Was asked to stop taking photo's today for the first time!!!

Carlo

Carlo

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Carl
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Was at my sons U14 football match today taking pictures (for myself and his club) as i have been doing for the last two seasons.
As usual, before the match out of coutesy (i know the rules, what i can and cannot do!) i approached the home teams manager/coach and asked him if he minded me taking pictures during the game.
He was suurprised i even asked and said it's fine, which is what most managers say and for the first 60 minutes all was fine.
Our team having been down 4-2 at half time dug in and had made the score 6-4 to us with less than 10 minutes remanining, it was at this point a lady came storming over to me in a very aggressive manner asking me what the **** are you doing? I explained who i was and that i'd asked permission of the manager and got the response "I'M THE MANAGER, and i want you to stop taking photos now"!!!
Not to cause a scene i said i'd stop at which point she went and spoke to the two men i spoke to earlier to check my story (they were the coaches) obviously they said i'd asked them and looked as surprised/shocked as i was!
She then storms over demanding that i delete all the pictures there and then!
(Jeez i'm now thinking!!!) i refused, politely stating that i won't and the one sided argument continued with her banging on about consent forms not being signed and the other teams parents refusing me permission etc.
Now i know the rules as i mentioned earlier, and i'm also a qualified level 1 FA coach so i know all clubs have a registration form that parents have to sign informing them that photos can/will be taken during matches!
All this i told her but she carried on until regardless until the game finished threatening to report me at the league meeting on the following Monday call the police etc ( i even volunteered my name, number address ) Then after the final whistle another lady claiming to be a welfare officer gave her 2p worth and it all ended with me being called a paedophile by them and abuse directed at me from the kids on their team!!!
To say i was shocked at their ignorance would be an understatement, and it really spoilt was up until then a great game between two evenly matched teams.
right, i feel better now i've got that off my chest!! :)
 
Go to the police and tell them the story and that they called you a pedophile(Poss a section 5 offense).Not becacuse it bothers you but because they need showing the error of their ways.Otherwise it continues to spread.I would not stand for that.
 
We live in a very twisted world, where the P word gets bandied about at the drop of a hat.
 
An unfortunate situation and sadly one that happens too often. Having been involved in grass roots football albeit adult amateur football I know too well how people behave and it was one of the reasons I gave up assisting in running a club. Sadly the way she and others reacted rubbed off on the children. It shows she should not be involved with children's football if she behaved like that as she is no role model for the children. There is sadly many people who wrongly believe everyone who has a camera is a paedophile. This is one aspect I feel the FA don't do enough to stop as it puts the right people off getting involved in grass roots football. In some ways hopefully she does bring it up at the next meeting as she will probably be laughed out the room complaining about a CRB checked FA qualified coach taking photos that he asked 2 coaches for permission. The FA would also have to take action for the abuse she gave you. Like others have said she could easily have committed a criminal offence by abusing you like that. She should not be involved in children's football. Although it seems has not affected you badly someone else could easily take it badly when it (not if as she will likely act like that again) happens to them in the future.
 
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As my Mrs told me when i got back, paedophiles take pictures covertly with mobile phones, (her friend who works in courts told her as she's dealt with lots of cases), NOT with DSLR's with huge telephoto lenses!
Also, a lady stood with their parents was taking photos with a DSLR all match!!!! forgot to tell her that as she was blowing her top!!
 
i would have told her that i am calling the police to have her arrested for abuse and i will be taking her to court for slander. people like that need taking down several pegs. just a shme you didnt catch a sneaky recording of her saying it
 
Whoa, feel so sorry, you had to endure that :eek: Honestly, I think iti's important, that you make a complaint to the relevant association.
 
johnnypanic said:
Whoa, feel so sorry, you had to endure that :eek: Honestly, I think iti's important, that you make a complaint to the relevant association.
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I think you're right, i wasn't going to do anything unless she did make a complaint against me with the FA/league.
Hopefully the authority will have the b#lls to do something!
All very sad really:(
 
I agree with all those above stating you should make a complaint against her to the relevant body and take it all the way, it's about time people like her were educated the error of their ways...I'd also seriously consider taking the slander issue further
 
Carlo said:
I think you're right, i wasn't going to do anything unless she did make a complaint against me with the FA/league.
Hopefully the authority will have the b#lls to do something!
All very sad really:(
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If it is not in your nature to complain it can be difficult.But what you have to think is you did not have to be sworn at or accused of being a pedophile.The person who says those things is being very insulting and it is likely a section 5 offense.The police will not look lightly on this women's actions their view is that if someone thinks there is a pedophile you call for them (the police).That sort of carry on causes a mob to be whipped up in certain areas.If you complain to the police they will investigate your complaint.Don't wait for her to complain.
 
Wow! I can't imagine how that must have felt.

I like to think I would have asked her for her details so I could report her to the relevant authorities, and told her that.

Not sure how I would actually have reacted in reality.
 
Unfortunately there are people in this world who think they are the only thing between a child's life and the eternal damnation that is all men and their carnal desires towards children. It is a pity that in modern times they have found their raison d'etre and photographers are their first line of attack as they are easily spotted. If they paused for a moment they would realise that the paedophile was not the guy standing on the touchline (now there's irony) with permission to take pictures but is [often] a relative of one of the children on the pitch that is the guilty party. Having said all that, the chances that there is an actual P**** at any given football match is probably, IMVHO, very low.

I'm sorry this happened to you and you must certainly complain or these 'child-protection Nazis' will win again.
 
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ShinySideUp said:
Unfortunately there are people in this world who think they are the only thing between a child's life and the eternal damnation that is all men and their carnal desires towards children.
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One wonders at such a response what possible abuse they may have suffered to make them so suspicious and hostile. On the other hand they may just be overly officious women on a power trip.
 
Justso said:
One wonders at such a response what possible abuse they may have suffered to make them so suspicious and hostile. On the other hand they may just be overly officious women on a power trip.
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You only have to look at the media for the source, the media can easily alter peoples opinion. Its like the early thread this week about the children attraction with a falconry display who banned single men from attending in case they were paedophiles. Sadly this will happen more often in the future.
 
Ok delete the photos for the time being and recover them if using a Sandisk memory card . Although the pictures have gone the data is still there easily recovered and restore the photos later.
By that time she is happy and you still got your shots.
I would have at least asked for her name and address and proof of who she said she was via an identity card.
Then in no uncertain terms you are reporting her to the police and to the FA. One thing that I really kick up about is someone accusing me of doing something wrong. I happen to have the ability of using a very loud voice and everyone in the vacinity would know what was happening.
 
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So much for the FA's 'Respect' agenda.

Don't let it slide. Make an official complaint to the FA and her club. File a complaint with the police (not that they'll probably do much now since it didn't escalate into a brawl) - that should help make sure her club and the FA know you mean business.

And if that doesn't work, play dirty and get the press involved. ;)
 
Carlo said:
ended with me being called a paedophile by them
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Sorry to hear your story Carlo, but I think as said above you need to get the police involved, even if just so these two women are put right on the laws and rules surrounding these issues.

The fact that another person (female) was also photographing and you were singled out for this treatment is another matter that needs addressing.

Good luck with this and please let us know how you get on.

David
 
Carlo said:
Then after the final whistle another lady claiming to be a welfare officer gave her 2p worth
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This is a particularly serious event. She may well have been lying, but there is a chance she wasn't and she had committed gross professional misconduct by abusing her 'authority' to make demands she was in no position to (and may have committed a criminal offence whilst doing so).
If you know her name, find out where she works and make a written formal complaint to her superiors. Hold them accountable for actions she carried out under the authority granted by them, and demand to know what action has been taken so they can't sweep it under the carpet. Again, don't be afraid to go to local paper to embarrass her employers into disciplining her, and let them know you reserve that right if you're not satisfied that they're treating you seriously.

If she used the "P" word, it's most likely an actionable offence. This could be very expensive for her.
 
Don't let this slide, these type of people need to be corrected, I'm glad you kept your cool, I would of told her to stick her head where the sun don't shine & informed her that I would be taking this up with he league & the Police
 
I dont think i would have been to happy,i think i might have hit the rec switch in my camera and let them both know i would be taking further action :(:mad:
 
The only issue I ever had with rugby was from out own teams welfare officer, mainly as she didn't like I was CRB covered from the RFU directly and hadn't gone through her.
Football however there's always one or two loud mothers. Usually I point out I have permission, am CRB cleared, am in a public place and it's them breaking the law with a public order offence. They never back down though.

Being abused, accused etc is not acceptable and must be reported to the league, your teams manager and a complaint made to the other team.
 
I think, given the reaction by TP members, that you know how serious this is and that you do need to make a complaint. That said, I think it appropriate to take the time, to congratulate you on not "loosing your cool". Given the venue and audience, I think you were correct, in not getting into an argument. I really hope that you get some justice and this does not deter you from continuing your role.
 
I think you should have done two things on the spot ...

1). When she threatened to call the police, you should have offered her the use of your mobile and insisted that she either do it now or shut the hell up.

2). When she openly branded you a paedophile (assuming here that someone heard her say it and you have a witness), you should have told her that you need her name and address so your solicitor knows where to send the relevant papers suing her for slander, defamation of character, and anything else you can think of.

I can almost guarantee that she would have shut up and gone away to sulk. These people are effectively bullies and like all bullies they rely on their target being submissive and non-confrontational. They don't like it when their target gives as good as they get. And if you don't confront them ... they win and we will descend into a deeper state of illogical paranoia.

And, as others have said, you should also report her appalling conduct to the local FA and request that something is done about her.
 
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I'm so sorry you had to deal with that. There has to be people like that in this world so we can truly appreciate the really good people. Part of me agrees with the rest about reporting her but the other part of me thinks that will just be more negative energy and that you would be better off moving past it.
 
And WTF was the referee doing whilst all this was going on?!
 
shaylou said:
I'm so sorry you had to deal with that. There has to be people like that in this world so we can truly appreciate the really good people. Part of me agrees with the rest about reporting her but the other part of me thinks that will just be more negative energy and that you would be better off moving past it.
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No, no.. that is why this sort of thing perpetuates it is far too bad already. Report it.The OP did everything correct by keeping his cool he just needs to report and make a complaint about it. Letting things like this go just encourages the idiots.
It does not help the other photographers if these idiots think they can just go and abuse a lone photographer in the name of "I am protecting the children". They need to be put in their place.
 
As with any photographer who provides pics for local press, I spend a lot of my time photographing children (I'll be spending today processing a few dozen Children In Need shots). You did exactly the right thing in checking that you were OK to shoot. This woman was absolutely out of order. It's very important that you put this on the record. Write to both clubs and the league secretary, and if possible get the people who gave you permission to confirm this. I wouldn't bother with the police at this stage.

And don't stop shooting. That would mean THEY have won!
 
The ref has it within his power to send club officials and spectators from the field of play.
I've been at two amateur games where the manager has been sent to the car park for aggressive behaviour.

The OP mentioned opposition players joined in the abuse. Should have been a load of red cards and in his match report.

Edit: just reread the OP and the abuse by the opposition came after the final whistle so the ref may have left by then.
 
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AHILL said:
the ref was probably controlling the game as is his job, what would you want the ref to do?
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The ref has over control of on and off the field activities/actions. As the lady said she was their manager (an official of their club) the ref would have the right to stop the game and deal with the situation if they felt it was necessary. The ref could have rightly sent off the lady for foul and abusive language or threatening behaviour and reported it to the FA. I've been involved in a few games where refs have had to do this to the oppositions manager.

Reading the FA's Respect Photography Guidelines should give all the required information. Perhaps the lady needs to be send a link to it! link here If I was the OP I would take several copies of this in my bag to give out to anyone who behaves like this again and thinks behaving like this is appropriate. The quote 'The FA would like to assure parents, carers, coaches, spectators, players and local media that we encourage the taking of appropriate images of children in football' should be highlighted to this lady and others who think this behaviour is right.

As the OP had asked permission of the two coaches before the game this should have covered points 2 and 3 (about consent forms and ensuring children under care proceeding are protected), the coaches should have if it was not ok at this point if there was any issues under point 2 and 3. Perhaps providing a copy of the guidelines to coaches/managers when you ask for permission and getting them to confirm there are no issues with points 2 and 3 will show you have done more than is required from you.
 
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Voice recorder, (just switch on the video recording) in the camera to record her and others conversations

Bloody women football managers they should stick to rounders
 
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Some thing similar happened to e a few years ago.
Ar owdy bunch of youngsters was sitting on my wall making a noise and disturbing my dog who wanted to go and sort them out. A tiny JR who thought that he was a rottie!

I went and politely asked them to move on when they went ballistic, threatening me with their parents and then degenerated to calling me a paedophile.

Just as it was getting interesting a police car passed I flagged them down and told them the situation. They were very sympathetic and a few minutes later I saw them lined up against someone elses wall being given a dressing down.

I was slightly worried as I expected my windows to be put in later but it must have been effective as I never saw them again.

@realspeed says "delete and recover later" NO In my opinion this would give others the idea that they can demand deletion
 
Realistically, it's likely that the referee on this occasion didn't see or hear the altercation as it happened. They would probably have their attention on the field and if they saw and heard nothing then they'd hardly be in a position to do anything about it. No! Here it was for the set upon party to deal with it in a polite, firm, and assertive manner. If that was me, I'd certainly pursue it with her club and the local FA with a view to getting her disciplined. Such ignorant people only usually begin to understand the error of their ways when it costs them something.


TAKE NO PRISONERS.
 
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Stuart M said:
Realistically, it's likely that the referee on this occasion didn't see or hear the altercation as it happened. They would probably have their attention on the field and if they saw and heard nothing then they'd hardly be in a position to do anything about it. No! Here it was for the set upon party to deal with it in a polite, firm, and assertive manner. If that was me, I'd certainly pursue it with her club and the local FA with a view to getting her disciplined.


TAKE NO PRISONERS.
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Surely as stated by Stuart and others above the right course of action post the event is to report them to the local FA etc so that (possibly) rather than discipline there is a re-education process put into place. The fact the OP did not get their names is not relevant as if they are officers of the club(s) they will be on record and the local FA can go in in a non judgemental e.g, 'saying they have reports of incorrect behaviour by female club officials and it must not continue....................or else.....' as for the "or else" whatever sanctions such local FA officials have??? But IMO the OP needs to stand back and let officialdom do its job........and let him know it was done so that is he gets a repeat ear bashing he can then remind them of the limits of their action and the correct actions as instructed by the FA and local FA!

Does the FA have 'secret shoppers' type officials to covertly police the effect of such visitations to ensure the club is compliant?
 
That's a shocking way to be treated. Anybody that kicks off with what the..... are you doing isn't going to end well. You didn't deserve any of that. I have to agree I think you should report this to the police. There seams to be an ever increasing threat and hostility to photographers and an increase in these type of altercations being reported on forums. Good luck and keep your chin up.
 
I agree with BC. The FA would only have the power to ban her from football. A police record would show up on her CRB and hopefully prevent her abusing (*) any more children.
Plus, the police will have the power to seize any photos/videos taken by others present as evidence.

(*) Yes, I wrote abusing. Being such an appalling role model (encouraging minors in her charge to make false accusations of paedophilia?) is a form of abuse. She needs to be stopped.
 
Some quite aggressive stances being given. Do you think two wrongs make a right?
It should be enought to report her to the club and league, probably through your clubs representatives
 
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