UK Population

[new2me]

'annoyed on behalf of'

and thereby lies the heart of the problem

Just as there is a perceived bandwagon for "annoyed/offended on behalf of" there is now a growing bandwagon for being annoyed with that bandwagon. People just seem to want to join one side or another, just so they can be part of some gang and call the other names. Personally, I can see where Ghoti is coming from in his posts, but also see why other members think the way they do; I don't believe anyone is ultimately right or wrong about anything and welcome any pathetic names anyone wants to direct at me for it.

 

[Cobra]

I can see where Ghoti is coming from in his posts,

Check the Avatar, you *may* have a sexual discrimination charge bought against you

 

[new2me]

Check the Avatar, you *may* have a sexual discrimination charge bought against you

oops!

 

[Phil V]

Check the Avatar, you *may* have a sexual discrimination charge bought against you

Though I'm not sure that is even close to discrimination. Isn't it simply a social embarrassment

 

[big soft moose]

If you look at the states Latino/hispanic people are generally looked down on and given second class jobs etc (particularly but not exclusively in the border area) theres not much doubt that the "ruling class" are predominantly White anglo saxons

Thus its worse that a white anglosaxon refer to a mexican derogatorily as a Beaner than a mexican refer to a White Anglosaxon as a WASP - because being called a wasp doesnt present barriers to employment and social advancement

I agree with gremlins sentiment - Intolerance is wrong, and yes we should focus on actions - which is why racial name calling is worse when acompanied by actually discrimination

 

[Cobra]

Though I'm not sure that is even close to discrimination. Isn't it simply a social embarrassment

Getting a gender wrong? Who knows these days?
Someone is likely to be offended I'm sure

But of course it maybe a double bluff and its me that's in the wrong to assume

 

[dejongj]

Y see, much as I'm as grumpy as you are (we could have a grump off), and I disapprove of 'annoyed on behalf of' throughout the political spectrum (it's not a leftie disease as it's often portrayed). I still know where I can find actual horrible racism, and where I can see it thinly veiled too.

Fair enough, although I'd rather have a pint with you and laugh about the silliness in the world. And yes there is horrible racism I'm not denying that, but lets face it, that is not @viv1969 here on the forum, anyone who has actually met her would know that. @ghoti has got that so wrong and is in my opinion so wrapped up in some odd pseudo intellectual reasoning that otherwise he/she would see that.

Thinly veiled racism is a difficult one, heck people have arguments about canon/Nikon, people's comprehension and (yes @Cobra here it comes...) personal responsibility is lacking at the best of times. Context is often missing as well. I find it hard to accept those people as racist. Heck the amount of times I could have taken offense of situations, but I prefer to take a positive interpretation. Only this week I got two black marks against my name on the board at work, one was for being a foreign git, and the other for bringing in Portuguese custard tarts on the day the boss was out. So many pickings there, but you know what, I see it as being part of the team as if I wasn't then they would be pussy footing around me. Nothing to do with being foreign, fat, black, jewish, british or whatsoever....

I think that in the 21st century too many people with not enough brain power overthink everything. I blame Oprah she started that television nonsense and now everyone thinks they are a psychiatrist or that it isn't their fault but the cause of someone else....

Nope, I'm a firm believer that change begins with oneself and nobody else. Off to my half full glass of Coca Cola Green

 

[big soft moose]

. I still know where I can find actual horrible racism, and where I can see it thinly veiled too.

ST4's posts ?

 

[Cobra]

two black marks against my name on the board at work, one was for being a foreign git, and the other for bringing in Portuguese custard tarts

I make that 3 strikes in one post, ......... you're out

 

[big soft moose]

Fair enough, although I'd rather have a pint with you and laugh about the silliness in the world. And yes there is horrible racism I'm not denying that, but lets face it, that is not @viv1969 here on the forum, anyone who has actually met her would know that. @ghoti has got that so wrong and is in my opinion so wrapped up in some odd pseudo intellectual reasoning that otherwise he/she would see that.
y

Whilst I make no allegation about Ruth per se - I would note that meeting someone for a few moments (or a few hours) doesn't qualify anyone to know what they think, feel, believe etc - there's a lady in our village who manifests as the sweetest little old lady going, kind, friendly, with a good word for everyone - right up to the point where the village post office was bought by an Algerian ... her take on that " well i won't be going in there any more, that paki bloke smells funny, and he's probably one of those muslim terrorists you hear about" , when he started selling home baked spelt bread " it smells wrong, i wouldn't put it past him to be poisoning it"

end of the day I'd judge racial prejudice by actions - if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and leaves duck s*** all over, its a duck ... if it talks like a racist , uses racist epiphets, and racial prejudiced opinions , then its a racist... regardless of how nice, friendly and amenable it might otherwise appear..

 

[dejongj]

cloggy
A particular breed of human who inhabit an exceedingly flat country bordering on the North Sea. Commonly over 6' tall, sporting a bushy moustache which does nothing to hide their enomous overbite, often seen riding ancient bicycles without due care and attention, and famed for wearing wooden shoes (clogs), from which their name derives. More likely to be on state-sponsored indefinite sick leave than have a job, these animals stack themselves into state-sponsored apartment blocks in the most densely populated area of northern Europe. Often seen in other parts of the world in their caravans, liberally stocked with chocolate sprinkles (to be eaten on bread), Heineken, meat croquettes, and porno mags, shocked that they are above sea level and not quite sure how to deal with the rarified air of the Cambridgeshire mountains. Children and dogs are usually untrained.

Luckily I've got a sense of humour. You've got to feel sorry for the cloggies who decent from Suriname, or the Antilles for example, they've got a double wammy. A bit like my best mate, then again he always got all the girls, don't think he was that bothered either

 

[viv1969]

.......
end of the day I'd judge racial prejudice by actions - if it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck and leaves duck s*** all over, its a duck ... if it talks like a racist , uses racist epiphets, and racial prejudiced opinions , then its a racist... regardless of how nice, friendly and amenable it might otherwise appear..

I use similar judgement methods for tw@ts.

 

[Cobra]

the sweetest little old lady going,

Different era different beliefs and she probably does believe everything she said.
In her eyes she is correct, and no amount of "You can't say that these days" will make her change her mind.

Whilst I make no allegation about Ruth per se

But you have insinuated by mentioning her name, and this is where it all goes tits up, I could be outraged on her behalf,
at a thinly veiled attempt to accuse her of racism,
or was it just a passing reference, with no malice intended?

It's all down to interpretation as are most of the posts in this thread.

 

[big soft moose]

But you have insinuated by mentioning her name, and this is where it all goes tits up,

Not at all (that would probably get me banned, again) the post i was replying to was about her so I was merely making it clear that my point was general and not about her specifically - saying "anyone who's met x would know that they aren't ABC" doesn't stand up - come to that you can know people for years and not really know them - to whit a lad i was good mates with at University has since become very active in far right causes (and i'm talking Nazi /EDL/White Supremacist type , not 'occasionally votes ukip') we spent three years on the same course and a year sharing the same house and I wouldn't have seen that coming in a million years

 

[dejongj]

Not at all (that would probably get me banned, again) the post i was replying to was about her so I was merely making it clear that my point was general and not about her specifically - saying "anyone who's met x would know that they aren't ABC" doesn't stand up - come to that you can know people for years and not really know them - to whit a lad i was good mates with at University has since become very active in far right causes (and i'm talking Nazi /EDL/White Supremacist type , not 'occasionally votes ukip') we spent three years on the same course and a year sharing the same house and I wouldn't have seen that coming in a million years

Fair enough, just remember that goes both ways Wouldn't it be wonderful if everyone keeps an open mind also to the point that they aren't so pre-occupied with...

 

[cambsno]

Fair enough, just remember that goes both ways Wouldn't it be wonderful if everyone keeps an open mind also to the point that they aren't so pre-occupied with...

Should point this to the organisers of gay pride, who tried to ban gay UKIP members this weekend!

 

[dejongj]

Should point this to the organisers of gay pride, who tried to ban gay UKIP members this weekend!

Excellent point well made, exactly what I mean.

 

[SFTPhotography]

When you deal gun to gun with another person, there's a 50% chance the dead person is going to be you.

Guns have no place outside the military and self defence is not a reason to own one.


Steve.

50% is better than 1%. If someone has a gun and you don't, the odds are 1% in your favour. A level playing fields better than the odds stacked against you.

Guns have a place in every home in the UK IMHO.

 

[Phil V]

50% is better than 1%. If someone has a gun and you don't, the odds are 1% in your favour. A level playing fields better than the odds stacked against you.

Guns have a place in every home in the UK IMHO.

Well you're entitled to your opinion, it makes it easier for the rest of us to be able to see that everything you say comes from a complete lack of understanding of the subject.
Post away, it's hilarious.

 

[SFTPhotography]

I think the paint is beginning to chip here and we're starting to see the ugly picture underneath. The REAL reason why people are uncomfortable with immigration, asylum seeking, etc. It's not about "space". It's not about taxes or the economy. That's just the window dressing.

It's about racism. Ethnocentrism. Jingoism. Xenophobia. And a complete inability to engage with or even understand issues of cultural privilege.

"Cloggy could be the same as nigger". LOL.

I've never seen why is racist to want to put the needs of our own countrymen first and give them the best chances of success.

I've never seen how it's greedy and selfish to want to keep what is yours but it's not greedy to want someone else's wealth spent in you because you have less.

I cannot see for the life of me how it's racist to want to control who comes in to your country and how it's wrong.

People go through a selection process for a job, why should it be any different for entering our country?

 

[SFTPhotography]

Well you're entitled to your opinion, it makes it easier for the rest of us to be able to see that everything you say comes from a complete lack of understanding of the subject.
Post away, it's hilarious.

Are you unable to grasp that 50 is greater than 1? Really, if that's how simple you are I pity you.

 

[Steve Smith]

50% is better than 1%. If someone has a gun and you don't, the odds are 1% in your favour. A level playing fields better than the odds stacked against you.

Guns have a place in every home in the UK IMHO.

The best odds are if neither party has a gun. The UK banned guns for self defence back in the 1930s for very good reasons.

Guns have no place in the home. You are plain wrong on this. The state of the US should be all the proof we need that this does not work.


Steve.

 

[SFTPhotography]

The best odds are if neither party has a gun. The UK banned guns for self defence back in the 1930s for very good reasons.

Guns have no place in the home. You are plain wrong on this. The state of the US should be all the proof we need that this does not work.


Steve.

Guns are great and should be in every home in the land.

Crooks here have guns, jihadists have guns. Why should British citizens be cannon fodder for them.

Every British home should have at least one gun.

 

[dejongj]

Guns are great and should be in every home in the land.

Crooks here have guns, jihadists have guns. Why should British citizens be cannon fodder for them.

Every British home should have at least one gun.

Oh no. I don't agree with that at all. I'm quite happy with the current system.

other than for commercial gain I can't think of any benefits to that at all.

 

[Steve Smith]

The vast majority in the UK do not have guns. That's why we don't have a gun problem here.

The US has almost as many guns as it has citizens. That's why they have a major gun probnlem.

I think I prefer what we have here to what the US has. Lets keep it that way.


Steve.

 

[SFTPhotography]

You fear them too?

Despise.

 

[viv1969]

Should point this to the organisers of gay pride, who tried to ban gay UKIP members this weekend!

And yet you try to prevent gays from doing anything......

 

[simon ess]

I can understand why someone full of fear, hatred and violent thoughts would want a gun.

Of course, they would be the very last person who should be allowed to own a gun.

 

[SFTPhotography]

The vast majority in the UK do not have guns. That's why we don't have a gun problem here.

Things change, criminals have them. Terrorists do. Imagine in the Charlie Hebbo office one of the jourbos had a gun. They could have shot the shooter dead before he wiped out the entire office. Or in the case of Tunisia if one of the tourists had a gun they could have shot back. *unlikely as it is you take a gun to the beach.

Maybe we need lots more armed police

 

[KIPAX]

I read all the posts in the first page.. thought hmm 7 pages.. jumped to the last page and read all these .....then wondered if I had jumped to a different thread... I really can't see gays being the reason for over population.. surely the opposite

 

[dejongj]

Things change, criminals have them. Terrorists do. Imagine in the Charlie Hebbo office one of the jourbos had a gun. They could have shot the shooter dead before he wiped out the entire office. Or in the case of Tunisia if one of the tourists had a gun they could have shot back. *unlikely as it is you take a gun to the beach.

Maybe we need lots more armed police

No, it would have merely caused an even bigger blood bath, Wild West style.

 

[Steve Smith]

Things change, criminals have them

Not many criminals here have guns. The fact that they are not generally available means that they are difficult to get - even for criminals. And that's the way it should be.


Steve.

 

[Steve Smith]

I think every country in the world should have nuclear missiles.

Nuclear missiles keep us safe.

That sounds ridiculous doesn't it?!!!

Same with guns.


Steve.

 

[big soft moose]

50% is better than 1%. If someone has a gun and you don't, the odds are 1% in your favour. A level playing fields better than the odds stacked against you.

Guns have a place in every home in the UK IMHO.

if someone has a gun and you don't then your best bet is to run like hell or do everything they say

if someone has a gun and you do - unless you are combat trained- your best bet is to run like hell or do everything they say, but you won't because having a gun creates an illusion of the ability to resist - thus you are actually more likely to get shot by acting like a penis if you are armed than if you arent.

Admittedly if you are combat trained you can then shoot the intruder several times in the head with confidence and far higher than 50% success rate...at which point you will then go to prison for manslaughter (or murder if the 'intruder' turns out to be your fiancee, child, or random stranger asking directions)

 

[big soft moose]

Things change, criminals have them. Terrorists do. Imagine in the Charlie Hebbo office one of the jourbos had a gun. They could have shot the shooter dead before he wiped out the entire office.

or he could have inadvertently shot one of his colleagues, put his next three rounds through the ceiling and then been gunned down while wondering why he missed -your attitide to firearms tends to suggest that the closest you've been to a gun is via your xbox or tv screen

 

[cambsno]

Not many criminals here have guns. The fact that they are not generally available means that they are difficult to get - even for criminals. And that's the way it should be.


Steve.

If we all had guns the criminals would be more likely to be tooled up too. While it could help to have a gun, and there are doubtless some stories where the homeowner having a gun could have saved their life, I think it would be a slippery slope

 

[Garry Edwards]

Back on topic...
The problem with immigration into this country (from outside the EU) is historical, it has caused problems that cannot now be undone, it isn't the fault of either the immigrants or the indiginous population, it's the fault of the Labour government who have now admitted to having a policy of letting in just about everyone who wanted to come, regardless of whether they would benefit us or not...

But the situation is now entirely different, and has perhaps gone too far.
A friend of mine, a Chinese citizen who has lived here for most of his life, has had enormous problems getting an entry visa for his wife, also Chinese. He meets the criteria in every way (character, income etc) and so does she (higher education, a real asset to the UK because she will be paying a lot in tax, she greatly exceeds their required standards for both written and spoken English, there is no possible doubt that their relationship is genuine) so no apparent problem - but the process to get her entry visa, granted last week, has taken nearly a year and her initial application (which cost over £1000) was rejected on entirely spurious grounds and an appeal then had to be made, costing a shedload more money, before she was granted the visa.

Contrast this to the situation in the late 90's, when female Pakistani employees were sent by their parents for a 'holiday' abroad, only to find when they arrived that a marriage had been arranged to men that they had never even heard of, and their new husbands, who had no skills and no English language, were immediately granted a visa. I'm no longer in touch with any of those people, but in the time that I was, I can say with certainty that they did nothing to enrich our country.

 

[LCPete]

The best odds are if neither party has a gun. The UK banned guns for self defence back in the 1930s for very good reasons.

Guns have no place in the home. You are plain wrong on this. The state of the US should be all the proof we need that this does not work.


Steve.

Exactly you're way wrong with this Steve I bet a lot of people in the states wish that their gun laws were the same as ours ie nobody can have them

 

[Steve Smith]

Exactly you're way wrong with this Steve I bet a lot of people in the states wish that their gun laws were the same as ours ie nobody can have them

I know quite a few Americans who would rather have our gun laws. Unfortunately, the right wing nuts and the NRA are such a strong force and they do everything they can to protect their second amendment rights - even though it has no modern day relevance.

After every US shooting, out comes an NRA apologist pointing out that guns aren't the problem, people are... forgetting that they have so many guns there that anyone can get one.

In fact, I think they are so far down that particular route that even a law banning every type of gun would have little effect. There are just so many in circulation in the US that legislation would be pointless.


Steve.

 

[Steve Smith]

And back to the subject of immigration, people have migrated ever since they existed.

Our problems started when we let those pesky Saxons in!


Steve.