Overexposed
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Ha Ha - cant quite believe this quote giving the mire that Osborne had to dig this country out of after the last Labour fiasco! - he didn't do a bad job really did he?
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Autumn budget statement
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tbh neither conservative or labour have that great a grasp of economics or that much of an impact on the economy - the mire the economy was in was little to do with blairite policies and more to do with the banking crisis and the subprime debt bubble , and theway the economy is moving now has more to do with global economics than it does to Ozzies policies
Overexposed
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So you think that Blair and Browns spend ,spend, spend policies hand no lasting effects on the economy?
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they may have had an effect - but they werent responsible for the down turn
and you will doubtless have noted that govt borrowing is actually up under the conservatives despite the need for austerity ...
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'Government economic policy is akin to a car being driven by a blind driver, being directed by a man looking out the rear window.'
Whenever it goes well, they laud themselves as genii. When it goes wrong, it's always someone else's fault.
A bit like football managers
Whenever it goes well, they laud themselves as genii. When it goes wrong, it's always someone else's fault.
A bit like football managers
JonathanRyan
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Dunno. I only really pay attention to stuff that affects me and more and more I'm finding it hard to tell the parties apart. But R4 summarised the autumn statement today as "the kind of budget Ed Balls would be proud of". Which was nice.
D
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Can't believe so many people fell for the "there's no money left" rhetoric... Or that Labour somehow caused the global financial collapse that started off in the US.
Overexposed
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The economy was built on sand ,of course the US triggered the meltdown but there was nothing to play with just lots of debt and a huge defecit !
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It isnt really as simple as blaming labours spending though consider this graph
Labour came to power in 1997 - the first year for quite some time that we actually had a budget surplus ... that surplus continued to grow until 2001 , and then shrank but remained in surplus untilil the end of 2002 - we then went back into deficit in a relatively controlled way (which actually mirrored the spending patterns in the later years of the major administration) until 2008 (which saw the start of the global financial crisis) , the deficit then shot up - principally as a result of govt spending in bailing out banks and financial institutions - peaking in 2010 ... then under ozzies stewardship it has started to come down slowly , but is still much higher than it was under blair or all but the last two years of brown
ergo the picture is much more complicated than labour =bad, conservatives=good
Labour came to power in 1997 - the first year for quite some time that we actually had a budget surplus ... that surplus continued to grow until 2001 , and then shrank but remained in surplus untilil the end of 2002 - we then went back into deficit in a relatively controlled way (which actually mirrored the spending patterns in the later years of the major administration) until 2008 (which saw the start of the global financial crisis) , the deficit then shot up - principally as a result of govt spending in bailing out banks and financial institutions - peaking in 2010 ... then under ozzies stewardship it has started to come down slowly , but is still much higher than it was under blair or all but the last two years of brown
ergo the picture is much more complicated than labour =bad, conservatives=good
OP
dejongj
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So what you are suggesting is labour befitted from the policies of the previous government in their early years, and then later on made a mess of it and leaving that behind for the successive government to fix?It isnt really as simple as blaming labours spending though consider this graph
Labour came to power in 1997 - the first year for quite some time that we actually had a budget surplus ... that surplus continued to grow until 2001 , and then shrank but remained in surplus untilil the end of 2002 - we then went back into deficit in a relatively controlled way (which actually mirrored the spending patterns in the later years of the major administration) until 2008 (which saw the start of the global financial crisis) , the deficit then shot up - principally as a result of govt spending in bailing out banks and financial institutions - peaking in 2010 ... then under ozzies stewardship it has started to come down slowly , but is still much higher than it was under blair or all but the last two years of brown
ergo the picture is much more complicated than labour =bad, conservatives=good
mex
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Nope, what its saying is that the big financial institutions and hedge funds took the p***, screwed it all up,they then got rewarded for doing so,got away with it scott-free and it is looking like its all going to repeat itself before too long.
OP
dejongj
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So who is the sucker? The person investing/hedging their funds with such institutions and leaving themselves vulnerable, or the institutions doing that and getting away with it? Ergo wouldn't avoiding getting your investments dragged down by such events be the smartest participant in these events?
JonathanRyan
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So about the autumn statement then.......
I believe the papers weren't quite as complimentary about George's plans as they were yesterday. Vague mutterings about the new forecasts being "wildly ambitious". And that was the Sun apparently.
I believe the papers weren't quite as complimentary about George's plans as they were yesterday. Vague mutterings about the new forecasts being "wildly ambitious". And that was the Sun apparently.
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To be fair, it's not Osbourne coming up the numbers - it's the OBR. I bet Osbourne did a little jig of joy round number 11 when he saw them. It's dug him out of a huuuuuge political hole - May, Gove and Johnson will be spitting feathers.
JonathanRyan
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It is the OBR, but people like the CBI are already saying "err, hang on a minute...." because they are so wildly different from all the other figures. A prudent chancellor might have double checked them before hanging the next 6 months' budget on them. Or even ignored them so that we have a massive surplus and bonanza give away next time. I mean, for real.
Only once per day? Seems more somehow....
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no i'm saying that labours economics were about the same as the tories - both were into deficit spending but in a controlled way (the bigger version of that graph also shows a surplus in the early 80s then turning back into a deficit under major) cycle between small surplus and small defecit is normal and pretty much the same regardless of who is in charge... it only got totally out of hand in the period 08-10 and that was due to the global meltdown and the banking crisis not to anything a particular party did