Unhappy Customers

First one is very soft and is a bit blurry. Shutter speed to low? Also looks a bit washed out, needs more black in! I am not a fan of selected colour and in this case it does no favours.

Second is better but all the kids are looking behind you - you either need proper eye contact or no contact, like looking away.
 
Kelly, I'm sorry to hear your friends were so ungrateful. You have taken the time to photograph their children (who sound poorly behaved) and you have then processed the images and handed them over as a gift - images of a standard they could not have replicated themselves without paying someone. Since you were not paid, they have absolutely no grounds with which to complain and they should have had the grace to thank you. I can perfectly understand the others suggesting that you tell them where to go, in the nicest possible way of course, but since you are doing this for practice there may be some value in doing a re-shoot - value for you, specifically. If the children are more cooperative then so much the better, but if not then I would cease to do these people any more favours. To be quite honest family and friends can be the most difficult people to "work" for, even when payment is not involved. You're likely to find that most of us suggest you avoid them for that reason!
 
As said, the first one is very soft, he also has a toe missing due to your editing. Second shot is much better but they are all still looking the wrong way. Would appear that Mum was doing the entertaining and so they were looking at her and not you.
These are fairly obvious faults and you need to make sure they aren't occurring before marketing yourself as a pro.
 
Darthchaffinch said:
the first one's a little soft, plus all I want to look at is the blue thingy. 2nd one's nice.
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Thanks

Maybe the toe was due to sitting on a mat I have got another one with some of the mat in, il upload it! Xx
 
cambsno said:
First one is very soft and is a bit blurry. Shutter speed to low? Also looks a bit washed out, needs more black in! I am not a fan of selected colour and in this case it does no favours.

Second is better but all the kids are looking behind you - you either need proper eye contact or no contact, like looking away.
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I get what u mean the mothers had bubbles :(
 
cambsno said:
First one is very soft and is a bit blurry. Shutter speed to low? Also looks a bit washed out, needs more black in! I am not a fan of selected colour and in this case it does no favours.

Second is better but all the kids are looking behind you - you either need proper eye contact or no contact, like looking away.
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Agree with all of this -

also

No 1: out of focus, (whats your exif data for this pic),
get the kid looking at you - get mum behind you calling / bribing...
there is an absence of colour & even black. lighting is flat.

No2: Its better than no 1
without the centre child wearing a vibrant colour they would all look lost,
None are even looking the same way - let alone at you,
lighting is very flat,
subjects need to be further away from backdrop,
try a different colour backdrop,
use a warmer reflector (gold !) to try & get colour in there...
 
also to the op - glad you are taking this on the chin...

What doesn't break you will make you stronger...


What are you going to do DIFFERENT to ensure that this is a sucess ?
 
I quite like the second shot. I certainly would be pleased with that. Btw thats from a personal view and not from a customer' perspective. I think you've done quite well, especially as you said you were new at this.
JohnyT
 
Diving Pete said:
also to the op - glad you are taking this on the chin...

What doesn't break you will make you stronger...

What are you going to do DIFFERENT to ensure that this is a sucess ?
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I guess I'm gunna take on what people suggest have a go and see if it works :) xx
 
Cagey75 said:
Anyone who thinks it's ok to [even politely] tell someone to F off because they didn't like a job they did shouldn't be dealing with clients IMHO.

Re-wording it 'politely' is a far cry from "F off!" - plain simple. What you're suggesting is tell them you won't entertain a re-shoot, not the same thing at all. Nobody said that wasn't an option. So why are you quoting me as if it were bad advice not to tell them to F off?

What's with the schoolyard reference? That's just a stirring remark I think. :thinking: I would say advising someone to do so, even "politely" is awful advice. Luckily the OP agrees. Firing ahead and taking the advice to "politely tell them to F off" even, could damage her rep in future, and I'm glad she's not taking up on that for her sake.
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Unfortunately, your desire to believe and to be 'shocked' that we'd tell a customer to F*** off is simply a symptom of your feelings towards pro photographers:nono:. Not one single pro would even go close to using those words.
You can bet your bottom dollar that whilst we're apologising for not meeting their expectations whilst making it resolutely clear that we're not going to budge - that in our heads what we're saying is 'F*** off and don't darken my door again' but what the customer will 'hear' is the total opposite. You really should consider what you're reading before you jump in and risk making yourself look a bit daft.:D
 
I somehow doubt that all the people suggesting the F off approach are all pro photographers are they?
Just people taking a reactionary approach without actually thinking it through, that is all.
 
ernesto said:
I somehow doubt that all the people suggesting the F off approach are all pro photographers are they?
Just people taking a reactionary approach without actually thinking it through, that is all.
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Absolutely, but Cagey only comes here to tell the pro's how they're all doing it all wrong and how disgusting they are as human beings:shake:
 
Where do you get the ideas Phil, seriously? Cagey does nothing of the sort. And you clearly know nothing little about me, so why act like you do?

I plain simple said you should not tell them to F off as some suggested, nobody mentioned or even hinted at you so pull your claws back in there ;) Why you're all defensive about me saying you shouldn't ever come close to that, I can't make out.

And I never tell anyone what to do :shrug:

Feel free to root through my posts for examples of such all you desire.
 
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Just throwing this out there... But I would be interested to know what your friends sister in laws expectations were? Had she seen your work previously?
 
ernesto said:
I somehow doubt that all the people suggesting the F off approach are all pro photographers are they?
Just people taking a reactionary approach without actually thinking it through, that is all.
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OP is fairly new here, and may take all suggestions as solid advice, for all we know. I don't even know when some posts on here are meant as serious or not, but better be safe than sorry - so I suggested not to go down that path, steer away from telling a customer, paying or not, to F off ... however politely

Don't know what Phil's beef with me is, but if my thing was telling pro's off, I'd surely be hanging out in the business section :thinking:
 
Cagey75 said:
Where do you get the ideas Phil, seriously? Cagey does nothing of the sort. And you clearly know nothing little about me, so why act like you do?

I plain simple said you should not tell them to F off as some suggested, nobody mentioned or even hinted at you so pull your claws back in there ;) Why you're all defensive about me saying you shouldn't ever come close to that, I can't make out.

And I never tell anyone what to do :shrug:

Feel free to root through my posts for examples of such all you desire.
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I love how you pull this about, where did I mention me?
:cuckoo:
Why would I be defensive?:shrug:
 
It was nicely getting back on track too. Consider this a nudge to get it back in the right direction. Kellyanne is getting some useful suggestions. Let's not spoil it
 
I' ve bitten my tongue thus far to be honest and apologise in advance for being controversial but given the OP is already and has for some time it appears, been marketing herself for portraits, weddings and bump to baby all over facebook etc I'm aghast to see her numerous posts on the forum to be frank.
 
Phil V said:
I love how you pull this about, where did I mention me?
:cuckoo:
Why would I be defensive?:shrug:
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Pull what about? Your degrading of me for no reason? If it's nowt to do with you, then quit the personals against me for no reason, cheers.

Phil V said:
Absolutely, but Cagey only comes here to tell the pro's how they're all doing it all wrong and how disgusting they are as human beings:shake:
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For example, completely uncalled for ^^

Donnie, all we can do is suggest/advise on what's on offer here. I don't see her facebook mentioned or advertised here, or am I missing something?
 
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Nothing advertised no, and no, facebook not mentioned either, but I'm a pedant by nature and I like to be as sure as I can be about something when voicing my opinion.

As there was something not ringing quite right and I couldn't be sure what I decided to have a google and found what Ive stated above :|

As I said to Simon previously, I am biting my tongue, I mean I wouldn't want to be guilty of not establishing what basis the OP is taking photos and then assuming the worst? :eek::eek:
 
sunnyside_up said:
Just throwing this out there... But I would be interested to know what your friends sister in laws expectations were? Had she seen your work previously?
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I had never seen her before and she's never seen my work before, my friend/cousins gf has cause I've done a lot of pictures of her kids and she's always been happy with them x
 
sunnyside_up said:
Just throwing this out there... But I would be interested to know what your friends sister in laws expectations were? Had she seen your work previously?
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Ok, I'm going to explain what I'm meaining here... and I suppose it has nothing to do with how you would deal with the actual complaint, although I don't agree with telling someone to 'do one' just because they don't like your work.

I too have done a bit of a google and found the OP's facebook page as I was interested in what sort of work she was producing. Now I'm no professional, never have touted myself to be, in fact, I don't even call myself a photographer, but actually a 'picture maker'... (which is beside the point)... BUT, I work in the industry so I do think I can have an educated opinion, and also a personal one. If the friend's sister in law has seen the level of work previous, and received anything similar to what is on the OP's facebook page, then really she has nothing to complain about. These images, in my opinion, are adverage (on adverage)... but nothing that I would call 'out of this world stunning'.. sorry Kellyanne, not meant to be offensive. But if the OP is attempting to market herself as a professional, offering professional services (even though at the same time saying just starting out), you're already setting a level of standard there and expectation. If the friend's sis in law hasn't seen the previous work, she may have been sorely disappointed, with reason. I do want to stress, I'm not attacking Kellyanne's work, but I think one has to be realistic with what and how they try to market themselves as... what's the expression, walk before you run? I hope that made sense... :)
 
sunnyside_up said:
Ok, I'm going to explain what I'm meaining here... and I suppose it has nothing to do with how you would deal with the actual complaint, although I don't agree with telling someone to 'do one' just because they don't like your work.

I too have done a bit of a google and found the OP's facebook page as I was interested in what sort of work she was producing. Now I'm no professional, never have touted myself to be, in fact, I don't even call myself a photographer, but actually a 'picture maker'... (which is beside the point)... BUT, I work in the industry so I do think I can have an educated opinion, and also a personal one. If the friend's sister in law has seen the level of work previous, and received anything similar to what is on the OP's facebook page, then really she has nothing to complain about. These images, in my opinion, are adverage (on adverage)... but nothing that I would call 'out of this world stunning'.. sorry Kellyanne, not meant to be offensive. But if the OP is attempting to market herself as a professional, offering professional services (even though at the same time saying just starting out), you're already setting a level of standard there and expectation. If the friend's sis in law hasn't seen the previous work, she may have been sorely disappointed, with reason. I do want to stress, I'm not attacking Kellyanne's work, but I think one has to be realistic with what and how they try to market themselves as... what's the expression, walk before you run? I hope that made sense... :)
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Thanks for the comments, just out of curiosity how would u market yourself? As I found people need to see the images I've produced in the past ( yeah I know there not out of this world but gotta start somewhere)
 
sunnyside_up said:
Ok, I'm going to explain what I'm meaining here... and I suppose it has nothing to do with how you would deal with the actual complaint, although I don't agree with telling someone to 'do one' just because they don't like your work.

I too have done a bit of a google and found the OP's facebook page as I was interested in what sort of work she was producing. Now I'm no professional, never have touted myself to be, in fact, I don't even call myself a photographer, but actually a 'picture maker'... (which is beside the point)... BUT, I work in the industry so I do think I can have an educated opinion, and also a personal one. If the friend's sister in law has seen the level of work previous, and received anything similar to what is on the OP's facebook page, then really she has nothing to complain about. These images, in my opinion, are adverage (on adverage)... but nothing that I would call 'out of this world stunning'.. sorry Kellyanne, not meant to be offensive. But if the OP is attempting to market herself as a professional, offering professional services (even though at the same time saying just starting out), you're already setting a level of standard there and expectation. If the friend's sis in law hasn't seen the previous work, she may have been sorely disappointed, with reason. I do want to stress, I'm not attacking Kellyanne's work, but I think one has to be realistic with what and how they try to market themselves as... what's the expression, walk before you run? I hope that made sense... :)
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Hmmm....Kellyanne made it clear in her opening post that she told woman she was learning.. so this should have reduced her expectations.
 
kellyanne1703 said:
Thanks for the comments, just out of curiosity how would u market yourself? As I found people need to see the images I've produced in the past ( yeah I know there not out of this world but gotta start somewhere)
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Kellyanne, I quite liked the second shot which you posted, but if you are going to attempt to make your photography pay, then it is not the marketing which you have to worry about first. If you have a look at the people and portrait section on here, then you will be able to honestly compare your work to others.
I am no expert on this, but your equipment needs to be up to scratch - you will not go very far using kit lenses and pop up flash. Ask people for advice on how to set up a portrait session, what lighting is needed, which lenses to use, how to control the situation.
There are lots of people on here who can give you worthwhile advice.
 
andy700 said:
Kellyanne, I quite liked the second shot which you posted, but if you are going to attempt to make your photography pay, then it is not the marketing which you have to worry about first. If you have a look at the people and portrait section on here, then you will be able to honestly compare your work to others.
I am no expert on this, but your equipment needs to be up to scratch - you will not go very far using kit lenses and pop up flash. Ask people for advice on how to set up a portrait session, what lighting is needed, which lenses to use, how to control the situation.
There are lots of people on here who can give you worthwhile advice.
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Hi thanks

I would say my equipment is up to scratch! I've got a Canon 450d & 650d, two flash guns ( which are oldish but got given them till can afford new ones ) when did the shoots I borrow flash lights and umbrellas from the college (don't know the brand) I'm looking at purchasing my own lights but there's so many different types I think it's going to take me a while.

Yeah I've seen others people's work on here and there's some I go wow on and hope to be able to do the same later on, that's why I've been doing a lot of free sessions to boost my confidence and get the experience.

Thanks
 
Kellyanne, the obvious answer is don't 'market' yourself - and by that I mean in the literal sense, don't promote yourself as an 'experienced professional' photographer, or even give that impression on facebook pages, or similar. Instead, make it very clear what you are, a learner looking for subjects on which to practice your skills with no guarantees of image quality, number of images, etc and no charges. Right now your subjects are guinea pigs and they need to know that - having a facebook page saying that you offer portraits or whatever in any sense is giving the impression you know what you are doing and in the kindest sense, at the moment you don't.

However more importantly, what this thread has shown is that you need to practice!! Use immediate friends and family as subjects, with no promise of them getting any photos, just simply as practice, and if no one is around, grab your self a couple of big teddy bears, just something on which you can practice how to use light, the camera, and your post processing skills [yes, teddy's won't teach you people skills, modelling etc, but you need to learn the technical side at the same time, so they are useful when no human guines pigs are available] ..and ASK questions here, get advice, post images in the sharing section for people to advise and give feedback on, that is where you will learn to improve.

I guess this has been a tough lesson for you, but if this is what you really want to do, you will both learn from it, take a step back and assess where you are, and move on with your learning curve. You can 'market' yourself if you wish, we cannot stop you, but you will find the lessons get tougher going down that route.


Good luck - and [dons moderator hat] just another reminder to everyone else to keep this thread polite and offering advice. :)
 
Yv said:
Kellyanne, the obvious answer is don't 'market' yourself - and by that I mean in the literal sense, don't promote yourself as an 'experienced professional' photographer, or even give that impression on facebook pages, or similar. Instead, make it very clear what you are, a learner looking for subjects on which to practice your skills with no guarantees of image quality, number of images, etc and no charges. Right now your subjects are guinea pigs and they need to know that - having a facebook page saying that you offer portraits or whatever in any sense is giving the impression you know what you are doing and in the kindest sense, at the moment you don't.

However more importantly, what this thread has shown is that you need to practice!! Use immediate friends and family as subjects, with no promise of them getting any photos, just simply as practice, and if no one is around, grab your self a couple of big teddy bears, just something on which you can practice how to use light, the camera, and your post processing skills [yes, teddy's won't teach you people skills, modelling etc, but you need to learn the technical side at the same time, so they are useful when no human guines pigs are available] ..and ASK questions here, get advice, post images in the sharing section for people to advise and give feedback on, that is where you will learn to improve.

I guess this has been a tough lesson for you, but if this is what you really want to do, you will both learn from it, take a step back and assess where you are, and move on with your learning curve. You can 'market' yourself if you wish, we cannot stop you, but you will find the lessons get tougher going down that route.


Good luck - and [dons moderator hat] just another reminder to everyone else to keep this thread polite and offering advice. :)
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That is the most level-headed, objective and considered advice that the OP could wish to receive. I only hope that the OP follows it to help on her road to success
 
Kelly Ann the last two quotes you put up are jokes taking the pee
As they say give herthe money back write it down on a letter
Saying you are very sorry at the quality of you work and that you have to decided to give her a full refund and then write a big £ sign with a big 0
Refund granted
 
Yv said:
...grab your self a couple of big teddy bears, just something on which you can practice how to use light, the camera, and your post processing skills ...
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I've been trying to figure out what I can use as a 'static' subject to practice on, now I know what to use :thumbs:
 
Faldrax said:
I've been trying to figure out what I can use as a 'static' subject to practice on, now I know what to use :thumbs:
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Or even Dave between farts :)
 
Cagey75 said:
Pull what about? Your degrading of me for no reason? If it's nowt to do with you, then quit the personals against me for no reason, cheers.



For example, completely uncalled for ^^

Donnie, all we can do is suggest/advise on what's on offer here. I don't see her facebook mentioned or advertised here, or am I missing something?
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May i suggest you and Phil take this conversation offline? These type of posts do nothing but harm for TP.....
 
Rapscallion said:
May i suggest you and Phil take this conversation offline? These type of posts do nothing but harm for TP.....
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Nooo.... I've just ordered a jumbo bag of popcorn
 
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