using a camera in preset mode

realspeed

realspeed

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Bazza
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Having bought an expodisc and have the result in preset mode ( Nikon D800 preset D1) does that setting have any affect on the presets the camera comes with? ie AWB-sun -shade-flash etc.
The camera presets are more to do with light than colour from what I understand.
Since using the" D1 Expodisc" setting I no longer struggle with for example the colour red in the built in camera ones- sun -shade -flash etc


Example





This question is only about COLOUR not focus composition or lighting or anything else in the examples above.
 
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Since WB is a most important tweak but may
be applied any time in PP, I don't think that it
is wotrh any disk or anything… just leave it on
Auto WB and enjoy the peace of mind.

Both seem to be ok btw!
 
In the first shot it looks like the reds are over saturated.

No idea what the pre-sets mean though and many cameras struggle with red flowers...
 
Red and green should not be seen
Except upon an Irish queen

Watch your back...
grounds
 
Not much help so far with the replies to the question asked
 
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realspeed said:
Not much help so far with the replies to the question asked
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As the question could only be answered by someone with a D800 or someone who is familiar with that camera, maybe the question would have been better in the camera specific thread.

Or even, try putting something useful as the question title. I've got to admit, it took a couple of reads before I 'got' what the question was.
 
I have only used preset mode in camera once,and that was by accident,although the results were quite good.
Personally if I am going to use presets which I do quite often then I do it in LR.
Hope thar helps
 
Expodisc is intended to be scene specific and not a general preset. I am not a Nikon user but using it to set a custom white balance should not affect the sun / cloudy etc presets as they are based upon colour temperature.
 
realspeed said:
Not much help so far with the replies to the question asked
Click to expand...

does that setting have any affect on the presets the camera comes with? ie AWB-sun -shade-flash etc.
Click to expand...

No, the presets are exactly that, presets. The Expodisc is a white balance tool and is used to set a custom white balance only.

If you put your camera into sunny, cloudy or AWB white balance then those presets will apply
 
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realspeed said:
Not much help so far with the replies to the question asked
Click to expand...
Try to
troutfisher said:
I have only used preset mode in camera once,and that was by accident,although the results were quite good.
Personally if I am going to use presets which I do quite often then I do it in LR.
Hope thar helps
Click to expand...

It's a wonder with all that technology we insist on processing what has already been processed
As for reds, one must treat them as your eyes must...with some balance
The sensor isn't your eye..just a device with no mind of its own

I speak from experience.
 
The problem with camera presets are you don't know how close to 18% grey they are set at and the manufactures. I would have thought work to a wide tolerance to allow for which country it is going to be used in,so it could be for example +/- 10 % out or even more. That is something camera manufactures don't give with each individual camera or even mention.
At least with this bit of kit one can get as close to 18% grey as is possible as each disc is individually tuned, a report on it when purchased. mine is calibrated to 17.80 % grey

Think of it this way. A car engine has to be able to work in all conditions from very hot climates to very cold ones. Therefore it is made to allow for this, which is why it can be better tuned locally for better performance because the tolerance it has to work in is far less. This results in more power and better economy.

A camera can be tuned the same way with a dedicated bit of kit designed to produce better results

PRESETS VIA EXPODISC D4 was a trial before i got the disc so ignore



AS you can see in D1 (that 17.80% grey, doesn't show up well on here ) I used in those photos to get the right colour ,which I presume alters all the other built in presets like awb - sun-shade flash etc.

There are 4 different ones Di D2 D3 D4 so I can quickly go to another self installed preset for different conditions ,such as indoors not yet tested.

I know the canon DSLR's have a similar facility built into their cameras but got to in a different way to Nikon
 
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ecoleman said:
No, the presets are exactly that, presets. The Expodisc is a white balance tool and is used to set a custom white balance only.

If you put your camera into sunny, cloudy or AWB white balance then those presets will apply
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normally yes but by setting another base to work from ie DI,then do all the other built in presets then work to that instead?

Only way I can explain what I am trying to say is like a car tyre, different tread patterns can affect how it a car performs but it is still the same car.
Having tried to understand in the instruction book it does affect every built in preset but they don't specifically mention a third party bit of kit to do it with
 
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Kodiak Qc said:
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Since WB is a most important tweak but may
be applied any time in PP,
Click to expand...

Presumably you mean IF you shoot in RAW ?

The OP has bought an expo disk so is obviously trying to get the WB right in camera rather than take a bad picture and fix later approach you seem to advocate.
 
KIPAX said:
Presumably you mean IF you shoot in RAW ?

The OP has bought an expo disk so is obviously trying to get the WB right in camera rather than take a bad picture and fix later approach you seem to advocate.
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Correct but not only in RAW as my camera has 2 card slots CF and SD so I have dedicated the RAW to the CF card and Jpeg to the SD card as well as video. I did it this way so RAW files don't get mixed up and only go to the CF card.

Like everyone else I find I am spending too much time editing getting the photo correct so now aiming to get correct in camera. AS i said red wa the hardest to get right. yes there are adjustments as well on a colour temperature adjustment screen /custom bank within the camera menu but hat means a lot more fiddling .

By the way trying to view RAW photos direct on the monitor I had to add a Nikon codec to my "C" drive on the computer . This saves having to go into a editing suite first.
 
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realspeed said:
Correct but not only in RAW .
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I meant the poster saying you can fix white balance in PP and I was saying presumably only if you shoot in raw... which he failed to mention as for some reason he seems to presume everyone shoots in raw :)

I ahve canon and when using my expo disk i save as a preset but its not a base for other presets to use.. that just wouldnt work...or have any need to .....
 
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KIPAX said:
I meant the poster saying you can fix white balance in PP and I was saying presumably only if you shoot in raw... which he failed to mention as for some reason he seems to presume everyone shoots in raw :)

I ahve canon and when using my expo disk i save as a preset but its not a base for other presets to use.. that just wouldnt work...or have any need to .....
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I understand what you are saying ,but nowhere in my 446 page Nikon D800 manual say that the preset via the expodisk or any other kit overrides the other preset base settings or not. So if I used say the sun preset that came with the camera, how do I know how close to the 18% grey is it set at? I don't.

From my tests all I can conclude, right or wrong, that setting the expodisk does override the base setting that the camera works to for built in presets.
All i will say is I could not get so much colour definition in those pictures without that disc straight from the camera

The kelvin scale also in the menu only measures colour temperature of light which again is something different to setting colours in a picture ,so won't even go down that route

My manageress when I was in business had a Canon and the same shot on the same setting on both camera came out different,. may be down to the lens used or the way each camera sees/records that picture
 
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KIPAX said:
WB right in camera rather than take a bad picture and fix later approach you seem to advocate.
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Oooops… something is not clear here!

  1. colours presets and WB apply only to jpg and not
    to RAW since it has no colour space
  2. When I have to shoot jpg, it is with Auto WB "on"
 
My point is a camera comes with presets and cameras recognise only grey, so how close to the 18% grey are those presets? at least I do know by calibrating with a known bit of kit already calibrated to within 0.2% of that 18%. That is a question that can't be answered because the manufacturers don't give out that information due to various factors. If that grey is not correct in manufacture then no matter if shooting in RAW or Jpeg the colours will not be correct.
 
realspeed said:
My point is a camera comes with presets and cameras recognise only grey, so how close to the 18% grey are those presets? at least I do know by calibrating with a known bit of kit already calibrated to within 0.2% of that 18%. That is a question that can't be answered because the manufacturers don't give out that information due to various factors. If that grey is not correct in manufacture then no matter if shooting in RAW or Jpeg the colours will not be correct.
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I think there's a misunderstanding here:
The 18% grey has nothing to do with WB, it's a reference point for exposure.

WB is a variable that (even when 'correct' it might not be what we want), it's an artistic decision, in film days we picked film that had a certain tone curve that we desired, or we accepted what the lab gave us from our chosen print film (we had made some choice but lost some control).

I think you're trying to understand an 'absolute' that doesn't really exist. It's like trying to nail a jelly to a ceiling.

When setting WB we can:
Choose a camera preset
Take a custom reading and use that
Use auto WB and allow the camera to guess

Or shoot Raw with any of the above and tweak in post.
Maximise the 'accuracy' of our tweaking by using a colour checker or similar calibration device*

*If you want 'accurate', that is the best option, but any of the other options can be 'good enough', as always it depends on specific requirements.
 
Phil V said:
WB is a variable that (even when 'correct' it might not be what we want), it's an artistic decision, in film days we picked film that had a certain tone curve that we desired, or we accepted what the lab gave us from our chosen print film (we had made some choice but lost some control).
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I think this is something that some people maybe forget as some seem to think that a picture has to be technically correct. A picture with an incorrect WB may be beautiful and much nicer to look at than a more technically correct picture :D

Oh, and I have to say this... the idea that shooting raw and processing for best effect for WB or indeed a number of other things is the same as taking a bad picture and fixing it latter is twaddle :D
 
Phil V said:
I think there's a misunderstanding here:
The 18% grey has nothing to do with WB, it's a reference point for exposure.

WB is a variable that (even when 'correct' it might not be what we want), it's an artistic decision, in film days we picked film that had a certain tone curve that we desired, or we accepted what the lab gave us from our chosen print film (we had made some choice but lost some control).

I think you're trying to understand an 'absolute' that doesn't really exist. It's like trying to nail a jelly to a ceiling.

When setting WB we can:
Choose a camera preset
Take a custom reading and use that
Use auto WB and allow the camera to guess

Or shoot Raw with any of the above and tweak in post.
Maximise the 'accuracy' of our tweaking by using a colour checker or similar calibration device*

*If you want 'accurate', that is the best option, but any of the other options can be 'good enough', as always it depends on specific requirements.
Click to expand...

^^^ This

With respect Baz, you've fallen for ExpoDisc's marketing spin (liberally laced with snake oil) and bought an expensive widget that is not the best way to adjust either white balance or exposure IMHO. But more to the point, you're not understanding how the ExposDisc works and what it's telling you. It can be used for both custom white balance and 18% grey exposure setting, but they are completely different things.
 
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