Turbocharger dead on a car.......

[Lynton]

OK have a fiat 1.3 multijet diesel......... not been used much since July last year... (in fact hardly at all)

took it to garage for MOT and service........ passed MOT but apparantly the turbo is dead... goes into limp home mode over 2300 revs...

Mechanic says its jammed.....

If not used, how could it "jam up?"

Can it be unjammed.... or is it a recon Turbo?

 

[andya700]

Bad luck, but it may not be terminal.
Do you go on any of the Fiat forums, because I browse the forums relative to our cars, and they are a mine of information.
For instance, a lot of VAG owners (VW, Skoda, Audi) know of the problems affecting turbos in diesel cars, and post information on how to clean/refurbish them.
Some of the fixes are amazing, involving oven cleaner and dishwasher tablets, leaving a gleaming new turbo - blades cleaned thoroughly.

 

[Lynton]

Andy.. no I haven't.......... at the moment no idea as to what is wrong with it, (other than it doesn't work)..... It's with the mechanic guy.. will have a look for fiat forums..may as well try on the existing one, and if it's dead, then a recon... if i can mend it, so much the better......

 

[srichards]

How does he know know it's jammed? Has he tried to turn the impeller by hand?

I'd be wondering whether the waste gate was stuck open or one of the pipes was loose. That would lead to no boost.

 

[Lynton]

suz.....

limp home mode and diagnostics..... Mick is a mechanic I do trust... has serviced my cars for about the last 15 years or so... will find out this week what is wrong with it....

what i don't get is how can it die from just sitting around....

 

[Davec223]

suz.....

limp home mode and diagnostics..... Mick is a mechanic I do trust... has serviced my cars for about the last 15 years or so... will find out this week what is wrong with it....

what i don't get is how can it die from just sitting around....

No different to any other mechanical item, of its not used then they can sieze.

 

[Lynton]

but how????

 

[neil_g]

but how????

Some turbos are made of chocolate..

 

[Davec223]

but how????

As you say the car has been standing for long periods and had little use the oil can drain from the turbo and the feed pipe, but the turbo will spin up as soon as the engine starts with no lubrication and the speed turbos soon at, the damage is done in a matter of seconds.

 

[paulc]

A lot of Turbos use journal bearings that rely on oil pressure to take up the play and lubricate the shaft and I suppose that if it was left standing for ages and then started up and immediately revved like mad it could possibly seize.
I just replaced the turbo cartridge on my Kangoo van that was worn out and leaking oil at less than 50,000 miles and the reason I have since discovered is that the last owner used the van as a mobile steam washer van and although it had low miles it was left ticking over for long periods and no doubt often not giving the turbo shaft and bearings a decent supply of oil at good pressure, hence a knackered turbo.
So check out CHRA replacement cartridges on ebay, saved me about £300 and was easy to fit.

 

[srichards]

suz.....

limp home mode and diagnostics..... Mick is a mechanic I do trust... has serviced my cars for about the last 15 years or so... will find out this week what is wrong with it....

what i don't get is how can it die from just sitting around....

If the last use was using lots of turbo and the car was switched off with a red hot turbo then it would have stuck it then. Turbos can get very hot.

If this car isn't going to be used much then I'd probably change it for a petrol non turbo or at least make sure it has a gentle run every month or two minimum.

 

[ozyboyross]

I've been told by mechanics I have a knackered turbo before... The last time it happened the turbo was a month old so needless to say I didn't replace it again!

I'm not saying your mechanic is that way inclined but in my experience alot of local garages can't be arsed to look properly so suggest the most expensive part needs replacing... Then when it's still playing up the bill goes up and up and up while they try replacing various different parts until the problem is solved which usually results in a far larger bill than was needed!

Again to clarify I'm not saying your mechanic is like that as I have no experience of using him! But I have experienced this at several garages!

 

[Forbiddenbiker]

so does it actually lose boost over those revs, I mean like does it suddenly let go (with a gentle jolt)and then go slow in limp mode? ...cos its spinning before hand if that's the case right? ...so it sounds like a regulator or some such mechanical/electronic interaction thingy is letting go and switching the boost off...

just a thought.

 

[ZoneV]

but how????

By not being run often. Same with anything mechanical.

 

[Lynton]

A lot of Turbos use journal bearings that rely on oil pressure to take up the play and lubricate the shaft and I suppose that if it was left standing for ages and then started up and immediately revved like mad it could possibly seize.

That kind of makes sense but was not revved up hard when started....

By not being run often. Same with anything mechanical.

Really? Thanks.

 

[paulc]

That kind of makes sense but was not revved up hard when started....



Really? Thanks.

I dont think that they have to be absolutely revved hard (perhaps I over egged the custard a bit saying that) because after a certain amount of revs there is a bit fixed onto the turbo called a wastegate that diverts the emitted exhaust gasses away from the turbo so over revving may not be possible but I would imagine that just starting the engine and driving normally would spin the turbo at a good lick.

also it is always a good idea just to tick the car over for a while if it has been off the road so it warms up and the oil loses its viscosity and goes runny then it would prime the turbo better before driving.
Hope you get it sorted out.

 

[BarryDawsib]

No different to any other mechanical item, of its not used then they can sieze.

but how????

Turbos although simple have quite a lot going on, the ones on the Saab (petrol) have oil and water feeds to keep them cool and lubricated, if the oil has degraded that could jam them up, wear down the bearings and going on to wreck other things with looseness.
Similar with the water and some people not using antifreeze.

Best and only way to really get a good look is to take the turbo off, check the oil and water feeds for sludge, rust and debris and probe the turbines inside, if they have any other lateral play than to spin, its new turbo time.

Or refurb which last time I got a quote a new turbo was cheaper.

Alternatively, it could be a vacuum leak or the regulator/blow off/pressure relief valves/wastegate/system mentioned by others.

Sorry to be vague, worked on a lot and systems are all different!
Some are just plain old mechanical, some are electronically controlled, some are hybrid electronic/mechanical/vacuum actuated.

PS, I am a home mechanic with a lot of gear and personal experience can only relay what I have experienced.

 

[Lynton]

Turbos although simple have quite a lot going on, the ones on the Saab (petrol) have oil and water feeds to keep them cool and lubricated, if the oil has degraded that could jam them up, wear down the bearings and going on to wreck other things with looseness.
Similar with the water and some people not using antifreeze.

Best and only way to really get a good look is to take the turbo off, check the oil and water feeds for sludge, rust and debris and probe the turbines inside, if they have any other lateral play than to spin, its new turbo time.

Or refurb which last time I got a quote a new turbo was cheaper.

Alternatively, it could be a vacuum leak or the regulator/blow off/pressure relief valves/wastegate/system mentioned by others.

Sorry to be vague, worked on a lot and systems are all different!
Some are just plain old mechanical, some are electronically controlled, some are hybrid electronic/mechanical/vacuum actuated.

PS, I am a home mechanic with a lot of gear and personal experience can only relay what I have experienced.

Vague is fine and thanks for taking the time to answer.

I have no idea of what happened etc... I didn't drive it to the garage... Turbo normally kicks in about 1800 revs though I assume it starts spinning a bit before that!

Will find out more tomorrow...