Unhappy Customers

Mystery57 said:
One question - the woman was putting you under pressure to deliver the results BUT Mothers Day is still a couple of weeks away ?
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Mother's Day is the 10th March so just over a week away x
 
Mystery57 said:
hmmm ten days away plus the deadline you were previously given to get the stuff to her --- are you sure she didnt want you to pay for access to her children for posing :)
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I am surprised that the woman hasn't asked to see Kellyanne's CRB acreditation;)
Are the free jobs often the ones where people are the least grateful?:(
 
If we put all the outrage at the 'clients' behaviour to one side for a moment - kelly is did this free because (presumably from other threads) she wants to do it paid one day.

therefore if she wants to work a lot with kids she has to learn to get the best out of them, and while I don't do that kind of work, i seriously doubt that getting the mum to order them to sit down and behave is the way to go - that will result in very static "do I have to" old school portraits type photos.

as Psi said earlier, the farting monkey type approach is one way to go - the other is to get them doing something they enjoy and then to take action shots rather than portraits per se.

On the other point its possible that the reason the customer is treating this like she would a paid job, is because thats how kelly has treated them - vis reffering to them as customers or clients. If you put people in a proffesional situation thats how they'll perceive it regardless of whether money is changing hands.

Its also telling that the freind is happy (freinds are nearly always happy - which is why they arent a very good barometter of quality of your work) but her sister in law who is presumably more like a stranger (and thuis less obligated to be favourable) is not.
 
Teflon-Mike said:
Actually... reminds me of my Dad....
He's a Doctor, & lives in Canada. Finds a conference in the UK in December, so he can get a Drug company to pay for his flights.... first class... back to blighty...... then tries to suggest that he has come ALL this way JUST to see me, and why do I have to do anything so inconvenient as, ooooh..... go to work...... while he's here...... and Christmas day? What presents do we get? Yup. The free samplers and curtecy gifts from the drug company paid for flights and hotel!
He gave me a Parker Pen when I was about eleven.... "Why does it say "Fluflenflixol" on it Dad?!"..... "Oh! Its a limited edition"
Talk about cheap-skate! Actually I could.... all day!
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I once got a box of golf balls for my birthday from my Dad... they all had his company's logo on them. Turned out someone ordered too many for their company golf day.
 
andy700 said:
I am surprised that the woman hasn't asked to see Kellyanne's CRB acreditation;)
Are the free jobs often the ones where people are the least grateful?:(
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Luckily I'm qualified in looking after children and have a CRB :) but those children were a nightmare hehe

I've done a few free jobs and people have been very grateful, some have even given me a bit of money to say thank you

There are just a few that are so ungrateful but want a PRO!
 
On the other point its possible that the reason the customer is treating this like she would a paid job, is because thats how kelly has treated them - vis reffering to them as customers or clients. If you put people in a proffesional situation thats how they'll perceive it regardless of whether money is changing hands.

What would u refer them to as?
 
big soft moose said:
If we put all the outrage at the 'clients' behaviour to one side for a moment - kelly is did this free because (presumably from other threads) she wants to do it paid one day.

therefore if she wants to work a lot with kids she has to learn to get the best out of them, and while I don't do that kind of work, i seriously doubt that getting the mum to order them to sit down and behave is the way to go - that will result in very static "do I have to" old school portraits type photos.

as Psi said earlier, the farting monkey type approach is one way to go - the other is to get them doing something they enjoy and then to take action shots rather than portraits per se.

On the other point its possible that the reason the customer is treating this like she would a paid job, is because thats how kelly has treated them - vis reffering to them as customers or clients. If you put people in a proffesional situation thats how they'll perceive it regardless of whether money is changing hands.

Its also telling that the freind is happy (freinds are nearly always happy - which is why they arent a very good barometter of quality of your work) but her sister in law who is presumably more like a stranger (and thuis less obligated to be favourable) is not.
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Agree. I could never have shot kids before having mine. I would say that while u need to know what you are doing camera wise, it's arguably more important to be able to get kids on your side and to get then to do what u want.
 
kellyanne1703 said:
On the other point its possible that the reason the customer is treating this like she would a paid job, is because thats how kelly has treated them - vis reffering to them as customers or clients. If you put people in a proffesional situation thats how they'll perceive it regardless of whether money is changing hands.

What would u refer them to as?
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freinds ?

if you are just someone with no real experience doing a favour for a mate, then thats very different to someone who is essentially a pro doing it free to build a portfolio - and thus their expectations will also differ
 
Teflon-Mike said:
Actually... reminds me of my Dad....
He's a Doctor, & lives in Canada. Finds a conference in the UK in December, so he can get a Drug company to pay for his flights.... first class... back to blighty...... then tries to suggest that he has come ALL this way JUST to see me, and why do I have to do anything so inconvenient as, ooooh..... go to work...... while he's here...... and Christmas day? What presents do we get? Yup. The free samplers and curtecy gifts from the drug company paid for flights and hotel!
He gave me a Parker Pen when I was about eleven.... "Why does it say "Fluflenflixol" on it Dad?!"..... "Oh! Its a limited edition"
Talk about cheap-skate! Actually I could.... all day!
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You may want to post in talkpsychiatry.co.uk as your father issues would get them going :)
 
kellyanne1703 said:
... but I can't seem to be able to load on the page with out a link
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Without a link? what does that mean?
:eek: When someone posts one of these "how do upload?", and at the same time takes photographs for clients that's a huge red flag.
You should get to grips with this in five minutes, using one of a whole host of ways to upload reasonably sized photos (both in terms of pixels and filesize) to the forum.
Surely taking, storing, editing and backing up your photos would give you enough skills to at least attempt an image here.

Or simply do it wrong but provide a link to something, and let another poster correct and embed the link.
 
Ulfric M Douglas said:
Without a link? what does that mean?
:eek: When someone posts one of these "how do upload?", and at the same time takes photographs for clients that's a huge red flag.
You should get to grips with this in five minutes, using one of a whole host of ways to upload reasonably sized photos (both in terms of pixels and filesize) to the forum.
Surely taking, storing, editing and backing up your photos would give you enough skills to at least attempt an image here.

Or simply do it wrong but provide a link to something, and let another poster correct and embed the link.
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I've tried copying and pasting, dragging, I can get the link but not the actual pic on the forum, plus using this forum on my phone is a completely different layout to what's on the computer!
 
Ulfric M Douglas said:
:eek: When someone posts one of these "how do upload?", and at the same time takes photographs for clients that's a huge red flag.
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A huge red flag? What are you, some sort of self appointed photographers regulator? :)
 
kellyanne1703 said:
I've tried copying and pasting, dragging, I can get the link but not the actual pic on the forum, plus using this forum on my phone is a completely different layout to what's on the computer!
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put the link , which should end with the file extension ie .jpg , inside
but without spaces
 
Phil V said:
This.

Tell her you're sorry she's not happy and that you did your best under the circumstances.
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Phil's right. Best to smooth the waters but also make it clear the circumstances under which the pictures were made.

When taking pictures of children, unless you know them or indeed perhaps because you do (!! ) it's a good idea to take some props like a bottle of blowing bubbles to distract them from the matter at hand.
 
Houston1863 said:
Phil's right. Best to smooth the waters but also make it clear the circumstances under which the pictures were made.

When taking pictures of children, unless you know them or indeed perhaps because you do (!! ) it's a good idea to take some props like a bottle of blowing bubbles to distract them from the matter at hand.
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It's been settled that I'm to redo the shoot to make them happy :) and to cause no rifts,

The pictures of the 2 children that I knew came out ok, the other 3 children that I didn't know or seen before came out a bit forced smiling or crying/grumpy. We used bubbles, sweets and a bag of wotsits!
 
try adding some Red Bull to the list of hyper activity enducing foods next time to really get them going...
 
I found during shoots involving kids, the ones acting up calmed down once their parents left the scene. Might be worth a try.
 
Cagey75 said:
I found during shoots involving kids, the ones acting up calmed down once their parents left the scene. Might be worth a try.
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Yh going to do each child separately and with no parents!
 
kellyanne1703 said:
I've tried copying and pasting, dragging, I can get the link but not the actual pic on the forum, plus using this forum on my phone is a completely different layout to what's on the computer!
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Kellyanne, you just need to upload a couple of the shots to your gallery on here after resizing them to within the limits. Then just paste the link to them in this thread.
 
Barrysprout said:
Kellyanne, you just need to upload a couple of the shots to your gallery on here after resizing them to within the limits. Then just paste the link to them in this thread.
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Thanks will have a go when I get to the computer x
 
GatoAzul1968 said:
:thumbs: This too. + uck ;)
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There's a lot of terrible advice floats about on this forum at times, and that, right there, is some of the worst I've seen in a while. Telling them to F off would get you a bad name fairly quickly. You'd certainly never get any work out of them again, nor anyone they know, and word travels fast with the likes of Facebook and other social media. Your name would be mud in a flash. And nobody will hear your side, you'll just be that "wannabe photographer who tells people to F off when they're not happy with results"

Just because someone is being awkward or rude with you, doesn't mean you have to be in return. It costs nothing to be nice, bite your tongue, and work around awkward situations.
 
Cagey75 said:
There's a lot of terrible advice floats about on this forum at times, and that, right there, is some of the worst I've seen in a while. Telling them to F off would get you a bad name fairly quickly. You'd certainly never get any work out of them again, nor anyone they know, and word travels fast with the likes of Facebook and other social media. Your name would be mud in a flash. And nobody will hear your side, you'll just be that "wannabe photographer who tells people to F off when they're not happy with results"

Just because someone is being awkward or rude with you, doesn't mean you have to be in return. It costs nothing to be nice, bite your tongue, and work around awkward situations.
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I don't think anyone is seriously suggesting the op does this literally. It's tell her to f*** off, but in a polite way.
 
Could have fooled me, reading back over the thread .

It's kind of hard tell someone to F off politely too ;)

You either suck it up, act professional about it, or don't bother to offer the service, free or not, to begin with. You have to be prepared for all sorts when it comes to family/child shoots. Anyone who ever says it's easy has rarely done it, or has been blessed with angelic kids to pose for them.
 
Cagey75 said:
There's a lot of terrible advice floats about on this forum at times, and that, right there, is some of the worst I've seen in a while. Telling them to F off would get you a bad name fairly quickly. You'd certainly never get any work out of them again, nor anyone they know, and word travels fast with the likes of Facebook and other social media. Your name would be mud in a flash. And nobody will hear your side, you'll just be that "wannabe photographer who tells people to F off when they're not happy with results"

Just because someone is being awkward or rude with you, doesn't mean you have to be in return. It costs nothing to be nice, bite your tongue, and work around awkward situations.
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I'd never tell them to F off! I'm being nice and redoing the shoot to keep them happy.
Like u said it don't take long to trash name x
 
Cagey75 said:
It's kind of hard tell someone to F off politely too ;)

.
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Dear Client

Thank you for your email

i'm very sorry to hear that you are disatisfied, but unfortunately our policy in these circumstances is that you can **** right off

my apologies for any inconvenience this causes you, and please keep us in mind for all your family portrait needs in the future

many thanks for taking the time to bring this matter to our attention

yours sincerely









(and no, for those without a sense of humour, i'm not serious)
 
Cagey75 said:
There's a lot of terrible advice floats about on this forum at times, and that, right there, is some of the worst I've seen in a while. Telling them to F off would get you a bad name fairly quickly. You'd certainly never get any work out of them again, nor anyone they know, and word travels fast with the likes of Facebook and other social media. Your name would be mud in a flash. And nobody will hear your side, you'll just be that "wannabe photographer who tells people to F off when they're not happy with results"

Just because someone is being awkward or rude with you, doesn't mean you have to be in return. It costs nothing to be nice, bite your tongue, and work around awkward situations.
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C'mon Captain Literal... no one is seriously suggesting she actually says F off... thought that was pretty obvious.
 
Since one of the objects of the exercise is to get your name out there, why not stick a hard to remove/crop out watermark on every picture?
 
Steve said:
C'mon Captain Literal... no one is seriously suggesting she actually says F off... thought that was pretty obvious.
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I think they were actually, and it's General Literal please.

Most people were telling them to get lost (whether literally telling them to F off or not) and the outcome is the same - badly dealt with over demanding customer who may cause you many issues.
 
ernesto said:
I think they were actually, and it's General Literal please.

Most people were telling them to get lost (whether literally telling them to F off or not) and the outcome is the same - badly dealt with over demanding customer who may cause you many issues.
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Cagey75 said:
Could have fooled me, reading back over the thread .

It's kind of hard tell someone to F off politely too ;)

You either suck it up, act professional about it, or don't bother to offer the service, free or not, to begin with. You have to be prepared for all sorts when it comes to family/child shoots. Anyone who ever says it's easy has rarely done it, or has been blessed with angelic kids to pose for them.
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Is this a wind up or have we been invaded from the schoolyard:shrug:?

It's easy to tell someone to F off politely and have them thank you for your time, It's simply a matter of a careful choice of words. Being polite, friendly empathetic and completely professional.

Anyone who can't manage the above ought to think about whether they should be in any customer facing job at all:).

Start with phrases like 'I completely understand why you feel that the photographs I provided didn't meet your expectations'. Try a smattering of 'I'm really sorry that I'm not able to meet your stringent requirements at this time'.

But it's irrelevant as the OP has committed to a 2nd attempt. Good luck to her (although I fear she'll need it).
 
Phil V said:
Is this a wind up or have we been invaded from the schoolyard:shrug:?

It's easy to tell someone to F off politely and have them thank you for your time, It's simply a matter of a careful choice of words. Being polite, friendly empathetic and completely professional.

Anyone who can't manage the above ought to think about whether they should be in any customer facing job at all:).

Start with phrases like 'I completely understand why you feel that the photographs I provided didn't meet your expectations'. Try a smattering of 'I'm really sorry that I'm not able to meet your stringent requirements at this time'.

But it's irrelevant as the OP has committed to a 2nd attempt. Good luck to her (although I fear she'll need it).
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Anyone who thinks it's ok to [even politely] tell someone to F off because they didn't like a job they did shouldn't be dealing with clients IMHO.

Re-wording it 'politely' is a far cry from "F off!" - plain simple. What you're suggesting is tell them you won't entertain a re-shoot, not the same thing at all. Nobody said that wasn't an option. So why are you quoting me as if it were bad advice not to tell them to F off?

What's with the schoolyard reference? That's just a stirring remark I think. :thinking: I would say advising someone to do so, even "politely" is awful advice. Luckily the OP agrees. Firing ahead and taking the advice to "politely tell them to F off" even, could damage her rep in future, and I'm glad she's not taking up on that for her sake.
 
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