Wedding payments

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neillewi

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Im after some help.

I got my first paying wedding in 2 weeks and was wondering when the client should pay the outstanding balance minus the intial deposit?

Look forward in hearing your views
 
2 weeks ago ...
 
Thought so, just got a client digging her heals in, saying she will pay me after the wedding and when the album is done.
 
Have you done any weddings before, also is it friends or not and is there a contract of sorts?
 
Well, I thought it should be more of a ' you'll pay me when I say' or no photos. I did a wedding last Saturday and they paid me the deposit back in June and the blanace in mid July. Otherwise I wouldn't have done it.
 
Yeh have done a few weddings for family and friends but this is the first paying one so to speak.

I have got a contract too that they signed in the beginning, so dont know what to do
 
This is a cut and paste of the actual contract

"5. Payments:

a) A non-refundable deposit/ retainer of: £50.00 (paid by cash, cheque, credit / debit card (if available), or online bank transfer), along with a completed booking form and a signed contract will confirm your booking. The retainer forms part of the total cost of your chosen Wedding Package (i.e. it is NOT in addition to the cost of the package) and is deducted when calculating the final balance due. The deposit/retainer is refundable during your statutory 14 day “cooling off” period. Payment for the photographic coverage is due in full NO LATER THAN TWO WEEKS prior to the contracted date and amounts to an additional: £200. You MUST allow sufficient time for cheque clearance. Non-receipt of the full balance by the due date will be deemed cancellation of the contract by The Client(s).

b) All additional goods must be paid for in full on ordering. This includes extra prints, albums, special editing and rendering of images, high resolution digital files, high resolution long term galleries, and any other services ordered after the event.

c) Title to all goods remains with Stepaside Photographic Services until paid for in full by The Client(s)."
 
I was thinking that if it were your first wedding they may be wary of the final quality but if you've done them and they've seen the portfolio plus you have contract than as JSP says, perhaps stand your ground?

You could still do the wedding but not release any photos until paid in full - they are bound to want wedding photos although maybe they want to see how the guest's p&s turn out? I'm being very presuming here though.

What's your gut feeling on their honesty in paying you afterwards?

EDIT: They are being stubborn over £200???? Bloody hell, I think you need to stand your ground and not end up doing a full day for £50.
 
Im meeting the clients on Thursday for the 4th time since they booked me, so im gonna stand my ground i think as its a civil wedding in a local hotel and they have named me as the official photographer with the registrar too.
 
neillewi said:
The deposit/retainer is refundable during your statutory 14 day “cooling off” period.
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err.... which statute is this?


neillewi said:
Payment for the photographic coverage is due in full NO LATER THAN TWO WEEKS prior to the contracted date and amounts to an additional: £200. "
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You've answered your own question - although quite what "contracted date" means is anyone's guess, unless its defined elsewhere in the contract as being the date of the wedding (which I assume that it is).
 
Four times, sounds like they are a little wary with trust but then £200 (or £250 all in) may be a lot of money to them. It's your call but I say go with your gut feeling on their honesty and I guess at the least if you do get bumped at least you'll have another set for your portfolio :)

If you suspect money is tight for them then you could consider meeting half way but although that's the nice thing to do business is business after all and money is tight for a lot of people these days, including some photographers I suspect! (except for people from Edinburgh called Gary ;))
 
It states in the contract earlier that then contracted date is the date of the wedding, plus most of the togs in my area give the client a 14 day cooling off period which gives them a chance to go else where.
 
I can see where your coming from gman and i might go with the pay half now and half when they have there album.
 
Don't call it statutory, it's a swear word in my profession and causes me a lot of additional work hehe ;) It's also an official term most commonly but not necessarily backed by law.
 
I would stand firm, a contract is a contract. If they can't afford to pay you £200 now, then they certainly will not be able to after the wedding.
 
Thats very true WeddingHack think i will stand my ground to be honest thinking about it.

What wording do you think i should use then gman?
 
I'd stick to what was contracted - i.e. full payment before the wedding because, lets face it, thats what the paper is there for. If they're having probems with cashflow, thats not going to change after the wedding, but you could be nice and accept an amount (50% of the outstanding balance?) in order to go through with the booking so you're not too out of pocket and stuck doinga days work for £50.

I've not shot a wedding, but used to organise them instead and we always asked for 25% deposit, 50% at least 2 weeks before the wedding day and the final 25% (and any incidentals) no more than 14 days afterwards. The only exceptions were if the honeymoon was going to be longer than this period, but then we requested a larger (normally 90% total payment) BEFORE the wedding.
 
Probably something like "during the agreed 14 day cooling off period" or something? It's not massively important to be honest and they would have to be pretty pedantic to accentuate it. If it's an agreed time put in the contract then it's legally binding, so long as it's reasonable.

Many people, especially letting agencies, don't put terms in a contract that are deemed reasonable but in reality they won't be upheld if challenged. I mention letting agencies because they often quote highly unreasonable fees for ending a lease early hoping that tennants will fall for it but in reality the fees should be reasonable and relative to costs that would be incurred by such an early termination of lease or contract. I suppose a good example of such was all that nonsense with the banks and their charges. Perhaps an OTT example would be if you had a term saying "If you cancel the £500 wedding you will be charged a fee of £10,000. It would never hold! Anyway, I'm going off topic now though, sorry :)
 
I know this is contrary to general opinion, but I don't ask for payment until the bride & groom receive the completed preview album - but never let the album go until you have been paid. In commercial work the customer always gets 30 days to pay - try asking then to pay up front!

In over 15 years and several hundred weddings I only ever had two couples default on payment. In both cases I worked out a payment schedule over a six month period and got paid then with no problem. I always used this as a 'selling point' and know I booked many more weddings as a result, because people knew they could trust me to come up with the results before they paid. In a competitive world that little edge can be worth a lot of money!

So don't panic if they don't pay up front. One very important point though - make sure you have commercial insurance in case of any mishaps on the day! That way if there is a problem with the pics you are covered. And equipment wise always carry two of everything in case of mishaps - that means at least 2 cameras, 2 lenses, 2 flash outfits etc.
 
Why be the only supplier that doesn't ask for payment in full before the wedding ???
 
gman said:
...then £200 (or £250 all in) may be a lot of money to them....
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Yeah, but its better that the 'tog gets the money for doing a day's work than not. If they can't afford the 'tog, then they should say so now. That way he has a choice - to get out of bed and do the shoot for free, or not.

This is a commercial contract we're discussing, not a good deed for
a mate.
 
Some good points there, especially with giving 30 days to pay which incidentially enough is as close to statutory as you'll get being HMR&C backed guidelines for commercial payments. Although it may not be viewed so much as commercial as that's more typically between two companies and this is probably more consumer, it technically still is as one party (you) is trading as a business, it certainly could be a good angle over any local competitors :)

As an after thought, have you got it specified in your contract that you are not liable for any personal/sentimental loss due to not being able to complete your end of the contract?
 
gman said:
... especially with giving 30 days to pay which incidentially enough is as close to statutory as you'll get ....
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As above - which is this mythical statute that people keep (not) quoting?

Its a straightforward matter of the terms of the contract. The contract requires payment 2 weeks before the wedding. I really can't see what the issue is here.
 
It's more to do with charging interest on late payment. Basically if a payment date isn't specified in a contract (unlike here) interest is charged after 30 days after the debt has been created therefore it crystallises that the statutory time for payment unless specified is 30 days. The statue in question is the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act 1998. But it's pretty much irrelevant here! lol
 
gman said:
The statue in question is the Late Payment of Commercial Debts (Interest) Act 1998. But it's pretty much irrelevant here! lol
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Quite. This is not a debt. They've failed to pay up front. That's their choice. No pay, no photos. The OP can't sue them. He's owed no money. he is relieved of any obligation he may have had under the contract. He does not need to get out of bed that day.
 
So im perfectly in the right to turn around and tell them to find a new tog then?
 
Of course as they are breaching the contract.

Mobilevirgin, sorry perhaps there was some confusion but my getting carried away was more aimed if you were to go down the 30 days payment route. It's late and both brains and fingers are slowing down with the added bonus being that this stuff is unfortunately also part of my day-job which I'll have to face again tomorrow :(

I guess the original question has now finally been resolved by us all! lol :)
 
I think so, thanks to you all, i will put a nice letter in the post tomoz stating what you all have said and give them the option of either paying up or finding a different tog.

Thanks again
 
Hi neillewi,

Just a thought for you.

This is your first paid wedding so getting the payment sorted is sort of secondary to doing the job correct!

At your next meeting I would explain that it is normal to be paid weeks before the wedding, but in this instance you will accept cash payment on delivery of the album.

Should they not like the photos then you will take them away with you. If they have not got the money you will take them away with you.

Personally I would see this as a mistake on your behalf in not making it clear that the money should be paid up front and move on. I would also contact a few members on here that are obviously running a successful business and make sure your T & C's are correct. Send a pm to Artona on this site I am sure he will advise. Tell him I suggested it!

At the end of the day you really don't want to be getting stressed at the wedding otherwise your pictures will show this.

Hope it goes well for you.

Oh and BTW I am a hobby tog but did take the pics at my recent Daughter and Son's weddings! No charge of course:D

Best regards

Chris
 
Of course you have the right........ They have broken the contract.

I would suggest that on Thu you ask for the outstanding balance or you will have to unfortunately pull out. And as stated in the contract the deposit is non-refundable so you keep that.

Try and find a tog with 9 days notice could be quite hard!!!

Alternatively, as mentioned above, it could be worth doing just for the experience and for the portfolio. You maybe lucky and get paid but if not you should have loads of photos they wish they had. If you accept payment after the shoot you could draw up a new contract for them to sign on Thu but put the price up to £300-£400 as the old contract has been broken. They then have a choice.

Good luck with your decision!!!
(Personally I would do it for the experience etc as chances like that could prove priceless)
 
G2EWS said:
Personally I would see this as a mistake on your behalf in not making it clear that the money should be paid up front
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Where's the mistake? His T&Cs are perfectly clear about payment terms.
 
gman said:
Mobilevirgin, sorry perhaps there was some confusion but my getting carried away was more aimed if you were to go down the 30 days payment route. It's late and both brains and fingers are slowing down ...
I guess the original question has now finally been resolved by us all! lol :)
Click to expand...

No worries :)
 
G2EWS said:
Personally I would see this as a mistake on your behalf in not making it clear that the money should be paid up front and move on.
Click to expand...

As mobilevirgin says, the contract is quite clear on this and states that payment is due no less than 2 weeks before the contracted date. There quite clearly has been no mistake on the OP's part.
 
Hi,

If he has not enforced this and they have told him no, then it is his mistake.

This is not a criticism just a point that he needs to make sure his customers are totally aware of in the future. Please don't make it a major point as it is not.

Regards

Chris
 
G2EWS said:
Hi,

If he has not enforced this and they have told him no, then it is his mistake.

This is not a criticism just a point that he needs to make sure his customers are totally aware of in the future. Please don't make it a major point as it is not.

Regards

Chris
Click to expand...

The point is that he hasn't not enforced it so therefore he hasn't made a mistake. That is why he came here for advice.
 
just remember, what ever payment method you use, you still are more than likely going to have to work with these people on one of the most important days of their lives.... any ill feeling will just make everyone tense and it will be hard going..... you maybe want to come up with a solution that will make them think they are still in control... like maybe half now half later, pre dated cheque something like that... remember that you will still have all the pictures....
 
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