Why are people buying electric cars?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Deleted member 68495
  • Start date Start date
JonathanRyan said:
So more cars = more fires? Got it. Statistics are fun.
Click to expand...
More electric cars more fires.

It's worth reading the page that Andy referenced. The sources appear to be reputable and the numbers make more sense to me than those mentioned by Hugh.
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
More electric cars more fires.

It's worth reading the page that Andy referenced. The sources appear to be reputable and the numbers make more sense than those mentioned by Hugh.
Click to expand...
Yes. People didn't used to have many and a tiny percentage caught fire. Now they have more and the same tiny percentage catch fire.

Or more fires as you'd like to spin it.
 
andya700 said:
I at least quoted statistics, whereas you didn't provide any links at all. You would have us believe that the numbers of EV car fires in the UK are low single figures, when in fact they are not. Electric car fires have surged by 77% in 2 years. There were 232 EV fires in 2024. Lithium-ion battery fires have increased by 93% oveall since 2022.

Click to expand...
There was posts earlier in this thread which showed that the chances of an EV catching fire was far less than ICE
 
JonathanRyan said:
Or more fires as you'd like to spin it.
Click to expand...
I'm not spinning anything, just pointing out that the source quoted by Andy seems reliable.

Here's another source on the subject...

www.fireservice.co.uk

Vehicle Fires

Vehicle Fires Every year in the UK, over 100,000 cars which equates to nearly 300 a day go up in flames and around 100 people die as a result. Around 65% of these fires are started deliberately to cover criminal activity, to make
www.fireservice.co.uk

The thing I found most interesting is the claim that 65% of car fires are started deliberately and are often related to other criminal behaviour.
 
Last edited:
Or this one


Tl;Dr: EVs are 20 times less likely to catch fire than ice (that's per vehicle). Neither are anywhere near as dangerous as hybrids. Crashing EVs almost never causes them to catch fire. This is also largely true of ice. Not so much with hybrids (high voltage + nasty petrol fumes = boom)

So if you want to prevent car fires, swap was many ice cars (or even better, hybrids) to ev as you can
 
It appears that someone is being economical with the actualite but the question is who?
 
  • Haha
Reactions: Nod
andya700 said:
I at least quoted statistics, whereas you didn't provide any links at all. You would have us believe that the numbers of EV car fires in the UK are low single figures, when in fact they are not. Electric car fires have surged by 77% in 2 years. There were 232 EV fires in 2024. Lithium-ion battery fires have increased by 93% oveall since 2022.

Click to expand...
I quoted the fire service of England, it's right there in my post though without a link. The statistics you quoted were for bikes and scooters not EVs.
Are you sure the number 232 is for EVs alone? Because the QBE data in that link specifically does not differentiate between lithium battery fires by type.
"London remains the hotspot for such incidents, with the capital recording the highest number of lithium-ion battery fires (407 in 2024), although the specific number involving EVs within the capital was not separately disclosed. "
 
Electric car prices are dropping fast, according to the first publication of the E.ON Next/The Independent EV Price Index.

The energy giant and media company have combined to produce the UK’s first-ever electric car price index that measures real-world prices (including available discounts) on every EV on sale in the UK.

The first E.ON Next/The Independent EV Price Index has revealed that over the past twelve months the median price of an EV has fallen by 7.7 per cent
 
According to a study by the Swedish Civil Contingencies Agency, electric vehicles are 20 times less likely to catch fire than petrol and diesel cars.

The study, corroborated by data from a US insurer using National Transportation Safety Board figures, indicates that battery-powered EVs suffer only 25 fires per 100,000 sold.

In stark contrast, petrol or diesel vehicles experience 1,530 fires per 100,000, with hybrid vehicles at a notably higher risk of 3,475 fires per 100,000.

internationalfireandsafetyjournal.com

Research highlights lower fire risk in electric cars compared to petrol and diesel vehicles

Recent research has shed light on the fire risks associated with electric vehicles (EVs), revealing that they are significantly lower compared to their petrol
internationalfireandsafetyjournal.com internationalfireandsafetyjournal.com
 
Delphin said:
Electric car prices are dropping fast, according to the first publication of the E.ON Next/The Independent EV Price Index.

The energy giant and media company have combined to produce the UK’s first-ever electric car price index that measures real-world prices (including available discounts) on every EV on sale in the UK.

The first E.ON Next/The Independent EV Price Index has revealed that over the past twelve months the median price of an EV has fallen by 7.7 per cent
Click to expand...
Heading in the right direction
 
Delphin said:
According to a study by the Swedish Civil Contingencies Agency, electric vehicles are 20 times less likely to catch fire than petrol and diesel cars.

The study, corroborated by data from a US insurer using National Transportation Safety Board figures, indicates that battery-powered EVs suffer only 25 fires per 100,000 sold.

In stark contrast, petrol or diesel vehicles experience 1,530 fires per 100,000, with hybrid vehicles at a notably higher risk of 3,475 fires per 100,000.

internationalfireandsafetyjournal.com

Research highlights lower fire risk in electric cars compared to petrol and diesel vehicles

Recent research has shed light on the fire risks associated with electric vehicles (EVs), revealing that they are significantly lower compared to their petrol
internationalfireandsafetyjournal.com internationalfireandsafetyjournal.com
Click to expand...

Do you know if they compared like for like by age or if it was a blanket comparison?
 
The headline rate on standard petrol and diesel is 52.95 pence per litre (see here)...

Fuel duties - Office for Budget Responsibility

Fuel duties are levied on purchases of petrol, diesel and a variety of other fuels. They represent a significant source of revenue for government. In 2025-26, we expect fuel duties to raise £24 billion. That would represent 1.9 per cent of all receipts and is equivalent to £835 per household...
obr.uk obr.uk

...and a rough average petrol useage for a car is 8 miles per litre. Hence the users of internal combustion engines pay the government about 6p per mile driven. So why should the users of electric cars not be required to pay the government that 6p?

If they did, everyone would be contributing more or less the same to the tax pot and all would be fair.
 
Last edited:
AndrewFlannigan said:
The headline rate on standard petrol and diesel is 52.95 pence per litre (see here)...

Fuel duties - Office for Budget Responsibility

Fuel duties are levied on purchases of petrol, diesel and a variety of other fuels. They represent a significant source of revenue for government. In 2025-26, we expect fuel duties to raise £24 billion. That would represent 1.9 per cent of all receipts and is equivalent to £835 per household...
obr.uk obr.uk

...and a rough average petrol useage for a car is 8 miles per litre. Hence the users of internal combustion engines pay the government about 6p per mile driven. So why should the users of electric cars not be required to pay the government that 6p?

If they did, everyone would be contributing more or less the same to the tax pot and all would be fair.
Click to expand...

In that case make road tax a flat £200 per year regardless of car, that way everyone is contributing the same to tax pot and fair. Also, put a higher level of tax on smaller 1l style cars, as they pay less fuel tax than a 3.5l car driver due to economy, let them pay the same tax!
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
The headline rate on standard petrol and diesel is 52.95 pence per litre (see here)...

Fuel duties - Office for Budget Responsibility

Fuel duties are levied on purchases of petrol, diesel and a variety of other fuels. They represent a significant source of revenue for government. In 2025-26, we expect fuel duties to raise £24 billion. That would represent 1.9 per cent of all receipts and is equivalent to £835 per household...
obr.uk obr.uk

...and a rough average petrol useage for a car is 8 miles per litre. Hence the users of internal combustion engines pay the government about 6p per mile driven. So why should the users of electric cars not be required to pay the government that 6p?
Click to expand...
Wait, I know this one. It's because they aren't using petrol. Just the same way when I had a petrol lawnmower I had to pay tax on the fuel even though I almost never drove it to the shops.

If it helps, the answer is in the first line of the article you linked

Fuel duties are levied on purchases of petrol, diesel and a variety of other fuels.
Click to expand...

Out of interest, due you also think bio gas users are tax cheats? How about tractor drivers? Trains? People who use gas to heat their home (rather than pay the duty on fuel oil)

ancient_mariner said:
Do you know if they compared like for like by age or if it was a blanket comparison?
Click to expand...

The original research is here https://rib.msb.se/filer/pdf/29438.pdf - I don't read Swedish, but an AI says, no they looked at all vehicle fires between 2018 and 2024 regardless of vehicle age. You'd probably expect newer vehicles to catch fire less than older ones. Also, see earlier point about most vehicle fires being deliberate - you'd expect "steal and torch" to skew more to older vehicles with fewer modern security methods. But the size of the discrepancy it IMO way too big to be explained by these 2 facts - every report I've ever seen says EVs catch fire less than ICE.

Sweden currently has about 60% EVs and PHEVs so from recent years there's a fair amount of data.
 
Delphin said:
One year’s worth of US mining waste has enough lithium for 10 million EVs

darcyhitchcock.wordpress.com

One year’s worth of US mining waste has enough lithium for 10 million EVs.

Mining operations are focused. They want to extract copper or gold, etc. Their targeted material is a teensy fraction of what they dig up. All that mining waste still contains a lot of useful metal…
darcyhitchcock.wordpress.com darcyhitchcock.wordpress.com
Click to expand...
Back before we "banned" disposable vapes (#spoiler this is a total lie) the BBC had some stat about 2 weeks' worth of disposable vape sales being equivalent to a Tesla. Since the ban is a total fiction, I suspect it's still about the same.
 
JonathanRyan said:
Wait, I know this one. It's because they aren't using petrol. Just the same way when I had a petrol lawnmower I had to pay tax on the fuel even though I almost never drove it to the shops.

If it helps, the answer is in the first line of the article you linked



Out of interest, due you also think bio gas users are tax cheats? How about tractor drivers? Trains? People who use gas to heat their home (rather than pay the duty on fuel oil)



The original research is here https://rib.msb.se/filer/pdf/29438.pdf - I don't read Swedish, but an AI says, no they looked at all vehicle fires between 2018 and 2024 regardless of vehicle age. You'd probably expect newer vehicles to catch fire less than older ones. Also, see earlier point about most vehicle fires being deliberate - you'd expect "steal and torch" to skew more to older vehicles with fewer modern security methods. But the size of the discrepancy it IMO way too big to be explained by these 2 facts - every report I've ever seen says EVs catch fire less than ICE.

Sweden currently has about 60% EVs and PHEVs so from recent years there's a fair amount of data.
Click to expand...

So you mean I have been cheating the taxpayer by using my electric mower??? Sorry!!!
 
andya700 said:
I at least quoted statistics, whereas you didn't provide any links at all. You would have us believe that the numbers of EV car fires in the UK are low single figures, when in fact they are not. Electric car fires have surged by 77% in 2 years. There were 232 EV fires in 2024. Lithium-ion battery fires have increased by 93% oveall since 2022.

Click to expand...
Did you actually read this. whilst Lithium-ion battery fires have increased by 97% since 2022 It doesn't actually say how many are EV's. As Lithium-ion batteries are used in many things including illegal scooters with dodgy batteries and questionable charging routines. If you can tell me how many fires where in actual cars I would like to know, because the report goes on to say. "London remains the hotspot for such incidents, with the capital recording the highest number of lithium-ion battery fires (407 in 2024), although the specific number involving EVs within the capital was not separately disclosed."

So we have increased the number of EV's on our roads in recent years, it would follow that the number of fires will increase. without looking at both figures the % (of fires) means nothing.
 
Not for long they're not. Ten years and they won't be able to sell a new one in the UK or Europe.
 
f/2.8 said:
A few other manufacturers are expected to follow suit over the next few months. Petrol is back.

www.electrive.com

Bentley to refocus on combustion engines - electrive.com

Instead of only building electric cars from 2030 onwards, the luxury brand is once again placing greater emphasis on combustion engines in the medium term.
www.electrive.com www.electrive.com
Click to expand...

So when the ICE ban comes in they'll be 10 years behind in EV development of those who choose to concentrate on electric now.

Quick profit now at the cost of a long term viable company.
We can see how the hypercar market has been upended with EV power, it'll not take long for the EV manufacturers to go for the high-end luxury market.
How long before Bentley will be asking for a government handout to save the company and jobs.
 
Last edited:
Delphin said:
So when the ICE ban comes in they'll be 10 years behind in EV development of those who choose to concentrate on electric now.

Quick profit now at the cost of a long term viable company.
We can see how the hypercar market has been upended with EV power, it'll not take long for the EV manufacturers to go for the high-end luxury market.
How long before Bentley will be asking for a government handout to save the company and jobs.
Click to expand...
Will never happen will be one of the first things tha goes when Farage becomes prime minister
 
f/2.8 said:
Will never happen will be one of the first things tha goes when Farage becomes prime minister
Click to expand...
If that ever happens companies like Bentley will go bust. The UK market for their cars is far too small to support their business.
 
Delphin said:
We can see how the hypercar market has been upended with EV power, it'll not take long for the EV manufacturers to go for the high-end luxury market.
Click to expand...
That's part of the current problem. The traditional car makers have been pushing towards the upper end of the market - Audi, VW, BMW, JLR, have all focused on higher end expensive models. What the country needs is decent spec EV's without the full luxery treatment. Take for instance my car, I have an Audi Q2. Audi are discontinuing it as it's too small and lower end. They've already dropped the A1 (decent car that too), I don't think I've seen a BMW 1 series EV. Volvo don't have a car that's under £40k.

What the market needs is decent EV's in the £23-30k range. That's why the Koreans are doing so well...
 
Mr Perceptive said:
Volvo EX30 is sub 40K, entry model around £33K
Click to expand...
Actually, I just noticed that. WHen I was in the showroom before I bought the Q2, the guy said only the very basic EX30 was under £40k. Looks like they've tried to keed them all under £40k, which is good...
 
Of course, Bentley may be the company that laughs loudest and longest. ;)
 
Jelster said:
Actually, I just noticed that. WHen I was in the showroom before I bought the Q2, the guy said only the very basic EX30 was under £40k. Looks like they've tried to keed them all under £40k, which is good...
Click to expand...

40k is the cap the government set, above which there's a hefty extra charge applied to the price of the car. So manufacturers have been stripping their mid range models back to try and make sure they have an offering under the cap. Too many of them thought they could control the market and protect their profit margins by setting the prices high with converted ice models. They should have watched China, they'd have seen what real innovation can do.
 
At the moment a petrol car is still the best option for many people including myself but I would expect that will change as technology improves
As range improves and the cost of the vehicle comes down people will buy electric cars just because they are the best option
 
Of course, everyone is rushing to change to electric...
  • 41.2 million licensed vehicles,
  • 1,015,000 licensed zero emission vehicles,
From...
www.gov.uk

Vehicle licensing statistics: 2023

www.gov.uk www.gov.uk

...so 1 out of every 41 licenced vehicles is any form of zero emission.
 
Jelster said:
That's part of the current problem. The traditional car makers have been pushing towards the upper end of the market - Audi, VW, BMW, JLR, have all focused on higher end expensive models. What the country needs is decent spec EV's without the full luxery treatment. Take for instance my car, I have an Audi Q2. Audi are discontinuing it as it's too small and lower end. They've already dropped the A1 (decent car that too), I don't think I've seen a BMW 1 series EV. Volvo don't have a car that's under £40k.

What the market needs is decent EV's in the £23-30k range. That's why the Koreans are doing so well...
Click to expand...

And not strictly ICE vs EV related, just look how big cars have become in general. The average car used to be around 1 ton, now it has to be nearer 2 ton surely....? Plus the physical size on the roads and for parking.... I can't get how everything is so big & high end now. There aren't really any cheaper, decent cars..... It may sound selfish (for the planet :rolleyes: ) but it has to be about the personal situation and finances. And, I'm not strictly anti EV but, but there's obviously the EV home charging situation - last night I had to park about 100m from the front door..... I live in number 13, I had to park outside of number 42......
 
LeeRatters said:
And not strictly ICE vs EV related, just look how big cars have become in general. The average car used to be around 1 ton, now it has to be nearer 2 ton surely....? Plus the physical size on the roads and for parking.... I can't get how everything is so big & high end now. There aren't really any cheaper, decent cars..... It may sound selfish (for the planet :rolleyes: ) but it has to be about the personal situation and finances. And, I'm not strictly anti EV but, but there's obviously the EV home charging situation - last night I had to park about 100m from the front door..... I live in number 13, I had to park outside of number 42......
Click to expand...
The size of cars has been driven by safety, profit, aspiration and selfish desire.

None of these care about the planet.
 
AndrewFlannigan said:
Of course, everyone is rushing to change to electric...
  • 41.2 million licensed vehicles,
  • 1,015,000 licensed zero emission vehicles,
From...
www.gov.uk

Vehicle licensing statistics: 2023

www.gov.uk www.gov.uk

...so 1 out of every 41 licenced vehicles is any form of zero emission.
Click to expand...
Apparently, similar ratios once existed between horses and cars. Given all the horses on our roads nowadays, you’d never believe that.

(Edited for autocarrot)
 
Last edited:
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top