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Top Gear
- Thread starter Rob_W
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Sabine Schmitz and the old geezer have now been kicked off the D-Motor TV programme... Tim Schrick is still there as lead host and I have to say it's a lot better...
Sabine may have been a good driver but she had all the personality of month-old sauerkraut...
Sabine may have been a good driver but she had all the personality of month-old sauerkraut...
Flash In The Pan
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Paul_UK
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Nametwoone well known German with a personality
Thats the way to kill a thread lol.
OK there are a few...one that I like:
Baron Freiherr Manfred von Richtoven used to put women's underwear on his head and run around the hangar flapping his arms and going "NEEEE-eeeeOOOOwwww!" to celebrate his victories over the British and French aviators in WW1...apparently it was a laugh-riot...
Baron Freiherr Manfred von Richtoven used to put women's underwear on his head and run around the hangar flapping his arms and going "NEEEE-eeeeOOOOwwww!" to celebrate his victories over the British and French aviators in WW1...apparently it was a laugh-riot...
true_one_picture
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Fair point our lads just used to come back and have a cup of tea, but saying that if they did that every time they had a victory then they would have been at it for days.
Phil
Hmm...
Highest scoring British ace of WW1? Phillip Fullard with 40 confirmed victories...
Highest scoring British ace of WW2? Johnnie Johnson with 34 confirmed victories...
Highest scoring German ace of WW1? Von Richtofen with 80 confirmed victories...
Highest scoring German ace of WW2? Erich 'Bubi' Hartmann with 352 confirmed victories...
They'd be better off drinking less tea and eating more schnitzel, I'd say...
Highest scoring British ace of WW1? Phillip Fullard with 40 confirmed victories...
Highest scoring British ace of WW2? Johnnie Johnson with 34 confirmed victories...
Highest scoring German ace of WW1? Von Richtofen with 80 confirmed victories...
Highest scoring German ace of WW2? Erich 'Bubi' Hartmann with 352 confirmed victories...
They'd be better off drinking less tea and eating more schnitzel, I'd say...
true_one_picture
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NO no no, our scores are only low because half the time we didnt bother counting coz it was tooooo easy!!!!
(Im glad you have a good sense of humour)
Phil
(Im glad you have a good sense of humour)
Phil
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were those 352 confirmed victories 1920s outdated french/polish etc biplanes , the british WWII victories would have been FW190s ME109s and heavily armed bombers, not biplanes
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Hartmann flew over 1400 missions on the Eastern front in wwii, British pilots flew on average less than 100. Some of his early victories will have been against outdated planes but later soviet aircraft like the Yak and Lavochkin variants were easily a match for any aircraft of their time.
lol...quite...
Gross mismanagement of the entire war effort for the most part. While the allies went onto wartime production in all factories almost immediately, Germany didn't... also the Arms Production itself was badly managed - we all assume that Germany was uber-efficient at all that stuff, but any detailed look at how the Third Reich did 'business' reveals a catalogue fo hopeless ineptitude from top to bottom...
Take the V1 and V2 Rocket programme as one example...so much money and materiel was expended on that one effort that it severely curtailed aircraft and U-Boat Production - the U-Boats that Germany went to war with were actually training boats, never intended for warfare by the Kriegsmarine (source: Peter Cremer, U-Boot Kapitan-Lieutnant, Commander of U-333). The boats that they were supposed to fight with weren't ready until December 1944, by which time it was too late.
The V2 rocket, despite being technologically advanced, accounted for surprisingly few casualties - according to allied sources, the average death-toll was about 3.5 persons per rocket. According to the German Aerospace museum at Peenemunde where the rockets were developed, each rocket cost about 3 billion Reichmarks to produce, taking into account all the R&D that went into the program (and much of the construction and assembly work was by slave-labour, so costs would have been even higher in a 'real-world' scenario).
That's not a cost-effective way of killing people...
Imagine if that expenditure had been spent on the jet-engine programme instead: the prototype Me 262 jet-fighter was ready to fly in 1942; only material shortages and funding prevented it going into production at that time. The strategic metals needed for the Jumo jet-engines was in short supply, why? Because they all were allocated to the V1 and V2 programmes.
If swarms of Me 262s had been flying over Europe 6 months before the arrival of the long-range NA P-51 Mustang, we'd never have been able to maintain air superiority. Without air supremacy (as opposed to superiority) the Normany Invasion wouldn't have taken place.
With more, modern U-Boats, the Atlantic convoys couldn't have kept Britain resupplied.
Lots of what-if's - but it wan't the quality of personnel that lost the War for the Germans, it was poor long-term planning, worse management and poor understanding of how best to use the limited resources available.
Gross mismanagement of the entire war effort for the most part. While the allies went onto wartime production in all factories almost immediately, Germany didn't... also the Arms Production itself was badly managed - we all assume that Germany was uber-efficient at all that stuff, but any detailed look at how the Third Reich did 'business' reveals a catalogue fo hopeless ineptitude from top to bottom...
Take the V1 and V2 Rocket programme as one example...so much money and materiel was expended on that one effort that it severely curtailed aircraft and U-Boat Production - the U-Boats that Germany went to war with were actually training boats, never intended for warfare by the Kriegsmarine (source: Peter Cremer, U-Boot Kapitan-Lieutnant, Commander of U-333). The boats that they were supposed to fight with weren't ready until December 1944, by which time it was too late.
The V2 rocket, despite being technologically advanced, accounted for surprisingly few casualties - according to allied sources, the average death-toll was about 3.5 persons per rocket. According to the German Aerospace museum at Peenemunde where the rockets were developed, each rocket cost about 3 billion Reichmarks to produce, taking into account all the R&D that went into the program (and much of the construction and assembly work was by slave-labour, so costs would have been even higher in a 'real-world' scenario).
That's not a cost-effective way of killing people...
Imagine if that expenditure had been spent on the jet-engine programme instead: the prototype Me 262 jet-fighter was ready to fly in 1942; only material shortages and funding prevented it going into production at that time. The strategic metals needed for the Jumo jet-engines was in short supply, why? Because they all were allocated to the V1 and V2 programmes.
If swarms of Me 262s had been flying over Europe 6 months before the arrival of the long-range NA P-51 Mustang, we'd never have been able to maintain air superiority. Without air supremacy (as opposed to superiority) the Normany Invasion wouldn't have taken place.
With more, modern U-Boats, the Atlantic convoys couldn't have kept Britain resupplied.
Lots of what-if's - but it wan't the quality of personnel that lost the War for the Germans, it was poor long-term planning, worse management and poor understanding of how best to use the limited resources available.
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malla1962
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cos the USA pulled us out of the ****, we were fighting the germans and the germans were fighting half the world.So if the German aces were that good how come we arent all driving German and Japanese cars then ?
Oh, wait.....
true_one_picture
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Strange thing to say, USA pulled us out.
From what I understand we was in it just as much and does Battle of Britain ring a bell????
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If not for the Yanks we would have all been goose stepping and speaking German right now. It's true that they could have come in earlier than they did and that would have shortened the war but you can't change history, only learn from it.
true_one_picture
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Well I have served in Iraq and can tell you one thing, they aint learnt a great deal.
Phil
They've learned that we'll pretty much do whatever they tell us...
Plus they're a lot better now than they were on Telic 1... a lot less of the Hoo-Ah! attitude when it comes to commanders doing business...
I must say it truly saddens me when it is said that the US saved us from the Third Reich.
In the summer of 1940 the UK and commonwealth (along with some Poles, French etc who had made it across the channel) stood alone aginst the might of the Luftwaffe. Despite the odds, the RAF prevailed, Operation Sealion (the German invasion of England) was cancelled and the Nazi regime turned to the East and Operation Barbarossa.
According to records the RAF and Fleet air arms pilots participating were;
2353 British
574 Overseas made up as approximately;
145 Poles
127 New Zealanders
112 Canadians
88 Czechoslovakians
28 Belgians
32 Australians
25 South Africans
13 French
10 Irish
7 Americans (officially 7 but some masqueraded as Canadians)
+ some other single figures from Jamaica, Palestine and the like.
Of these, 544 lost their lives defending our freedom and preventing the conditions that would have allowed invasion to proceed. A further 791 of the BAttle of Britain pilots perished by the end of the war, almost 50% of the original number.
Obviously ultimate victory in western europe would have been impossible without US intervention but equally invasion of the UK was impossible without German air superiority.
Germany and most of Europe would have suffered a terrible fate of Soviet domination after their eventual but probably inevitable victory over the Nazis.
Where we would be today is anybodys guess.
Never forget the sacrifices made :nono: nor who made the sacrifice and for whom.
In the summer of 1940 the UK and commonwealth (along with some Poles, French etc who had made it across the channel) stood alone aginst the might of the Luftwaffe. Despite the odds, the RAF prevailed, Operation Sealion (the German invasion of England) was cancelled and the Nazi regime turned to the East and Operation Barbarossa.
According to records the RAF and Fleet air arms pilots participating were;
2353 British
574 Overseas made up as approximately;
145 Poles
127 New Zealanders
112 Canadians
88 Czechoslovakians
28 Belgians
32 Australians
25 South Africans
13 French
10 Irish
7 Americans (officially 7 but some masqueraded as Canadians)
+ some other single figures from Jamaica, Palestine and the like.
Of these, 544 lost their lives defending our freedom and preventing the conditions that would have allowed invasion to proceed. A further 791 of the BAttle of Britain pilots perished by the end of the war, almost 50% of the original number.
Obviously ultimate victory in western europe would have been impossible without US intervention but equally invasion of the UK was impossible without German air superiority.
Germany and most of Europe would have suffered a terrible fate of Soviet domination after their eventual but probably inevitable victory over the Nazis.
Where we would be today is anybodys guess.
Never forget the sacrifices made :nono: nor who made the sacrifice and for whom.
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true_one_picture
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Well just to say I agree with Rodintee on the whole matter.
And at the end of the day we should remember all those who died including the people on the other side.
Phil
And at the end of the day we should remember all those who died including the people on the other side.
Phil
352 wins? Now that's what I call pure pwnage.
Mostly scored in Poland and Soviet Russia - the German Pilots engaged on the Eastern Front said that a 100 kills there was akin to 10 on the Western Front as the Soviet pilots were so poorly trained it almost wasn't fair - well it wasn't, but that's war for you...
After the War Hartmann downplayed his score a great deal saying that it wasn't really a true indication of how good he was but how bad were their opponents.
Still, to take down 30 in a single sortie takes some doing even if you just consider that the ammunition used to do that would have been about 10 rounds per aircraft...
Cold Rival
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Can someone explain to me what the hell happened to this thread?!
OP
Rob_W
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Dunno, i put my hard hat one, and been sat in the air raid shelter with my fingers in my ears for a while now...Can someone explain to me what the hell happened to this thread?!
:shrug:
Can someone explain to me what the hell happened to this thread?!
Go back and read through them again - it's the fairly usual meandering off-topic that happens here...lol