Do you eat halal meat?

Do i care if meet is halal? is it worse for me? no does it make a real difference no? why is everyone up in arms? no idea ???
 
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I have no doubt I did at the Halal certified Tandoori restaurant in Tooting I dined at on Bank Holiday Monday.
 
Yeah almost certainly, truth be told I don't really care either way so long as the meat is safe for human consumption I'll eat it, and based on some of my past kebab experiences "safe" clearly is a flexible measurement depending directly on how much alcohol I've consumed :D
 
God not here too. Getting fed up with all the internet rants about subway and pizza express recently.

No I don't care by the way. I'm sure worse things happen in abettors. Most places stun before the halal act anyway (possibly EU law?)
 
neil_g said:
God not here too. Getting fed up with all the internet rants about subway and pizza express recently.
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I had an entertaining discussion on Twitter with the head of PR at the Sun newspaper over their definitions of the words 'exclusive' and 'secret' used prominently in relation to their front page story about Pizza Express this morning.

From what he said, a story can still be described as exclusive even if it's been published months ago in other newspapers (including the Guardian, Independent and Belfast Telegraph). Pizza Express can be said to be acting in secret even if they do mention their use of Halal meat on their web site, Twitter, and have done so to the newspapers previously referred to, and responding to anti-Halal campaigners campaigning against it in various parts of the country last year.

This is, I was told, is on the basis that Sun readers don't read anything else but the Sun.
 
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neil_g said:
Most places stun before the halal act anyway (possibly EU law?)
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Having first hand experience of working in an abattoir ,many years ago,where a certain amount of animals were killed by the Halal method, I assure you that you are incorrect Neil.
 
fracster said:
Having first hand experience of working in an abattoir ,many years ago,where a certain amount of animals were killed by the Halal method, I assure you that you are incorrect Neil.
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I think things may have change huge amounts between the practices at abattoirs nowadays from many years ago.

As I'm lead to believe the only real diffrence between the vast amount of hala meat and normal meat is a pray is said while killing/stunning the animal.
 
acetone said:
I think things may have change huge amounts between the practices at abattoirs nowadays from many years ago.

As I'm lead to believe the only real diffrence between the vast amount of hala meat and normal meat is a pray is said while killing/stunning the animal.
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That's how I understand it too :thumbs:
 
The animal has to be alive when it's throat is cut, it then bleeds to death

All stunning does is subdue the animal and makes it easier for the throat to be cut, also only some abattoirs stun the animal first before cutting its throat

There are a number of secular & Christian groups/organisations/people that are not in favour of this, people should be given the correct information about the food they are eating so that they can make an informed choice, it certainly should not be hidden from them what it is they are eating
 
I've been to many of these places - subway, pizza express etc and never eaten halaal meat. Helps being vegetarian:p

TBH I'd want to be informed at the very least.
 
Well, I for one will not be frequenting either place again. With subway, it isn't just the halal thing, it's the lack of ham and bacon too. With pizza express, if they are not ashamed about it why not make it more public beforehand? Not sure on the reason behind it tbh as whenever I have been in pizza express (and we used to go a lot), I rarely saw any Muslims in it so really baffled by this as it doesn't seem to be from customer pressure?

I do not want others religious beliefs literally forced down my throat. You want to eat halal, kosher or anything else then that's down to you, and if you own your own restaurant and want to serve it fine, but national chains should not be going down this road.
 
cambsno said:
Well, I for one will not be frequenting either place again. With subway, it isn't just the halal thing, it's the lack of ham and bacon too.
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You will be pleased to know that it's only one of the 12 Subway stores in the Cambridge area that is not serving ham and bacon. The others all are.

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/Cam...and-switches-to-halal-meat-20140501122052.htm

With pizza express, if they are not ashamed about it why not make it more public beforehand?
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It's been on PE's web site FAQ since 2012, they've Tweeted about it and spoken to the press about it over that period. Unlike The Sun's claim this morning, it's not a secret. If you care about the issue either way it has not been difficult to find out.
 
cambsno said:
Well, I for one will not be frequenting either place again. With subway, it isn't just the halal thing, it's the lack of ham and bacon too. With pizza express, if they are not ashamed about it why not make it more public beforehand? Not sure on the reason behind it tbh as whenever I have been in pizza express (and we used to go a lot), I rarely saw any Muslims in it so really baffled by this as it doesn't seem to be from customer pressure?

I do not want others religious beliefs literally forced down my throat. You want to eat halal, kosher or anything else then that's down to you, and if you own your own restaurant and want to serve it fine, but national chains should not be going down this road.
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Have you "liked" the Britain First Facebook page yet?
 
I avoid it where I can TBH.
Having found a really good butchers near me (6miles away!) I should be cutting all supermarket meat out :)
 
Keith W said:
people should be given the correct information about the food they are eating so that they can make an informed choice, it certainly should not be hidden from them what it is they are eating
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For me this is the key ... clearly even following the 'horse meat scandal', little has changed in respect to respect for customers - yes many may not care what they eat, how it is killed, what if any suffering that causes or any religious connotations ... however many others do.
 
personally, I don't see the issue with this. Atleast you know where the meat came from, how it was reared and how it was slaughtered. Unlike the horse meat at many major supermarkets. It strikes me that this is purely a business decision. Far easier to make your products acceptable to all who may buy. Specially as there can be no real objection from those without the requirement. Surely its better to keep costs down by only producing one way.

It seems like these stories are the Sun/Mail etc trying to stoke outrage where there simply is no cause. They'd just like to be outraged

I read in a lot of the papers Pizza Express using halal chicken. They declare this openly for everyone and its pretty clear from their menus. All of which avoids the big issue. Who on earth puts chicken on pizza
 
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Having worked in the meat industry for 5 years (my first main job after leaving the Army) in the early Eighties i have first hand experience at what went on in Abattoirs ,i am a Butcher by trade but the main money those days was in the Abattoirs,i worked in Blackburn and cheetam hill and witnessed and participated in both sides of slaughtering of animals and lets say the good practice and the concern of the animals was not adhered to,my morals and principles then were not as they are now ,money and bringing up a family were more important ,i will not go in to detail what went on but a lot of meat went on to supply then one of the biggest suppliers to supermarkets all around the country ,and a lot of people would have believed they were eating meat that was slaughtered and look after in the way of the law ,basicaly what i am trying to say is you really never know what you are getting unless you can source it yourself from start to finish ,i personaly now if i have a choice would not purchase Hallal meat if i had a choice but i am also welll aware when i eat out or takeaways how the meat is slaughtered .
 
cambsno said:
I do not want others religious beliefs literally forced down my throat. You want to eat halal, kosher or anything else then that's down to you, and if you own your own restaurant and want to serve it fine, but national chains should not be going down this road.
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why does it hurt you Simon? They're not forcing anything down your throat. Maybe Pizza express in Cambridge serves prayer matts with its food?
 
boyfalldown said:
Specially as there can be no real objection from those without the requirement.
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But many, many people do have real objections, mainly on animal welfare grounds.
 
gramps said:
But many, many people do have real objections, mainly on animal welfare grounds.
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Whilst I hate to dismiss those concerns I'm assuming those people who have genuine concerns about animal welfare either choose not to eat meat at all, or only eat meat the can be sure of the provenance of, from farm to slaughter. It would ring a little hollow for someone to claim to have major welfare concerns and then be buying tesco's value chicken ;). Even the daily mail says that the slaughter is performed to Western standards while still being halal

The article you linked is flawed, if nothing else its been on Pizza express's menu, and they tweet about it. Not sure how thats secret
 
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acetone said:
I think things may have change huge amounts between the practices at abattoirs nowadays from many years ago.

As I'm lead to believe the only real diffrence between the vast amount of hala meat and normal meat is a pray is said while killing/stunning the animal.
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I hope your right bud and things have changed.
 
boyfalldown said:
Whilst I hate to dismiss those concerns I'm assuming those people who have genuine concerns about animal welfare either choose not to eat meat at all, or only eat meat the can be sure of the provenance of, from farm to slaughter. It would ring a little hollow for someone to claim to have major welfare concerns and then be buying tesco's value chicken ;). Even the daily mail says that the slaughter is performed to Western standards while still being halal

The article you linked is flawed, if nothing else its been on Pizza express's menu, and they tweet about it. Not sure how thats secret
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People have their own individual standards of 'acceptable' and 'unacceptable', whatever we may feel about the hypocrisy or otherwise of this ... the fact remains that the information about halal slaughter is, in many cases, being withheld from them and as a consequence they cannot make an informed decision according to their conscience/standards of acceptability.
Of course this is not all about Pizza Express, who many people never ever visit but most people use a supermarket and clearly there is an almost universal 'issue' with lamb.
 
gramps said:
People have their own individual standards of 'acceptable' and 'unacceptable', whatever we may feel about the hypocrisy or otherwise of this ... the fact remains that the information about halal slaughter is, in many cases, being withheld from them and as a consequence they cannot make an informed decision according to their conscience/standards of acceptability.
Of course this is not all about Pizza Express, who many people never ever visit but most people use a supermarket and clearly there is an almost universal 'issue' with lamb.
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Of course you're right about people having their own individual standards of acceptable and the right to a choice. I merely used Pizza Express as an example from that article to show its at the mail's usual reporting standards. But, I think, the article and current furore lead by certain papers is merely an attempt to stoke outrage where there is non.

The article you linked - written in 2010. Thats not to dismiss it but maybe things have moved on. I know its in the press this week.
 
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I would eat it, I just don't agree with the reasons behind it was introduced.
 
I would suggest that getting ventilated about the last five minutes of an animal's life whilst ignoring the awful conditions that many meat animals endure in the preceding weeks and months is a bit selective, to say the least.

Also, given the rate at which animals (chickens in particular) are killed in modern slaughterhouses, I can only assume that the muslim equivalent of Busta Rhymes is delivering the prayers for each animal.
 
pwhysall said:
I would suggest that getting ventilated about the last five minutes of an animal's life whilst ignoring the awful conditions that many meat animals endure in the preceding weeks and months is a bit selective, to say the least.
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One of the most sensible comments in this thread.
 
pwhysall said:
I would suggest that getting ventilated about the last five minutes of an animal's life whilst ignoring the awful conditions that many meat animals endure in the preceding weeks and months is a bit selective, to say the least.
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Can't argue against that other than to say it doesn't make their life any better.
pwhysall said:
Also, given the rate at which animals (chickens in particular) are killed in modern slaughterhouses, I can only assume that the muslim equivalent of Busta Rhymes is delivering the prayers for each animal.
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As per the article one slaughter-man says 45 chickens per minute ... including individual prayer!
 
acetone said:
I think things may have change huge amounts between the practices at abattoirs nowadays from many years ago.

As I'm lead to believe the only real diffrence between the vast amount of hala meat and normal meat is a pray is said while killing/stunning the animal.
Click to expand...

There was a "debate" on R4 about this a few weeks ago - I put that in quotes because the rabbi and imam refused to talk to each other. They both said their method was the most humane. I concluded they were both untrustworthy so I didn't lend much weight to the debate but the rabbi clearly said that kosher killing didn't stun the animals (he said that stunning them was cruel which seemed a bit ridic but I'd already concluded he was a liar). You can see CIWF's view here (http://www.ciwf.org.uk/faqs/organisation/halal_meat_and_religious_slaughter.aspx).

Bottom line: if I ate meat I'd be more worried about unknowingly eating kosher meat than halal - but both would bother me. What really worries me is that 3 successive stories on Today this morning seemed to be using the words "Muslim", "Islamist" and by extension "terrorist" interchangeably. Which seemed odd.
 
I think all waitrose meat is halal*. That's ancient news. Halal allows pre stunning so it probably makes little odds.

The Jewish kosher belief prohibits pre stunning. No one is bothered about that though

If religious people don't want their meat killed humanely then they can go vegetarian. They don't have to eat meat. Animals have to be killed humanely and forcing your cruel beliefs on an animal is unacceptable to me.

* it isn't. Must have read it somewhere strange!
 
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There's more than religious reasons to eat halal meat: taste.

When the blood dries inside the meat, they produce a really bad smell once cooked. This smell is very disturbing if you are used to eating meat without the blood (say China). Only solution is to soak the meat in regularly changed warm water for a few hours.

If only pork comes in such form...... :rolleyes:
 
boyfalldown said:
personally, I don't see the issue with this. Atleast you know where the meat came from, how it was reared and how it was slaughtered. Unlike the horse meat at many major supermarkets. It strikes me that this is purely a business decision. Far easier to make your products acceptable to all who may buy. Specially as there can be no real objection from those without the requirement. Surely its better to keep costs down by only producing one way.

It seems like these stories are the Sun/Mail etc trying to stoke outrage where there simply is no cause. They'd just like to be outraged

I read in a lot of the papers Pizza Express using halal chicken. They declare this openly for everyone and its pretty clear from their menus. All of which avoids the big issue. Who on earth puts chicken on pizza
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According to the report in an earlier post, only 4% of the population are Muslim. So gearing your business model for that seems flawed. Not only that, that also prohibits Jews for example from eating there and possibly other religions too.

I can to a point understand that if you are in a massive Muslim area like say Bradford then using halal makes business sense, but for the rest of the country???
G
 
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JonathanRyan said:
What really worries me is that 3 successive stories on Today this morning seemed to be using the words "Muslim", "Islamist" and by extension "terrorist" interchangeably. Which seemed odd.
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Why is Muslim and Islamist interchangeable with 'terrorist' other than in the minds of the bigot or the mis-informed?
 
cambsno said:
According to the report in an earlier post, only 4% of the population are Muslim. So gearing your business model for that seems flawed. Not only that, that also prohibits Jews for example from eating there and possibly other religions too.

I can to a point understand that if you are in a massive Muslim area like say Bradford then using halal makes business sense, but for the rest of the country???
G
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That assumes they are using separate sources for food in restaurants in some areas. I'm going to bet thats not the case. By not declaring your menu as Kosher as well you exclude Jews anyway, but what other religion would be excluded?

gramps said:
Why is Muslim and Islamist interchangeable with 'terrorist' other than in the minds of the bigot or the mis-informed?
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unfortunately there is that overtone in some sources nowadays though.
 
cambsno said:
According to the report in an earlier post, only 4% of the population are Muslim. So gearing your business model for that seems flawed.
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I must say I am impressed that you got hold of a copy of the executive summary of their planning and strategy document. Where did you get it? Their website, a share-holder meeting? Other source? What else influences their "business model" or is it solely based on appeasing the Muslim population?
 
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