Politeness in modern society - was I wrong?

fracster said:
Kick him in the balls instead next time Dave..........:thumbs:
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When I last looked, that wasn't possible on the telephone. ;)

And no, it wasn't unreasonable at all. If he'd been upset by it all, then so be it.

As for the mother, she sounds like a bully as well. Only problem is, bullies in the adult world aren't quite as effective. She's probably best ignored, I would imagine.

Alternatively, if she said something like "speak to me next time you have a problem"... you could have just replied with "'c'mon now... what's the magic word?"
 
I have a 30 year old hanimex 200mm lens solid metal and verey heavy,I would have asked mother and scrote to play head tennis with it


TO KNOCK SOME BLOODY MANNERS INTO THE PAIR OF THEM
 
altyfc said:
When I last looked, that wasn't possible on the telephone. ;)

And no, it wasn't unreasonable at all. If he'd been upset by it all, then so be it.

As for the mother, she sounds like a bully as well. Only problem is, bullies in the adult world aren't quite as effective. She's probably best ignored, I would imagine.

Alternatively, if she said something like "speak to me next time you have a problem"... you could have just replied with "'c'mon now... what's the magic word?"
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Like it :thumbs:

DD
 
dellipher said:
:lol::lol::lol::lol:
I could imagine dave saying that in a completely patronising tone! :)
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Obviously

But then - what are you saying ???

I NEVER patronise anyone !!!






Ok - guilty as charged - but they deserved it your honour

DD
 
fabs said:
Just a thought here. If you are told off, aren't you SUPPOSED to be upset by it? That's the whole point, wouldn't be very effective if it was a pleasant experience! :bang:
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Hmmm - so you're saying I shouldn't have laughed at her ???

I see your point

BTW - her 6ft 3" hubby was standing alongside her at the time (she's about 5ft 3") and he didn't look me in the eye as he passed, in fact I'd say he 'shrunk' in embarrassment at his wife :lol:

DD
 
CaptainPenguin said:
I have a 30 year old hanimex 200mm lens solid metal and verey heavy,I would have asked mother and scrote to play head tennis with it


TO KNOCK SOME BLOODY MANNERS INTO THE PAIR OF THEM
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I hear you mate

Wouldn't want to risk any lens on them though - unless it was a Canon, then it wouldn't matter :D

DD
 
altyfc said:
When I last looked, that wasn't possible on the telephone. ;)
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Thanks for that pearl of wisdom, I meant a metaphorical kick in the balls, well, you know what I meant............:lol:
 
next time he forgets to say hi or please etc. hang up the phone:thumbs:

he will either get the idea, or stop calling, either way its a winner

:hug:<<looking for this smilie???
 
DiddyDave said:
:eek::eek::eek:

For God's sake tell me you made that up ???

:shake::shake::shake:

DD
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nope its called self forfilling prophosy (cant spell it) basically if u labell a child and they hear it enough they start to believe their no good and so act accordingly lol its all about labels
 
so i can blame my parents for why im a *******:thumbs:
thanks for the heads up ashers:)
 
Ashers said:
nope its called self forfilling prophosy (cant spell it) basically if u labell a child and they hear it enough they start to believe their no good and so act accordingly lol its all about labels
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Claptrap, with all due respect..........:)
 
So what exactly is the self fulfilling prophecy? I think it has relevance especially to parents and school teachers, or anyone who works directly with a child. Here is an example of how this theory works. It really is quit simple. Johnny is a student who is always thought of as being unruly and bad in school. He has had problems year after year. Teachers expect Johnny to be bad, his parents expect him to be bad, and school administrators expect him to be bad. Not a year has gone by with Johnny disappointing them. He succeeds every year in fulfilling the prophecy of being a bad child. The teacher automatically starts treating Johnny like a bad kid, putting him in the time out desk from the first day. When Johnny gets home, the parents say, "So how long before you teacher calls and tells me your bad? I swear, if I have to put up with what I did last year, your in for it." Geez, give Johnny a break. Poor Johnny doesn't stand a chance from the start. Everyone has framed Johnny as who he is, a bad unruly child. So why should Johnny act differently? He is living out his self fulfilling prophecy or that of being the expected bad child.
 
or he could think, im not bad and ill prove it???

so how should that situation be dealt with?
 
The following five-step model explains how the SFP works:

1. The teacher forms expectations.

2. Based upon these expectations, the teacher acts in a differential manner.

3. The teacher's treatment tells each student (loud and clear) what behavior and what achievement the teacher expects.

4. If this treatment is consistent, it will tend to shape the student's behavior and achievement.

5. With time, the student's behavior and achievement will conform more and more closely to that expected of him or her.

its called the pygmalion effect

this has been taken from http://www.ericdigests.org/1999-3/good.htm
 
Ashers said:
nope its called self forfilling prophosy (cant spell it) basically if u labell a child and they hear it enough they start to believe their no good and so act accordingly lol its all about labels
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Remind me...which university are you studying at? :shake:
 
so do i assume these expectations are targets for the kid to aim for??? or things like, i expect you to throw paper planes cross the room all day?
 
fletch5 said:
or he could think, im not bad and ill prove it???

so how should that situation be dealt with?
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well personally i feel like positive renforcement, but not to the point of excluding the good kids, because then the good kid thinks hes being naughty and gets attention, im being good and im being ignored so ill be nasughty, that is something that can happen, positive re-enforcement i think, reward good behavior, sometime negative re-enforcement can make the kid be naughtier because they are getting the attention they want, so by rewarding the positives and not punishing the negatives u will get the kid to go hey i like being good. when i say not punishing what i mean is this, give them something good, to start off with a good word or a goal, or something for them to be good for, but take it away when naughty, rather than giving them punishment, not lt them have th good thing the other members of the class are getting, so the kid will think hey i dont like this, and it encourages the other kids to be good while also encourages good behaviour in the naughty child.... just my 10p u understand
 
ok, but arent you excluding the child by taking the good thing away??
 
well you have to think about it like this, by re-enforcing his negative behavior, you risk alienating the harder working members of the class, or the group, as they will suffer, you need to strike a balance. the naughty child will get the treats if they are good, and you explain that to them and to the class /group as a whole. its not taking it away, as such like say if the class do their work for x amount of time, they get a treat, if they are naughty then that treat gets taken away from the offenders. the offenders will want the treat and seek to improve. there is no magic wand for it its just trial and error, because there may be underlying reasons for the way the child is acting, sociol problems, learning difficulties, like dislexia, bullying etc
 
mature student, they went on my life experiance rather than quals. i wasnt very good at school. i was lazy. i got my equiv of 11+ in maths (key skills level 2) in 2005 on my second attempt, and a C in english on my third attempt. but it was hard. i also did an a level in english but got an E. my academic passion is sociology but u couldnt do that at school when i was a lad.
 
Ashers said:
im not studying english... lol and i use spell check in word but the spell check on here wont work for me.
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A spell checker won't tell you when to use loose or lose; their, there or they're, and lots of other common mistakes. Here's something I found not long ago:

Eye have a spelling chequer, it came with my pea sea
It plainly marks four my revue miss steaks eye kin knot sea.
Eye strike a quay and type a word and weight for it to say
Weather eye yam wrong oar write, it shows me strait a weigh.
As soon as a mist ache is maid it nose bee fore two long
And eye can put the error rite its rare lea ever wrong.
Eye have run this poem threw it I'm shore your pleased to no
Its letter perfect awl the way, my chequer told me sew.
 
fabs said:
Expecting a child to be naughty and treating them with that in mind is very different to telling them they have been naughty. Children need to know if they have done something naughty.
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:agree:

But his explanation of SFP makes sense, as does positive reinforcement rather than negative (which is easier!)

What this really comes back to with the kid in question though is... crap parents. I think it's crazy teachers have to be trained in correcting bad parenting - I say...

'Naughty kid = get parents in for a few lessons on parenting"



And as for Asher's spelling/grammar, well we all make mistakes and some people just can't get it right - he may be dyslexic and not know. What does make me smile though is the spelling of 'Cannon' under the avatar - take a look at the front of your camera m8 :thumbs:

DD
 
DiddyDave said:
But his explanation of SFP makes sense, as does positive reinforcement rather than negative (which is easier!)
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I agree with that 100%. Was just pointing out that the situation you were talking about was different.

DiddyDave said:
What this really comes back to with the kid in question though is... crap parents. I think it's crazy teachers have to be trained in correcting bad parenting - I say...

'Naughty kid = get parents in for a few lessons on parenting"
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Oh if only!

DiddyDave said:
What does make me smile though is the spelling of 'Cannon' under the avatar - take a look at the front of your camera m8 :thumbs:
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:lol::lol::lol:
 
Armchair parenting...this boys parents are probably guilty of this and should be ashamed of themselves for confronting you in public but at the end of the day it is not the right way to deal with it and sets another bad example for thier boy to follow.

It will probably backfire on the parents when the boy lets them down badly later in life...then again would they even care.
 
DiddyDave;1123913 What this really comes back to with the kid in question though is... crap parents. I think it's crazy teachers have to be trained in correcting bad parenting - I say... 'Naughty kid = get parents in for a few lessons on parenting" DD[/QUOTE said:
I agree. My Father-in-law sent me the following in an email, and I thought it quite fitting.

At one point during a game, the coach said to one of his young players, "Do you understand what cooperation is and what teamwork is all about?" The little boy nodded in the affirmative.

"Do you understand that what really matters is not whether we win or lose, but that we play together as a team?" The little boy nodded yes.

"Good," the coach continued. "And, when a strike is called, or you're thrown out at first, you don't argue, curse, attack the umpire with a bat, or throw dirt in the opposing team members' faces. Do you understand all that?"

Again the little boy nodded, "Well, sure, coach. That's what you taught us."

"Good," said the coach. "Now, please go over there and explain all that to your mother."
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nilagin said:
I agree. My Father-in-law sent me the following in an email, and I thought it quite fitting.

At one point during a game, the coach said to one of his young players, "Do you understand what cooperation is and what teamwork is all about?" The little boy nodded in the affirmative.

"Do you understand that what really matters is not whether we win or lose, but that we play together as a team?" The little boy nodded yes.

"Good," the coach continued. "And, when a strike is called, or you're thrown out at first, you don't argue, curse, attack the umpire with a bat, or throw dirt in the opposing team members' faces. Do you understand all that?"

Again the little boy nodded, "Well, sure, coach. That's what you taught us."

"Good," said the coach. "Now, please go over there and explain all that to your mother."
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Quite !!!

DD
 
At one point during a game, the coach said to one of his young players, "Do you understand what cooperation is and what teamwork is all about?" The little boy nodded in the affirmative.

"Do you understand that what really matters is not whether we win or lose, but that we play together as a team?" The little boy nodded yes.

"Good," the coach continued. "And, when a strike is called, or you're thrown out at first, you don't argue, curse, attack the umpire with a bat, or throw dirt in the opposing team members' faces. Do you understand all that?"

Again the little boy nodded, "Well, sure, coach. That's what you taught us."

"Good," said the coach. "Now, please go over there and explain all that to your mother."
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:lol::lol::lol: That's brilliant!
 
Sadly our teachers are not good teachers any more. Most of them are totally depressed about the whole thing. I am not being rude towards them, its a bit like saying all TP photographers are not good photographers anymore just after all our cameras have been taken away.

Teachers have lost the right to punish. We have four children. Three have left home and are over 20. Two of them are at university. Our fourth was 3 two weeks ago. She already understands the routine - an iron fist in a velvet glove. She has mega tons of love and time spent on her but step out of line and she hears the mention of a smacked hand - it stops her in her tracks.

Here she is doing her home work :):)

jessatwork.jpg


as you can see, neither hand is currently too red, I have not had to punish her for some time

stew
 
My Wife works in a Girls high school, the same school that my two girls attend and she is amazed sometimes at the unfairness of thier policies, for example if you are a child who is unruly and a poor attender you will get a 10.00 phone top up of your choice if you attend for 2 full weeks with no lates or detentions....the good kids get nothing.

Kids who are under learning mentors for having bad behaviour or home issues get special flexibility with returning homework, assignments etc even extended times for Sats tests.....the good kids get detention and no leeway at all and believe me they can get Mondo Homework!

the upside is that good kids get good grades in the end and ultimately live better more fruitful lives...Hopefully
 
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