Why are people buying electric cars?

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Oldbones said:
I have noticed that on some of the cars I drive at work, EV cars don't have a vacuum brake servo assist its electronic, and the brake pedal application feels different.
We have had a notice from VOSA that if we are replacing the beam jacks on the MOT ramp they have to be upgraded to cope with the extra weight of the larger EV cars.
I charged an EV car up yesterday on a high speed charger, it took 2.5 hours to get it from 20% to 80%
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That wasn't a high speed charger.. I suspect it was a 22kwh unit or it was faulty.

The naming of charger types can be confusing.
The original chargers were 3.5kw
Then came 7-22kw and they called them fast chargers
Then 50kw DC called rapid
Then 100-150kw called ultra rapid
Above that the naming isn't fixed but super or hyper are both used.
 
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The EUSSR are turning the screw on owners of older ICE vehicles. From this year it will not be possible to sell any vehicle without a current MOT except as scrap or to a professional motor dealer. No more selling your car as a dooer upper to some competant amateur mechanic to put back on the road. Also, they plan to introduce mandatory annual MOT testing for vehicles of 10 years or older instead of the current bi-annual tests.

In France they have taken this a step further in that you cannot sell or transfer a vehicle unless it is within 6 months of passing an MOT. And you cannot sell a vehicle as 'sold as seen with no guarantee or warranty' except to trade buyers.
 
MOT is every year for all vehicles 3 years old or over here in the UK. Apart from vehicles over 40 years old (that haven't been significantly altered in the past 30 years).
 
The French regs aren't new about the 6 month controlle technique, and their regs seem generally anti-amateur car mechanic
 
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Steep said:
392 models of Stellantis cars recalled as a fire risk.

All petrol cars..

Vauxhall, Citroen, Fiat and Peugeot fire risk: Over 390 models recalled amid fuel leak fears | Auto Express

392 more Stellantis cars have been recalled in the UK due to a faulty high-pressure fuel pipe which is thought could lead to fires
www.autoexpress.co.uk www.autoexpress.co.uk
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That's the equivalent to poorly designing the connectors to the battery so that they can loosen and short-circuit. It's not a fuel problem but an engineering fault.

But thanks for posting this - it makes me feel better about not buying a new Stellantis car recently instead of the used BMW diesel that I did get.
 
We've just come back from Tenerife where we had a 'mild hybrid' Fiat Panda. The engine was obviously tiny and under-powered but adequate, however one might ask the question "what happens when you use up the tiny booster battery?". The answer is it just has less power and becomes a drag to drive when the terrain is demanding - in a steep, hilly area it would go up the hills in second or sometimes third with the booster, but first gear only without boost. It was certainly economical on a flattish road, but really struggled after a little while on hills. The MH is probably a great asset around town, but not so much in a hilly area.
 
ancient_mariner said:
We've just come back from Tenerife where we had a 'mild hybrid' Fiat Panda. The engine was obviously tiny and under-powered but adequate, however one might ask the question "what happens when you use up the tiny booster battery?". The answer is it just has less power and becomes a drag to drive when the terrain is demanding - in a steep, hilly area it would go up the hills in second or sometimes third with the booster, but first gear only without boost. It was certainly economical on a flattish road, but really struggled after a little while on hills. The MH is probably a great asset around town, but not so much in a hilly area.
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I guess the rental company bought it because it's cheap and weren't aware or didn't care much how it performs outside it's intended environment.
 
ancient_mariner said:
We've just come back from Tenerife where we had a 'mild hybrid' Fiat Panda. The engine was obviously tiny and under-powered but adequate, however one might ask the question "what happens when you use up the tiny booster battery?". The answer is it just has less power and becomes a drag to drive when the terrain is demanding - in a steep, hilly area it would go up the hills in second or sometimes third with the booster, but first gear only without boost. It was certainly economical on a flattish road, but really struggled after a little while on hills. The MH is probably a great asset around town, but not so much in a hilly area.
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I can confirm that Toni. You have to use 1st and 2nd gears on hills and get flashed at by drivers that you are holding up. The one that we hired in Madeira had been stood for a few weeks before we hired it. First day was like riding a donkey. A little better the second day. Third day it was barely OK on the motorways, but hopeless after half a mile of uphill driving on steep hills.
 
In the end it's just a small, cheap car that's adequate around town, and that's where most will be used.
 
Am not sure about Hybrid cars seem to be very complicated compared to either full electric or petrol vehicles, will they be still reliable once they get a few years old ?
Im not an expert though just seem to be a compromise, if we was looking for a new car now it would either be full electric or petrol
our petrol car is about 7 years old now and still completely reliable
 
Marc said:
what's complicated about hybrids compared to full electric or petrol?
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Any vehicle with two different methods of propulsion is inherently more complicaterd than one that uses a single method

I too have had a couple of hydrids (and still have one Toyota Yaris), I got rid of my XC60 as the potential 'bork' costs on the hybrid system out of warranty where significant and full extended Volvo warranty was ££££ The Toyota has a different sort of warranty and can be up to 10 years.

After doing a lot of research, most hybrid batteries do not have the same battery cooling performance as full BEVs and using a self-charging hybrid is putting a lot of charge cycles through the battery and consequently heat. This will naturally lead to battery degradation over time (masked by the fact that the petrol engine will just kick in when required).

I know the batteries often have 8 year warranties but the control systems don't!!!!
 
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Having decided against the Citroen eC3 because of the Stallantis ownership, I'm going to go for a Suzuki Vitara or a small Mazda ev; if I can afford it as it looks like I'm going to be forced to give up being a contractor and go permie with my current client. However it's not definite about getting the EV as I'm certainly not giving up my Mazda 6 tourer 2.2 diesel, it's a superb car and only 7 years old; nor the VW camper van also diesel (2l). The EV is a practical idea because we have a solar setup and a lot of our journeys are under 15 miles.
 
ancient_mariner said:
We've just come back from Tenerife where we had a 'mild hybrid' Fiat Panda. The engine was obviously tiny and under-powered but adequate, however one might ask the question "what happens when you use up the tiny booster battery?". The answer is it just has less power and becomes a drag to drive when the terrain is demanding - in a steep, hilly area it would go up the hills in second or sometimes third with the booster, but first gear only without boost. It was certainly economical on a flattish road, but really struggled after a little while on hills. The MH is probably a great asset around town, but not so much in a hilly area.
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Last year when in Cyprus we hired a Hyundai i10 and went on a trip on the sweeping hills to the EOKA Hideout locating in very tight and steep roads of Omodos with the intention to then continue on to Mount Olympus to watch the sun set. I'm not sure what the engine was in this car or how well it had been maintained, but it was all too much for it and it blew up after reaching Omodos.

I wasn't going to even try and get to Mount Olympus. Had to crawl back to Paphos in limp mode with the engine making a horrible noise. I prefer to have a little more power and not need it, than pushing a little engine to its limits. Although my wife's Swift only has a 1.2 naturally aspirated engine and it's pretty decent, even on the motorway.
 
lindsay said:
Having decided against the Citroen eC3 because of the Stallantis ownership, I'm going to go for a Suzuki Vitara or a small Mazda ev; if I can afford it as it looks like I'm going to be forced to give up being a contractor and go permie with my current client. However it's not definite about getting the EV as I'm certainly not giving up my Mazda 6 tourer 2.2 diesel, it's a superb car and only 7 years old; nor the VW camper van also diesel (2l). The EV is a practical idea because we have a solar setup and a lot of our journeys are under 15 miles.
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I would suggest driving both, especially the Suzuki. I loaned a Swift and it was like being nagged by a Prozac Queen. I had it three days and could 't wait to drop it off. I called it Bing Bong. After that I loaned a Mazda 3 and it was a lot better driving experience and much more relaxing regards the lane assist, frontal collision warnings, etc. When using sat-nav the Suzuki verbally reminded me to beware of traffic entering at every f*****g intersection and went into a blind panic if brake lights came on 200 metres away.
 
Clive K said:
I would suggest driving both, especially the Suzuki. I loaned a Swift and it was like being nagged by a Prozac Queen. I had it three days and could 't wait to drop it off. I called it Bing Bong. After that I loaned a Mazda 3 and it was a lot better driving experience and much more relaxing regards the lane assist, frontal collision warnings, etc. When using sat-nav the Suzuki verbally reminded me to beware of traffic entering at every f*****g intersection and went into a blind panic if brake lights came on 200 metres away.
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The nagging is unfortunately universal these days, EU regulations. Most cars let you turn off the nagging, though you have to do it at the start of every trip.
On my MG you can select all the stuff you don't want and assign it to a profile, then picking that profile is simply swipe down, tap icon and hit confirm, all is peace and quiet.
 
Marc said:
Had 2 hybrids for 7 years in total. Had no problems with them at all. Couldn't say the same about the ICE vehicles I had.

@LCPete what's complicated about hybrids compared to full electric or petrol?
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Just the fact of having 2 drive systems and the control electronics for all that seems complicated to me but im not an engineer
 
New Hyundai Inster a proper game changer at this price point
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LCPete said:
Just the fact of having 2 drive systems and the control electronics for all that seems complicated to me but im not an engineer
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I can only speak from a driver's POV (I'm no engineer either), but I found the hybrids no different to drive than ICE vehicles.
 
Marc said:
I can only speak from a driver's POV (I'm no engineer either), but I found the hybrids no different to drive than ICE vehicles.
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i think what the guy from the 1% club that drives a car from 1976 is saying is his car does everything better than, well everying else.....
so why is there any need for change?
 
gman said:
Last year when in Cyprus we hired a Hyundai i10 and went on a trip on the sweeping hills to the EOKA Hideout locating in very tight and steep roads of Omodos with the intention to then continue on to Mount Olympus to watch the sun set. I'm not sure what the engine was in this car or how well it had been maintained, but it was all too much for it and it blew up after reaching Omodos.

I wasn't going to even try and get to Mount Olympus. Had to crawl back to Paphos in limp mode with the engine making a horrible noise. I prefer to have a little more power and not need it, than pushing a little engine to its limits. Although my wife's Swift only has a 1.2 naturally aspirated engine and it's pretty decent, even on the motorway.
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Our first trip to Greece in 1986 we had a 600cc Subaru for 3 days (£150 - all we could afford) and drove 750 miles in that time including across the mountains above Thessaloniki. A small engine doesn't have to be pathetic.
 
Steep said:
The nagging is unfortunately universal these days, EU regulations. Most cars let you turn off the nagging, though you have to do it at the start of every trip.
On my MG you can select all the stuff you don't want and assign it to a profile, then picking that profile is simply swipe down, tap icon and hit confirm, all is peace and quiet.
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I've loaned or hired four new cars in the last 12 months. The Suzuki was by far the worst for many reasons including not easily being able to turn off most annoying things every trip and not being able to turn off the most annoying things at all. The Mazda 3 was more tolerable. The BMW 120 pleasantly better and the Fiat Panda was: "Do what you like. You're the driver!"

Also, my wife's new Seat Ibiza is great. One button to deactivate stop/start and three quick presses of buttons to switch off lane assist. Other than that just a few unnecessary reminders if driving in sport mode or idleling with the handbrake on with the stop/start deactivated.

That is five new cars and they aren't all the same so test drive before deciding.
 
Mr Bump said:
i think what the guy from the 1% club that drives a car from 1976 is saying is his car does everything better than, well everying else.....
so why is there any need for change?
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Am not saying that at all just that I am not convinced once a hybrid car is 5 or more years old that would be a good idea buying second hand especially since we tend to keep our car as long as we can our current one is nearly 6 years old
A different proposition to buying a new car and changing it every 3 or 4 years
Am not against electric cars at all either, for the record
 
Oh look, I mention having a Swift and moments later Clive is slagging the Swift. :rolleyes:
 
ancient_mariner said:
Our first trip to Greece in 1986 we had a 600cc Subaru for 3 days (£150 - all we could afford) and drove 750 miles in that time including across the mountains above Thessaloniki. A small engine doesn't have to be pathetic.
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The 600cc in my GSXR600 was pretty nice. :cool:

But I agree and like I say the 1.2 in the Swift is pretty nippy and so far bombproof. It's the previous gen with none of those modern safety gizmos to annoy and it weighs nothing, so handles like a go-kart and is good fun. I suspect that i10 being a hire car has probably been thrashed and poorly maintained.
 
Had a 1200km 1.2 Swift as a hire car last September. OK on the flat but a bit wheezy up in the mountains on Crete. As a matter of course, I check oil and other levels/condition and all was well so, given the mileage and the levels, I'm not sure that thrashing and/or poor maintenance were the problem.
 
Nod said:
Had a 1200km 1.2 Swift as a hire car last September. OK on the flat but a bit wheezy up in the mountains on Crete. As a matter of course, I check oil and other levels/condition and all was well so, given the mileage and the levels, I'm not sure that thrashing and/or poor maintenance were the problem.
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Up the mountains for a 1.2 it wouldn't surprise me to struggle a little. I think the Hyundai I had was a 1 litre three cylinder, might have been the 1.2. But it wasn't a case of it being wheezy, something went pop in the engine! lol
 
gman said:
Up the mountains for a 1.2 it wouldn't surprise me to struggle a little. I think the Hyundai I had was a 1 litre three cylinder, might have been the 1.2. But it wasn't a case of it being wheezy, something went pop in the engine! lol
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The last time we went to Crete we had a small Nissan. It seemed ok, if a little worn, pulling out of the car park, but on the first bend you could really hear the CV joints knocking. We'd queued for a long time to pick it up, and I didn't fancy going back again so just kept going and drove carefully. It was fine for the duration, but you could tell it wouldn't last forever.
 
lindsay said:
Having decided against the Citroen eC3 because of the Stallantis ownership, I'm going to go for a Suzuki Vitara or a small Mazda ev; if I can afford it as it looks like I'm going to be forced to give up being a contractor and go permie with my current client. However it's not definite about getting the EV as I'm certainly not giving up my Mazda 6 tourer 2.2 diesel, it's a superb car and only 7 years old; nor the VW camper van also diesel (2l). The EV is a practical idea because we have a solar setup and a lot of our journeys are under 15 miles.
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As a fellow Mazda6 owner (although a much older 2011 model) I've been keeping an eye on the Mazda electric cars but the MX-30 obviously wasn't very good and the new 6E is clearly a lot more of the Chinese company than it is a Mazda.

I think you're right to have concerns about Stellantis who weren't looking great anyway but the $26 billion write off for EV losses looks a good bit worse.
LCPete said:
Just the fact of having 2 drive systems and the control electronics for all that seems complicated to me but im not an engineer
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Having watched a number of car repair channels, while clearly a hybrid can be reliable (Toyota regularly top the charts with theirs), hybrids do increase the number of parts and if a part fails in the electric part of the system it can kill the entire car. A BMW 330e had failed and couldn't move (the petrol engine was fine) which turned out to be a failed part on the motor however the motor is integrated into the gearbox housing so the entire gearbox needed replaced which along with the other parts needing replaced was a hefty bill and likely many times more than the hybrid part ever saved, On a V6 Infinity which was also a beached whale it turned out a resistor pack had failed in the electric drive system again crippling the car despite the petrol engine working fine. On a Mercedes hybrid, there was a short in the batterypack which needed the batterypack failed (well into five figures total including labour) which again had a working diesel engine but couldn't move because of the battery fault.

I'd agree with the comment above I'd prefer a pure petrol or pure battery vehicle and a Toyota Corolla estate would probably be the most suitable replacement for my Mazda6 but I'd much rather it was only a petrol engine. The hybrid part adds cost and complexity for little benefit for my usage.
 
ancient_mariner said:
The last time we went to Crete we had a small Nissan. It seemed ok, if a little worn, pulling out of the car park, but on the first bend you could really hear the CV joints knocking. We'd queued for a long time to pick it up, and I didn't fancy going back again so just kept going and drove carefully. It was fine for the duration, but you could tell it wouldn't last forever.
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Same in Cyprus. Before joining the EU a lot of Cypriot vehicle imports were 2 or 3 year old imports from Japan, what we used to call grey imports. And they kept them for decades. In the Troodos we had a ride in a Merc' taxi that had 600k km on the clock and the rear seat had no springs. The ancient driver never got above third gear.
 
Clive K said:
Same in Cyprus. Before joining the EU a lot of Cypriot vehicle imports were 2 or 3 year old imports from Japan, what we used to call grey imports. And they kept them for decades. In the Troodos we had a ride in a Merc' taxi that had 600k km on the clock and the rear seat had no springs. The ancient driver never got above third gear.
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Turkish taxis can be a little like that too.
 
ancient_mariner said:
Turkish taxis can be a little like that too.
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That has brought back memories of the nightmare ride from the airport to a hotel in Istanbul. The driver had to pump the brakes and the horn was operational for almost 50% of the time. The only thing that worked properly was the meter. It could be read in almost any world currency.

But, out on the coast they all had new Dacias.
 
JohnMcL7 said:
As a fellow Mazda6 owner (although a much older 2011 model) I've been keeping an eye on the Mazda electric cars but the MX-30 obviously wasn't very good and the new 6E is clearly a lot more of the Chinese company than it is a Mazda.

I think you're right to have concerns about Stellantis who weren't looking great anyway but the $26 billion write off for EV losses looks a good bit worse.

Having watched a number of car repair channels, while clearly a hybrid can be reliable (Toyota regularly top the charts with theirs), hybrids do increase the number of parts and if a part fails in the electric part of the system it can kill the entire car. A BMW 330e had failed and couldn't move (the petrol engine was fine) which turned out to be a failed part on the motor however the motor is integrated into the gearbox housing so the entire gearbox needed replaced which along with the other parts needing replaced was a hefty bill and likely many times more than the hybrid part ever saved, On a V6 Infinity which was also a beached whale it turned out a resistor pack had failed in the electric drive system again crippling the car despite the petrol engine working fine. On a Mercedes hybrid, there was a short in the batterypack which needed the batterypack failed (well into five figures total including labour) which again had a working diesel engine but couldn't move because of the battery fault.

I'd agree with the comment above I'd prefer a pure petrol or pure battery vehicle and a Toyota Corolla estate would probably be the most suitable replacement for my Mazda6 but I'd much rather it was only a petrol engine. The hybrid part adds cost and complexity for little benefit for my usage.
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You can get the Toyota Corolla estate as a pure petrol, although quite rare.

Here's one currently for sale: LINK

The hybrid though is on my radar if I ever have to change cars.
 
gman said:
You can get the Toyota Corolla estate as a pure petrol, although quite rare.

Here's one currently for sale: LINK

The hybrid though is on my radar if I ever have to change cars.
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It's a current model I'd be considering since it comes with blind spot monitoring and a few other features, the newer versions were only sold as hybrids. It's a lot more difficult choosing cars now since for the first time there's almost as many downgrades as there are upgrades.
 
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JohnMcL7 said:
It's a current model I'd be considering since it comes with blind spot monitoring and a few other features, the newer versions were only sold as hybrids. It's a lot more difficult choosing cars now since for the first time there's almost as many downgrades as there are upgrades.
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Ah ok, fair enough. Maybe something similar will come out.
 
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