W10 update to W11 sooner than anticipated?

Box Brownie

Box Brownie

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I spotted this in the newsfeed

www.forbes.com

Microsoft Windows Update—CISA October 29 Deadline Has Now Passed

Government issues emergency update warning for all Windows users, with existing security fixes likely “insufficient.”
www.forbes.com www.forbes.com

The article says to do so latest 29th October :thinking:

Personally I was planning on doing my update sometime early in 2025
 
GeeJay57 said:
Microsoft say that they will stop supporting Windows 10 in October 2025

www.microsoft.com

End of support for Windows 10, Windows 8.1, and Windows 7 | Microsoft Windows

Make a smooth transition to Windows 11 from your unsupported operating system with help from Microsoft. Enjoy the benefits of upgrading to a Windows 11 PC.
www.microsoft.com www.microsoft.com
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This much I knew hence I was leaving it until next year.

But the article (seems to) infers that there has been an exploit identified that MS cannot mitigate in a W10 security update?
 
Box Brownie said:
This much I knew hence I was leaving it until next year.

But the article (seems to) infers that there has been an exploit identified that MS cannot mitigate in a W10 security update?
Click to expand...
Ah ok, I mostly use Mac, but have a Windows 10 install on a Bootcamp drive which gets used occassionally, so have a passing interest.
 
This isn't looking great. I had something from Microsoft to the effect that on my laptop with Windows 10 and working perfectly happy (not even that old - only around 6 years or so) it is not possible to upgrade to Windows 11. So, they make it impossible to upgrade, then warn that we must upgrade within a fortnight or we are 'doomed'. ie: buy a new laptop you skinflint.....
 
Box Brownie said:
This much I knew hence I was leaving it until next year.

But the article (seems to) infers that there has been an exploit identified that MS cannot mitigate in a W10 security update?
Click to expand...
No, I think what they mean is that this time next year when Windows 10 support expires there won't be an update for vulnerabilities like this but that's not the case yet. Looking at the Microsoft site they have Windows 10 updates to fix this CVE:

Security Update Guide - Microsoft Security Response Center

msrc.microsoft.com msrc.microsoft.com
 
In windows 11 there is a lot missing with camera updates added. for example RAW files. Microsoft have not updated on my camera the Panasonic G9ii to show RAW files (pink screen)


Panasonic G9ii RAW in windows 11


P1000557aaa.jpg


Pana G9 RAW in windows 11
P1011698aaa.jpg


So microsoft need to up their game to accept new cameras
 
JohnMcL7 said:
No, I think what they mean is that this time next year when Windows 10 support expires there won't be an update for vulnerabilities like this but that's not the case yet. Looking at the Microsoft site they have Windows 10 updates to fix this CVE:

Security Update Guide - Microsoft Security Response Center

msrc.microsoft.com msrc.microsoft.com
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When I read your linked article it is unclear (could have misread it) which and when the security update was in Windows Update?

But the article says this....I have made bold, it is explicit but vague as they don't make reference to any impending MS mitigation :thinking:

"The latest vulnerability is CVE-2024-43573, which the US cyber agency warns is “an unspecified spoofing vulnerability which can lead to a loss of confidentiality.” It has mandated all federal employees to “apply mitigations per vendor instructions or discontinue use of the product if mitigations are unavailable” by October 29. In other words, update your PC within the next ten days, or stop using it until you can."
 
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I'm not sure the relevance of raw file support in Windows 11 is but given you seem to keep mentioning this, why does it bother you so much? Previously windows didn't support any raw files at all in explorer.
 
Box Brownie said:
But the article says this....I have made bold, it is explicit but vague as they don't make reference to any impending MS mitigation :thinking:

"The latest vulnerability is CVE-2024-43573, which the US cyber agency warns is “an unspecified spoofing vulnerability which can lead to a loss of confidentiality.” It has mandated all federal employees to “apply mitigations per vendor instructions or discontinue use of the product if mitigations are unavailable” by October 29. In other words, update your PC within the next ten days, or stop using it until you can."
Click to expand...
I don't think that's what they're saying, I think what that statement is saying is that systems have to be patched (Windows 10 or 11) or they get kicked off the network which is likely a standard policy. There's no need for mitigation since the patch was released on the 8th October, I've linked the Microsoft response to the CVE which clearly shows the patches for Windows 10 and 11. I think it's basically a clickbait article using a bit of scaremongering to make there appear to be a problem that doesn't exist, any Windows system on standard auto updates will be protected already and on checking my current Win10 system it was patched on the 10th October for this issue.

Mitigation can be useful if there are problems applying a patch (such as it causing downtime) or if a patch isn't available, that could be because the vendor is working on producing one or the system isn't supported any more.
 
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John
it is just the way I have always worked viewing RAW files straight away . now to view means going into an editing suite first. Yes I Do shoot in Jpeg and Raw at the same timen
 
JohnMcL7 said:
I don't think that's what they're saying, I think what that statement is saying is that systems have to be patched (Windows 10 or 11) or they get kicked off the network which is likely a standard policy. There's no need for mitigation since the patch was released on the 8th October, I've linked the Microsoft response to the CVE which clearly shows the patches for Windows 10 and 11. I think it's basically a clickbait article using a bit of scaremongering to make there appear to be a problem that doesn't exist, any Windows system on standard auto updates will be protected already and on checking my current Win10 system it was patched on the 10th October for this issue.

Mitigation can be useful if there are problems applying a patch (such as it causing downtime) or if a patch isn't available, that could be because the vendor is working on producing one or the system isn't supported any more.
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I am not on my PC now (on the phone), once back on it I will cross check the updates "dates" and check I received it. (y)
 
LancsMak said:
I'd just say get the upgrade done, W11 is well established now.
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The problem is as mentioned above is that W11 hardware requirements are much stricter than Windows 10 and also I've found some compatible systems which can run Win10 without issue struggle with Windows 11. It's not the first time a new Windows OS has had tougher requirements but Windows 11 isn't really much of an upgrade or change over Windows 10.
 
I'm still running W7 on one machine, and it is still getting security updates, not that it matters.

I see W11 has better "productivity tools", by that I assume they mean better money making tools.

When I check for updates, I do not get any messages about W11, guessing my laptop is not up to specs, which means that my son's school laptop, and my wife's laptop won't be either, and there is no ways we can afford to replace three of them, and I doubt hat we are the only ones in that position, so I really can't see W10 just not working any more.



Does W11 allow you to install from MSI packages or only MSIX?
 
LancsMak said:
I'd just say get the upgrade done, W11 is well established now.
Click to expand...
Upgrading to Windows 11 requires in some cases, an upgrade in hardware. My other half’s laptop and my iMac 27 are not upgradeable to Windows 11. Same with my father-in-law’s laptop. So for some perhaps many, especially older users (FIL is 85) who have machines that are perfectly functional for their needs, this is a costly upgrade for no good reason.
 
Just updating my W7 laptop to Service Pack 1 so that I can install an antivirus :)
 
Bodian said:
This isn't looking great. I had something from Microsoft to the effect that on my laptop with Windows 10 and working perfectly happy (not even that old - only around 6 years or so) it is not possible to upgrade to Windows 11. So, they make it impossible to upgrade, then warn that we must upgrade within a fortnight or we are 'doomed'. ie: buy a new laptop you skinflint.....
Click to expand...
I'm exactly in the same boat got a windows 10 "gaming laptop" with lots of ram, 2 ssd, graphic card. I don't really want to upgrade anytime soon but cannot update to win 11 to to hardware restriction.
 
The article says update not upgrade. See also posts #6 and #10
 
JohnMcL7 said:
I don't think that's what they're saying, I think what that statement is saying is that systems have to be patched (Windows 10 or 11) or they get kicked off the network which is likely a standard policy. There's no need for mitigation since the patch was released on the 8th October, I've linked the Microsoft response to the CVE which clearly shows the patches for Windows 10 and 11.
Click to expand...

I have checked the updates installed re: 8th October patch(es) and could not see one that specifically addressed the referenced one CVE-2024-43573

Yes, the page that you linked does say that Windows 10 22H2 (in the list) was patched but curiously why doesn't an/the appropriate update KB illustrate that particular CVE (as for example KB5044091 .NET Framework update shows two CVE'd that it fixed)

JohnMcL7 said:
I think it's basically a clickbait article using a bit of scaremongering to make there appear to be a problem that doesn't exist, any Windows system on standard auto updates will be protected already and on checking my current Win10 system it was patched on the 10th October for this issue.
Click to expand...
As above, can you please tell which KB number you are seeing in regard to CVE-2024-43573 ?
JohnMcL7 said:
Mitigation can be useful if there are problems applying a patch (such as it causing downtime) or if a patch isn't available, that could be because the vendor is working on producing one or the system isn't supported any more.
Click to expand...
 
Would there be interest in me putting together and full "HOW TO" detailed document and process how you can install W11 on hardware that is not compliant?

It is actually very easy and even supported by Microsoft , its just not talked about.
All the software etc to do it is freely available and completely legit.

For info I am a recently retired lifetime IT guy with a huge amount of experience in this particular matter and have
installed W11 on older hardware probably 30+ times since W11 first surfaced with very few issues.
 
Mr Bump said:
Would there be interest in me putting together and full "HOW TO" detailed document and process how you can install W11 on hardware that is not compliant?

It is actually very easy and even supported by Microsoft , its just not talked about.
All the software etc to do it is freely available and completely legit.

For info I am a recently retired lifetime IT guy with a huge amount of experience in this particular matter and have
installed W11 on older hardware probably 30+ times since W11 first surfaced with very few issues.
Click to expand...
That may be of benefit to many..... None too sure without checking the status of the OH's Dell laptop ?

On my recent 2023 build PC AFAIK it passes for W11 install on its hardware specs which IIRC is primarily around the TPM and motherboard again IIRC has TPM 2.0
 
This PC is on Win10 22H2 so the KB is KB5044273, this is the full list of CVEs the patch fixes:

Security Update Guide - Microsoft Security Response Center

msrc.microsoft.com msrc.microsoft.com

The one you've highlighted (and one other I believe) are notable because they're being actively exploited which makes it crucial to get patched quickly whereas most CVEs should be patched before there's a chance for them to be xploited.
 
Box Brownie said:
That may be of benefit to many..... None too sure without checking the status of the OH's Dell laptop ?

On my recent 2023 build PC AFAIK it passes for W11 install on its hardware specs which IIRC is primarily around the TPM and motherboard again IIRC has TPM 2.0
Click to expand...

The only two things in Microsoft's eye are the TPM (they want v2, older ones are usually V1.2) both still do the job well but hey ho.

The other thing is the processor mainly because of the downfall leak and some other processor vulnarbilities that have been discovered which is why some very good and powerful processors are also not on the approved list.
 
Mr Bump said:
Would there be interest in me putting together and full "HOW TO" detailed document and process how you can install W11 on hardware that is not compliant?

It is actually very easy and even supported by Microsoft , its just not talked about.
All the software etc to do it is freely available and completely legit.

For info I am a recently retired lifetime IT guy with a huge amount of experience in this particular matter and have
installed W11 on older hardware probably 30+ times since W11 first surfaced with very few issues.
Click to expand...
Microsoft don’t recommend installing Windows 11 on non-compliant hardware and do not guarantee on-going updates including security updates…

Windows 11 on devices that don't meet minimum system requirements - Microsoft Support

Installing Windows 11 on devices that do not meet minimum system requirements is unsupported and is not recommended by Microsoft.
support.microsoft.com support.microsoft.com
 
GeeJay57 said:
Microsoft don’t recommend installing Windows 11 on non-compliant hardware and do not guarantee on-going updates including security updates…

Windows 11 on devices that don't meet minimum system requirements - Microsoft Support

Installing Windows 11 on devices that do not meet minimum system requirements is unsupported and is not recommended by Microsoft.
support.microsoft.com support.microsoft.com
Click to expand...

Yes we all know that but there is a very easy way to circumvent that and it runs fine , this method is out in the community and being used by millions of people, obviously it needs to be decent hardware, the laptop i am using now to type this is a 7 year old HP 14 inch and has been running W11 for over 2 years using this install version, i'm not looking to change the world, i am offering to document the process so if anyone out there has a non compliant laptop/pc then there are options rather than just throw it away.
 
Mr Bump said:
Yes we all know that but there is a very easy way to circumvent that and it runs fine , this method is out in the community and being used by millions of people, obviously it needs to be decent hardware, the laptop i am using now to type this is a 7 year old HP 14 inch and has been running W11 for over 2 years using this install version, i'm not looking to change the world, i am offering to document the process so if anyone out there has a non compliant laptop/pc then there are options rather than just throw it away.
Click to expand...
Ok
 
JohnMcL7 said:
This PC is on Win10 22H2 so the KB is KB5044273, this is the full list of CVEs the patch fixes:

Security Update Guide - Microsoft Security Response Center

msrc.microsoft.com msrc.microsoft.com

The one you've highlighted (and one other I believe) are notable because they're being actively exploited which makes it crucial to get patched quickly whereas most CVEs should be patched before there's a chance for them to be xploited.
Click to expand...
Thank for the added clarity, looking on my W11 laptop I can see the whole page and the parts of the list that I initially missed as was using my phone to search the issue :)

Doh! I was previously looking on my phone and it was not obvious that the table on the above web page was wider than shown, I have only just checked and it does side-scroll! :headbang:

My route was to 'check' the KB info and on this page

There is no mention that I can see about the CVE being patched?

IIRC the KB504473 is on my desktop update listing :)
 
They don't list them on that page because there's far too many of them (113 in October), you need to check the link I posted above for the CVEs being patched.
 
JohnMcL7 said:
They don't list them on that page because there's far too many of them (113 in October), you need to check the link I posted above for the CVEs being patched.
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Yes, and will bookmark it for future reference:)
 
If people don't want Windows 11 then Linux is a viable alternative for many things these days, but there is a learning/adjustment curve. At the end of the day W10 is nearly 10 years old. I certainly wouldn't go circumventing things on a W11 install to save a few quid.

For those fancying Linux, Mint is a good version ("distro") to have a play with.
 
LancsMak said:
If people don't want Windows 11 then Linux is a viable alternative for many things these days, but there is a learning/adjustment curve. At the end of the day W10 is nearly 10 years old. I certainly wouldn't go circumventing things on a W11 install to save a few quid.

For those fancying Linux, Mint is a good version ("distro") to have a play with.
Click to expand...

But W10 was designed to last a lot longer, They said 10 would be the last :)

Thing is it didn't do what they wanted in two areas, monetisation and dictating what the users must do.

Linux is good, I was running Linux file, mail and proxy servers in 1999, and it was good even then, but there is always something that people want that is not there, and in my case at the moment it is Affinity (I know about Gimp, I used it for years before changing to Affinity a couple of years ago)
 
I know lots of firms running win10. They ain't upgrading by tomorrow just because "the us government" says so.

Meanwhile, my MacBook nags me every day to upgrade. My options are delay for a day or go to the app store. The app store tells me I can't upgrade because my hardware is too old. It's the circle of stupidity. But zoom still works so that's ok.
 
Seniorshot said:
Paul, I for one would appreciate your "HOW TO" document. People can choose to follow it or not depending on their particular requirements.
Click to expand...
:plus1:
Mr Bump said:
I will do that, give me a few days and I will make a seperate thread.
Click to expand...
Thank you Paul, I think it will be a very useful document certainly for me.
 
Topsy said:
:plus1:

Thank you Paul, I think it will be a very useful document certainly for me.
Click to expand...

give me 7 days , i need to be back at base (home) so i can dig out an old donor laptop so i can do it completely accurately
i could do most from memory but i would rather get all the steps spot on for the lesser techy out there that might be interested. :)
 
Sangoma said:
But W10 was designed to last a lot longer, They said 10 would be the last :)

Thing is it didn't do what they wanted in two areas, monetisation and dictating what the users must do.
Click to expand...
Nope, that was a single statement made by one inidividual and not endorsed by MS :).
 
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