What would you do? RTA

[Splog]

Whilst driving in Cumbria near Windermere I came across this RTA. The heap on the right is a bike that had gone under the land Rover and burst into flames also setting fire to the car. The rider appeared to be very seriously injured and a couple who had also stopped were very distressed as was the car driver.

The rider was later taken away by the air ambulance, although by this time I had left the scene and parked a bit further away as the emergency services started to arrive.

I was seriously tempted to take more shots but felt it would cause to much distress to those at the scene ... What would you have done?

 

[Kaouthia]

Assuming all involved in the accident were OK, I'd have carried on shooting.

If everybody's ok, or somebody more qualified than you is able to keep an eye on them til more help arrives, there's not much you can do, and if you got some really good dramatic saleable images that you could put up as stock (without having to go the expense of buying and torching your own land rover and bike - and getting any local required permits to do such on a public road), chances are they'd sell to insurance companies for their brochures and leaflets.

 

[Grayman]

Steve, I think I would go with Arkady's philosophy on a previous thread..always get the shot! Whether I would actually go through with it when faced with such a situation is another thing. Essentially you did what you thought was right...some might agree some might not, so long as you feel comfortable in yourself.

 

[OutLore]

chances are they'd sell to insurance companies for their brochures and leaflets.

And that shot would definately go out in the local paper...

 

[Arkady]

Several scenarios to this:
If you're the only person there or the first on the scene - obvious - you have to assist - anything else would be morally reprehensible - these are human beings after all.
If the opportunity presents itself later, after others have arrived and no harm is being done, by all means take some images if you feel the need to do so.

If there are other people in attendance who are just unqualified civilians (assuming you have some of the required medical/emergency skill-sets), take a quick snap or two and then lend a hand, possibly taking more images later on when the situation is in hand.
If you are as unqualified as they, take photos but keep an eye open to see if your assistance is required and be prepared to drop everything to help out...

If the Emergency Services are in full attendance, just take photos.

 

[SpikeK6]

I have mixed feelings on these sorts of pics.
whilst I agree with Arkady's way of thinking of getting the pic, and selling it on and do what ever else you need to do with the pic as a pro photographer, to earne a living etc etc as said in other post not nessecerily this one,right place right time etc etc.

I also disagree in a sence of an amature/hobbyist takes these pics for no gain or exposure other than to say I was there when this happend, specially when someone is seriously injured (as said by OP), whilst it is a good pic oppertunity that does not come along very often, does this make it right??

When taking these sorts of pics do you give name and address tel numbers etc to those involved, police etc to say i have a load of pics in case needed for further investigation??

Its not my cup of tea to be honest but each to their own.

spike

 

[dseered]

http://www.thewestmorlandgazette.co.uk
http://www.cumbria.police.uk/neighbourhood-overview/windermere

I would contact the Police with the images before the paper, looks like a serious collision that I would imagine had further investigation. Sadly this is something all to common on the Lake Districts roads and one of the reasons I stopped biking !
Westmorland Gaz is the local rag.

 

[neil_g]

Several scenarios to this:
If you're the only person there or the first on the scene - obvious - you have to assist - anything else would be morally reprehensible - these are human beings after all.
If the opportunity presents itself later, after others have arrived and no harm is being done, by all means take some images if you feel the need to do so.

If there are other people in attendance who are just unqualified civilians (assuming you have some of the required medical/emergency skill-sets), take a quick snap or two and then lend a hand, possibly taking more images later on when the situation is in hand.
If you are as unqualified as they, take photos but keep an eye open to see if your assistance is required and be prepared to drop everything to help out...

If the Emergency Services are in full attendance, just take photos.

dont feel like running for prime minister do you?

 

[Arkady]

Wouldn't want the job TBH...bad suits, bad haircuts, lousy hours and have to deal with cretins at PM's Questions...naaahhh...
Only idiots and despots want to go into Politics...

 

[mrphilk]

The way I see it, snap away (obviously assuming everyone is ok / being dealt with etc).

But be sure to get or give your details to the people involved.

Assuming the chap on the bike was ok I reckon he would love those pictures once he was well on the mend "look how ruddy lucky I was"!

 

[mrtoad]

prayed for the guy in the crash on his way to hospital

sat and reflected on the situation

deleted the photograph

 

[Kaouthia]

deleted the photograph

Even if you don't use it for any commercial gain, why delete the photograph? There are no injured or dying people in the image, and it's a good image to demonstrate the dangers of motorcycles (or, more accurately, the dangers of cars to motorcycles) to people.

If your kid suddenly said to you "Dad, I wanna motorbike", and you didn't want him to get one, an image like that could convince them to see your point of view. I used to ride bikes myself, but with the amount of inexperienced idiots on the road in cars these days, there's no way I'll get on 2 wheels outside of a track again, not in this country.

 

[mrtoad]

Even if you don't use it for any commercial gain, why delete the photograph? There are no injured or dying people in the image, and it's a good image to demonstrate the dangers of motorcycles (or, more accurately, the dangers of cars to motorcycles) to people.

If your kid suddenly said to you "Dad, I wanna motorbike", and you didn't want him to get one, an image like that could convince them to see your point of view. I used to ride bikes myself, but with the amount of inexperienced idiots on the road in cars these days, there's no way I'll get on 2 wheels outside of a track again, not in this country.

i had a motorbike and crashed it several times...that isnt a problem to me and i would have another if i wasnt so scared of what can do nearly twice the speed my old triumph speed twin could do...1961
what came to mind was grief, pain and suffering suggested by the shot
and the fact i wouldnt really need to take the shot to have as a souvenir...

its sensational i will admit and seemingly a scoop...i just dont use my camera for that reason...but roll on macduff...see if i care

 

[danbroad]

I'd have helped. I'd be open to potential legal action if I so much as stopped to take a single shot - unless it was important for mechanism. Quite a few of us trauma guys ride bikes, too... In this case, though, the first rule is scene safety. There are at least two fuel tanks there, ready to go; if it's not safe, I'd have to wait.

 

[DrRusty]

Keep the photo, make sure you know exactly where you were and ensure you provide it to the police. (with the exif data)

However, it may mean that you would be required to go to court, but I assume you have already provided your details to the Police as a witness.

 

[Splog]

Thanks for the advice everyone! I arrived before the emergency services but didn't actually witness the accident and I didn't feel I could have added much to help the situation.

 

[awp]

I could make no contribution in any medical sense - my job is to document the scene - and I would have no hesitation in doing that. Pictures could be useful for all sorts of reasons afterwards - not just for press use.

 

[desantnik]

Nice composition, I like the leading lines.

Useful shot for the Police? I doubt it. Useful would be capturing the incident as it happened. Anything else is not much cop.

Paper will love it though, bang it in.

 

[redhand010]

Shame it been photoshopped though..

Nothing in the papers and police have no knowledge of a motorcycle hitting a landrover and catching fire.

There's no damage to the landrover at all. hardly likely given the severity of the crash, and no sign of any one else on the scene?? and the defenders wheels are dead straight ahead, which would mean the driver took no avoiding action.

 

[Splog]

Shame it been photoshopped though..

Nothing in the papers and police have no knowledge of a motorcycle hitting a landrover and catching fire.

There's no damage to the landrover at all. hardly likely given the severity of the crash, and no sign of any one else on the scene?? and the defenders wheels are dead straight ahead, which would mean the driver took no avoiding action.

Are you serious? :shrug: Nice first post :shake:

 

[scottcampbell]

Shame it been photoshopped though..

Nothing in the papers and police have no knowledge of a motorcycle hitting a landrover and catching fire.

There's no damage to the landrover at all. hardly likely given the severity of the crash, and no sign of any one else on the scene?? and the defenders wheels are dead straight ahead, which would mean the driver took no avoiding action.

That's a very silly accusation to make. If you have any knowledge of the media, you'll know that local papers don't normally publish on Sundays, and are often weekly. It's just a car crash so isn't of national interest.

 

[MisterE]

Shame it been photoshopped though..

Nothing in the papers and police have no knowledge of a motorcycle hitting a landrover and catching fire.

There's no damage to the landrover at all. hardly likely given the severity of the crash, and no sign of any one else on the scene?? and the defenders wheels are dead straight ahead, which would mean the driver took no avoiding action.

Is somebody else going to call him one, or is it down to me?

 

[alexkidd]

Shame it been photoshopped though..

Nothing in the papers and police have no knowledge of a motorcycle hitting a landrover and catching fire.

There's no damage to the landrover at all. hardly likely given the severity of the crash, and no sign of any one else on the scene?? and the defenders wheels are dead straight ahead, which would mean the driver took no avoiding action.

the left front of the land rover is on fire and crumbling which considering the build quality of the defender is impressive, theres been a collision with the bike which has set the car on fire, chances are the driver has reversed away from or off the bike and more than likely in a straight line and as others have said it was on a sunday..

p.s i think everyones implying your name is richard.

welcome to the forum


-----

back to the original point, primarily if there was anything productive i could do i'd be doing it if not i'd be taking pictures whilst making sure i'm not causing any distress

 

[Briony]

prayed for the guy in the crash on his way to hospital

sat and reflected on the situation

deleted the photograph

I agree with this, no way would I shoot this just for the sake of it, god how heartless can one be,:shrug::nono: just to get that shot, :nono: perhaps I am not a prpoper togger then not to get this opportunity but having lost a relative in a bike accident with a "decapitated head" there is no way that I would want to capture this.:thumbsdown:

Whoops, I can hear things flying at me and all the name calling but hey I can take it.

 

[alexkidd]

i think to call someone heartless because they're taking photos of an accident is a little off myself, it's like calling someone a paedophile because they're taking photos of kids.

or did i mis-interpret your meaning? (apologies if so)

obviously i understand your individual lack of motivation to do so obviously and respect that

 

[Briony]

i think to call someone heartless because they're taking photos of an accident is a little off myself, it's like calling someone a paedophile because they're taking photos of kids.

or did i mis-interpret your meaning? (apologies if so)

obviously i understand your individual lack of motivation to do so obviously and respect that

Probably mis-interpreted my meaning but you can understand where I am coming from after losing someone from a bike accident I just could not do it,) same scenario of that MP who came out of tha plane crash I suppose.

But me personally "no" could not take a photo, anyway I would have camera shake.!

 

[alexkidd]

Ah ok, sorry

 

[Briony]

 

[ruvor]

How would you feel with someone taking a photo of you if you had an accident? Either way at best you get say £20 from the local media for the shot, worst you have your time wasted being called into court for no pay...

 

[Voyager]

First secure the area - try to stop any traffic barrelling into the incident making things worse

Second check casualties - anyone trapped/suffocating/bleeding badly?

Third try to put the fire out!

Take all the pictures you like. Can't see that they will be much use to you though - local press will take them but haven't the money to pay unless it was Prince William crashing his bike! The police and those involved might like some copies though. The Land Rover looks to be on it's own side of the road in that shot - suggesting that the bike overcooked the corner - but your evidence might help either party in their claim.

 

[mickledore]

First secure the area - try to stop any traffic barrelling into the incident making things worse

Second check casualties - anyone trapped/suffocating/bleeding badly?

Third try to put the fire out!

Take all the pictures you like. Can't see that they will be much use to you though - local press will take them but haven't the money to pay unless it was Prince William crashing his bike! The police and those involved might like some copies though. The Land Rover looks to be on it's own side of the road in that shot - suggesting that the bike overcooked the corner - but your evidence might help either party in their claim.

That is just about spot on. Your first duty is to help in whatever way you can. Take pictures when your assistance is no longer needed, but do not get in the way of those still helping. Keep your distance. Then offer them to the Police, and maybe the drivers concerned - both of them, you can't apportion blame.

Then use the pics as you think right and proper.

 

[London luke]

Whilst driving in Cumbria near Windermere I came across this RTA. The heap on the right is a bike that had gone under the land Rover and burst into flames also setting fire to the car. The rider appeared to be very seriously injured and a couple who had also stopped were very distressed as was the car driver.

The rider was later taken away by the air ambulance, although by this time I had left the scene and parked a bit further away as the emergency services started to arrive.

I was seriously tempted to take more shots but felt it would cause to much distress to those at the scene ... What would you have done?

I know this pic has had one "query"
at what stage did you take this pic? There is no one there? Or did you move the rider to a safer area etc.

Or did the rider "land" out of the shot? And those assisting him/her etc are out of shot also?

To be honest , if i was a editor i would not publish this pic, i would want to see "people" in the scene ,attending to the guy etc . So it creates a story.

 

[MisterE]

How would you feel with someone taking a photo of you if you had an accident?

When I dislocated my shoulder in a remote part of South Africa hours away from a hospital I told the friend I was with to make sure she took some photos at some convenient point.

And another time when she passed out and nearly choked to death on her own vomit due to air sickness on a sight seeing flight and I had to get her breathing again, the first thing she said to me when she regained consciousness was "Did you get any pictures?" No, I didn't.

 

[POAH]

nothing I would have went on my way without taking any pictures. where is the point of taking a picture at such a scene. its not going to be arty, its not somthing I would print out, its not my job.

Whilst driving in Cumbria near Windermere I came across this RTA. The heap on the right is a bike that had gone under the land Rover and burst into flames also setting fire to the car. The rider appeared to be very seriously injured and a couple who had also stopped were very distressed as was the car driver.

The rider was later taken away by the air ambulance, although by this time I had left the scene and parked a bit further away as the emergency services started to arrive.

I was seriously tempted to take more shots but felt it would cause to much distress to those at the scene ... What would you have done?

 

[mrphilk]

You could maybe flog it to the paper, see if the motorbike chap wants it. If hes doesnt offer to give the money to charity?

I reckon if I was the motorbike chappy I would want a copy of the picture though.

I definately wouldnt want to delete it. Why would you want to deny what had happened? Just because its tragic does not make the photograph wrong?

 

[awp]

Why would you want to deny what had happened? Just because its tragic does not make the photograph wrong?

Exactly.
If photographers only take pictures of nice pretty things, what sort of impression is that going to leave for the next generation? We have to record the world as it is - sometimes it is not pleasant.

 

[GrittyShaker]

I reckon if I was the motorbike chappy I would want a copy of the picture though.

Definitely without doubt.

I had an accident on an S2000 meet on the IOM a couple of years ago. I was livid that nobody got any photos.

 

[Icee]

Several scenarios to this:
If you're the only person there or the first on the scene - obvious - you have to assist - anything else would be morally reprehensible - these are human beings after all.
If the opportunity presents itself later, after others have arrived and no harm is being done, by all means take some images if you feel the need to do so.

If there are other people in attendance who are just unqualified civilians (assuming you have some of the required medical/emergency skill-sets), take a quick snap or two and then lend a hand, possibly taking more images later on when the situation is in hand.
If you are as unqualified as they, take photos but keep an eye open to see if your assistance is required and be prepared to drop everything to help out...

If the Emergency Services are in full attendance, just take photos.

I would go with the above.

As someone who has the medical/emergency skill-sets and is a press tog it would be make sure everyone is ok and/or being attended to by someone qualified to do so, then take photos for whatever purpose.

 

[Nod]

999, try to put out fire if safe, wait for Plod/Ambulance then leave. TBH, I wouldn't dream of getting the camera out but that's just me! (I'm not first aid trained but do know enough to know not to try to move a casualty unless he/she is in immediate mortal danger, so unless he/she was in the fire, there's very little i could do to help)

There are at least two fuel tanks there, ready to go; if it's not safe, I'd have to wait.

Yup, the bike tank which has already ruptured and is burning out and that of the Defender (Not as someone's said, a Discovery). I would be prepared to bet that the Defender is a Diesel rather than petrol so is less likely to explode.

 

[alexkidd]

^ i'm such a tard, i was concentrating so much on not getting those two mixed up i got them mixed up, lol