What camera for estate agents

What do you need from the camera that your current Fuji can't do?
 
timboellis said:
Well its pretty poor at exposure and find the images a bit too sharp. Mostly the images inside are either under or over exposed is bright outside
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A new camera won't help you there. You just need to learn how to use the one you have

Where you have a dark and bright scene eg a room with a window, the camera will pick one to prioritise. It will either expose for the dark room and the window will be over exposed, or it will expose for the bright window and the room will be underexposed. As the subject is the room, you want the room to be exposed, so need to tell the camera to expose for the room.

Another option is to use flash to balance the exposure, or exposure blending, which tbh would be a pain in the backside.
 
timboellis said:
Well its pretty poor at exposure and find the images a bit too sharp.

Mostly the images inside are either under or over exposed is bright outside
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Whilst you're shopping you could buy a car that'll make you a better driver and a set of pans that'll make you a gourmet cook :D.

Apologies for the sarcasm, it's not a camera you need it's the ability to use it properly :).
 
Perhaps he just got the same email as I did. . .

We are a multiple award-winning business to business supplier of marketing solutions to the property industry (Estate Agents, Letting Agents and Property developers).

As part of the company’s continuous development, we are currently looking for professional photographers to work on a subcontracted basis around numerous areas of Scotland including Glasgow, Dumbartonshire, Renfrewshire, Ayrshire, Lanarkshire and Stirlingshire.


DETAILS.

• Continuous and ongoing work coming through as we set a preferred photographer per local area.
• Full frame SLR camera 15 - 35mm lens (or equivalent) or Crop Frame SLR Camera with 10-20mm lens is required.
• A property visit takes between 30 and 45 minutes so easy to fit around other work. (approx 15 photos)
• Monday to Friday appointments.
• We do not require any photo enhancement as it is all done from Head Office.
• Payment structure of £30.00+VAT per property.
• Standard 30 day terms, you will get a self-billing invoice and BACS payment at the end of each month for properties done in the previous month.
• Local work (10-15 mile radius)

Experience in property photography will be an advantage but not essential as you will be given the guidelines
 
£30 PER PROPERTY!

Gosh! And I'd get a whole 30-45 minutes to take 15 photos. This sounds irresistible.

A full-frame camera with a 15-35 lens. Where do I get one of them then?
 
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Well its pretty poor at exposure and find the images a bit too sharp.
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Sounds like my dream camera! Fancy a swap? :D

jon ryan said:
£30 PER PROPERTY!

Gosh! And I'd get a whole 30-45 minutes to take 15 photos. This sounds irresistible.

A full-frame camera with a 15-35 lens. Where do I get one of them then?
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Yeah, I bet all the professional photographers in Scotland are queuing up for that job!:cuckoo:
 
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Phil V said:
Whilst you're shopping you could buy a car that'll make you a better driver and a set of pans that'll make you a gourmet cook :D.

Apologies for the sarcasm, it's not a camera you need it's the ability to use it properly :).
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Have to be honest, this...

Cameras don't take photos, people do.

I have to say though how can the images be "too" sharp?

what kind of thing do you want?

A dslr with a wide angle lens will give you better and sharper images than the one you have, looking at the reviews and sample images the fuji is disasterous at iso 1600 and inside images are likely to be taken at 1600 so I can't see the images being too sharp but possibly noisy?
 
goodwin1234 said:
Yeah, I bet all the professional photographers in Scotland are queuing up for that job!:cuckoo:
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Well if you think that's crazy how about this.

A few days ago I was passing a furniture showroom and decided to drop in to have a look at some £200.00 bookshelves, during the conversation I mentioned I was a photographer.

The manager took me aside to ask my advice on problems he was having with a half page advert he had taken out in a local paper (he wasn't happy as the images in the advert were blurred) I pointed out that they were also flat, badly lit and had distorted perspective due to the shooting angle, focal length and distance of the lens, but he reckoned they should be good as "they were shot on an S3" (he was referring to a Samsung Galaxy S3) under normal showroom fluorescent lighting and with a white sheet as a backdrop.

Apparently he's demanding a refund from the publication and despite my limited advice on equipment and technique etc. he has taken out another half page advert with a different publication but using the same files, He would however consider paying up to £100.00 for "a proper compact camera" to do the job properly.

He then asked me for a quote (which I gave him), but wasn't keen when I mentioned 2-3 hours to shoot 13 pieces of furniture as he had managed it in only 20 minutes (and was offended when I said you could tell)anyway I left him with my contact details and I'm expecting a call any day now. . . (well not really)

If you're interested the online version can be viewed at the bottom of page8 with the following link, http://edition.pagesuite-profession...f56ee1d-df78-4856-8e56-1620b8ce649b&skip=true.
 
goodwin1234 said:
Yeah, I bet all the professional photographers in Scotland are queuing up for that job!:cuckoo:
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Minimum wage is £6.31 for my age group, it's £5.03 for 18-20 year olds and even lower for 17 year olds and lower.

£30 is not a lot, but it's better than minimum wage. Would you rather photograph 3 houses in a day, or nearly kill yourself in a dead end job?
 
that 90 quid won't all be profit though - first you've got to spend several hundred quid on the camera and another several hundred on the lens, then you've got to get around the area to the houses etc ... chances are your profit won't be much more than minimum wage once all the on costs are added up ... and that's assuming you get 3 houses per day reliably rather than one here and there
 
big soft moose said:
that 90 quid won't all be profit though - first you've got to spend several hundred quid on the camera and another several hundred on the lens, then you've got to get around the area to the houses etc ... chances are your profit won't be much more than minimum wage once all the on costs are added up ... and that's assuming you get 3 houses per day reliably rather than one here and there
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You have to recruit to the job paying minimum wage though - you have to buy uniform unless it's provided.

For someone with a camera (and you can get dslr's very cheap) it's an ok way to earn some steady cash whilst pursuing more lucrative channels.
 
where can you get a 10-20mm very cheap ?
 
Phil V said:
it is on minimum wage;)
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Exactly - and this job is a better prospect than minimum wage.

My overdraft whilst at uni was 3 grand. If someone wants to they could set themselves up doing this.
 
supersammy said:
Minimum wage is £6.31 for my age group, it's £5.03 for 18-20 year olds and even lower for 17 year olds and lower.

£30 is not a lot, but it's better than minimum wage. Would you rather photograph 3 houses in a day, or nearly kill yourself in a dead end job?
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I'm sure at those rates commercial photography would be a dead end job.
 
so that's 300 quid for the lens and the same again for a camera - 600 quid set up costs - so you need to do 20 properties before you break even (actually more than that due to other costs like travel) if you only get one or two per week that's ten weeks before you start making any money.
 
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big soft moose said:
so that's 300 quid for the lens and the same again for a camera - 600 quid set up costs - so you need to do 20 properties before you break even (actually more than that due to other costs like travel) if you only get one or two per week that's ten weeks before you start making any money.
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As I said - you'd probably try and get more lucrative work as well. I'm not saying £30 jobs will give you an amazing life, I just think it's better than working at McDonalds.
 
most things are
 
supersammy said:
As I said - you'd probably try and get more lucrative work as well. I'm not saying £30 jobs will give you an amazing life, I just think it's better than working at McDonalds.
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I agree with the poor level of pay here but it's also better than no income. If it's a matter of food on the table then £30 is £30 (minus expenses), that doesn't make it right though I know.
 
did you miss the bit where it says "easy to fit around other work"

they're not expecting it to be full time income for anyone - it's a bit of cash to go towards cover costs of gear/top up the toy fund

for someone like me who already has the gear for pleasure, a couple of evenings here and there, earn a couple of hundred
 
a couple of evenings here and there
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That's interesting I find it quite difficult to do the external shots when it is dark and even worse when it is raining as well. Also the internals do not look as good when it is black through the windows. Its difficult enough during the days (we have not seen the sun here for two weeks). Try making a property look appealing in the fog.
 
Uneducated_Rick said:
did you miss the bit where it says "easy to fit around other work" they're not expecting it to be full time income for anyone
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No, not everyone has other work though. Also I don't expect it would be anywhere near a full time income but a little of something is better than a whole lot of nothing (or dole as the case may be).
 
Tim - have a play with the exposure compensation on the camera. If the exposure is too bright, set the EC to -1 (or whatever - experiment) and try again. If it's too dark, set it to +1.

Your other option is to shoot RAW (your camera can do this) and process in Lightroom. Cheaper than a new camera (which will almost certainly still over/under expose anyway)

Edit: good work asking for advice here. Given that the first impression anyone is going to have of a house is the photos in the paper/agent window, I'm often flabbergasted about how bad some estate agent photos are.
 
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rclarke80 said:
No, not everyone has other work though. Also I don't expect it would be anywhere near a full time income but a little of something is better than a whole lot of nothing (or dole as the case may be).
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Unfortunately there's no special supermarkets for self employed people working for peanuts, you can't go fill your car up and ask them to reduce it by 50% because all their other customers are in proper employment and can afford whatever is being asked. So whilst £60 a week for a few hours work is better than nothing, it won't keep a roof over anyone's head.

In total honesty, companies offering work like this are only tempting people who are prepared to pocket the cash either because they're on benefit or already have a job and won't be declaring the extra income. Jobs like this do not pay enough to justify the running of a business for.

Even the strongest advocates for this 'job offer' haven't gone as far as saying 'I'd do it', that speaks volumes. They seem to think it'd be alright for someone else to do (presumably someone poorer and with lower expectations).
 
supersammy said:
Minimum wage is £6.31 for my age group, it's £5.03 for 18-20 year olds and even lower for 17 year olds and lower.

£30 is not a lot, but it's better than minimum wage. Would you rather photograph 3 houses in a day, or nearly kill yourself in a dead end job?
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People earning minimum wage don't generally have hundreds, if not thousands of pounds worth of camera equipment laying around either, do they? Also if you're a ''professional photographer'' (as the advert stipulates you need to be) and you find yourself working at McDonalds, then you're doing something wrong ;)
 
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As Kieron says "they stipulate that you have to be a professional photographer" but even if you're in full time employment and decided to do this to earn some extra pocket money, you would have to declare your (self employed) earnings, as you have to invoice for each £30.00 which is paid by BACS directly into your bank account.

Therefore once you subtract your travel expenses, income tax, and class 2 national insurance contributions etc. you'll probably be earning less than £20.00 for a job which could take up to 2 hours of your time (inc. traveling etc).
 
Thanks for the feedback on this I was just going out the door when i posted earlier and was not quite clear.
They have 1 person using a Sony H1 off the top of my head which seems good however the new person taking the pictures are just using these as Program mode, and with a wide angle adapter on it which i feel is poor quality.

They need a camera / lens that is wider first off.

Yes i agree that training is 99% of the issue.

I just feel even with a cheaper SLR with a wider lens would suit better.

I was offered last night a EOS350d with 18mm-55mm kit for £100

Also feel that I would be able to tell them how to use the SLR better than i would with the Fuji.

So suggestions do i suss out the Fuji myself then walk them through it or try for a SLR?

Or anyone got better tips for taking interior photos, Flash can be a problem on glass and high gloss worktops.

Thanks

Tim
 
timboellis said:
Or anyone got better tips for taking interior photos, Flash can be a problem on glass and high gloss worktops.
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Stick your camera on a tripod, shoot RAW with available light (window light and interior lights), bracket 3 to 5 shots one stop apart.

Rinse and repeat for your next room/angle.

When you get home, stick them in Lightroom and pick the best exposure out of each shot. you can then recover all the highlights from overexposed windows and bring up all the shadows from the interior from the one shot in seconds with the 'Basic' sliders.

Export the adjusted images as JPEGS and off you go.

Not a perfectionists approach but quick, easy and effective... which is what you want for 30 quid!
 
timboellis said:
Or anyone got better tips for taking interior photos, Flash can be a problem on glass and high gloss worktops.
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I shoot interiors commercially, mainly for architects and interior designers. I use portable flash if necessary but prefer to work with the light the room offers, whether it be downlighters, wall lights, ceiling lights or table lights, whatever there is try and switch it on, a lot of estate agents shots are dark and don't look welcoming.

Use a tripod, and a low ISO, long shutter speeds will help with the darkness. If you want to do a proper job of it take a custom white balance off a grey card, it will help avoid the odd colour casts you see on some EA shots.

One of the main things is to find a good angle, lots shoot square on and the room looks dull. Shoot at an angle, possibly from the next room and through the doorway and you might find a much better view.

Finally don't forget to dress the room, clear away dishcloths, mugs left out on worktops etc.

Obviously there is more to shooting interiors than that but it will get you in the right direction. Also my clients needs for full page glossy adverts may well be different to a few snaps to bang on rightmove, it all depends on your market and how much time / expense you can run to. If you're selling high end properties why not look at how much a local pro will charge to take the shots for you? You might find the improved photos mean you can market the property at a higher price and your increased commission covers the cost of the photography.
 
I see that the pay is low. But, surely for someone starting out you could scrabble together the money with business start up grant. Look at it from development pov take your time get good shoots build a portfolio. Got to start somewhere?
 
markmullen said:
I shoot interiors commercially, mainly for architects and interior designers. I use portable flash if necessary but prefer to work with the light the room offers, whether it be downlighters, wall lights, ceiling lights or table lights, whatever there is try and switch it on, a lot of estate agents shots are dark and don't look welcoming.

Use a tripod, and a low ISO, long shutter speeds will help with the darkness. If you want to do a proper job of it take a custom white balance off a grey card, it will help avoid the odd colour casts you see on some EA shots.

One of the main things is to find a good angle, lots shoot square on and the room looks dull. Shoot at an angle, possibly from the next room and through the doorway and you might find a much better view.

Finally don't forget to dress the room, clear away dishcloths, mugs left out on worktops etc.

Obviously there is more to shooting interiors than that but it will get you in the right direction. Also my clients needs for full page glossy adverts may well be different to a few snaps to bang on rightmove, it all depends on your market and how much time / expense you can run to. If you're selling high end properties why not look at how much a local pro will charge to take the shots for you? You might find the improved photos mean you can market the property at a higher price and your increased commission covers the cost of the photography.
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Brilliant thanks for that, I did originally suggest a tripod but will get a card(forgot all about that)

Thanks for all you help
 
timboellis said:
I just feel even with a cheaper SLR with a wider lens would suit better.

I was offered last night a EOS350d with 18mm-55mm kit for £100
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I think that's a good idea. The 350D is fairly obsolete by modern standards, but it would do a fine job in these circumstances; you don't need a high megapixel count, you don't need a high frame rate, you don't need high ISO capability, and you don't need video.

And £100 is a bargain if the camera is in decent condition. Although the 350D hasn't been sold for about 6 years, most probably won't have been used very intensively and should have a lot of life left in them.

But I don't think the 18-55mm lens is necessarily your best choice. It's probably not wide enough for most interiors. You'd be better off with a Canon 10-22mm or Sigma 10-20mm or similar. Unfortunately they're not so cheap.
 
18-55 will be fine. Anything wider and you're going to run into problems with perspective/converging verticals/straight things going all curvy. Shoot at around f/8, 100 ISO, and whatever shutter speed is needed to get these.

Tripod is a must. Set it to around half the ceiling height, shoot into a corner to get the greatest distance and minimise distortion, and use a remote release or shutter delay to avoid moving the camera when tripping the shutter. Mirror lock as well, possibly. I'd think flash is pretty essential, particularly if you are working in winter. Trying to bring detail out of dark corners in post will bring grief. Make sure the camera is mounted parallel to whatever bit you are shooting, again to minimise perspective distortion.

Other bodies worth looking at are Canon 400D, 10-20-30D (all available for around £100), Nikon D40-50-60 at about the same.
 
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