Returning a brand new camera for a refund/swap?

Sharps

Sharps

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Hi

Just after some advice. I purchased my wife a Panasonic S5 with a 20-60mm lens (comes as a kit with a shooting grip) last week, she has used it a couple of times but complained of lag when using the EVF and rear display. I took it out this morning for quick use and the lag is awful to the point where the camera is unusable, which is a shame as we both thought the camera would be great for her usage.
Where do I stand, can I return and either swap for another camera or refund to spend on another camera with wex?
 
WEX have a good return pollicy and you could return it for a refund within 30 days of purchase. Obviously, if you have taken a lot of shots or there are signs of any wear etc that could be an issue. Best to contact them right away.
 
Could it be a settings question......?

What sort of lag, shutter, EVF/rear LCD 'updating'... ...etc
 
Sharps said:
Hi

Just after some advice. I purchased my wife a Panasonic S5 with a 20-60mm lens (comes as a kit with a shooting grip) last week, she has used it a couple of times but complained of lag when using the EVF and rear display. I took it out this morning for quick use and the lag is awful to the point where the camera is unusable, which is a shame as we both thought the camera would be great for her usage.
Where do I stand, can I return and either swap for another camera or refund to spend on another camera with wex?
Click to expand...

Best bet is contact WEX, they might want to charge a restocking now its essentially a used camera.
What do their return terms say?
Just looked out of interest and its as follows, might want to ring them up and discuss

The item must be complete and in the same condition in which you received it:
  • If you have opened the box to examine the product you must have done so without damaging or marking the product or packaging
  • You haven't used the item (items are not sold on a trial basis)
  • The item contains no personal data and hasn't been registered to a user
 
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It's a simple case of the camera not being fit for purpose. Just return it for a full refund.

Wex are normally very good, so I can't see there being any argument, but obviously it will be to their advantage if you take another camera rather than a refund.
 
Panasonics work slightly differently....
What are you settings when you notice the lag?
If your shutter speed is on the lower side with live view effects turned on, your live view will seem laggy
You just need to turn off that setting.
 
Box Brownie said:
Could it be a settings question......?

What sort of lag, shutter, EVF/rear LCD 'updating'... ...etc
Click to expand...
When you move the camera around it takes a second or two to catch up, makes you feel like you have motion sickness!
 
nandbytes said:
Panasonics work slightly differently....
What are you settings when you notice the lag?
If your shutter speed is on the lower side with live view effects turned on, your live view will seem laggy
You just need to turn off that setting.
Click to expand...
She uses manual mode but I tried A and P modes and its still evident in those modes, not sure about the effects being turned on , i will have to look at that
 
Sharps said:
She uses manual mode but I tried A and P modes and its still evident in those modes, not sure about the effects being turned on , i will have to look at that
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Nothing to do with the shooting mode.
The camera will try to emulate a slow shutter speed which makes it seem laggy.
 
nandbytes said:
Nothing to do with the shooting mode.
The camera will try to emulate a slow shutter speed which makes it seem laggy.
Click to expand...

Ah - this might explain my intense dislike of a Panasonic mirrorless system I tried years ago. It really was laggy and buggy.

Of course, with an optical view finder you don't have to worry about such things and can just get on with things
 
SFTPhotography said:
Ah - this might explain my intense dislike of a Panasonic mirrorless system I tried years ago. It really was laggy and buggy.

Of course, with an optical view finder you don't have to worry about such things and can just get on with things
Click to expand...

I quite like a number of Panasonic cameras despite some of their shortcomings.
 
nandbytes said:
Apart from all the recent Sony and Nikon FF camera and Fuji MF ;)
Click to expand...

Last Sony I tried was the A7RIII - could see it was getting there but not quite. The A7RiV and A1 are more interesting but I feel they feel a little small in the hands for me. Z7 - not arsed. Only 45mp and doesn't seem to offer anything over a D850 for me.

Fuji - yes - but only for the 100mp - which will come to Pentax and probably the K1 III will have the A7RIV sensor.

As a camera, ignoring the sensor, the 645z is a landscape shooters dream. So logically laid out and the nice big OVF makes composing a joy and doddle. Throw in the hilariously accurate AF - stupendously accurate metering and it's the DSLR to end all DSLRs.
 
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nandbytes said:
Panasonics work slightly differently....
What are you settings when you notice the lag?
If your shutter speed is on the lower side with live view effects turned on, your live view will seem laggy
You just need to turn off that setting.
Click to expand...
Live view is greyed out and i cant even select it
 

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SFTPhotography said:
Last Sony I tried was the A7RIII - could see it was getting there but not quite. The A7RiV and A1 are more interesting but I feel they feel a little small in the hands for me. Z7 - not arsed. Only 45mp and doesn't seem to offer anything over a D850 for me.

Fuji - yes - but only for the 100mp - which will come to Pentax and probably the K1 III will have the A7RIV sensor.

As a camera, ignoring the sensor, the 645z is a landscape shooters dream. So logically laid out and the nice big OVF makes composing a joy and doddle. Throw in the hilariously accurate AF - stupendously accurate metering and it's the DSLR to end all DSLRs.
Click to expand...
Especially for landscapes I'd say EVF it far more useful to have than OVF.
 
tijuana taxi said:
Best bet is contact WEX, they might want to charge a restocking now its essentially a used camera.
What do their return terms say?
Just looked out of interest and its as follows, might want to ring them up and discuss

The item must be complete and in the same condition in which you received it:
  • If you have opened the box to examine the product you must have done so without damaging or marking the product or packaging
  • You haven't used the item (items are not sold on a trial basis)
  • The item contains no personal data and hasn't been registered to a user
Click to expand...

So their terms *say* that.....but last time I checked (and it's been a while - this legislation moves fast), there was a clause that said retailers had to accept returns even if the item had been used if it's the sort of item you can't tell whether it's suitable for you without using it. As long as the item is perfect and the packaging is completely undamaged I'd return it under the grounds that I no longer wanted it. You have more rights here than claiming it's essentially "faulty by design".
 
Sharps said:
streamable.com

Watch VID_20210822_145751 (1) | Streamable

Watch "VID_20210822_145751 (1)" on Streamable.
streamable.com

A quick video of the lag
Click to expand...
Your problem is not the camera but the speed you are moving the camera at in that video. Rolling shutter is not uncommon and one has to adapt to the camera not the camera to the photographer. This is one of the things I have learnt to overcome to a certain extent. My advice is slow down and don't rush, doing videos is entirely different from taking stills. Even with my Sony FDR-ax53 handycam I will have the same issue as you if I pan too fast. Pan at the speed that the camera is capable of. may seem very slow to do so but the videos will come out a lot better
I have been taking videos for 10+ years and still got a lot more to learn, such as how long for a clip before it becomes boring. I have been watching carefully on youtube and counting the seconds from one shot to another and generally it is about 5 seconds
 
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SFTPhotography said:
I don't see why? Particularly in low light, or with the sun behind you they don't work so well. I've yet to see how this system would improve my photography.
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Not all OVFs are (were?) equal,

I'm guessing your 645Z is bright and has a decent focusig screen?

But when DSLRs were gaining traction in the mass market the cheaper APS-C ones had pentamirror based OVFs which are quite a step down from the 'proper' pentaprism based bright OVFs in professional grade cameras. The use of AF meant that manual focusing was less important so OVFs got worse in cheaper SLRs in the 90s.
 
Dryce said:
Not all OVFs are (were?) equal,

I'm guessing your 645Z is bright and has a decent focusig screen?

But when DSLRs were gaining traction in the mass market the cheaper APS-C ones had pentamirror based OVFs which are quite a step down from the 'proper' pentaprism based bright OVFs in professional grade cameras. The use of AF meant that manual focusing was less important so OVFs got worse in cheaper SLRs in the 90s.
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That is a fair point.

I recall trying @Kevin O'Brian D700 years back and that's what got the bug caught for larger cameras. At the time I had D80 and the D700 viewfinder seemed vast, and bright.

The 645z has a really large viewfinder - but oddly a 99% one which means you end up with a hair more - just a crop away.

Not tried any EVF that was really satisfactory tbh but as the tech improves and the DSLR really does die - I guess I'll have to.

I doubt the Panasonic camera here in question is actually faulty - and as @nandbytes has pointed out the lag is a function of the camera shutter speed. My advice to the OP is to try it in brigher condtions and see if this failt persists - I suspect it's more of a characteristic and "they all do that sir".

A faultly camera as such would probably not power on, shutter would jam, randomly freeze etc.
 
SFTPhotography said:
I don't see why? Particularly in low light, or with the sun behind you they don't work so well. I've yet to see how this system would improve my photography.
Click to expand...

In low light I can actually see things through the EVF unlike OVF where it's just darkness.
Easier to manually focus to with EVF especially for night time photography where you can focus in on individual stars.
It also provides WYSIWYG which OVF doesn't and simply was a waste of time chimping especially when I am trying to get through a bunch of shots quickly.
Not to mention all the other aids it provides like peaking, histogram, leveling etc.
Can't see why EVF is an issue with sun behind you. There is no issues what so ever in my experience.

The only area where OVF was superior until recently was for shooting action as it's lag free but bodies like Sony A9 or A1 (soon R3/Z9) has changed that too.

Personally I pretty much see no reason to get a camera with OVF, EVF is a better tool for the job
 
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realspeed said:
Your problem is not the camera but the speed you are moving the camera at in that video. Rolling shutter is not uncommon and one has to adapt to the camera not the camera to the photographer. This is one of the things I have learnt to overcome to a certain extent. My advice is slow down and don't rush, doing videos is entirely different from taking stills. Even with my Sony FDR-ax53 handycam I will have the same issue as you if I pan too fast. Pan at the speed that the camera is capable of. may seem very slow to do so but the videos will come out a lot better
I have been taking videos for 10+ years and still got a lot more to learn, such as how long for a clip before it becomes boring. I have been watching carefully on youtube and counting the seconds from one shot to another and generally it is about 5 seconds
Click to expand...
The camera is for photography not for video, this was just a little sample of how bad it can be, we tried taking stills of ducks today in our local pond but couldn't even track them without really bad lag, never had this on another system, so the Panasonic just isn't to our needs if we cant rack wildlife or sports due to not being able to move the camera without it lagging
 
Sharps said:
The camera is for photography not for video, this was just a little sample of how bad it can be, we tried taking stills of ducks today in our local pond but couldn't even track them without really bad lag, never had this on another system, so the Panasonic just isn't to our needs if we cant rack wildlife or sports due to not being able to move the camera without it lagging
Click to expand...

Looks like you're looking at a Sony A1, or DSLR or other high end mirrorless system

nandbytes said:
In low light I can actually see things through the EVF unlike OVF where it's just darkness.
Easier to manually focus to with EVF especially for night time photography where you can focus in on individual stars.
It also provides WYSIWYG which OVF doesn't and simply was a waste of time chimping especially when I am trying to get through a bunch of shots quickly.
Not to mention all the other aids it provides like peaking, histogram, leveling etc.
Can't see why EVF is an issue with sun behind you. There is no issues what so ever in my experience.

The only area where OVF was superior until recently was for shooting action as it's lag free but bodies like Sony A9 or A1 (soon R3/Z9) has changed that too.

Personally I pretty much see no reason to get a camera with OVF, EVF is a better tool for the job
Click to expand...

Ha, both my 5ds and 645z have in viewfinder leveling - and both will give histograms in live view. The metering is so good with the 645z it doesn't need this function - and it has focus peaking, which I've never bothered to use as again, with the AF it just finds it.

I've never not been able to see anything with an OVF. They're ace.
 
Sharps said:
The camera is for photography not for video, this was just a little sample of how bad it can be, we tried taking stills of ducks today in our local pond but couldn't even track them without really bad lag, never had this on another system, so the Panasonic just isn't to our needs if we cant rack wildlife or sports due to not being able to move the camera without it lagging
Click to expand...
You will never be happy with it, if it is within the terms of sale return it. :)
 
Sharps said:
The camera is for photography not for video, this was just a little sample of how bad it can be, we tried taking stills of ducks today in our local pond but couldn't even track them without really bad lag, never had this on another system, so the Panasonic just isn't to our needs if we cant rack wildlife or sports due to not being able to move the camera without it lagging
Click to expand...
If the lag means that you cannot track moving objects then the camera is not fit for purpose. Return it.
 
Bit surprised because my G9 with the latest firmware does a good job of tracking.
 
tijuana taxi said:
Bit surprised because my G9 with the latest firmware does a good job of tracking.
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I also have an S1 and cant fault it, that's why I bought my wife the S5 thinking it would be fit for purpose
 
If you bought it mail order rather than from a branch, you may have additional rights to a refund under the Distance Selling Regulations, which allow a 14 day return window.
 
Retune said:
If you bought it mail order rather than from a branch, you may have additional rights to a refund under the Distance Selling Regulations, which allow a 14 day return window.
Click to expand...
Thanks but does this still apply if I have tested the camera?
 
JonathanRyan said:
So their terms *say* that.....but last time I checked (and it's been a while - this legislation moves fast), there was a clause that said retailers had to accept returns even if the item had been used if it's the sort of item you can't tell whether it's suitable for you without using it. As long as the item is perfect and the packaging is completely undamaged I'd return it under the grounds that I no longer wanted it. You have more rights here than claiming it's essentially "faulty by design".
Click to expand...
That was my understanding, your basically allowed the same rights you would if you went into the shop, ie unpack an item and try it.
 
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