Want to get rid of digital all together

Mahoneyd187

Mahoneyd187

Suspended / Banned
Messages
2,604
Name
Danny
Edit My Images
No
Hi all,

Currently I'm using my Nikon digital equipment to assist with composing and metering my images before I go ahead with the RZ67, especially as I use flash mixed with ambient alot, I find it so much easier to check the images first.

So, what are my best options to progress to moving solely to film? I have a light meter, though I never trust it without shooting a "digital polaroid" with my Nikon. Should I just buy a polaroid back and suck up the £1.50 per shot cost?

Or maybe, buy a 35mm film slr and shoot more with that and build confidence in my light meter (as it's cheaper than 120 6x7 negs)?

What would you guys do?

Discuss :)

Dan
 
I just got a 35mm film camera.

I toyed with the idea of doing that or getting a light meter (though the slr effectively has all that).

Then I thought, dont bother, you might like the results and end up with a style you like.

Ive done some sunny 16 work and plan to just 'give it a whirl' though I fear i am liable to get my first can of film back and banish the camera to the drawer :D
 
small digital point and shoot with manual modes, then you can use it to record the exif data you used when shooting the RB76. You don't need a proper viewfinder, or even a particularly good lens, just a basic record of exposure.
 
Polaroid film is a very expensive way of getting the exposure right. Polaroid backs were initially aimed mostly at pros for studio use and they could obviously pass on the cost.

What sort of meter do you currently have? If it's a decent meter I think you need to get down to really understanding how to use it - that's your cheapest and most sensible option.

There's nothing wrong with using your DSLR to meter with as long as you're not using it as a crutch to avoid getting to grips with that hand held meter. :D

Your other option of course is to get a metered prism for your RZ67, but you'll need to understand the metering pattern it uses to get the best out of it.
 
dannyrich said:
I just got a 35mm film camera.

I toyed with the idea of doing that or getting a light meter (though the slr effectively has all that).

Then I thought, dont bother, you might like the results and end up with a style you like.

Ive done some sunny 16 work and plan to just 'give it a whirl' though I fear i am liable to get my first can of film back and banish the camera to the drawer :D
Click to expand...

Good luck I'm sure they'll come out just fine :) lol

puggie said:
small digital point and shoot with manual modes, then you can use it to record the exif data you used when shooting the RB76. You don't need a proper viewfinder, or even a particularly good lens, just a basic record of exposure.
Click to expand...

This did cross my mind actually, something like a Canon G11 or whatever. I'll have a look into it and find out if any of them have a decent enough flash sync speed

CT said:
Polaroid film is a very expensive way of getting the exposure right. Polaroid backs were initially aimed mostly at pros for studio use and they could obviously pass on the cost.

What sort of meter do you currently have? If it's a decent meter I think you need to get down to really understanding how to use it - that's your cheapest and most sensible option.

There's nothing wrong with using your DSLR to meter with as long as you're not using it as a crutch to avoid getting to grips with that hand held meter. :D

Your other option of course is to get a metered prism for your RZ67, but you'll need to understand the metering pattern it uses to get the best out of it.
Click to expand...

I only have the basic sekonic 308S, and yes I definately do use the DSLR as a crutch lol :bang:
 
Danny, I am not sure why you want to get rid of the digital. Its doing the same job as a polaroid back. Unless you are willing to do as Cedric suggests and go all out with the meter and not have that visual check on exposure it seems that keeping a digital slr to hand is the best way to do it.
 
Mahoneyd187 said:
I only have the basic sekonic 308S, and yes I definately do use the DSLR as a crutch lol :bang:
Click to expand...
Well there's nothing wrong with that but ditching digital and having to hang onto your DSLR for metering is a bit like having a mistress you can't quite get rid of. :D

If you're really sure you want to go purely medium format, I think you need to gear up for it. An ideal hand held meter would do both incident and reflected readings. It should also do flash readings which is invaluable for setting up for studio work, and you can't put a value on a 1 degree spot reading facility for accurate readings from very small areas. Meters like that aren't cheap, but you'll probably never have to buy another. I'm not knocking your current meter btw - I just don't know enough about that particular model.
 
menthel said:
Danny, I am not sure why you want to get rid of the digital. Its doing the same job as a polaroid back. Unless you are willing to do as Cedric suggests and go all out with the meter and not have that visual check on exposure it seems that keeping a digital slr to hand is the best way to do it.
Click to expand...

Basically mate I have about 2grands worth of Nikon stuff, that I now only use as a posh metering system, lol.

Rather than just let it depreciate I figured I'd get something else to do the job and sell it
 
CT said:
Well there's nothing wrong with that but ditching digital and having to hang onto your DSLR for metering is a bit like having a mistress you can't quite get rid of. :D

If you're really sure you want to go purely medium format, I think you need to gear up for it. An ideal hand held meter would do both incident and reflected readings. It should also do flash readings which is invaluable for setting up for studio work, and you can't put a value on a 1 degree spot reading facility for accurate readings from very small areas. Meters like that aren't cheap, but you'll probably never have to buy another. I'm not knocking your current meter btw - I just don't know enough about that particular model.
Click to expand...

The little 308S does do incident, reflected and flash ;)

And I agree...hanging on to my DSLR and all my lenses for the sake of metering is seeming quite silly to me now.

If I get something smaller like a G11, I can use it to meter, and it'll make an awesome point and shoot for trips abroad and so on...
 
From reading this discussion on Flickr you can only get the max sync in manual mode with no ETTL. In Av, it'll stick to 1/60.

rjptn said:
I hope this will help, but I'm not sure... Off camera, and in manual mode the G11 gives me full sync at up to 1/1000sec. using a hotshoe adapter for my 1/8" sync cord. (Miniphone) I can still get sync at 1/2000 sec. but, because the flash duration is longer than the shutter duration, I don't capture it all and it appears as though there is a flash power loss. This works for multiple flashes too using slaves in addition to the one wired flash.

Using radio triggers, I can get full sync at 1/500sec.

So, I don't know about 1/250 sec using AV, I hope you find a way.
Click to expand...

For your application, though, I imagine that's not a problem.
 
Mahoneyd187 said:
Basically mate I have about 2grands worth of Nikon stuff, that I now only use as a posh metering system, lol.

Rather than just let it depreciate I figured I'd get something else to do the job and sell it
Click to expand...

then sell up and go for it. Perhaps put the money towards a digital back if there is one that fits! :eek:;)
 
menthel said:
then sell up and go for it. Perhaps put the money towards a digital back if there is one that fits! :eek:;)
Click to expand...

OI! I thought this for a brief moment but soon realised it was a TERRIBLE IDEA!!!!!!!!!

:razz:

;)
 
Mahoneyd187 said:
If I get something smaller like a G11, I can use it to meter, and it'll make an awesome point and shoot for trips abroad and so on...
Click to expand...

Well I have a little Canon G9 which actually takes up less room in my pocket than the zonking great Sekonic L-558 I have. The advantage of using the G9 for metering is that you can use the zoom facility to match the field of view exactly to that in the viewfinder of your RZ67 and also take advantage of the advanced metering pattern of the G9 applied to that scene as you've framed it. The result is pretty reliable exposures.
 
I use my G11 in pretty much the same way Ced :thumbs: It's a bit heavier than the Sekonic 358 I have, but in a more pocket friendly shape, and the ability to use the zoom to cover different FOV is a big help. It's also nice to use it in parallel with the film shots to record exif details - time/shutter speeds etc.

The G11 is also a pretty damned good Point-and-shoot for someone who likes to retain a bit of (or even complete) manual control on the shot where necessary.

I do think that putting the sale proceeds of the Nikon into a digital back is an Idea with a certain merit however :)
 
OK OK OK ......

Purely speculative....

If I was to go for the digital back route say...

I'm struggling to find details on the availability and compatibility of digibacks on the RZ67 Pro that I have. As in I don't have a Pro II or Pro IID.

Anyone want to enlighten me? ;)
 
I got rid of my D90 in favour for going all film, only digital camera I use now is the LX5, small enough to go in the camera bag with the other cameras should I need to use it.
 
get a better, spot meter, and a grey card? :) And a g11 cos they're awesome, I keep almost buying one...
 
Through gained experience you can kick the I-need-to-see-a-preview-of-the-image-first habit. Granted, it is really helpful and often critical for strobe work but for regular shooting you can use a one-degree spot meter as your "light preview". And by that I mean you will know before you take the shot what areas of the scene will fall to accent black/white (for BW work) and what will render to middle gray once you learn to use it.

Funny, after using a one-degree for so long I get frustrated when using an incident/reflection meter. It just doesn't tell me where my highlights and shadows are being placed as well. You get use to knowing that your highlights are, say, 7 stops above the shadows for example or that you have a 15 stop scene and you need to compress the highlights during developing. That sort of stuff your reflection/incident meter makes just take on good faith often.

I'm sure many here can attest that when they go out shooting their film camera they know what shots are going to be good before they develop the film. Eventually, you just know with an occasional surprise here and there that some were better/worse than expected.
 
Mahoneyd187 said:
Trouble is...this accounts for 90% of my work ;)
Click to expand...

I'd keep the digital for your "polaroid back". I think using them as an exposure preview is way more accurate and versatile. And you don't have to worry about one day they discontinue your instant film like happened with my 4x5 polaroid back holder.
 
Sorry to be a bit blunt but why don't you learn how to read a scene and meter accordingly. Half the fun of shooting film is the sometimes unexpected results.
Write down all your exposures and learn from your mistakes.

After all, we all managed pre 1998 to take pictures with film :)

The one thing I really hate about digital is the reliance on the screen. 15 years ago I used to know if things were lit properly by the sound of the "pop" from the flash.
 
Edtog said:
Sorry to be a bit blunt but why don't you learn how to read a scene and meter accordingly. Half the fun of shooting film is the sometimes unexpected results.
Write down all your exposures and learn from your mistakes.

After all, we all managed pre 1998 to take pictures with film :)

The one thing I really hate about digital is the reliance on the screen. 15 years ago I used to know if things were lit properly by the sound of the "pop" from the flash.
Click to expand...

Don't apologise mate it's no issue. As I'm only shooting 6x7 format right now its quite an expensive option to just shoot away, whilst guessing exposures, and learning from my mistakes.

You can expose for flash by the sound of the "pop"?? Seriously?? So what if someone gave you a different head to use? Excuse my being blunt (I'm not meaning to offend), but you'd be ******ed. ;) lol
 
After using equipment for long enough you get to know it :)
If someone gave me a different head then I would have to start from scratch and look at the screen or use a light meter.

For metering, without going into the zone system, negs meter slightly towards the shadows, tranny towards the highlights, or with TTL put your hand in front of the lens and overexpose by around 2/3 stop, that should give a nice midtone reading.
 
Last edited:
Danny, if you are serious about using the RZ full time you could do a lot worse than buy a Sekonic L758D meter and learn to use it fully. If you get a digital back adapter plate for your camera that takes Hasselblad V fit backs, I will lend you my Phase One H10 (you will need a powered FireWire 400 or 800 port) and cables for a couple of weeks to allow you to get to grips with the L758D meter.
 
EdBray said:
Danny, if you are serious about using the RZ full time you could do a lot worse than buy a Sekonic L758D meter and learn to use it fully. If you get a digital back adapter plate for your camera that takes Hasselblad V fit backs, I will lend you my Phase One H10 (you will need a powered FireWire 400 or 800 port) and cables for a couple of weeks to allow you to get to grips with the L758D meter.
Click to expand...

Wow thanks for the offer Ed!! I'll get hunting for the adapter plate and get some of my Nikon stuff sold :)

Just had a look at that meter, blimey, that's an expensive meter! Excuse my ignorance but in layman's terms what advantages does it offer over the cheaper ones? I don't mind spending the money if it's worthwhile :thumbs:

Love this forum
 
Mahoneyd187 said:
Wow thanks for the offer Ed!! I'll get hunting for the adapter plate and get some of my Nikon stuff sold :)

Just had a look at that meter, blimey, that's an expensive meter! Excuse my ignorance but in layman's terms what advantages does it offer over the cheaper ones? I don't mind spending the money if it's worthwhile :thumbs:

Love this forum
Click to expand...

I don't know what prices you've seen but can be had from OneStop for under £300 unless you want the radio trigger option for Pocket Wizards when it rises to £350. The meter is Spot & Incident for both flash and ambient. It will also give you a readout of the ratio between flash and ambient. You can also set parameters for different cameras.

I realise that it is not cheap, but there are few better meters on the Market, it does take some time to get to know how to use it to best advantage though and you may, along the way decide to delve fully into the Zone System which will have you using different film backs for different dynamic ranges (B&W only I'm afraid) as then you can alter development to expand or compress the tonal range.
 
Another vote for the 758, it's a 1 time purchase that will last you a lifetime, so worth every penny ;)
 
EdBray said:
I don't know what prices you've seen but can be had from OneStop for under £300 unless you want the radio trigger option for Pocket Wizards when it rises to £350. The meter is Spot & Incident for both flash and ambient. It will also give you a readout of the ratio between flash and ambient. You can also set parameters for different cameras.

I realise that it is not cheap, but there are few better meters on the Market, it does take some time to get to know how to use it to best advantage though and you may, along the way decide to delve fully into the Zone System which will have you using different film backs for different dynamic ranges (B&W only I'm afraid) as then you can alter development to expand or compress the tonal range.
Click to expand...

I'd only looked on wex to be fair, just did a quick google search. £300 doesnt seem so bad at all to be fair. I need to write a shopping list down of things I need.

I'm still accumulating the stuff to develop at home, there's just so much to take in with film, I'm quite taken back to be fair I feel like a real amateur lol :bonk:
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top