Wanting to connect a desktop & printer to a wireless router

Chris L

Chris L

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We've been using a wireless router supplied by our ISP to allow a desktop and laptops to network & connect to the internet. The desktop has now been moved out of the same room as the router and we've recently bought a laser printer that can connect via either USB or RJ45 which is in the same room as the desktop.

I'd like to add the desktop and printer to the network without cables trailing through our home. I've purchased a second wireless router thinking that I could set this up in the same room as the desktop and printer and connect them via the LAN ports and then link the new router to the original.

I'm having trouble setting the new router up. It gives me various operation mode options in configuration and I'm unsure which is the one I need. The options I've got are:

Wireless Client Router
Wireless Router
Wireless Repeater
Wireless Bridge
Wireless Client

Am I right in thinking the wireless client is the option to go for, as this would allow wired devices to connect to the AP?

Cheers,
Chris
 
Which router is it (make/model)?
 
arad85 said:
Which router is it (make/model)?
Click to expand...

Hi,

The one connected to the internet is a Thomson tg585v7. The new one I'm trying to add is a Tp-Link tl743nd. I had another go at it last night. I set the operation mode on the new router to wireless client, entered the ssid of the Thomson. The new box then found the bsid of the Thomson. I entered the password for the Thomson into the new box having made sure it was set to wpa2, the same as the Thomson and disabled dhcp on the new box. I can't get the Thomson to see this new box though
 
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The mode you have it in sounds right, although I can't find the documentation for the router on the web anywhere (well, I can, but it only mentions the two router modes). You may have a problem with the IP addresses of the Thomson. Have you changed the IP address of the TP-Link to be something other than 192.168.1.1 (and outside of the range of the DHCP server on the Thomson?)

The first step is to get the two connected and to be able to access both web interfaces from either router.
 
arad85 said:
The mode you have it in sounds right, although I can't find the documentation for the router on the web anywhere (well, I can, but it only mentions the two router modes). You may have a problem with the IP addresses of the Thomson. Have you changed the IP address of the TP-Link to be something other than 192.168.1.1 (and outside of the range of the DHCP server on the Thomson?)

The first step is to get the two connected and to be able to access both web interfaces from either router.
Click to expand...

Thanks for replying Andy. I've left the IP address of the TP-Link (I got the model slightly wrong earlier - it's actually the tl-wr743nd) at it's default of 192.168.1.1. Could you explain what you mean about there may be a problem with the IP addresses of the Thomson? One last question...by get them connected do you mean via LAN?

Steep said:
Would a range extender work for you? this one has an rj45 socket for the printer http://www.amazon.co.uk/TP-Link-TL-...1_1?s=computers&ie=UTF8&qid=1339832836&sr=1-1

/Edit actually, no I don't think that would work.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the suggestion. As I've only had this new box since Wednesday so I will send it back under the 7 day no quibble return policy if I can't get the two boxes to talk to each other and ask for other suggestions.

I did think of moving the Thomson into the same room as the desktop and printer as the only things in the living room that access the internet are all wireless anyway, but that would mean a long run of rj11 cable and there'd also be several door frames for the cable to have to go around so at this time I've dismissed the idea in favour of an additional box in the spare room
 
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Chris L said:
Thanks for replying Andy. I've left the IP address of the TP-Link (I got the model slightly wrong earlier - it's actually the tl-wr743nd) at it's default of 192.168.1.1. Could you explain what you mean about there may be a problem with the IP addresses of the Thomson? One last question...by get them connected do you mean via LAN?
Click to expand...
That's going to be a problem.

I think the Thomson has it's IP address at 192.168.1.1 and when you get the two devices connected, there'll be a conflict as to which device has that IP address. Depending on where you are on the network, you'll "see" a different machine at 192.168.1.1. Check what the Thomson IP address is and what the DHCP address range is (it might be .2 to .254). You need to do two things (and check a third!).

  • Assign the TP-link box a different IP address to the Thomson box (192.168.1.2 should probably do if you don't have any static IPs in the house).
  • Make sure the Thomson DHCP range doesn't cover any static IPs you've assigned (e.g. 192.168.1.2 !)
  • Check that all systems are on the same logical network (i.e. they all start with 192.168.1.).

If everything is working, you should be able to browse to 192.168.1.1 and see the Thomson pages and browse to 192.168.1.2 and see the TP-Link pages. In all cases, if you need to set a subnet mask it should be 255.255.255.0 and any gateway settings should be the IP address of the Thomson box (which I'm guessing is 192.168.1.1).

If the IP address of the Thomson box starts with 192.168.x.x then just adjust the settings above to have the third digit the same as the Thomson box and the 4th digit to be different. If the IP address of the Thomson box starts 10.x.x.x please post again (the network mask will probably need to be different).
 
arad85 said:
That's going to be a problem.

I think the Thomson has it's IP address at 192.168.1.1 and when you get the two devices connected, there'll be a conflict as to which device has that IP address. Depending on where you are on the network, you'll "see" a different machine at 192.168.1.1. Check what the Thomson IP address is and what the DHCP address range is (it might be .2 to .254). You need to do two things (and check a third!).

  • Assign the TP-link box a different IP address to the Thomson box (192.168.1.2 should probably do if you don't have any static IPs in the house).
  • Make sure the Thomson DHCP range doesn't cover any static IPs you've assigned (e.g. 192.168.1.2 !)
  • Check that all systems are on the same logical network (i.e. they all start with 192.168.1.).
If everything is working, you should be able to browse to 192.168.1.1 and see the Thomson pages and browse to 192.168.1.2 and see the TP-Link pages. In all cases, if you need to set a subnet mask it should be 255.255.255.0 and any gateway settings should be the IP address of the Thomson box (which I'm guessing is 192.168.1.1).

If the IP address of the Thomson box starts with 192.168.x.x then just adjust the settings above to have the third digit the same as the Thomson box and the 4th digit to be different. If the IP address of the Thomson box starts 10.x.x.x please post again (the network mask will probably need to be different).
Click to expand...

OK, success...sort of! The IP of the Thomson is ok as it's on 192.168.1.254 and there's nothing with a static IP address. However, the two boxes were on different channels. They're now both on the same channel and I can now access both router interfaces from the laptop wirelessly.

There's two new problems now though. The first is that the TP-Link is showing up as an unsecured Wireless network but I can see no security settings on it and it's supposed to be linked to the Thomson via WPA2:thinking: The second problem is that as soon as I plug the laser printer into the TP-Link the network goes down and we can't connect to either router or the internet. The printer is currently setup to use 192.168.1.1 as a default gateway and has an IP address of 192.168.1.100
 
Chris L said:
There's two new problems now though. The first is that the TP-Link is showing up as an unsecured Wireless network but I can see no security settings on it and it's supposed to be linked to the Thomson via WPA2:thinking: The second problem is that as soon as I plug the laser printer into the TP-Link the network goes down and we can't connect to either router or the internet. The printer is currently setup to use 192.168.1.1 as a default gateway and has an IP address of 192.168.1.100
Click to expand...
So what is the IP address of the TP-Link router now.

If you have the "simple" setup (i.e. PC plugged into the Thomson router only) when you have internet access.

Assuming windows, what does the command

ipconfig /all

show for the PC when it has access to the internet.
 
arad85 said:
So what is the IP address of the TP-Link router now.

If you have the "simple" setup (i.e. PC plugged into the Thomson router only) when you have internet access.

Assuming windows, what does the command

ipconfig /all

show for the PC when it has access to the internet.
Click to expand...

The TP-Link is still on it's original IP of 192.168.1.1. The laptop shows as 192.168.1.70 when connected to the Thomson via LAN
 
What are the gateway and netmask settings of the PC when you have internet connectivity (start->run and type cmd <enter> and then ipconfig /all <enter>)
 
arad85 said:
What are the gateway and netmask settings of the PC when you have internet connectivity (start->run and type cmd <enter> and then ipconfig /all <enter>)
Click to expand...

Gateway is 192.168.1.254 and the subnet mask is 255.255.255.0
 
OK. Gateway and netmask are network wide values. The 192.168.1.254 and 255.255.255.0 look correct. Anything that is on your network should have these all set the same. I would expect there to be a setting on both the TP-Link and printer to configure these. Once you have those values set correctly you can move to debugging the connection.

The way I'd do that is as follows:

Turn the printer off until everything works correctly. Connect the PC to the Thomson router and configure the TP-Link router to attach to the Thomson. When this is working, you should be able to browse to the TP-Link status page whilst the PC is plugged into the Thomson box. That will prove the two are connected together and that the network is working correctly.
You can now take the PC and plug it into the TP-Link box and you should be able to browse 192.168.1.1, 192.168.1.254 and the internet. If you can't, what does the TP-Link wifi seem to be doing?
 
arad85 said:
OK. Gateway and netmask are network wide values. The 192.168.1.254 and 255.255.255.0 look correct. Anything that is on your network should have these all set the same. I would expect there to be a setting on both the TP-Link and printer to configure these. Once you have those values set correctly you can move to debugging the connection.
Click to expand...

So even though the printer is connecting to the TP-Link's LAN port I should set the gateway IP on the printer as the Thomson's rather than the TP-Link's? Should I also keep DHCP disabled on the TP-Link? There's now way that I canfind to set the IP address of the TP-Link on the wireless settings, just the IP address it has on it's LAN.

I also still can't see the TP-Link in the list of devices on the Thomson's web interface, not sure if that's a problem?
 
Chris L said:
So even though the printer is connecting to the TP-Link's LAN port I should set the gateway IP on the printer as the Thomson's rather than the TP-Link's? Should I also keep DHCP disabled on the TP-Link? There's now way that I canfind to set the IP address of the TP-Link on the wireless settings, just the IP address it has on it's LAN.

I also still can't see the TP-Link in the list of devices on the Thomson's web interface, not sure if that's a problem?
Click to expand...
The gateway is your networks gateway to the outside world which is 192.168.1.254. All machines will go through that no matter where they are on the 192.168.1 network.

You have to get the wireless to attach as a bridge. Try wireless bridge rather than client. Some quick googling (i don't have much time at the moment) says that the TP-Link can act as a WDS bridge (which is what you want). The Thomson also needs to be in WDS mode (and I'm not sure if that then stops wireless devices connecting to it. See: http://npr.me.uk/wds.html for how to set the Thomson into WDS mode.

A length of cat5 and a switch might be the best option ;)
 
id be inclined to try bridge mode.

but yes what andy said, the gateway should be the box connecting to the internet and there should only be one DHCP server (again the box connecting to the internet).

doesnt quite make sense why the printer would be crashing the network if the IP is not clashing with one of the routers. do you have to set the printer address manually? id be inclined to set it to DHCP then set a reservation on the DHCP box so that it always picks up the same IP.
 
arad85 said:
The gateway is your networks gateway to the outside world which is 192.168.1.254. All machines will go through that no matter where they are on the 192.168.1 network.

You have to get the wireless to attach as a bridge. Try wireless bridge rather than client. Some quick googling (i don't have much time at the moment) says that the TP-Link can act as a WDS bridge (which is what you want). The Thomson also needs to be in WDS mode (and I'm not sure if that then stops wireless devices connecting to it. See: http://npr.me.uk/wds.html for how to set the Thomson into WDS mode.

A length of cat5 and a switch might be the best option ;)
Click to expand...

I really appreciate the time you've spent trying to help Andy :) I'll have a read of the BeBox site but must admit I'm a little wary of messing with the Thomson as the person writing that article said the network suffered high packet loss, plus if I knack it up somehow then as it's supplied by our ISP we'll understandably be liable for the cost of a replacement.

Or even cheaper than the cat5 and switch is a 30ft run of rj11 and extension socket and bung the Thomson into the spare room with the printer and desktop! I wasn't keen on the idea when I started out but it's definitely growing on me:lol:

neil_g said:
id be inclined to try bridge mode.

but yes what andy said, the gateway should be the box connecting to the internet and there should only be one DHCP server (again the box connecting to the internet).

doesnt quite make sense why the printer would be crashing the network if the IP is not clashing with one of the routers. do you have to set the printer address manually? id be inclined to set it to DHCP then set a reservation on the DHCP box so that it always picks up the same IP.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the advice Neil,

I've changed the gateway address on the LAN settings of the TP-Link to 192.168.254 as suggested by Andy and I've tried setting the printer manually using IPv4 (with and without DHCP enabled) as well as trying IPv6, again, with and without DHCP enabled on the printer so that it looks at the Thomson, however, for some reason, as soon as I hook the printer up to the TP-Link via a LAN cable the wireless network goes down and the Thomson repeatedly keeps trying to reboot itself, appearing for maybe a second on the list of available wireless networks before disappearing again :bang:
 
On the subject of dodgy cables... Even new may well be suspect. I've been reworking things here today and had ordered a few cat5e cables from e-bay. Turned out they aren't very well made and they don't connect properly. Last time I buy cheap cables from an unknown source (ebuyers cheap cables seem fine).

On another note Neil: link aggregation isn't worth the trouble for home use. You only get one link used between two machines (or that's the way it seems here) even if multiple processes are accessing the link.
 
arad85 said:
On the subject of dodgy cables... Even new may well be suspect. I've been reworking things here today and had ordered a few cat5e cables from e-bay. Turned out they aren't very well made and they don't connect properly. Last time I buy cheap cables from an unknown source (ebuyers cheap cables seem fine).

On another note Neil: link aggregation isn't worth the trouble for home use. You only get one link used between two machines (or that's the way it seems here) even if multiple processes are accessing the link.
Click to expand...

Yeah it only takes something to be wrong with the machine that pushes the pins into the cable..

I doubt I'll ever use aggregation at home to be honest, got the nas set to failover mode but don't need the bandwidth.
 
neil_g said:
odd.. try another cable and port on the router. might be something dodgy with either of those.
Click to expand...

arad85 said:
On the subject of dodgy cables... Even new may well be suspect. I've been reworking things here today and had ordered a few cat5e cables from e-bay. Turned out they aren't very well made and they don't connect properly. Last time I buy cheap cables from an unknown source (ebuyers cheap cables seem fine).
Click to expand...

hmmm...I've tried three different cat5 cables and all of them allow me to connect directly to either the TP-Link or the printer using a laptop but as soon as I try and connect the printer to the TP-Link (using all four different LAN ports) the network falls over.:shrug:

I'm seriously considering sending the TP-Link back. I've just taken the Thomson into the hall so it's close enough for the cat5 cable to reach from the printer to it and then used an rj11 extension cable to connect the Thomson to the phone socket and both laptops can see the printer and the network is still up and I'm able to access the internet. Surely that would logically point to the TP-Link having the conflict/problem?
 
No idea what's causing the TP-Link issue. My managed switch is a TP-Link and it's reasonably good. If it were me, I'd either move the Thomson or buy a long cat5e cable and a cheap switch and route the cat5e to where you want the new switch leaving the Thomson where it is. I hate wireless for network infrastucture (it's fine from the access point to a laptop for browsing, but little else unless you're right next to the router IMHO).

@Neil: my switch has a cable test facility. On most of the cables it was saying 2 of the 4 pairs were suffering from crosstalk. Badly manufactured internally IMHO. They're going back for a refund...
 
arad85 said:
No idea what's causing the TP-Link issue. My managed switch is a TP-Link and it's reasonably good. If it were me, I'd either move the Thomson or buy a long cat5e cable and a cheap switch and route the cat5e to where you want the new switch leaving the Thomson where it is. I hate wireless for network infrastucture (it's fine from the access point to a laptop for browsing, but little else unless you're right next to the router IMHO).
Click to expand...

You're right, I'm going to get a 15m BT to rj11 cable (if I can find one) and set the Thomson up in the spare room next to the printer & desktop. £6 and a bit of No Nails (assuming that doesn't melt the cable :thinking:) and no more headaches :D Thank you very much both to you and to Neil for taking the time to try and help sort out my networking issues, I really appreciate it :thumbs:
 
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