Would You Let a Gay Man Teach Your Children Performing Arts?

Ricardodaforce said:
The woman discriminates. Not good. Can't see that anyone here has said they'd not deal with you because you are a christian, so how have you been discriminated against?
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That's twice you have made that assumption.:thinking:
 
Phil V said:
I don't feel compelled to believe 'anything' without evidence. Therefore I'm free to believe, based on what I know of the lady in the original story that she's an awful person, who uses her faith as a crutch to justify her nasty mind. It's not a 'Christian' issue at all. I don't dislike her because she's a Christian, I dislike the way she behaved, which makes her a bad person (to reasonable people). Her religion only has relevance because she chose to hide her bigotry behind it, it's actually irrelevant.

I would go as far as to say that she's not a 'Christian' at all. The fact that you feel compelled to defend her bigotry likewise reflects poorly on you.

One of the issues with some Christians is they see Atheism as 'anti Christian' no matter how many times we say it, we only renounce one more God than they do, they're renouncing hundreds if not thousands of belief systems, we're just adding one more, we're not singling Christians out.

Your post re paedos and homosexuals makes no sense other than the way it was read by me and others, you still haven't really done or said anything to prove an innocent point.
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I can only assume English comprehension wasn't your best subject at school.
 
nilagin said:
It's simple enough. The post I quoted said Christians should love everyone (or neighbour) as themselves and should not judge anyone. ..
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So we agree she's not a Christian then, and therefore, just like I said a nasty woman.

Glad that's sorted. :)

I still don't understand why you chose to argue with me though when we're in such straightforward agreement.
 
Furtim said:
She's not suggested she feels her kids are at risk as far as I can see it.

As I read it, she's said, privately - "my kids won't be coming anymore because the way you live your life doesn't match my view of the world, and I don't want my kids exposed to that view".
He's then escalated the issue publicly, trying to be a bit of a smart arse. Escalation because he brings up 'life and death' (he's a dance teacher not a bloody doctor).

I think she's a bit of a tit because of her views, and I think he's a bit of a tit for turning it into a crusade (far from the calm response that's claimed, he shared it on Facebook, and that is not in itself indicative of a calm response, that's a "look at me, I put that bigot down in style" boast), and for that reason, I think he's the bigger tit in this situation.

Had she posted her message publicly, I'd have a different view, but there's nothing to indicate that is the case.

I think she's wrong to deny her kids the opportunity of learning with a well respected teacher because of an irrelevance such as the sexuality of the instructor, but I don't think her private message to him to inform him of her decision was wrong in itself; it was truthful. A better response would to have been respond in private and educate her.
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spot on
 
What if the message read as this:

Hi Michael. Following our chat this week, I have decided that [my children] will not be attending class on Monday. I have recently learned of your Christian beliefs and as an atheist I cannot allow my children to be influenced by such ideas. I look forward to receiving my deposit which you may post to me via cheque. Regards.

I am going to play my 3rd assumption card and assume that @nilagin would be jumping up and down about discrimination!








Now I await the Candyman.
 
Hm. So, Andrew, bigotry should be kept private?
 
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Ricardodaforce said:
What if the message read as this:

Hi Michael. Following our chat this week, I have decided that [my children] will not be attending class on Monday. I have recently learned of your Christian beliefs and as an atheist I cannot allow my children to be influenced by such ideas. I look forward to receiving my deposit which you may post to me via cheque. Regards.

I am going to play my 3rd assumption card and assume that @nilagin would be jumping up and down about discrimination!








Now I await the Candyman.
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Good luck and be safe....

Unless it's the wrong candyman and he brings sweets, then you share :D
 
nilagin said:
Why should it cause him personal discomfort?
He has done more wrong by posting a private message on facebook and as a consequence it has appeared in the press.
He could just as easily expressed his regret at her decision and even offered to allow her to sit in on his classes and persuade her otherwise. Instead he makes fun of her beliefs and donates the money to a group he hopes she would not be agreeable to.
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If she's entitled to her beliefs, he's entitled to his... including deciding how to spend his own money.
 
Ricardodaforce said:
What if the message read as this:

Hi Michael. Following our chat this week, I have decided that [my children] will not be attending class on Monday. I have recently learned of your Christian beliefs and as an atheist I cannot allow my children to be influenced by such ideas. I look forward to receiving my deposit which you may post to me via cheque. Regards.

I am going to play my 3rd assumption card and assume that @nilagin would be jumping up and down about discrimination!








Now I await the Candyman.
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Perfectly reasonable, truthful and honest except as before, expecting to get her deposit back.
 
Phil V said:
I don't feel compelled to believe 'anything' without evidence. Therefore I'm free to believe, based on what I know of the lady in the original story that she's an awful person, who uses her faith as a crutch to justify her nasty mind. It's not a 'Christian' issue at all. I don't dislike her because she's a Christian, I dislike the way she behaved, which makes her a bad person (to reasonable people). Her religion only has relevance because she chose to hide her bigotry behind it, it's actually irrelevant.
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How about taking a few seconds to get your head out of the sand (may take hours as it seems you have done such an excellent job or burying it) and think where she would have got her views on homosexuality and then you will see just how stupid your quoted statement really is.
 
There are plenty of christians who have no problems with homosexuality, including those ministered to by gay members of the clergy.
If she's sticking to her Christianity as the reason behind her bigotry, then it's something she's chosen to focus on, and cling to.
To hold such views through ignorance is one thing, but to hold them through choice and then espouse them in the name of Christianity is laughable.
 
I can't belief that in 2015 not only this event had happened, but also that people are defending it so strongly for five pages.

Is this perhaps a sign of denial, and an internal battle to come out? ;)
 
nilagin said:
How about taking a few seconds to get your head out of the sand (may take hours as it seems you have done such an excellent job or burying it) and think where she would have got her views on homosexuality and then you will see just how stupid your quoted statement really is.
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My head isn't in the sand, Jesus said nothing about Homosexuality, and plenty of Christians have told us that there's nothing 'christian' about homophobia, it harks back to pre Christian times.

Jesus preached 'love thy neighbour' he had a particular dislike for 'big church' for religious leaders who thought they were above others and for rich people. He said absolutely nothing about homosexuality.

The lady is wrong to call herself a Christian, it's not complicated. She might believe that Jesus would condone her bigotry, but I can show you lots of people who'd say she's wrong. Including Christians who've contributed here.

This will be one of the logic points you won't respond to though, as your habit seems to be throwing insults, and not actually debating points.

If you do choose to answer though, maybe you could tell us your actual position on Christianity, and what you meant in the post about paedophiles.
 
kendo1 said:
Hm. So, Andrew, bigotry should be kept private?
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She just like you are entitled to an opinion. Whether or not you agree with it.
If she approached it privately then yes.

I don't care about most things on race gender etc but the world isn't fair.

You can have gay pride, but straight pride would be homophobic.
You have association of black police officers, if you had the same for white police officers it would be racist.
You can't have a men only working man club as it's sextet, but you can have a women only gym.
 
To answer the original question in the thread title, if I had kids, yes. As long as he was a good teacher.
 
Nod said:
To answer the original question in the thread title, if I had kids, yes. As long as he was a good teacher.
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What? Didn't the magical sky fairy warn you, in a dream, he will do something bad?
 
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Don't have an imaginary friend, so no! :P

I do know a few performing arts teachers and several of them are gay - very good teachers as well (if results are anything to go by!)
 
I feel sorry for the woman's kids. What a great example of parenting, encouraging bigotry in your children, and denying them the opportunity to experience performing arts.
 
I am wondering what the agenda is to be honest....:) I see the attacks on Chritianity in this forum more so than anywhere else at the moment, of the places I visit..... Makes me wonder......


That said...I see it thus...

Funny how "Pro Choice" gets a battering when a persons choice and reasoning does not match yours or the general trend.

boogie man said:
Always makes me laugh when someone blames their Christian beliefs for not accepting gays. I thought the whole premise of following the teachings of Christ was that you accept everyone for who they are, without judgement. "Love thy neighbour"? Seems that some of these hardline "Christians" are the most intolerant of people.
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This is correct. homosexuality is no reason to reject a person, we are called to love one another with a ferverant love, (read not sexual) but the bible says that the practise of homosexual sex is a sin and so its interpreted as such as something not Godly and so immature Christians will see it that way and could well be predudiced against it.

Same as inexperienced photographers get bad images more often than more experienced ones.....well similar.

Christians are not perfect, why do you all expect them to be?





Edited .....to say I see the thread has started to decline anywho...........LOL
 
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I wouldn't let my kid do bloody performing arts anyway, they can do proper subjects that might give them a better opportunity in life.
 
andyscott said:
I wouldn't let my kid do bloody performing arts anyway, they can do proper subjects that might give them a better opportunity in life.
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Seriously??? .. You wouldn't encourage what they were passionate about?
 
nilagin said:
How about taking a few seconds to get your head out of the sand (may take hours as it seems you have done such an excellent job or burying it) and think where she would have got her views on homosexuality and then you will see just how stupid your quoted statement really is.
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LASTOLITE said:
This is correct. homosexuality is no reason to reject a person, we are called to love one another with a ferverant love, (read not sexual) but the bible says that the practise of homosexual sex is a sin and so its interpreted as such as something not Godly and so immature Christians will see it that way and could well be predudiced against it.
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The bible does indeed say homosexuality is a sin, but as I've pointed out several times, and been ignored by Nilagin, these were laws given to the nation of Israel (not Christians who follow the teachings of Jesus). These old laws have also been superseded by the new testament. It says so several times in the new testament, as documented several times in this thread.

https://www.talkphotography.co.uk/t...en-performing-arts.609141/page-3#post-7150830 - amongst several others
 
andyscott said:
I wouldn't let my kid do bloody performing arts anyway, they can do proper subjects that might give them a better opportunity in life.
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Quite good for learning how to speak in public, all sorts of good useful skills come out of performing arts that one can use in everyday life, interviews etc
 
andyscott said:
I wouldn't let my kid do bloody performing arts anyway, they can do proper subjects that might give them a better opportunity in life.
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Better opportunity?

As with ANY other subject, talent or career, if they are any good at it they can make a bloody good and lengthy living in the arts.
Yes, there are some awful performers, but there are people in all sectors who perform atrociously in their field.
Perhaps there are even more superb talents out there who've been held back and tolerate crappy jobs because their parents "wouldn't let them do" performing arts.
 
Well said Luvvy! :D or is that Darling.....

Being around stage and performing arts people all the time they are more bothered about the end result than anything else! I shoot lots of theatre and sexuality is not a concern the performance is though and doing you best is what counts. In the school side of things it was very refreshing to see a youngster get it ALL wrong, get in a mess on stage and nobody laughed at him they were all just encouraging and supportive, it was an eye opener! but is the norm in stage and drama schools! from my experience anyway.
 
LASTOLITE said:
I see the attacks on Chritianity in this forum more so than anywhere else at the moment, of the places I visit..... Makes me wonder......
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I consider those sorts of religions generally fine as a hobby. As long as people don't think they are any more important than just a hobby to a degree that adversely affects other people. So in cases like this where the kids as well as the teacher are affected, people are bound to speak out.
 
viv1969 said:
Better opportunity?

As with ANY other subject, talent or career, if they are any good at it they can make a bloody good and lengthy living in the arts.
Yes, there are some awful performers, but there are people in all sectors who perform atrociously in their field.
Perhaps there are even more superb talents out there who've been held back and tolerate crappy jobs because their parents "wouldn't let them do" performing arts.
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Its the spread betting though, performing arts, narrow end of the wedge with few who excel. They need a proper job, not prancing around on a flipping stage in a costume.
 
andyscott said:
Its the spread betting though, performing arts, narrow end of the wedge with few who excel. They need a proper job, not prancing around on a flipping stage in a costume.
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Photography is exactly the same. Would you not allow a child of yours to study or take part in photography, even as a hobby?

At the end of the day I want my children to be well rounded individuals, not accountants who can earn a wedge and not know how to enjoy life.
 
nilagin said:
It's simple enough. The post I quoted said Christians should love everyone (or neighbour) as themselves and should not judge anyone. Which would mean a Christian isn't allowed to judge anyone.t.
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so how can the woman in the OP judge the teacher concerned ? - a clear case here of matthew 7:1 ' Judge not, that ye be not judged' that is the women concerned clearly judged the teacher based on her own predjudices thus acting in an unchristian manner , and has in return been judged for her own behaviour
 
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