Elitism - why?

magicaxeman

magicaxeman

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Yes really, why?

I cant understand it, but just the same as most other hobbies, pastimes or sports we have rampant elitism.

The digital togs seem to think they're better than film togs and vice-versa, and of course there's the whole medium format thing.
Then we have the brand warriors fighting over Canon or Nikon whilst both poo poo'ing any other brand as "inferior".

So why?.. it really irks me sometimes as I have no issue with brand, method etc.


I shoot film/medium format/DSLR/Digital compact and use lenses that vary from dirt cheap to mid range.
Discuss...
 
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I think people do it just becuase they can!

Also people have different perspective on a subject. Check out the school photography thread running at the mo - amateur and pro paths crossing with some heated responces.

I shoot with a bridge, so probably get frowned on by most......;)

I therefore don't get involved in the nikon/canon/sony/film/digi/MF rubbish. I spend half my time telling people that a bridge is better than they think it would be, and would suit many more beginners on here than a DSLR would as it is more flexible and let them work out what they want without parting with a small fortune to get the focal range they want.
 
I've never understood - Nikon/Canon, Mac/PC, just never "got" it...

It doesn't matter what it is to me, so long as I like it and it does the job. I'd love to get me a Nikon D40 for the 1/500 flash sync speed, but I'd not get rid of my Canon either.

I sometimes feel like I am the only person in the world who appreciates both competing brands in whatever duopoly is being discussed. Okay, sure, I joke about Apple sometimes but don't we all? Doesn't stop me from owning an iPod, running Mac OS on a netbook and wishing to have a real Mac (drop your prices Apple!), as well as being a very avid Windows user.

A lot of people seem to have this notion that to have one you can't have the other as well, which really bugs me.
 
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Anyone who believes they are superior simply because they load their camera with a film or a memory card, or have Canon or Nikon written on their strap, have a serious problem and really aren't worth wasting time on.

Frankly.
 
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Its to do with group theory. As you say, that kind of behaviour is common across most (all?) groups of like minded people. Firstly the belonging to the group is important and then establishing status (real or imagined) is always a driver, particularly for people who don't have a particularly high self worth.

That sounds a bit grandiose, but it boils down to saying "I have a Leica; Leica cameras are the best; therefore I am the best" Feel free to substitute Canon, Nikon, Medium Format, plate camera etc, etc.

I'm not sure how you stop that approach other than to recognise it for what it is and to feel sorry for those afflicted.
 
Don't know what the problem is...for me the end result is the most important thing, not what equipment you use to get there.
 
Lifes far too short to worry about these kind of people. Like most hobbies/sports, you will always get prats.
I try to encourage a no snobbery attitude when it comes to this kind of thing.


Kev.
 
:thinking: :shrug: I really don't get it either.

I'm perfectly happy with what I have. Yes, I could afford better, but why would I want it? What I have is more than sufficient for what I use it for.

I honestly couldn't care less about what kit somebody else has, how much money they make out of it or what they think about my kit.
I enjoy looking at the photos on here for their own merit, not for what they were taken with - And as long as I'm enjoying my hobby I'm happy :)

Although to be fair, I don't find this site anywhere near as elitist as some forums I've come across.
 
Why

Well usually for a bit of fun. Well that is how I see it between the Canonites and the Noinkers anyway... nothing elitist in it tbh.

I've met plenty of people who all shoot different formats/brands/systems and never experienced anything beyond genuine interest couples with light hearted jibes. Makes for fun conversation I say.
 
I have an AGA cooker - they really are the best - I must be a wonderful chef
 
iancandler said:
Yes really, why?

I cant understand it, but just the same as most other hobbies, pastimes or sports we have rampant elitism.

The digital togs seem to think they're better than film togs and vice-versa, and of course there's the whole medium format thing.
Then we have the brand warriors fighting over Canon or Nikon whilst both poo poo'ing any other brand as "inferior".

So why?.. it really irks me sometimes as I have no issue with brand, method etc.


I shoot film/medium format/DSLR/Digital compact and use lenses that vary from dirt cheap to mid range.
Discuss...
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I don't take any of it seriously, I just take it as a form of joshing :lol:
 
I think that ultimately this industry is unique. We all work as individuals (most of the time), two equally talented photographers working in the same environment at the same time will take in most cases vastly different photographs. What one person likes another hates and visa versa. We all want to achieve some kind of recognition (not measured by financial reward) and while I don't agree with an elitist view, I can in many cases understand why.

The transition within photography over the last 10 years is practically unprecidented which in an industry that is cut throat and failure is never more than a couple of shots away from failure, peoples natural reaction is to protect their interests based on their own boundaries.

On top of this, the fantastic development in digital quality at very low prices, has encouraged a "have a go" ethos with poorly trained and inexperienced photographers marketing themselves as established. It is a small minority of individuals who ruin it for everyone else, by affecting public opinion when they fail to provide the quality of product they promise.

This will inevitably lead to an elitist attitude from people who are desparate to protect what they have when they see the competition closing in.

Then there are those that jump on the bandwagon!
 
Flash In The Pan said:
A lot of it is tongue-in-cheek, anyone that takes it seriously needs a sense of humour transplant....
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You are correct in that a lot of it is tongue in cheek, but (and it's a lot worse with PC/Mac crowd) there IS also a lot of it that is clearly not tongue in cheek. There are people out there who genuinely think that you will catch something if you go near a PC operating Windows, or that all Nikon photos are washed out - for example.
 
I take it all with a pinch of salt and do make a few jibes at Canon users. It is only for a little fun and I get it back in spades too.

If you cant stand the the heat! get a Nikon :exit:
 
I'm one of those who couldn't care less what camera, computer, car, house, bank balance, whether you wear Burberry or Blazer made in some fancy shop in a fancy street in London. It's who you are and the way you treat me that matters.

What matters to me is that you leave a good impression on everyone you meet and hopefully put a smile in their life.

I have Canon because I have a 30 year old Eos 1000fn film camera that still works so went the Canon digital route. I recommend all makes and I'm not snobbish about brands.
Then again I was raised wearing Pumps and home made clothes and had to do chores for my weekend treats.

Elitism will always exist, it's engrained in British Society from time immamorial :D
 
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trencheel303 said:
You are correct in that a lot of it is tongue in cheek, but (and it's a lot worse with PC/Mac crowd) there IS also a lot of it that is clearly not tongue in cheek. There are people out there who genuinely think that you will catch something if you go near a PC operating Windows, or that all Nikon photos are washed out - for example.
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or RAW/jpeg, photoshop/paintshop, AMD/Intel, ATI/Nvidia, prime/zoom, etc etc
 
I don't mind because I know I'm right and everyone else is wrong :p :lol:
 
CGeezer said:
I take it all with a pinch of salt and do make a few jibes at Canon users. It is only for a little fun and I get it back in spades too.

If you cant stand the the heat! get a Nikon TO BURN :exit:
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Fixed the quote for you! :D
 
Why? ..... No idea!

Canon is obviously far superior to Nikon and I should know because I'm better than everyone..... :D
 
perhaps many fear what they dont know. and to hide it they either call them rubbish or belive the hype.


just use what you are comfortable with , Nokon canon or other . Pc mac or linux .

you have to use it so it doesn`t really matter what others think

Cheers Steve
 
I can't say I've ever encountered any genuine brand enmity. There's a lot of good hearted canon vs. nikon banter on here but it's all good natured and a bit of a laugh.
 
Elitism or snobbery is encouraged by the advertising industry, there is an inbuilt desire in most people to be liked and successful, so images portraying that are pushed at us, the right car, you must have a BMW, Mercedes, Porche to show you are successful, is it badge snobbery yes I think it is to some extent. I've just changed my car and got a Merc, and it's slightly more comfortable than my last car, which I had for six years. That was great it never let me down was economical, drove well, and had some features the Merc hasn't got I wouldn't be unhappy if I was still driving it, what was it... a Skoda. So have I suddenly become more successful, erm I don't think so, have I changed, I sincerely hope not, do I treat other drivers differently now, no.

I don't possess a white lens, or even a black L lens but I'm happy with what I have at the moment, Ok so I'd like a Macro lens, but I doubt if I would get an MPE-65 for it's snob value. Be who you are, that is what really counts, don't let other people or things determine your character.
 
The Nikon v Canon thing might be a lot of things but it hasn't ever been elitist, its simply a brand war.
Elitism seems to crop up in attitudes between Pro and Am photographers, Film v Digital shooters and Art v art type "discussions".
Its all about misinformation, ignorance and occasionally arrogance.
Forums are perfectly placed to right wrongs though...:)
 
KIPAX said:
TROLL :(
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No sorry but most trolls don't hang around to rack up a post count before they wake up.. just discussion

niv2 said:
Don't know what the problem is...for me the end result is the most important thing, not what equipment you use to get there.
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I couldn't agree more.

dod said:
This is one of my favourite threads ever on here, all with a bridge :)

http://www.talkphotography.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=44724
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Awesome shots.. thanks..

Paul Male said:
I don't mind because I know I'm right and everyone else is wrong :p :lol:
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Hahahaha.. someone had to.. nice one.

artyman said:
Elitism or snobbery is encouraged by the advertising industry, there is an inbuilt desire in most people to be liked and successful, so images portraying that are pushed at us, the right car, you must have a BMW, Mercedes, Porche to show you are successful, is it badge snobbery yes I think it is to some extent. I've just changed my car and got a Merc, and it's slightly more comfortable than my last car, which I had for six years. That was great it never let me down was economical, drove well, and had some features the Merc hasn't got I wouldn't be unhappy if I was still driving it, what was it... a Skoda. So have I suddenly become more successful, erm I don't think so, have I changed, I sincerely hope not, do I treat other drivers differently now, no.

I don't possess a white lens, or even a black L lens but I'm happy with what I have at the moment, Ok so I'd like a Macro lens, but I doubt if I would get an MPE-65 for it's snob value. Be who you are, that is what really counts, don't let other people or things determine your character.
Click to expand...


I used to work for a firm who specialised rebuilding old jags, maserati's etc and who also ran several race cars, after road testing the porche we had just built for the director my boss asked me what I thought, I replied, its like a skoda with a roll cage and better engine.. he nearly sacked me on the spot :D
 
Why?

Simple reason: money.

Photographic equipment costs loads by virtually all standards, so people paying more for stuff tend to sneer or look down upon others with lesser grade materials. If top cameras, lenses, and other paraphernalia cost only a few bucks, elitism within the field wouldn't even exist, I guarantee it.
 
True - It happens everywhere although I would say since 'digital' - photography has succomed more to 'elitism' than ever before.

Whilst technology is there to embrace and for the pro's - necessary - I see a definate 'lust' for gear that wasn't as strong before the camera became a 'gadget' that could be 'rated' by it's spec.

How often do we hear the word 'upgrade' - every camera body seems to be rated - like we've 'progressed' up the ladder as a photographer if we simply swap a D90 for a D3 or a 50D for a 5DII.

As for the whole Nikon / Canon thing (yawn)......I agree with what others have said. Some folk feel the need to 'champion' the brand they chose as it somehow makes them feel like they have made the correct choice.

A young girl I interviewed a while back (and now works within the same comapny) got wind that I was into photography the other day and the very first question she asked.........."what camera do you have" - 20 years ago you wouldn't ask that question and even if you did - you certainly wouldn't form an opinion on that individuals ability based on their answer........

Just ask yourself - how would reply to this thread title.....

Hi my name is Phil - I'm new to the forum and I have a problem with a Nikon D40

Hi my name is Phil - I'm new to the forum and I have a problem with my D3
 
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custodian said:
Its to do with group theory. As you say, that kind of behaviour is common across most (all?) groups of like minded people. Firstly the belonging to the group is important and then establishing status (real or imagined) is always a driver, particularly for people who don't have a particularly high self worth.

That sounds a bit grandiose, but it boils down to saying "I have a Leica; Leica cameras are the best; therefore I am the best" Feel free to substitute Canon, Nikon, Medium Format, plate camera etc, etc.

I'm not sure how you stop that approach other than to recognise it for what it is and to feel sorry for those afflicted.
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Nail, head, firmly whacked. And in the absence of physical presence on t'interweb it only gets worse.
 
dinners said:
Just ask yourself - how would reply to this thread title.....

Hi my name is Phil - I'm new to the forum and I have a problem with a Nikon D40

Hi my name is Phil - I'm new to the forum and I have a problem with my D3
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you silly boy phil... you should have bought a canon! :lol::lol::lol:
 
In my experience, Canon v Nikon has never been about elitism, it's just a bit of fun.

Film v digital can be a more elitist thing but - again, in my experience - that always seems to come from the film buffs denigrating the digital users rather than the other way around so is probably people trying to reassure themselves that their choice not to use digital equipment is a justified one. Which it is, just not for the reasons that most anti-digital film buffs quote.

But really, who cares?
If it's your mates being elitist, do you really want them as mates?
If it's strangers doing it, chalk them up as a d**khead and move on.
 
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