It seems an integrated Muslim is not what some want, very very sad story.

[LASTOLITE]

I have just been told this in the last 10 mins and I said I don't believe it. Its very sad,

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/655611/Muslim-shopkeeper-murdered-after-wishing-Happy-Easter

Apologies if its been posted already.

My sympathy and heart felt feelings to Mr Shah's family and may he rest in peace.

This was what he did wrong - posted this message...he was only 40 years old and served his local community in his shop, very sad indeed.

 

[LongLensPhotography]

+1. A jihadist killed him because he apparently wasn't a true salafist / wahhabyst Muslim. Very sad indeed.

This murderous despicable scum has no place in Europe nor anywhere on planet earth.

 

[EdwardL]

It is sad, isn't it? And in the UK. No excuse but this won't be the work of a true Christian or Muslim.

We don't hear half of what's going on in the world. I go to church regularly and earlier in the year we were told about christians in Syria (I think) being murdered and the priests being crucified upside down, just like St. Peter. This wasn't in the media and it's barbaric what some humans do. This act to Mr. Shah is just as disgusting.

 

[OldCarlos]

It was on the news yesterday. A decent guy living & working hard who was liked by most of the community. He posts a good will message, only for some dirty, twisted religious zealot, to take offence! (apparently)

 

[studioworks]

I only heard about this briefly and assumed it was a robbery gone wrong etc, the fact he could be murdered for being so open minded is even more appalling.

 

[LASTOLITE]

It was on the news yesterday. A decent guy living & working hard who was liked by most of the community. He posts a good will message, only for some dirty, twisted religious zealot, to take offence! (apparently)

Have read more about the guy now, just sickening a fellow muslim has taken exception to his good will to Christians and The Jewish communities and this country. It appears he was an agent of cross faith harmony in the area and has used social media to unite all together in the area. A Muslim maverick of sorts breaking ranks and desiring peace. very sad he should loose his life and his family be left this way.

 

[simon ess]

Agree with all the sentiments expressed here, but I have to express my discomfort at this statement,

A Muslim maverick of sorts breaking ranks and desiring peace

He was not the maverick, the extremist nutter who killed him is the maverick.

 

[Ricardodaforce]

Agree with all the sentiments expressed here, but I have to express my discomfort at this statement,



He was not the maverick, the extremist nutter who killed him is the maverick.

Indeed.

 

[LASTOLITE]

Agree with all the sentiments expressed here, but I have to express my discomfort at this statement,



He was not the maverick, the extremist nutter who killed him is the maverick.

Yeah you may well be correct standing up and desiring peace should not be viewed as what is unusual here, I agree. I mean in the Muslim community he was outspoken for integration and was active in trying to unite various communities, in his area. but I see what you mean and I agree!

 

[StewartR]

I read this in the papers yesterday. It really is an appalling story.

He was not the maverick, the extremist nutter who killed him is the maverick.

Well yeah. I know what you mean.

However the victim was an Ahmadi, and mainstream Muslims regard Ahmadis as heretics, so in that very narrow and restrictive sense he was arguably something of a maverick. Mainstream Islam treats heresy as punishable by death. So if the motivation for the murder was the fact that the shopkeeper was an Ahmadi, rather than his promotion of inter-faith harmony, then the extremist nutter was arguably just doing what his mainstream beliefs required.

What a mess. That's not how religion is supposed to work, surely.

 

[simon ess]

That's not how religion is supposed to work, surely.

Quite.

If there is a god, he'll be doing a massive face palm.

 

[arclight]

The motive for the killing has not yet been made public.

 

[viv1969]

The motive for the killing has not yet been made public.

And is rather irrelevant IMO.

 

[StewartR]

The motive for the killing has not yet been made public.

And is rather irrelevant IMO.

Absolutely, couldn't agree more.

When I mentioned the motive I was just making the narrow technical point that the extremist nutter *might* not be viewed as an extremist nutter by mainstream Muslims. It would be interesting to see whether the Muslim Council of Great Britain support the death sentence for an Ahmadi heretic, but I sure hope not.

 

[Laudrup]

The motive is entirely relevant, especially when the imam of the Glasgow Mosque is praising extremist murderers like Mumtaz Qadri who was hanged in Pakistan after murdering a local politician who opposed strict blasphemy laws.

 

[viv1969]

The motive is entirely relevant, especially when the imam of the Glasgow Mosque is praising extremist murderers like Mumtaz Qadri who was hanged in Pakistan after murdering a local politician who opposed strict blasphemy laws.

So if the motive was anything other than Islam related, that would be OK?

 

[Sejanus Aelianus]

The motive is entirely relevant, especially when the imam of the Glasgow Mosque is praising extremist murderers like Mumtaz Qadri who was hanged in Pakistan after murdering a local politician who opposed strict blasphemy laws.

The sad truth is that Islam has always been a religion of violence. It was allegedly founded in 610 and by 624 was fighting wars of expansion around Medina. In that context, the decent, kind Muslims (of whom there are many) are the aberration.

 

[Steep]

The sad truth is that Islam has always been a religion of violence. It was allegedly founded in 610 and by 624 was fighting wars of expansion around Medina. In that context, the decent, kind Muslims (of whom there are many) are the aberration.

Applies to nearly all major religions.

 

[arclight]

The motive is entirely relevant, especially when the imam of the Glasgow Mosque is praising extremist murderers like Mumtaz Qadri who was hanged in Pakistan after murdering a local politician who opposed strict blasphemy laws.

Yes, motive is never irrelevant. Apart from influencing how the perpetrator is dealt with under the judicial process it influences public reaction. If it transpires that the victim was killed as part of a mugging etc. then there will not be much public reaction. However, if it is the case that the man was killed by a nutter who took exception to a muslim being overtly friendly towards Christians then that will risk public reaction.

 

[Phil V]

Applies to nearly all major religions.

This^
Religions are designed to grow and flourish, therefore 'unbelievers' are castigated (which depending on location and timeframe will be anything from a ritual murder to treating as an outcast), and usually some method of evangelism is necessary in order to convert them. Of course anyone who follows a particular faith will claim special circumstances to justify their chosen 'team' behaving like this. Then they'll confirm that other teams supporters are behaving unreasonably in doing the same.

Unsurprisingly, Christianity and Islam (as they both have the same cultural beginnings) both contain instructions from God that it's fine to kill unbelievers, of course for lots of modern Christians the old testament doesn't count for a lot, but plenty of them still pick and choose the bits of the OT they need to justify however they like to behave (see the CofE's uncomfortable position over gay marriage - weird as there's no mention of homosexuality in the NT). And just like in Islam, different Christian teams are prone to killing each other over these differences (and in Glasgow you only have to go back 20 years to find one).

 

[andya700]

The sad truth is that Islam has always been a religion of violence. It was allegedly founded in 610 and by 624 was fighting wars of expansion around Medina. In that context, the decent, kind Muslims (of whom there are many) are the aberration.

I wonder which armies were involved in the crusades to the Middle East - yes, that would be European armies, and their own religion of violence.

 

[OldCarlos]

I wonder which armies were involved in the crusades to the Middle East - yes, that would be European armies, and their own religion of violence.

Correct.

The issue is ...... they still hold it against us

 

[Phil V]

Correct.

The issue is ...... they still hold it against us

Well the moral of that story should be that violence breeds violence. The other lesson being that there's a long history of people who have tried to bring stability to the region using violence - they've been failing for hundreds of years. Oddly some people think they can succeed next time if only they try a bit harder

 

[LASTOLITE]

Lets not detract from the evil that has taken place with petty squabbles that don't really say much about what has happened. Please remember a man has lost his life for wanting his customers to have a happy Easter and desiring that people just get along in his community.

 

[Sejanus Aelianus]

I wonder which armies were involved in the crusades to the Middle East - yes, that would be European armies, and their own religion of violence.

This is true. Would that it were not.

 

[StewartR]

Lets not detract from the evil that has taken place with petty squabbles that don't really say much about what has happened. Please remember a man has lost his life for wanting his customers to have a happy Easter and desiring that people just get along in his community.

Yes.

 

[LongLensPhotography]

Well the moral of that story should be that violence breeds violence. The other lesson being that there's a long history of people who have tried to bring stability to the region using violence - they've been failing for hundreds of years. Oddly some people think they can succeed next time if only they try a bit harder

You have to understand that this murderous scum will not stop slaughtering anybody that wants to differ. They will eventually slaughter the whole Europe and America installing their own political system that will be little different to Stalin's and Mao's communism in terms of body count. I appreciate you like peace just as the rest of us, which is why that scum must be stopped NOW.

 

[Phil V]

You have to understand that this murderous scum will not stop slaughtering anybody that wants to differ. They will eventually slaughter the whole Europe and America installing their own political system that will be little different to Stalin's and Mao's communism in terms of body count. I appreciate you like peace just as the rest of us, which is why that scum must be stopped NOW.

Well don't just sit there, go and sort them out!

 

[viv1969]

You have to understand that this murderous scum will not stop slaughtering anybody that wants to differ. They will eventually slaughter the whole Europe and America installing their own political system that will be little different to Stalin's and Mao's communism in terms of body count. I appreciate you like peace just as the rest of us, which is why that scum must be stopped NOW.

Of course they will.

 

[Marc]

You have to understand that this murderous scum will not stop slaughtering anybody that wants to differ. They will eventually slaughter the whole Europe and America installing their own political system that will be little different to Stalin's and Mao's communism in terms of body count. I appreciate you like peace just as the rest of us, which is why that scum must be stopped NOW.

Blimey, I thought you liked Trump!

 

[norters]

You have to understand that this murderous scum will not stop slaughtering anybody that wants to differ. They will eventually slaughter the whole Europe and America installing their own political system that will be little different to Stalin's and Mao's communism in terms of body count. I appreciate you like peace just as the rest of us, which is why that scum must be stopped NOW.

This is so far beyond parody it's almost like Monty Python at their peak. I reckon you need a lie down after typing that!

 

[LongLensPhotography]

This is so far beyond parody it's almost like Monty Python at their peak. I reckon you need a lie down after typing that!

I reckon you need to change your avatar asap. Soviet union slaughtered over 40 million people by 1950s and that symbol is very deeply offensive to me, my family and others affected by the Red terror. Thanks for understanding.

 

[viv1969]

The hammer and sickle is a symbol of the communist movement in general, not the Soviet Union.
The hammer stands for the industrial working-class while the sickle represents the agricultural workers.

 

[boyfalldown]

Correct.

The issue is ...... they still hold it against us

This is true, but go to Israel and they still curse the Romans for destroying Judea. The point is that they not unique in holding a grudge or two. But unless it gets dropped they'll never be peace in the region

 

[StewartR]

You have to understand that this murderous scum will not stop slaughtering anybody that wants to differ. They will eventually slaughter the whole Europe and America installing their own political system that will be little different to Stalin's and Mao's communism in terms of body count. I appreciate you like peace just as the rest of us, which is why that scum must be stopped NOW.

Oh for goodness sake.

Most people just want to get along with one another in peace.

There are a relatively small number of extremist nutters who think otherwise, and the murderer of Asad Shah is one of them.

And then there are the extremist nutters who call for all-out war against Islam. You're just as bad as them. Or maybe you're just exhorting other people to violence which you're not prepared to undertake yourself, in which case you're a hypocrite too.

 

[boyfalldown]

that symbol is very deeply offensive to me, my family and others affected by the Red terror.

@norters remember to shuffle along, head down, whispering from now on so you offend nobody

 

[Ricardodaforce]

You have to understand that this murderous scum will not stop slaughtering anybody that wants to differ. They will eventually slaughter the whole Europe and America installing their own political system that will be little different to Stalin's and Mao's communism in terms of body count. I appreciate you like peace just as the rest of us, which is why that scum must be stopped NOW.

Were you scared of the daleks too?

 

[Nod]

Were you scared of the daleks too?

No but the cybermen scared the crap out of me!

 

[norters]

I reckon you need to change your avatar asap. Soviet union slaughtered over 40 million people by 1950s and that symbol is very deeply offensive to me, my family and others affected by the Red terror. Thanks for understanding.

My avatar represents workers the world over. It's not an endorsement of anybody. Get over yourself, watch some Benny Hill, have a Martini and get on with your day.

 

[Earley Man]

+1. A jihadist killed him because he apparently wasn't a true salafist / wahhabyst Muslim. Very sad indeed.

This murderous despicable scum has no place in Europe nor anywhere on planet earth.

I am neither Muslim nor Christian, but I do know this quote from the Prophet, which the jihadist should have read, then he would have known that his action was directly contrary to the tenets of the Muslim religion.

• Religion is very easy and whoever overburdens himself in his religion will not be able to continue in that way. So you should not be extremists, but try to be near to perfection and receive the good tidings that you will be rewarded.