Windows 8 - grrr

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Got myself a new non-touch screen computer last week in the knowledge it would come with Windows 8 installed. I hadn't realised how counter intuitive 8 could be, grrr!

I was quite accomplished with W7 and its predecessors, but W8 is so different!
Anyone else been through the same agony as myself?

What the hell is a charm bar by the way, and why is it so called? I find nothing charming about it as far as I can tell!
And similarly the start bar, that doesn't appear to do that much either. Heres hoping 8.1 is better, if not I'm going to consider junking it and do a W7 install.
 
Ctrl+x - admin bits

Ctrl+c - charms

Ctrl+i - settings including power

Stick with Windows 8, yes it is different but I find I work much faster than Windows 7.

Hitting the start key on your keyboard and type the name of what you are looking for is the quickest way to launch an app (also in Win7)
 
Dale_tem said:
Hitting the start key on your keyboard and type the name of what you are looking for is the quickest way to launch an app (also in Win7)
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Not every keyboard has a "start" key (e.g. the one I am typing on now) ;)
 
onomatopoeia said:
Not every keyboard has a "start" key (e.g. the one I am typing on now) ;)
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Can't you map a key on the model M to act as start? (genuine question...)
 
FWIW I'm still liking W8 on my touch screen laptop and have no need of a start menu so if 8.1 to bring back the start menu is optional I'll pass.

It's different to 7 and takes a little learning but I now find it faster and easier.

The start screen with the tiles is the start menu and search page. I have it customised to show things I use regularly. Things I don't use often are found by just typing the first few letters of the program name and the search find them.
 
Using desktop wallpaper as start menu background makes quite a difference I find.
 
Install Start8

Best 5 dollars you'll ever spend, it brings back the start button/start/programs etc, etc menu
 
We have 2 notebooks running Win8 and we love them both but then again, we spent the little extra for touch screens. I've played with mine in touchpad/mouse mode (self inflicted, to see what it's like) and found it far less rewarding! TBH, I rarely drop back to the traditional desktop view - pretty much everything I use this thing for is available from the tile screen.
 
It really comes into it's own on a convertible.

Surface Pro is sat on my desk at work chugging away an Oracle/RHEL VM and reference stuff. 1080p display, type keyboard and wedge mouse makes a very powerful, compact workstation in desktop mode.

Then on the way home i just snap off the keyboard and have all the Metro touch friendly apps for mail, skype, videos, games etc.

I think we're still in a painful transition phase before people mostly use a slim light tablet that docks into a proper office. (yes MS, where is that docking station that the connection on the bottom of surface are clearly for!)
 
RobertP said:
The start screen with the tiles is the start menu and search page. I have it customised to show things I use regularly.
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This! The Windows 8 interface summarized in one sentence. I struggle to understand why people struggle to understand this!
 
mid_gen said:
It really comes into it's own on a convertible.

Surface Pro is sat on my desk at work chugging away an Oracle/RHEL VM and reference stuff. 1080p display, type keyboard and wedge mouse makes a very powerful, compact workstation in desktop mode.

Then on the way home i just snap off the keyboard and have all the Metro touch friendly apps for mail, skype, videos, games etc.

I think we're still in a painful transition phase before people mostly use a slim light tablet that docks into a proper office. (yes MS, where is that docking station that the connection on the bottom of surface are clearly for!)
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Just picked up a price dropped Surface RT. Nice bit of kit and the W8 interface makes lots of sense in touch mode. And using Remote Desktop I can get to my home PC for grunty tasks/things that RT cannot do. Although as a modest app consumer, I've not found many of those tbh.

Add to that Office + Outlook (with 8.1) and it knocks my iPad into a cocked hat as far as being a useful producing rather than consuming device goes.
 
DuncanF said:
This! The Windows 8 interface summarized in one sentence. I struggle to understand why people struggle to understand this!
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I fully understand it, but I have 3 monitors that are more often than not covered in different windows. I just want a small popup in the corner, not a complete new screen - it adds nothing to my UI experience.
 
Problem with programs like classic shell is that yes they get rid of all new OS features old people are unable to learn, but by doing that they also remove a lot of the useful stuff as well
 
redsnappa said:
Problem with programs like classic shell is that yes they get rid of all new OS features old people are unable to learn, but by doing that they also remove a lot of the useful stuff as well
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Classic shell is awful. Why anyone would want to use it is beyond me. Start8 on the other hand does nothing but add a proper start menu. It doesn't remov useful functionality from explorer, change its layout or even remove the metro screen.

Modernmix is very good as well, it lets you run metro apps in their own window.

It's an uncanny throwback to windows 95 which would often let you run DOS apps in a window instead of full screen. I can't help but think MS are going backwards on multitasking.
 
redsnappa said:
Problem with programs like classic shell is that yes they get rid of all new OS features old people are unable to learn, but by doing that they also remove a lot of the useful stuff as well
Click to expand...

What useful stuff :shrug:
 
The problem with start screen is that on a desktop screen, it increases amount of mouse movement compared to the start menu. Same with wi-fi connection in win7 vs win8. On a large monitor with 2560x across, this is unacceptable.

Win8 metro interface is great on convertibles and tablets. But the touch screen world is ultimately different, require a completely different design approach to WIMP and Microsoft failed to realise that. Design philosophy with WIMP is as little mouse movement as possible whereas with tablets, things need to be as large as possible for easier tapping.


I personally would rather stick with a desktop-centric operating system. Use a different operating system designed for tablets running on power saving ARM processor. NAS central storage for documents and remote desktop into the i7 powerhouse for desktop applications.
 
I've just ordered a new PC and made sure it had Win7 rather than 8. TBH this is mainly due to fear of the unknown as I've never tried it myself, I've just read about people finding it difficult. But the other things that swayed it was that my company are upgrading our XP PCs to windows 7 this year so I'll be using the same OS at work and home which is useful.
 
I have Windows 8 on a regular laptop (two actually, plus a desktop) and I just carry on as normal, in desktop mode, without resorting to extra software or workarounds. It's not often I need to tackle the modern UI so I'm really not fussed about it. The Windows key alone or Windows-X gets me quickly to things that aren't on the desktop, and if I'm not already at the desktop then Windows-D gets me there in a flash. For the dozen apps in regular use I just pin links to the task bar where I have instant access to them at all times.

I don't use any of the Windows 8 apps and I have no interest in them. For me it's business as usual with my desktop apps and it has been ever since installing the customer preview last year. All the complaints about missing start buttons and menus seem to be a bit of a storm in a teacup if you ask me.
 
tdodd said:
All the complaints about missing start buttons and menus seem to be a bit of a storm in a teacup if you ask me.
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For me, it was more about the direction the UI was going - I wasn't about to buy into something that was more restrictive - I could buy a Mac and do that ;). They appeared to have halted that and Microsoft seem to be thinking straight again :)
 
The modern UI might be fine for a touch device, but it's a disaster for those of us still using proper hardware. So long as I can bypass the crap and carry on using my grown up apps in a multi-windowed interface I don't much care.
 
wuyanxu said:
The problem with start screen is that on a desktop screen, it increases amount of mouse movement compared to the start menu. Same with wi-fi connection in win7 vs win8. On a large monitor with 2560x across, this is unacceptable.

Win8 metro interface is great on convertibles and tablets. But the touch screen world is ultimately different, require a completely different design approach to WIMP and Microsoft failed to realise that. Design philosophy with WIMP is as little mouse movement as possible whereas with tablets, things need to be as large as possible for easier tapping.


I personally would rather stick with a desktop-centric operating system. Use a different operating system designed for tablets running on power saving ARM processor. NAS central storage for documents and remote desktop into the i7 powerhouse for desktop applications.
Click to expand...

As someone who has used mobile OS for about 4 years, more and more I have been getting annoyed with the speed it takes to get to different things on the desktop, on iOS or android I get notifications, I can see by looking at the icon that there are things needed to check etc. This is what the new UI is about, I can see today's calendar appointments, latest mail, facebook updates, pc alerts, server alerts all from the new start screen. On my desktop, I have to open the browser and click on a favourite. It is quicker to use this forum on my ipad or phone (also clearer and cleaner).

I use it on a normal laptop, touch laptop and desktop with 3 monitors. I love it. The bit I want is the ability to put metro apps on all 3 monitors on my desktop, currently I can only use 1 for metro.
 
What useful stuff
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Classic shell kills breadcrumbs in explorer address bar, removes libraries, hides the windows 8 new file transfer progress dialog and stops the use of windows 8 specific hotkeys e.g Win X.

On my desktop, I have to open the browser and click on a favourite.
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I'm not sure what OS you are using but on Windows 7 & 8 to open to a website all you do is right click the browser icon that is pinned to the task bar then choose from recently used or pinned website shortcuts.

I don't use any of the Windows 8 apps and I have no interest in them
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How do you know if you have not tried them, take your blinkers off for a couple of hours and just try, if you don't like then don't go there again.

I work in IT Support and the vast number of people who are having issues with Windows 8 are the middle aged and older people. They have learned one way of working (usually parrot fashion) and cant be bothered making the effort to change to a new way of working

I've just ordered a new PC and made sure it had Win7 rather than 8. TBH this is mainly due to fear of the unknown
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What the hell is there to be scared of? I hear this almost every day in my job, again from middle aged and older people who have developed a fear of the new.
 
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Easy way to access 'Favourites' - add them as a toolbar - right click the taskbar - click toolbars - New Toolbar and then use the Favourites folder as the destination. You can then access favourites by clicking the >> symbol........

Have to say that my first encounters with 8 were annoying but (and I know that in reality you shouldn't have to do this but ho hum) by tinkering and research I have my setup working very nicely thank you and is just as productive as my 7 laptop - that's without purchasing or adding any free 'work around' software. Can even power down or restart the machine from icons on the taskbar!

My gut feeling is that the interface is aimed primarily at the "average" home user - those that need a bit more "specialised" use need to do some tweaking. Not saying it's right - just that with a bit of effort Win 8 is actually a quite good experience.
 
I'm pretty sure that the Modern UI is aimed at big, fat fingers prodding and swiping at a touch screen, which is why it is absolutely no advance for people using keyboards and mice and wanting to put their screen real estate to good use with lots of information displayed at once, rather than giant tiles plastered all over the place and room to barely show anything.
 
wanting to put their screen real estate to good use with lots of information displayed at once,
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Which is what Microsoft have done with the Windows 8 start screen.
The start screen when used with Live Tile news and weather apps display more real time information than any static desktop can ever do.
 
redsnappa said:
The start screen when used with Live Tile news and weather apps display more real time information than any static desktop can ever do.
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No, no... news and weather are not important. Several terminal windows, a spreadsheet and a web browser is. My weather/news feeds are on a sidebar gadget where I can look at it if needed whilst still concentrating on getting something done.

I don't need a glorified animated screen saver - once I'm at the point where it kicks in, the monitors power off ;)
 
Exactly. Who wants to stare at the "desktop" all day. I want to use apps and often I want to use them side by side, whether that's to compare spreadsheets, browser windows, raw files in different raw software or whatever. I want things to be small so that I can have more of them displayed at once. I don't want fat, finger friendly tiles and buttons consuming the whole screen when I have a mouse and can easily snip things that are a fraction of the size.

How do you achieve something like this in the Modern UI - assuming you'd want to, which sometimes I do?....

Screenshot%2520%25289%2529.png
 
I want to use apps and often I want to use them side by side, whether that's to compare spreadsheets, browser windows, raw files in different raw software or whatever. I want things to be small so that I can have more of them displayed at once
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Erm... you can do all that in Windows 8 without any problems
Your mistake is believing that windows 8 has only a modern UI environment, Windows 8 has both Modern Ui and a desktop environment.
 
Yes, I know. That screen print was taken from a Windows 8 desktop. The whole point is that the lame Modern UI does not support such functionality and is redundant for those of us who want to carry on with real work instead of just scrolling other people's content. It is an annoying irritant which might as well FOAD. There is no place for it in my world.
 
Is it really that hard to hit the Desktop tile to get you to your chosen environment? With a touchscreen, the Tiles work great - with a mouse, they're less so. Likewise, most desktop software is a PITA with a touchscreen but works as we're used to with a mouse/trackpad etc.

Win8 is obviously designed for touchscreens but is useable with mices (sic) should you wish to do so. Not tried earlier versions of Win with a touchscreen but I would imagine it's a less than rewarding experience even if it's possible! (Yes, I do have big, fat fingers and a touchscreen on this machine but I do all my "serious" computing on a Win7 desktop with a trackball. Horses for courses...)
 
tdodd said:
Yes, I know. That screen print was taken from a Windows 8 desktop. The whole point is that the lame Modern UI does not support such functionality and is redundant for those of us who want to carry on with real work instead of just scrolling other people's content. It is an annoying irritant which might as well FOAD. There is no place for it in my world.
Click to expand...

Absolutely correct and you get a special prize for acronym of the year.......

......FOAD, love it!

The only thing Win8 has going for it is speed.
 
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tdodd said:
Yes, I know. That screen print was taken from a Windows 8 desktop. The whole point is that the lame Modern UI does not support such functionality and is redundant for those of us who want to carry on with real work instead of just scrolling other people's content. It is an annoying irritant which might as well FOAD. There is no place for it in my world.
Click to expand...

I can get 2 modern UI windows up side by side, currently they are on a 25/75 split, but the 50/50 option is coming in 8.1. You can have modern UI take up 25% with a chat app and use 75% for the desktop, or put the desk top in 25% and it will show you tiles for each open application. Click on an application and it will switch to 75% with that app open.

I normally have around 25 windows open on my desktop, 80% are desktop and 20% are metro, it depends what I am doing. Trello, Onenote and PC Monitor are better in The modern UI and other apps are coming out all the time.

Remote Desktop in Wndows 8 is much better with screen scaling (at last!!!)
 
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