TTIP trade agreement with US

LCPete

LCPete

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Transatlantic trade and investment partnership, should we be worried about this?
It looks to me to be handing over UK sovereign power to US corporations
I don't know much about this but its being kept out of the news does anyone know much about it?
 
Yes I think it is wrong. IMHO there should be a referendum for this. And it would really help if bloody ukip and co stopped detracting the issues onto blaming the eu for everything bad that ever happened to everyone. REMOVED PLEASE STOP BEATING THE SWEAR FILTER!
 
People only like UKIP for their headline policy of immigration. If they looked closer they would realise they are Ryan Air I.e. if you want to use it you must pay rather then the cost covered by government.

The people behind TTIP should be shot for treason. As always the devill is in the detail. Our government will be opening itself up to being prosecuted for impinging on free trade. This could be as we ban cigarette advertising or because we subsidise the NHS. Even tough I am blue this lot will sell anything for a quick back hander
 
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To enter into any agreement that would allow foreign corporations to sue our government when it takes actions that they perceive to affect their profits would be utter madness.
And I agree, the media aren't saying much about it are they? Surprising that...
 
ST4 said:
The detail on this is very skcetchy for sure. I doubt supporting the NHS would stop free trade but I was not for banning tobacco advertising anyway.
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tobacco is one of the worst things discovered by man. Smoking is awful filthy and harmful habit. The worst thing is that it affects all of us, not just the drug user himself.
 
bindex said:
And I agree, the media aren't saying much about it are they? Surprising that...
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Because that needs to happen, and they want to keep up the anti-EU momentum going before the election.
 
ST4 said:
Yeah, lots of revenue in tax :) smokers should be given a medal for the fiscal contribution they make
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and the NHS expenditure associated with it. I don't wan't lung cancer than you very much because irresponsible idiots have to smoke near me.
 
daugirdas said:
Yes I think it is wrong. IMHO there should be a referendum for this. And it would really help if bloody ukip and co stopped detracting the issues onto blaming the eu for everything bad that ever happened to everyone. Bastards
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Your are not keeping up very well on this, are you? TTIP is an agreement between the EU and the US. There is no chance of any referendum on this. If you don't like it you'll have to leave the EU.
 
How the TTIP could affect the NHS:
U.S. medical health company wants to setup in the UK.
It can not compete with subsidised free NHS.
It sues.
Other British companies have already had to pay 'fines' for being subsidised by government.
We should be more French and just stick our fingers up
 
chadders said:
Your are not keeping up very well on this, are you? TTIP is an agreement between the EU and the US. There is no chance of any referendum on this. If you don't like it you'll have to leave the EU.
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That I didn't know, another reason to consider a UKIP vote?

Its in the link posted to read

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...-why-the-answer-should-scare-you-9779688.html

An EU US agreement, something Europe has dragged us into that we don't have control over. The EU was set out to be a simple free trade agreement between a few central euopean and uk countries, thats all. Time to get away
 
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If you're worried about TTIP then remember on 1st November QMV comes into force. That will remove the right of our own parliament(s) to legislate for us in 43 separate areas. Something else the MSM aren't rushing to remind us about.
 
ST4 said:
That I didn't know, another reason to consider a UKIP vote?

Its in the link posted to read

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices...-why-the-answer-should-scare-you-9779688.html

An EU US agreement, something Europe has dragged us into that we don't have control over. The EU was set out to be a simple free trade agreement between a few central euopean and uk countries, thats all. Time to get away
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Hold on, didn't you just want a US-style wild capitalism system? This is exactly what TTIP aims for.

And why don't UK MEPs do anything about this? Probably because UK is the most interested to go in bed with the US.
 
daugirdas said:
Hold on, didn't you just want a US-style wild capitalism system? This is exactly what TTIP aims for.

And why don't UK MEPs do anything about this? Probably because UK is the most interested to go in bed with the US.
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Hey, all I am saying if you are against this, and you are set on remaining in Britain for a good few years, a UKIP vote might not be a bad thing.

I am for a US capitalist, low tax state, but I don't want our government being sued by foreign companies for looking after the needs of people in Britain.
 
ST4 said:
Hey, all I am saying if you are against this, and you are set on remaining in Britain for a good few years, a UKIP vote might not be a bad thing.
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Sorry I just can't see how UKIP government could be in my interests. Labour is the only sensible choice despite their awful benefit policies and a rather uninspiring political leader.
 
daugirdas said:
Sorry I just can't see how UKIP government could be in my interests. Labour is the only sensible choice despite their awful benefit policies and a rather uninspiring political leader.
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If you are against TTIP you need out of Europe. Who can deliver that. Labour aren't sensible, they just spend what is not there to spend. Given you are employed, how will labours massive welfare spending suit you?
 
ST4 said:
If you are against TTIP you need out of Europe. Who can deliver that. Labour aren't sensible, they just spend what is not there to spend. Given you are employed, how will labours massive welfare spending suit you?
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1. I am not against TTIP, just certain details of it. The overall idea is good; I mean free trade is good. That will for example mean lots more european cars in the US, which can only be a good thing for the EU.

2. Labour will hopefully resume the spending on education and research. That is all I need. I am not in 40% tax band so it won't affect me even if it rises. They are also good for SMEs, while torries favour large multinationals.
 
daugirdas said:
Sorry I just can't see how UKIP government could be in my interests. Labour is the only sensible choice despite their awful benefit policies and a rather uninspiring political leader.
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Let me see if I can help you.

You've made it clear elsewhere you are very much pro the EU.
The EU have negotiated a trade deal with the US (TTIP).
You don't like the idea and aims of TTIP.
You want a referendum on this, which is a non starter, and in any case the UK is bound to this deal by it's membership of the EU.
Conservatives have "promised" (whatever that promise is worth) some sort of referendum on UK membership of the EU in 2017 (after QMV is fully implemented) but only IF they are re-elected in 2015.
Labour have stated there will be NO referendum on UK membership of the EU. Ergo Labour are fully in favour of TTIP.
UKIP are the only party whose policy is withdrawal from the EU.

Therefore if you don't like TTIP, vote UKIP for the chance to leave the EU (and TTIP).

Life is full of choices. In your case, as you are so wedded to the idea and principles of the EU, you will bite the TTIP bullet and swallow it, including all the bits you don't like.
 
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chadders said:
Let me see if I can help you.

You've made it clear elsewhere you are very much pro the EU.
The EU have negotiated a trade deal with the US (TTIP).
You don't like the idea and aims of TTIP.
You want a referendum on this, which is a non starter, and in any case the UK is bound to this deal by it's membership of the EU.
Conservatives have "promised" (whatever that promise is worth) some sort of referendum on UK membership of the EU in 2017 (after QMV is fully implemented) but only IF they are re-elected in 2015.
Labour have stated there will be NO referendum on UK membership of the EU. Ergo Labour are fully in favour of TTIP.
UKIP are the only party whose policy is withdrawal from the EU.

Therefore if you don't like TTIP, vote UKIP for the chance to leave the EU (and TTIP).

Life is full of choices. In your case, as you are so wedded to the idea and principles of the EU, you will bite the TTIP bullet and swallow it, including all the bits you don't like.
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Indeed I will swallow it. I could afford health insurance if needed it (and that would hopefully mean lower NI bill on the other hand), and then sod the rest. However voting against EU will be cutting the branch I am sitting on, or crazy and suicidal.

P.S. If it is a treaty change, which I imagine it would be, then don't all the countries need to ratify that in parliament or via a public referendum? However it will be this particular government that will let it slide quietly. It will be too late after next election to change TTIP.
 
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daugirdas said:
Class B drug confession?!
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Perfectly legal to smoke shisha.
Take a walk up the Edgeware Road on any given day and you'll see a lot of gentlemen of Middle Eastern origins enjoying it :-)
 
viv1969 said:
Perfectly legal to smoke shisha.
Take a walk up the Edgeware Road on any given day and you'll see a lot of gentlemen of Middle Eastern origins enjoying it :)
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I suppose it is what they put in it. Weed is not unheard I believe.
 
daugirdas said:
Indeed I will swallow it. I could afford health insurance if needed it (and that would hopefully mean lower NI bill on the other hand), and then sod the rest. However voting against EU will be cutting the branch I am sitting on, or crazy and suicidal.

P.S. If it is a treaty change, which I imagine it would be, then don't all the countries need to ratify that in parliament or via a public referendum? However it will be this particular government that will let it slide quietly. It will be too late after next election to change TTIP.
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I am becoming concerned that you do not really understand the issues, surrounding membership (or otherwise) of the EU. Your comment re "treaty change" seems to indicate that.

P.S. See my post re QMV. UK government has little say on this matter. TTIP is a matter for the EU not the UK, and the EU have done the deal.
 
Peter69 said:
How the TTIP could affect the NHS:
U.S. medical health company wants to setup in the UK.
It can not compete with subsidised free NHS.
It sues.
Other British companies have already had to pay 'fines' for being subsidised by government.
We should be more French and just stick our fingers up
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Whilst I agree with the general thrust of your post, it's worth noting that the NHS is not subsidised. It is wholly funded by UK taxpayers. You are correct in saying that TTIP may pose a threat to the NHS as we know it. The European Commission have said that public services would not fall under TTIP, but, as with so many other things in life, time will tell.
 
viv1969 said:
Perfectly legal to smoke shisha.
Take a walk up the Edgeware Road on any given day and you'll see a lot of gentlemen of Middle Eastern origins enjoying it :)
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Give me the Damrak over the Edgeware Road anytime. :coffee:
 
Thanks everyone I know a bit more about it now:)
I was suspicious as its a major issue yet hasn't been in the news
although there was a short piece in the BBC news last night, apparently US companies operating in Europe won't have to comply with EU environmental legislation only US law
surely that is wrong as the standards are lower in the USA
I'm surprised that Ukip are not saying anything about this as it's a big change to UK sovereignty
 
UKIP can get us out if Europe and this deal so we can impose our own regulations on us companies.

The Americans were only too quick to go after British Petroleum when the was a wee bit of oil in their sea ;) vicious lawsuit
 
Do you not think that uk is the main interested party of this agreement despite a few "little quirks"?

LCPete said:
Thanks everyone I know a bit more about it now:)
I was suspicious as its a major issue yet hasn't been in the news
although there was a short piece in the BBC news last night, apparently US companies operating in Europe won't have to comply with EU environmental legislation only US law
surely that is wrong as the standards are lower in the USA
I'm surprised that Ukip are not saying anything about this as it's a big change to UK sovereignty
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ST4 said:
UKIP can get us out if Europe and this deal so we can impose our own regulations on us companies.

The Americans were only too quick to go after British Petroleum when the was a wee bit of oil in their sea ;) vicious lawsuit
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daugirdas said:
Do you not think that uk is the main interested party of this agreement despite a few "little quirks"?
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Would you care to expand on that? Because it sounds meaningless to me.
 
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daugirdas said:
Do you not think that uk is the main interested party of this agreement despite a few "little quirks"?
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Sorry mate not sure what you mean
I am in favour of staying in the EU though
I know it's not perfect but it's still a good thing for us in the UK
 
chadders said:
Would you care to expand on that? Because it sounds meaningless to me.
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I can only presume that not all of the EU countries are equally interested in signing the TTIP. Due to very close ties with the US, it is only natural to presume that UK would be amongst those leading these talks. Apart from Germany, what other country would benefit as much from free trade? I could be wrong though.
 
daugirdas said:
I can only presume that not all of the EU countries are equally interested in signing the TTIP. Due to very close ties with the US, it is only natural to presume that UK would be amongst those leading these talks. Apart from Germany, what other country would benefit as much from free trade? I could be wrong though.
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Yes you are wrong.

In the final analysis it does not really matter what individual sovereign states like or don't like about TTIP. It's the EU, via the European Commission (not Britain), that have negotiated the deal. The only real input Britain has is the same as all the other member states. It's not, and never was, about what is good for Britain. It's about what the EU thinks is good for the EU.
 
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