6 said:
I'm not sure but I assume when you say you 'life was simpler then"
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Just a comment on a sign of the times, half-day / Sunday closing was just part of it.
 
ancient_mariner said:
France has laws preventing people making noise on Sundays (linky) recognising that day as a day when people spend time at home.
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Any noise when someone is trying to relax is a nuisance, both colloquially and (in many places) legally.

As we get closer and closer to a 24 hour / 7 day business cycle, more needs to be done about controlling such disturbance. In the UK we already have legislation which is, for the most part, unenforceable, due to there being so many exceptions, together with requirements for successful prosecution that are almost impossible to meet. Fixing the existing rules to give them teeth would be a more effective solution than keeping one day quiet for what is now (according to the polsters) a minority population.
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
Any noise when someone is trying to relax is a nuisance, both colloquially and (in many places) legally.

As we get closer and closer to a 24 hour / 7 day business cycle, more needs to be done about controlling such disturbance. In the UK we already have legislation which is, for the most part, unenforceable, due to there being so many exceptions, together with requirements for successful prosecution that are almost impossible to meet. Fixing the existing rules to give them teeth would be a more effective solution than keeping one day quiet for what is now (according to the polsters) a minority population.
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Sadly, without a 'religious' reason to give people time off, I fully expect the powers of commerce to sweep away the idea of having a regular closing time across the retail (and many other) industries. At least @JohnC6 will be able to get his eggs and milk when ever he needs them.
 
Tesco Express and Sainsbury Local are built to conform to Small shop size so they can trade from 7am to 11pm on a Sunday week in week out along with most Nisa/Coop including the petrol station variants so pretty sure there was somewhere that sold eggs, veg and milk not to far from @JohnC6.

As someone that works in retail Im quite thankful that the business is restricted to 6 hours of trading on a Sunday as I dont want to have to work another 9 hour day a week. Shops are open 363(362 in some cases) days a year so its hardly the end of the world when most close for 2 days.

Our local "Mall" has, over the years, extended the opening hours to over 12 hours a day yet ££'s through the till hasnt increased, its just spread over more time costing the retailers more in overheads most of which comes from labour.
 
AgentOrange76 said:
Tesco Express and Sainsbury Local are built to conform to Small shop size so they can trade from 7am to 11pm on a Sunday week in week out along with most Nisa/Coop including the petrol station variants so pretty sure there was somewhere that sold eggs, veg and milk not to far from @JohnC6.

As someone that works in retail Im quite thankful that the business is restricted to 6 hours of trading on a Sunday as I dont want to have to work another 9 hour day a week. Shops are open 363(362 in some cases) days a year so its hardly the end of the world when most close for 2 days.

Our local "Mall" has, over the years, extended the opening hours to over 12 hours a day yet ££'s through the till hasnt increased, its just spread over more time costing the retailers more in overheads most of which comes from labour.
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Both the large Tesco stores in town have got rid of the 24 hour opening closing at midnight, I believe the costs outweighed the income from customers.
 
ancient_mariner said:
I won't say exactly what I think of you and your rant here John, because it would get me a ban. Your hatred of faith has blinded you to your selfishness and demand for personal satisfaction regardless of the cost to others. Yes, there's a religious origin to the holiday, but now it's just a holiday - like Bastille Day in France - where people have time off together.

WAMT? You.
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Your response, Toni, is as intolerant as you see my position to be. You shouldn't have responded originally you knew I'd have had an answer.

My hatred is not of faith per se but 'organised' religion as I've mentioned on a couple of occasions. You just won't acknowledge that. I don't see you responding like this to others on here that voice similar opinions, albeit in not so much detail. It's certainly not very Christian-like is it. I could quote from the Bible to that effect but I don't suppose it would be appreciated. Clearly, my criticism hits home. In this country organised religion is on the decline.. rapid decline, Churches are closing such is the fall in attendance, why should such a small a minority dictate how the rest should be allowed to live their lives ? But that's the nature of organised religion. Just look around the world. Iran is now using CCTV in public places to identify females who aren't wearing the hijab. That's after killing 300,mostly young people who demonstrated after the 'religious police' beat to death a young women who wasn't wearing one 'properly' The principal is the same...control of the populace a demonstration of power .

Can you imagine the reaction here if we didn't have such trading laws (as is the case with Scotland) and the government thought of introducing them ? These laws belong to yesterday. Infact, David Cameron and George Osborne tried to at least relax restrictions with longer opening hours in 2016, but were defeated in a parliamentary vote after 27 Tory backbenchers voted against the government. In 2014 Philip Davies MP,(Con.) during a TV interview, described the laws as "completely absurd and unjustifiable " It's not "just a holiday" now as you say. The purpose is and always was to allow people to attend church. Sunday is church day. The MP who led the rebellion said he was responding to faith groups in his constituency as well a shop workers. The fact that he's the co-founder of the Conservative Christian Fellowship didn't have any bearing on his position on the issue

So, according to your opinion these three politicians and other MPs who voted to reduce the restrictions the restrictions, myself and a majority of the population who want rid of these laws are .. quote selfish, regardless of the cost to others and just for personal satisfaction. No re the latter .. not personal satisfaction but choice. By the way..there is no statutory obligation for employers to give time off for religious events.. but denying a reasonable request could leave them open to a claim for discrimination. In 2014 a ComRes poll found that 72% of those polled wanted to shop when they want to. For the 2012 Olympics in London the laws were suspended for eight weekends.

Goodness knows why you quoted Bastille Day as an equivalent. Here's a long list of shops open on Bastille Day las year.. https://www.sortiraparis.com/en/wha...-2022-bastille-day-in-paris-and-ile-de-france

If I feel I need to say something that involves organised religion which comes up now and then and not always at my instigation, may I respectfully suggest that you don't respond it clearly has a detrimental affect on your well being and I really wouldn't want to cause that.

​

 
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Cobra said:
As an aside, according to all the complaints, on the local FB news hub, the local taxi's are adding at least £2 per journey, because its Ramadan month.
( the Muslim community seem to have gained something of a monopoly in that service)
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What ?????... That's outrageous. That's taking the mick. Who will save us from this madness ? Answers on a postcard and addressed to.... :D
 
ancient_mariner said:
You really do have a thing about this, don't you? The most likely reason regarding loading is noise, ensuring that people having time off on a Sunday (something you apparently oppose strongly) aren't disturbed before 9am. Even systematically secular France has laws preventing people making noise on Sundays (linky) recognising that day as a day when people spend time at home.
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Oh well, if it's re noise then fair enough. Quite right, too. It was under the Sunday Trading laws legislation that' why I thought it was to do with that.
 
AgentOrange76 said:
Tesco Express and Sainsbury Local are built to conform to Small shop size so they can trade from 7am to 11pm on a Sunday week in week out along with most Nisa/Coop including the petrol station variants so pretty sure there was somewhere that sold eggs, veg and milk not to far from @JohnC6.

As someone that works in retail Im quite thankful that the business is restricted to 6 hours of trading on a Sunday as I dont want to have to work another 9 hour day a week. Shops are open 363(362 in some cases) days a year so its hardly the end of the world when most close for 2 days.

Our local "Mall" has, over the years, extended the opening hours to over 12 hours a day yet ££'s through the till hasnt increased, its just spread over more time costing the retailers more in overheads most of which comes from labour.
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My wife tried two garage shops and no eggs and no spinach. She got both today in Morrisons supermarket but not the Burford free range we usually buy. They're properly free range, too. If you're in food retail I expect you're familiar with them.

For the general public who want the laws scrapped (72% in a poll) t he problem here is that how is one to know if the restrictions are just on the basis of stopping exploitation by retailers..which they'd do... or the religious lobby is behind it. In my post to Toni I mentioned that the MP David Burrowes (Con) led the rebellion against David Cameron/George Osbourne's bill to ease tje restrictions if not scrap them. I think it was a case of 'slowly, slowly cachy monkey'. They knew they wouldn't get a ban through. Who is this David Borrowes. He only co-founded the Conservative Christian Fellowship. So..the defeat of tha bill was,in effect based on his religious convictions.
 
JohnC6 said:
For the general public who want the laws scrapped (72% in a poll)
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...there are several questions that need to be answered before that figure can make sense, aren't there?

Just a few: who designed the poll; how were interviewees selected; how many people refused to take part in the poll; exactly what question was asked; what questions preceded this question... Polls can be informative but it is essential to remember the fiasco of the Literary Digest 1936 poll: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Literary_Digest
 
I think shops should close more often than they do. Most retail staff are on minimum wage (or thereabouts) and certainly don't need their bosses pressuring them to work longer hours without it being bonused (time & 1/2 for instance). My wife works in a care home, and the amount of extra hours they try to pressure her into was unbelievable, but they don't bother now as they know the answer....
 
huffy said:
Both the large Tesco stores in town have got rid of the 24 hour opening closing at midnight, I believe the costs outweighed the income from customers.
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I believe they are Tesco Extra as in the superstore. - Tesco Express are the small "corner shop" style branches and I dont know of one that shuts before 11pm any day of the week
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
...there are several questions that need to be answered before that figure can make sense, aren't there?

Just a few: who designed the poll; how were interviewees selected; how many people refused to take part in the poll; exactly what question was asked; what questions preceded this question... Polls can be informative but it is essential to remember the fiasco of the Literary Digest 1936 poll: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Literary_Digest
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That Wiki link was an eye-opener. As you say, many variables at play. I did mention the poll was by Comres in case anyone wanted to check it out. I'd read this.

The debate over Sunday trading laws was reignited in 2014, when a ComRes poll commissioned by pressure group 'Open Sundays' revealed that 72% of people believe they should be able to shop whenever is convenient to them." There was no way I could ascertain how the poll was carried out in relation to the questioins you've posed which are valid questioins to ask, of course. How woukd anyone do that ?

Just now, I Googled who that company is and in 2017 the Guardian interviewed the chairman. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/may/17/how-comres-weights-its-polling-samples

In the interest of better accuracy I've just found another poll by Yougov. Can we trust Yougov ? I Googled that,too Just have a quick read of the first few paragraphs if you don't want to read the whoile articvle. It states they made an error. Peter Kellner is well respected,I'm sure. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/jun/08/polling-firms-yougov-tweak-polls

Do you think the answer is not to take any notice of polls ? YouGov had this result for the Sunday Trading laws. June 8th 2020.

www.cityam.com

British public support scrapping Sunday trading laws, says new poll

The government's plan to allow super markets in England and Wales to open for longer on Sundays has the public's backing, according to new polling. A
www.cityam.com www.cityam.com

"The government’s plan to allow super markets in England and Wales to open for longer on Sundays has the public’s backing, according to new polling. A YouGov poll released today showed that 48 per cent of people supported the change, with 31 per cent opposing and 21 per cent unsure "

I am aware that the trade unions are opposed to any change but on the grounds that their members need a day off and Sunday has been the traditional day but how many of that 31% against did so on those grounds or religious grounds ? In the article it states that "David Cameron and George Osborne tried to get rid of the restrictions in 2016, but was defeated in a parliamentary vote after 27 Tory backbenchers voted against the government." When I posted I said they'd tried to ease the restrictions and the reason I said that was that I'd actually seen an article that reported they tried to scrap them as well as an article stating it was just to relax/extend them a bit. .Quite a difference so I opted for "just extending the hours" Looks like they wanted to get rid of them.

I know from your comments that you are on the same page as myself and one or two others on here re religion.The 'organised' bit is important. I was just saying to my wife today about the near neighbours who are muslims and are fasting all day..until sunset.. not for two or three days but a month. Does a month rather than a few days make them and their fellow muslims better muslims ? It's crazy. That's my gripe. I appreciate it's more enriching to do things in groups with like-minded people so why can't they do their praying and whatever else and just carry on life with no impositions of any kind either within the religion or daily life ? No, .the hierarchy impose all manner of conditions . The C of E the least,I think, so somewhat benign. Goodness knows why Marc gave Toni's post a 'like' when he posted not long ago that he wasn't allowed to marry in a Synagogue (him being Jewish) unless she converted .The poor chap got it both ways because he said that his parents wouldn't have been too impressed if he married her in her church..I assume C of E or Catholic. I assume, in the end it was in a register office.

I'll finish with the words of the 18th century French philosophers Denis Diderot and Voltaire( Francois-Marie Arouet)

Diderot: "Man will never be free until the last King is strangled with the entrails of the last priest"

"The most dangerous madmen are those created by religion and people, whose aim is to disrupt society, always know how to make good use of them on occasion"

Of his time of course..Volatire.. "Christianity is the most ridiculous ,the most absurd and bloody religion that has ever infected the world"

"Of all religions the Christian,should of course,inspire the most tolerance but until now the Christian has been the most intolerant of all men"

“The institution of religion exists only to keep mankind in order, and to make men merit the goodness of God by their virtue. Everything in a religion which does not tend towards this goal must be considered foreign or dangerous.”
 
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To be honest the most pertinent and easily answered question would be 'what didn't annoy me today'.
 
Just to say @JohnC6 I notice your post and in line with forum rules I shall not continue discussion in this thread about this topic with you.
 
I really cannot understand why closing shops for 2 days a year is such a huge problem :thinking:
We know it's going to happen why is it so difficult to make sure you have htings in stock ?
 
WAMT.

Whenever I book my car in I seem to be the last in the queue.

For example... As I'm in no hurry and don't rely on one car I can book my car in weeks in advance so that's what I do. I then turn up at pretty much 09:00 or whatever opening time is. Why then have they not started on my car yet at 15:00? 16:00? How come they've had the car 6 or 7 hours before they even pull it into the workshop? Are they busy? Why? Do they accept more bookings than they can cope with?

All rhetorical questions. I'm sure I'm the only one this happens to.
 
woof woof said:
WAMT.

Whenever I book my car in I seem to be the last in the queue.

For example... As I'm in no hurry and don't rely on one car I can book my car in weeks in advance so that's what I do. I then turn up at pretty much 09:00 or whatever opening time is. Why then have they not started on my car yet at 15:00? 16:00? How come they've had the car 6 or 7 hours before they even pull it into the workshop? Are they busy? Why? Do they accept more bookings than they can cope with?

All rhetorical questions. I'm sure I'm the only one this happens to.
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The garage I use is always busy!

However, if I need something done urgently they will do their best to fit me in between other customers while I wait because I do rely on one car.
 
ancient_mariner said:
Just to say @JohnC6 I notice your post and in line with forum rules I shall not continue discussion in this thread about this topic with you.
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I don't understand his almost rabid attack on religion either.
I'm not a religious person, but I don't want to be shopping on Christmas day, I have family to spend time with.
If I cocked up and run out of anything, the local Indian guy will be open.
As for Easter, same as above, but the smaller Tesco's are open anyway.

Banks shut on "bank holidays", and Sundays too,
Bank holidays originated back in 1871 Granted the shops are mostly open ( here anyway)
But most bank holidays align with religious festivals particularly the Catholic faith, across the continent.
And I don't see anyone getting upset about those.
 
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