When did respect for the Police end

wack61

wack61

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No
I'm in my early 50s , as a child if a copper had cause to speak to me I'd look at the floor and say nothing unless it was in direct response to a question

Today kids seem to do whatever they want while recording it on their phones while the police stand by afraid to do anything unless it's on YouTube that night

I have to commend the police officers restraint in this video , after 5 minutes of this I don't think I'd have been so calm

He wants to speak to a driver after witnessing him doing a hand brake turn

http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=c35_1365986611
 
The hippy/flower power generation was the main cause of disrespect in my opinion is the short answer


Realspeed
 
I reckon it's always been the same in Inner city areas. It's just now the police can't give the gobshytes a smack like they probably would have done in the past.
 
Well if you want my opinion ....



censored-smiley.png
 
I've got a great deal of respect for the police, I've friends who are police officers and because of the nature of what I do photographically and for work I average contact/interactions with the police once a month, like any profession there are a few that let the rest of them down etc but on the whole they spend most of there working live dealing with people that no the chance of the getting a meaningful punishment is slim and that they "have human rights"

I've only had one really bad run in with the police and that was at the torch run last year :shake:
 
may be if the police arrived at the scene in a lambourghini gulardo with phat tunez with a thudding bass playing instead of a siren, wore several yards (or should that be yardz) of gold chain instead of body armour , carried a highly polished sig sauer handgun, and had tears tattoed on their cheeks for each scrote they''d arrested then they'd get more 'respec' from the kidz :nuts:

They could also bring the arrest declaration up to date

" Yo hear me now, you is under da arrest dawg , you has the right to remain silent an that, you has the right to da attorney , you down with that bro ? ... "
 
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Mod edit: unsubstantiated party political broadcast removed.
 
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It's complicated.

Firstly, I don't believe that most people have in fact lost respect for the police, and I also believe that the vast majority of the public (myself included) accept that the police have an extremely difficult job to do, and are fully supportive of what they try to do, even if we don't always support (or understand) their approach.

Secondly, the fact that idiot like this 'gentleman' can bait the police and NOT get beaten up for his pains, says a lot about the way that the police behave - just try that in some countries...

Thirdly, we hear a lot about police misconduct, actions, failures etc because of the internet, just as we hear about a lot of things via the internet. The reach of instant communications has never been greater, and people can and do tell lies on the internet without too much fear of reprisals - newspapers have to worry about libel action, internet posters can generally get away with almost anything.

But, there's no doubt in my mind that although most of the public continue to fully support the front line police, their own bosses don't. Budget cuts result in less training, less equipment, a reduction in immediate backup and low morale, and in turn this can lead to police officers waiting for backup to arrive instead of putting themselves into dangerous situations, which can mean that things can get out of hand.

And some senior officers now seem to see themselves as spin doctors, being very economical with the truth when the police have screwed up, and often lying through their teeth, to protect the reputation of their force - when all that is actually needed is an acceptance that, sometimes, their officers don't get it right. Reasonable members of the public fully accept that police officers, like all other people, can't get it right all the time. What we cannot and will not accept is the lies and cover ups.

How do the senior police officers get away with lying? Easy. They know that complaints from the public will be investigated by their own internal investigators, and they know that their professional standards department only find that junior officers get it wrong, senior ones always get their full support.

As for the post above about police misconduct at demos, unfortunately this is by no means an isolated incident. Somehow, many police officers seem to be spoiling for a fight at demonstrations, and again their actions are covered up by their 'superiors'.
 
neil_g said:
*waits patiently for thread to descend into police bashing*
Click to expand...

well that didnt take long

Organnyx said:
fully armoured "shock troops"

the only violence was from the police,

MET psycho bully boys,

send the bully boys

political enforcer thugs,

......
Click to expand...

shall we just skip to the third reich refferences, godwin and thread closure now :lol:
 
How that policeman had kept calm the whole time and not said "Oh sod this, I've gone past caring about it all" and smacked one in the driver's face, I'll never know.
But it is a sad indication of today's society, but then again I've been fortunate in never having got into trouble with the law in all my life - apart from a parking ticket back in 1994. :D
 
Ian D J said:
How that policeman had kept calm the whole time and not said "Oh sod this, I've gone past caring about it all" and smacked one in the driver's face, I'll never know.
But it is a sad indication of today's society, but then again I've been fortunate in never having got into trouble with the law in all my life - apart from a parking ticket back in 1994. :D
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One of my favourite "crime makes you stupid" stories comes from a freind who is a cop in Milton Keynes

On pulling one of the local 'intellectual elite' for driving like a prat on the A5D ( 90+ in a 70 limit IIRC) he warned said driver that this would likely end in points on his licence

My mate was somewhat suprised when the driver responded " shows what you know copper, I haven't got a ***ing licenc... ahhh ****sticks " :lol:
 
Garry Edwards said:
It's complicated.

Firstly, I don't believe that most people have in fact lost respect for the police, and I also believe that the vast majority of the public (myself included) accept that the police have an extremely difficult job to do, and are fully supportive of what they try to do, even if we don't always support (or understand) their approach.

Secondly, the fact that idiot like this 'gentleman' can bait the police and NOT get beaten up for his pains, says a lot about the way that the police behave - just try that in some countries...

Thirdly, we hear a lot about police misconduct, actions, failures etc because of the internet, just as we hear about a lot of things via the internet. The reach of instant communications has never been greater, and people can and do tell lies on the internet without too much fear of reprisals - newspapers have to worry about libel action, internet posters can generally get away with almost anything.

But, there's no doubt in my mind that although most of the public continue to fully support the front line police, their own bosses don't. Budget cuts result in less training, less equipment, a reduction in immediate backup and low morale, and in turn this can lead to police officers waiting for backup to arrive instead of putting themselves into dangerous situations, which can mean that things can get out of hand.

And some senior officers now seem to see themselves as spin doctors, being very economical with the truth when the police have screwed up, and often lying through their teeth, to protect the reputation of their force - when all that is actually needed is an acceptance that, sometimes, their officers don't get it right. Reasonable members of the public fully accept that police officers, like all other people, can't get it right all the time. What we cannot and will not accept is the lies and cover ups.

How do the senior police officers get away with lying? Easy. They know that complaints from the public will be investigated by their own internal investigators, and they know that their professional standards department only find that junior officers get it wrong, senior ones always get their full support.

As for the post above about police misconduct at demos, unfortunately this is by no means an isolated incident. Somehow, many police officers seem to be spoiling for a fight at demonstrations, and again their actions are covered up by their 'superiors'.
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:agree: How they do it on the other side of the pond.

[YOUTUBE]?v=RVmGWLsn0iM[/YOUTUBE]
 
Hmm, let's see him try that in another country! People in the UK are quick to complain about the police here but don't realise just how lucky they are to have the type of police service they have. Take the recent example of the police brutality in South Africa...arose from a traffic offence. Police will always be seen as thugs of the current government, irrespective of which type of govt is in place. Ultimately they will also always bare the brunt of the public's frustration at the govt.
 
Saw this today and thought 2 things....

Knowledge is power.


Not knowing how to handle power is dangerous.

This will send out a message to the ill informed and will lessen the respect and power of those who serve to protect us from those who can't handle power.

Very sad indeed.
 
Some people have been behaving like that since 1979 when I first hit the streets.
Why? Well, what's a court going to do? Not much. At least then they'd see a court, but nowadays thats unlikely. By the time you've got past ACPOO guidelines, Attorney Generals Guidelines and the CPS the courts are constrained by what they can sentence with.
No deterrent, no interest in obeying laws and no interest in Police trying to stop them doing what they like.
Videos like that don't help, they see others get away with murder, then others will try the same. Any attempt to stamp it out is met with "It's so unfair, they did it and nothing happened....." etc.
Why have things changed? Simple really, the Public (through Government) wanted it that way, well so the politicians would have us believe.
 
Bernie174 said:
Some people have been behaving like that since 1979 when I first hit the streets.
Why? Well, what's a court going to do? Not much. At least then they'd see a court, but nowadays thats unlikely. By the time you've got past ACPOO guidelines, Attorney Generals Guidelines and the CPS the courts are constrained by what they can sentence with.
No deterrent, no interest in obeying laws and no interest in Police trying to stop them doing what they like.
Videos like that don't help, they see others get away with murder, then others will try the same. Any attempt to stamp it out is met with "It's so unfair, they did it and nothing happened....." etc.
Why have things changed? Simple really, the Public (through Government) wanted it that way, well so the politicians would have us believe.
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No, IMO only a TINY minority want it that way.
As I said in my earlier post, I think the problem is that everyone can be a plonker on the internet, and getting publicity for themselves costs nothing. You may have come across the odd idiot back in 1979, but back then they couldn't get their 15 minutes of pointless fame.
 
Garry, you're certainly right they couldn't get the 15 minutes of fame (or looking like a plonker as this bloke does) to a large audience, but given a crowd, they got their adoration. Again, yes, it was the odd twit, and I doubt this guy is that representative of people now, any more than the odd berk was then.

There was a number of ways of getting him out, and nicked but is it worth the effort? Probably not, so I would guess the result was we'll leave him for another day, they always come again. Again, thats not changed, we did that in the the 70's too.
 
realspeed said:
The hippy/flower power generation was the main cause of disrespect in my opinion is the short answer


Realspeed
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This is about right, this is when we stopped respecting most professionals
 
A run in with the local copper was no problem when I was younger :thumbs: When my Dad found out was when I had to start worrying.
 
There is a number of issues... not just police but lack of respect generally.

Now there are many reasons for this, lack of discipline in schools, too many 'human rights'. I am 40, and remember at the age of 6 getting hit on the hands with a ruler at school for being naughty... guess what, I didnt do it again!!

There is the 'u tube generation' where they can be famous too.

There is also the lack of punishment too. You can get away with so much if you want to, especially if you can play the system - and blame other people for it too.

With police, i certainly have less respect for them when I see them dishing out fines for driving without a seatbelt and other very minor crimes when they are constantly moaning about resources... well target the more serious crimes then. I also dont see too many bobbies on the beat which i think helps.

I think the justice system is also a cause (for me) about having less respect for the police even though I know they are not the same. But when you can get a £60 fine (plus points which can easily add £100 to your insurance) for speeding, it grates that you do read of people having kiddie porn getting away with it (going on a register and maybe a small fine). Or when you see the police reality shows where people get away with all sorts.
 
Simon
The problem is that speeding causes a great deal of harm. So £60 FPN is bad? Go back 20 years and it was a summons, a lot more than £60 and the points.
The idea of FPN's is to save police time, and avoid a court appearance for you.
I understand that some think speeding isn't important, but trust me, do the walk up a garden path, the knock on the door, and "Hello Mrs Smith, can I come in please" followed by telling said Mrs Smith her family member is dead because he/she/a n other thought their speed wasn't important and you will have a different perspective.

Yes, costs the person caught more on insurance? I am not filled with sympathy, sorry.

So on the face of it, No seatbelt, excess speed, red traffic light are 'minor'. Trouble is when they come into contact with something else, that minor offence can become a fatal accident, investigating that can cost well over a million, and is usually avoidable. Who do you think is paying that £ Million bill? You, me and every other tax payer. It's not quite so minor when you put it into perspective.

In any case, if people don't want the tickets, don't speed, it's really that simple.

As for other crime, Police do deal with that, which is why you don't see them walking the streets very often now. Trouble is every other of societies ills is also lumped their way. You don't see other public services after 5pm now, so unless your ill (and even then more and more Police are having to deal with that to cover holes in the Ambulance services), or on fire, then it's Police that get the job. In my time I spent far more time doing things that really had nothing at all to do with Police, and the situation is far far worse now.

Don't be fooled by Mrs May either, her promises (and to be fair that of every Home Sec ever) of reducing paper work are utter rubbish. For example, a simple shoplifter I could have nicked, charged paperwork done and be back on the streets in 1.5 hours, is now an 8 hour epic. Followed by, as you rightly say, a distinct lack of punishment, and thus no deterrent effect.
 
u8myufo said:
A run in with the local copper was no problem when I was younger :thumbs: When my Dad found out was when I had to start worrying.
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:lol: Same here! My Dad was in the Police for 30 years from the mid 1950's and the Guards before that. He didn't mess about!

Edit: Removed the rest because it was just me rambling and reminiscing in the past.
 
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Bernie174 said:
In any case, if people don't want the tickets, don't speed, it's really that simple.
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This ^

Reference the lack of respect, it's not just the police it's everything and everyone. Each successive generation complains about lack of respect as they get older and that's because respect for others is slowly disappearing from our culture. People have less sense of community as the world get smaller, less sense of responsibility as government takes more and more of it away from us. And less fear of punishment as those we place in power to govern become paralysed by fear of being sued for every perceived offense.

I hate to think what the UK will be like in a hundred years.
 
In all honesty there's very little respect for anyone these days, trouble is the youth of today is tommorows future what hope have we got!
 
Bernie. Speeding is something we all do. Some may speed all the time, and in some cases dangerously like 70 in a 30 which needs action. However many of us will simply lose concentration, forget what the limit on the road is etc... Yet we can be punished for a small error or misjudgement. We all make mistakes and are all human but why should minor offences like that carry a bigger punishment than some of the anti social crime we see.
 
With speeding you get 4 chances before a ban, I call that pretty lenient

Somebody with 9 points for speeding isn't going to learn until they have a ban hanging over their head
 
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wack61 said:
With speeding you get 4 chances before a ban, I call that pretty lenient

Somebody with 9 points for speeding isn't going to learn until they have a ban hanging over their head
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It's not about whether 3 points is too much or too few. It's the fact that I could make a small error, not paying full attention, and get hit with a fine while someone who shoplifts or is abusive/violent or steals, may get away with a telling off. Often a teenage joyrider will get a lesser punishment than someone doing 60 in a 50 in perfect conditions. when I see what I believe to be more trivial offences punished more that far more serious ones, it makes me lose respect forthe justice system which includes police.

Obviously we all have different morals, and what we deem as serious and non serious so all of us wold have different ideas
 
Familiarity breeds contempt. Being stopped as a youngster once is scary. By the 10th time its just annoying.
 
Simon

Whether you regard it as minor or not, the only person at fault is the driver. You say a minor lack of concentration, sorry, it doesn't wash. If you are driving you have a responsibility to pay attention. If you don't, then there's only one person to blame, that isn't a police officer.
We might all speed, the difference is that if some of us are caught doing it, we take responsibility for that, not lay the blame or deflect it someone who wasn't in control (and that is debatable if you aren't paying attention). Using that as an excuse for poor driving is just failing to man up, not a reason for not respecting a police officer.
 
Bernie174 said:
Whether you regard it as minor or not, the only person at fault is the driver. You say a minor lack of concentration, sorry, it doesn't wash. If you are driving you have a responsibility to pay attention. If you don't, then there's only one person to blame, that isn't a police officer.
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Agreed.


Steve.
 
cambsno said:
However many of us will simply lose concentration, forget what the limit on the road is etc....
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Don't the odds of killing a person dramatically increase with just a small rise in speed?

It's your responsibility as the driver of a moving 1.5 tonne hulk of metal and plastic to be concentrating and know what the limit is.

I'm not saying I've never sped, but I'd take it like a man when I got caught.

But we digress...
 
How else would they deal with speeding, the amount of people caught speeding every day is probably in the 10s of thousands

If they started handing out cautions through the courts it'd bring the system to a stop

You're not going to get a ticket for doing 33 in a 30 , even if you were doing 33 your speedo would be reading 35-36 so you should be well aware you're over the limit

People that have been prosecuted for doing 36 would have had 40mph showing on the dash
 
wack61 said:
You're not going to get a ticket for doing 33 in a 30 , even if you were doing 33 your speedo would be reading 35-36 so you should be well aware you're over the limit
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Not all speedometers are incorrectly calibrated :thumbs:
 
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