What no jeremy cobyn thread?

Phil V said:
So, for fun, tell me why there's any relevance to my long dead grandad whether or not I'm a Monarchist.

No deflection, just an answer.
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No, I'm not going to debate or discuss your long dead grandfather or any if the brave men and women who have and continue to lay down their lives, for your fun or amusement. If you don't get it, then I'm surprised you are not as intelligent or articulate as you seem to portray into.

The pool awaits.
 
SPLASH!!!!
 
BillN_33 said:
why does he get so serious about some of the ceremonial stuff mentioned in here - it is all about people, the economy, quality of life, the health service, the environment and dare I mention it defence ..... many other stuff that will be chipped in by
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That's the point, he doesn't. He doesn't care. Look at yesterday's PMQs. It is the media that is making a big deal about small details and ignoring the policy issues.
The interview on the BBC News last night was embarrassing. The interviewer asked him at least 3 times if he'd kneel before the Queen, after he'd already said it was the first he'd heard of it and would have to think about it and discuss it with his colleagues. Again, and again he was pressed for an answer on this meaningless trivia. A whole interview about what position he'll adopt to be sworn into the Privy Council, no mention of any public policy.
 
Maybe he could come up with a more suitable chant

"The Labour Party is Dead.............Long Live The Labour Party" :-)
 
Mr Bump said:
Maybe he could come up with a more suitable chant

"The Labour Party is Dead.............Long Live The Labour Party" :)
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Surely, given his pacifist beliefs, "We'll keep the white flag flying here"? :naughty:
 
BillN_33 said:
I hope so as I quite like to sing their National Anthem, (not being Scottish) ......... and hum along with the French one
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Nothing to stop you doing that whenever you choose. Do it now.
 
andyscott said:
The monarchy is hugely important, even if you disregard all of the powers (and yes she does have a few) Remember the PM has to ask her permission to form a government, she has to open parliment etc etc.

The soveriegn brings in a huge amount of income to the country, and makes a lot more than they cost.
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Do you have any evidence to back this up? I would be interested to see how this is calculated / reasoned.
 
Rapscallion said:
Do you have any evidence to back this up? I would be interested to see how this is calculated / reasoned.
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Monarchists do the simple calculation that their estates bring in x amount and they cost y amount and balance it. From that simple calculation it appears that they do take in more than they cost. But the truth isn't as simple. That equation doesn't factor in the cost of security for state visits both in the UK and abroad - a royal visit to NI for example is exceptionally expensive. Secondly, the estates income includes various attractions that do not rely on a sitting monarchy to prove popular - eg. Tower of London - so it's unfair to say that the monarchy brings in this money. It's impossible to come to a conclusion on whether they do or don't provide good value.

What I do know is that people show deference to a bloodline of people - giving them privilidge and wealth for no good reason.

I'd love to know why people are monarchists. It makes no sense to me at all.
 
decigallen said:
I oppose intolerance and support freedom of choice and expression. A lot of people died for me (and Corbyn) to have that right.
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So would you support freedom of speech as long as it doesnt upset or offend anyone? Is that freedom?
 
BillN_33 said:
the more you see the guy, the more you may respect him, agree with him or not ......... but it is all going to end in tears ............. two labour parties ........ maybe a small group led by Corbin and a large group of the rest???
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I fear you may be right, the biggest level of criticism against him seems to be coming from his own MP's :(
 
dejongj said:
Why stop at a monarchy? Why not just remove country borders. Or hey let's abolish tax all together.
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Thats a bit wide of the mark JP, plenty of countries are republics but they still have borders and taxes.

edit Whoops, just noticed @ghoti reply. Thats what you get for posting on the hoof :)
 
BRASH said:
No, I'm not going to debate or discuss your long dead grandfather or any if the brave men and women who have and continue to lay down their lives, for your fun or amusement. If you don't get it, then I'm surprised you are not as intelligent or articulate as you seem to portray into.

The pool awaits.
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So you have no reasonable answer, I'm just wrong because the phrase 'turning in their graves' plays to a popular unthinking mindset and has no basis in any reality that should suggest a change in someone's opinion or behaviour.

The thing is, as you can see above, most people understand that, but there's a small enough very vocal minority who aren't bright enough to work it out.
 
andyscott said:
So would you support freedom of speech as long as it doesnt upset or offend anyone? Is that freedom?
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Where does that come from? It's a right wing media myth that people only like other people's freedoms so long as it doesn't offend.

Feel free to be offended by my opinions, whilst I'll feel free to find yours hilarious :)
 
Mr Bump said:
http://www.theatlantic.com/internat...-british-royal-family-worth-the-money/278052/

not that I care as I would support the royal family if they didn't make a single penny but here is a good read :)
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It's nonsense.
Would tourists not visit Windsor Castle or the Tower of London if it wasn't for a living Monarch?

I guess all those English Heritage and National Trust properties are really struggling having no visitors. People love history, and that is something I can understand more than being inferior to someone because somewhere in her family tree there was someone rich enough to raise an army.
 
decigallen said:
Why? Why do you support them? I'm not condescending here, I'd genuinely love to know this.
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because they are part of our rich and powerfull heritage as a nation.
If we hadn't had such a powerfull royal family through the ages we would never have been Great Britain, we would have never forged our way across the planet like we have.
What we have now is just a small part of what we had then, I think its a wonderfull part of our history.
 
Phil V said:
It's nonsense.
Would tourists not visit Windsor Castle or the Tower of London if it wasn't for a living Monarch?

I guess all those English Heritage and National Trust properties are really struggling having no visitors. People love history, and that is something I can understand more than being inferior to someone because somewhere in her family tree there was someone rich enough to raise an army.
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When I visited Versailles it was a ghost town, only 7.5 million visitors per year...
 
dejongj said:
Right you are mixing up various references in the posts now. It is very hard to have a discussion when you shift goal posts like that.
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The argument is perfectly clearly reasoned. I think you may be deliberately trying to muddy the waters here!
 
Mr Bump said:
http://www.theatlantic.com/internat...-british-royal-family-worth-the-money/278052/

not that I care as I would support the royal family if they didn't make a single penny but here is a good read :)
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Do you know how they come to the figure £500-£700 million in tourism revenue. Its quite hilarious actually. Visit Britain conducted a survey which concluded that 28% of visitors were attracted by Britain's culture and heritage. From this figure they estimated that a quarter of Britain's heritage attractions had “ties” with the British monarchy.

Paris capital of a republic state have more tourists than London and Chester Zoo and Stonehendge have more visitors than Buckingham Palace. I think actual paying tourists to the palace is around £10 million.
 
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Mr Bump said:
because they are part of our rich and powerfull heritage as a nation.
If we hadn't had such a powerfull royal family through the ages we would never have been Great Britain, we would have never forged our way across the planet like we have.
What we have now is just a small part of what we had then, I think its a wonderfull part of our history.
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Exactly! History, if the royal family ceased to exist tomorrow, people would still be attracted to the history. People are currently interested in the history just as much as the present.

So we're free to modernise and people will still find the history interesting.
 
Mr Bump said:
because they are part of our rich and powerfull heritage as a nation.
If we hadn't had such a powerfull royal family through the ages we would never have been Great Britain, we would have never forged our way across the planet like we have.
What we have now is just a small part of what we had then, I think its a wonderfull part of our history.
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Some of us aren't so proud of that either, which have been talked about on other threads.
 
That's fine for all of the above people like/don't like that's what we all decide.

I'm a BIG fan and long may the Queen Reign and Rule Britannia :-)

I was asked why I liked them so much and I responded, I am certainly not offended by other peoples opinions on the matter.
 
rjbell said:
Some of us aren't so proud of that either, which have been talked about on other threads.
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Its amazing how it was spun to you as a child, the great british empire, all that red on the map. I used to look at it with pride, until I actually understood what it meant. There was nothing great about the great british empire, unless you consider greed, great.
 
Llamaman said:
That's the point, he doesn't. He doesn't care. Look at yesterday's PMQs. It is the media that is making a big deal about small details and ignoring the policy issues.
The interview on the BBC News last night was embarrassing. The interviewer asked him at least 3 times if he'd kneel before the Queen, after he'd already said it was the first he'd heard of it and would have to think about it and discuss it with his colleagues. Again, and again he was pressed for an answer on this meaningless trivia. A whole interview about what position he'll adopt to be sworn into the Privy Council, no mention of any public policy.
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It seems that since Downing St. have threatened to cut the BBC budget a Rupert Murdogh attitude and tact has been employed.
 
Mr Bump said:
Maybe he could come up with a more suitable chant

"The Labour Party is Dead.............Long Live The Labour Party" :)
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Be still my aching sides.
 
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