Trident may cost £167bn - is it worth it?

Jim_Tod said:
Evil - yes

Necessary - no

Have America, France and the UK been attacked in the past 15 years? yes

Has the nuclear deterrent done them any good in halting that?

Did we launch torpedoes at the Belgrano because our ultimate deterrent was a success?

As ive said before we need a certifiable lunatic to launch our deterrent and it aint going to happen- spend the money more wisely and give up the seat on the security council
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The Nuclear Deterrent is to deter a nuclear attack. India and Pakistan have had multiple skirmishes and haven't annihilated each other. Culturally the Japanese found no honour in surrender, yet soon did faced with assured destruction.

Who attacked America, France and the UK?

Thatcher torpedoed the Belgrano in international waters, some call it a war crime, I call it having balls and also irrelevant to a discussion on the purpose of a nuclear deterrent once you understand the justification of such a weapons system.

No one, lunatic or otherwise is going to launch a deterrent, clue is in the name.

The principal responsibility of any legitimate government is the safety and security of its people, you along with countless others might be willing to surrender that and the seat on the UN, however many, many more believe otherwise.
 
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I can look words up too. It still doesn't answer the question really does it...
 
AndyB1976 said:
No one, lunatic or otherwise is going to launch a deterrent, clue is in the name.
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If it would never be used, it's not a deterrent. It's a white elephant.

AndyB1976 said:
1.
a thing that discourages ... someone from doing something.
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And how exactly does Trident manage that if everyone knows "no-one..is going to launch [it]"?
 
OldCarlos said:
Where politicians are involved, there's a lot of fiction in truth. ;)
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In this case, the fiction being that Nuclear Weapons have any relevance to the UK's defence strategy.
 
bindex said:
According to an MP's and Reuters calculations based on official figures Trident could cost far more than expected, link HERE.

I'll make no comment other than to ask in the present age of austerity could the money be better spent?
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It's not worth it.

What's the point of making a bomb but don't use it. Like the bad guys said in the Hollywood movies (I don't remember which ones, but I think Speed comes to mind), a bomb is designed to be blown up. What's the point of building a bomb like Trident, only to do nothing but carry it around in a submarine, then some years later, it had to be thrown away for a new one?

Seriously, do any of you actually buy a new lens for your camera, put it in your camera bag, carry it around, but never once actually used it at all?
 
ST4 said:
How did Ukraine get on without nuclear weapons?
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The same as they would have done with nukes. Russia hasn't actually invaded Ukraine in the traditional sense.
See the skit about 'salami slicing' above - it's exactly what Putin is doing, and as predicted by Yes Prime Minister, it's immune to the nuclear 'deterrent'.
 
Llamaman said:
Why? What are they going to do, send them by FedEx?
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Don't you know how many countries without a nuclear deterrent live in fear of North Korea?

Oh, wait - there aren't any are there?
 
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border_all said:
Because even odds Scotland will leave the union in the future and if that is the cost of keeping Trident as a renewal i would sooner it be this side of the border and it would stop any potential blackmail if they went independant simples:D
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If Scotland leaves the union it will be moved, but its doing no harm where it is just now.
 
ST4 said:
If Scotland leaves the union it will be moved, but its doing no harm where it is just now.
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Apart from a vast amount of Scottish people don't want them.
Like others have said if we are to have them, move them south and the Scotland can't hold the rest of the UK to ransom.
 
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eeyore said:
Apart from a vast amount of Scottish people don't want them.
Like others have said if we are to have them, move them south and the Scotland can't hold the rest of the UK to ransom.
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You'll find that it's a case of NIMBYism re Scotland and nuclear weapons but the same CND crybabies will cry like babies if Faslane closed and a lot of jobs were then lost.

The referendum was had, the separatists lost and that's that. The nukes can stay put :)

And yes I live near them, I have no issues with them.
 
Llamaman said:
Because a majority of people living there (well, of those that vote) don't want them?
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Do you have proof, Scotland voted to stay in the uk and a big part of the independence campaign was removal of nuclear weapons from Scotland.

Given that the independence campaign was lost I'd put it to you the vast majority of people here really don't care bar a few vociferous left wing CND crybabies
 
border_all said:
Tell you what we could agree to disagree not kwon on spending all that money when they really think they will be safer if its not in their country:beer:
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How will it be safer, if one of those things goes bang it's a much larger area than Scotland that gets nuked.

I suspect the hardened yessers don't like it being in Scotland as it's symbolic of the UK and her prowess.
 
This is all pointless. Nukes are here to stay, nothing will change that. Good thing too. Get over it.
 
ST4 said:
How will it be safer, if one of those things goes bang it's a much larger area than Scotland that gets nuked.
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Spot on

If they were in England and one went bang Scotland would be no more
 
ST4 said:
You'll find that it's a case of NIMBYism re Scotland and nuclear weapons but the same CND crybabies will cry like babies if Faslane closed and a lot of jobs were then lost.

The referendum was had, the separatists lost and that's that. The nukes can stay put :)

And yes I live near them, I have no issues with them.
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Not a huge number of jobs at faslane are trident dependent. Less then a 3rd according to some reports.
That's assuming that only the Trident system goes.
(I did think it was more, seemed it when I was there)
 
6000 000 families tax credits binned at a saving of 4.4 billion and then a price hike in this weapon of 67 billion....Starting to be thankfull I did not vote this lot in...........
 
LASTOLITE said:
6000 000 families tax credits binned at a saving of 4.4 billion and then a price hike in this weapon of 67 billion....Starting to be thankfull I did not vote this lot in...........
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Me too
 
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ST4 said:
Do you have proof, Scotland voted to stay in the uk and a big part of the independence campaign was removal of nuclear weapons from Scotland.

Given that the independence campaign was lost I'd put it to you the vast majority of people here really don't care bar a few vociferous left wing CND crybabies
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But nuclear disarmament is a key SNP policy, and they currently enjoy what is probably the largest majority (*) in a free multi-party democracy anywhere in the world. That's quite a mandate.

(*) within Scotland, obviously.
 
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Did someone mention safety
There were 105 "nuclear safety events" officially recorded at the Faslane and Coulport submarine and bomb bases in 2013-14, compared to 68 in 2012-13. That's by far the highest for at least the last six years.
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http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...in_one_year_at_Scotland_s_nuclear_bomb_bases/

Maybe we should let them stay a bit longer... ;)

Reminds me of question I got asked by our heath a safety guy in barrow "What should you do if you hear the nuclear alarm going off?" to which I replied "Repent my sins" :) He was not a happy chap after that....
 
eeyore said:
Did someone mention safety


http://www.heraldscotland.com/news/...in_one_year_at_Scotland_s_nuclear_bomb_bases/

Maybe we should let them stay a bit longer... ;)

Reminds me of question I got asked by our heath a safety guy in barrow "What should you do if you hear the nuclear alarm going off?" to which I replied "Repent my sins" :) He was not a happy chap after that....
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Yeah definitely if they are unsafe we don't want them in England, you know that place that actually makes money for the union.
 
ST4 said:
If they are so unsafe how come people in the west of Scotland have a normal amount of limbs and digits and aren't burnt to a crisp?
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They are totally safe :) oh and its funny how many jocks in the navy actually want a posting there, because they are so scared of them.

I think the jocks need to stop deep frying everything, as heart disease kills more people in Scotland than nukes do, but where is the outrage about chip shops?
 
Did someone people not see the ;) in the post

I know they are safe, when I worked on them my bed was was about 500m from a reactor core.
 
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