Todays teachers strike

ANDYHOP said:
Not at all but the teachers are the only ones moaning never heard a dickie word off:

Immigration and passport
UK Border agency
Courts service
D of E in job centre plus
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Maybe you not onlyhad your blinkers on but you also had your fingers in your ears ... just bacause you never heard it does not mean it was not said.
 
ANDYHOP said:
THEY DO HAVE A CHOICE CHANGE JOB
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There's no need to shout :D

By JOB I assume you mean career?
So you think it's acceptable that if your current employers try to force terms on you that you don't agree you should have to move to a whole different career from one that you love and are good at?

If you just mean switch schools, then you miss my point as doing this will land them with exactly the same terms.
 
The economy being the way it is combined with an ageing population means we all need to tighten our belts. The problem naturally comes when it is your belt that needs to be tightened :).

I can understand their disappointment but equally I pay out 1.25k in tax each month (single, no kids), so I don't have too much sympathy. Everything for me has jumped up in price recently and workload has also increased due to downsizing. Pension options suck so I'm investing in property where I can.

The point is people in the private sector have it much worse. My father, for example, has nowhere near the pension he was expecting to receive.

Just because people work in the public sector does not mean they don't need to collectively pull their weight to keep the country on track. Can't have "yes, we are in it together, just not me guv" attitude.

As an aside a day long strike isn't going to have much impact at all.
 
:love::lol::love: ok teachers were moaning the most cause like was mentioned on QT there special.
 
Jim.R said:
There's no need to shout :D

By JOB I assume you mean career?
So you think it's acceptable that if your current employers try to force terms on you that you don't agree you should have to move to a whole different career from one that you love and are good at?
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I've seen it happen plenty of times in the private sector. Economy being as it is I'm sure there are plenty of people willing to pick up the teaching job on revised terms.
 
jojo90 said:
The economy being the way it is combined with an ageing population means we all need to tighten our belts. The problem naturally comes when it is your belt that needs to be tightened :).

I can understand their disappointment but equally I pay out 1.25k in tax each month (single, no kids), so I don't have too much sympathy. Everything for me has jumped up in price recently and workload has also increased due to downsizing. Pension options suck so I'm investing in property where I can.

The point is people in the private sector have it much worse. My father, for example, has nowhere near the pension he was expecting to receive.

Just because people work in the public sector does not mean they don't need to collectively pull their weight to keep the country on track. Can't have "yes, we are in it together, just not me guv" attitude.

As an aside a day long strike isn't going to have much impact at all.
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:wave::clap::thumbs:
My sentiments as well
 
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jojo90 said:
I've seen it happen plenty of times in the private sector. Economy being as it is I'm sure there are plenty of people willing to pick up the teaching job on revised terms.
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Really, let them! How come there are a shortage of teachers in certain subjects? Surely there should be none with how easy teachers have it, in fact if it was that cushy surely there would be loads of teachers fighting for every job as we pretty much just doss all day.

Maybe that's what the New adverts to get people in to teach should be



LEARN TO TEACH

Massive pay and loads of holidays, plus you doss loads!
 
ding76uk said:
Really, let them! How come there are a shortage of teachers in certain subjects? Surely there should be none with how easy teachers have it, in fact if it was that cushy surely there would be loads of teachers fighting for every job as we pretty much just doss all day.

Maybe that's what the New adverts to get people in to teach should be



LEARN TO TEACH

Massive pay and loads of holidays, plus you doss loads!
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No because there not allowed to discipline children any more because children have 'Rights'
 
mcdonalds_logo.jpg
 
ding76uk said:
Really, let them! How come there are a shortage of teachers in certain subjects? Surely there should be none with how easy teachers have it, in fact if it was that cushy surely there would be loads of teachers fighting for every job as we pretty much just doss all day.

Maybe that's what the New adverts to get people in to teach should be



LEARN TO TEACH

Massive pay and loads of holidays, plus you doss loads!
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I didn't make any judgements on how cushy or challenging the job is nor would I without any direct experience. From the descriptions given it seems comparable to my role i.e. in at 07:30 and out round 20:00 with some weekend work. Renumeration is likely higher however I personally feel justified.

As for the shortage that's likely steeped in complexity with a number of contributing factors. I'm curious to know what public statistics are available detailing this?

Personally if I was out of work, perhaps made redundant, and teaching jobs were available I might sign up. There are after all plenty of people unemployed right now! I may well decide to go that route later in life as I plan to retire into SE Asia. The summer holidays would give me enough time to set things up and the qualifications, work experience, and 2 degrees would get my foot in the door at some decent private language schools.
 
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boyfalldown said:
no - not really fact, just a very selective look at the figures. Your arguments assume two things that the figures presented don't support.

1) That there were UK born workers willing and able to fill those jobs.

2) That the non-self supporting 680,000 aren't being supported some other way, ie - as a wife of a worked for example, and are being supportd by the state in some way.
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Those figures have been lifted from the ONS and are a matter of record. I see no assumption what so ever in the pst whiteflyer made.

I see that your coming up with are assumptions.
 
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acetone said:
Those figures have been lifted from the ONS and are a matter of record. I see no assumption what so ever in the pst whiteflyer made.

I see that your coming up with are assumptions.
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to give those figures any meaning, especially in the context they were made then you need to make those two assumptions, otherwise its just lies, damn lies and statstics. You understand the difference?
 
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Jim.R said:
But that's the point. They started with one set of conditions, but these are now being changed.
If my employer tried to change my terms to less favourable ones, I'd be on the blower to a recruitment agency and after a new role ASAP. Teachers/policeman/firemen/nurses/doctors don't have this option as their terms for their role are the same nationwide.
Change the T+Cs for new recruits by all means, but these people started off their career expecting certain things, and these are now being taken away!
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I very much doubt when choosing their career anyone even considers what the pension will be like or when they will get to retire. I know I certainly didn't. I knew where I wanted to work and a rough idea of what I wanted to do and I've been fortunate to have been doing it for 32 years so far. It's only now at the age of 48 that a pension is beginning to have any sort of meaning to me.
 
boyfalldown said:
to give those figures any meaning, especially in the context they were made then you need to make those two assumptions, otherwise its just lies, damn lies and statstics. You understand the difference?
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Your right absolutely no UK born person would ever want the jobs these guys have.

Arsène Wenger
Roberto Martínez
Roberto Mancini
André Villas-Boas
Fabio Capello

António Horta-Osório CEO Lloyds TSB Group

Now you could argue the UK-Born don have the skills for those jobs, but I can easily come up with a list of men who certainty believe they could do the job just as well.
 
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whiteflyer said:
Your right absolutely no UK born person would ever want the jobs these guys have.

Arsène Wenger
Roberto Martínez
Roberto Mancini
André Villas-Boas
Fabio Capello

António Horta-Osório CEO Lloyds TSB Group
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Want? Or be capable of doing? premiership and England managers ? Not exactly common or garden jobs are they? Kind of weak support for your argument cause they could of plucked just anyone off the street for those jobs :shrug:
 
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nilagin said:
I very much doubt when choosing their career anyone even considers what the pension will be like or when they will get to retire. I know I certainly didn't. I knew where I wanted to work and a rough idea of what I wanted to do and I've been fortunate to have been doing it for 32 years so far. It's only now at the age of 48 that a pension is beginning to have any sort of meaning to me.
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Are you saying that if you were suddenly forced to lose a portion of your take home pay that you'd be happy? With no alternative then to go along with it if you wish to continue in your current career?
 
Jim.R said:
Are you saying that if you were suddenly forced to lose a portion of your take home pay that you'd be happy? With no alternative then to go along with it if you wish to continue in your current career?
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But many people have. Take Honda workers. Enforced 6 months shutdown on reduced pay, no jobs available in the area as they are such a big employer.
 
Those are temporary measures, not permanent changes.
 
Ok time for reflection. What did the days strike achieve? nothing that I can conceive as making a blind bit of difference afterwards. Ok yes it put people out as some had to rearrange their day, but it hasn't changed the governments mind one bit. Things are now exactly the same as before the strike. So why not get around the discussion table instead and take a civilised approach to their grievance.

Realspeed
 
realspeed said:
Ok time for reflection. What did the days strike achieve? nothing that I can conceive as making a blind bit of difference afterwards. Ok yes it put people out as some had to rearrange their day, but it hasn't changed the governments mind one bit. Things are now exactly the same as before the strike. So why not get around the discussion table instead and take a civilised approach to their grievance.

Realspeed
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There's nothing civilised about teachers and the public sector..... They live in dream world of always being right about everything and telling us how to live our lives... :D
 
Primary Teachers easiest job in the world and cant get that right for when the children go to secondary school.

LEt me know any day when you want to come in with me at 7.30am work til 9.15 then deal with kids until 3.30 and then work for another 2 hours, go home see your own kids for an hour and then go to a 2 hour meeting, all the time trying to be polite and accepting of the fact that everyone expects you to be perfect all the time, and put their kids in front of everyone else. And if you are really lucky I'll let people come in and judge you and then publish the findings on the internet for everyone to read....

Yes I get quite well paid
Yes I have longer holidays - although they are all in peak time so to actually go away is horrendously expensive
Yes - I am entitled to 5 days training a year

Yes - I teach your children to read, write, add up, play sports, develop relationships,

and Yes when your family life goes down the pan and your kid is screwed up, I am the one who arranges for them to get some support, and help them out.

Please don't judge if you haven't got a clue - it just makes you look stupid
 
Splog

I deliberately avoided any comments about any particular group although I also have my own opinions. Having had to go on strike in a previous job (against my better judgement), and taken note of other similar actions by trade unions, rarely do stikes achieve what they set out to do and just aggravate the general public towards them.

Is there a case for union bosses to stir up trouble to justify their £100,000+ salaries by causing strikes to make it look as if they are trying to do something for their members, which in turn makes them look big and important whereas in reality they couldn't do a decent days hard work if they tried

Realspeed
 
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realspeed said:
Splog

I deliberately avoided any comments about any particular group although I also have my own opinions. Having had to go on strike in a previous job (against my better judgement), and taken note of other similar actions by trade unions, rarely do stikes achieve what they set out to do and just aggravate the general public towards them.

Realspeed
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Ah!... So we agree then.
 
boyfalldown said:
Want? Or be capable of doing? premiership and England managers ? Not exactly common or garden jobs are they? Kind of weak support for your argument cause they could of plucked just anyone off the street for those jobs :shrug:
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But it blows out the water your argument that all non-UK are doing low paid jobs the UK people don't want .

Yes extreme examples but to think that all non-UK are only doing jobs we don't want to do, is just burying your head in the sand.

Now on the radio today it said that in some parts of London, in some hospitals a 1/4 of all the staff from cleaners right up to the top doctors are non-UK.

If we Brit don't have the skills then why the hell not, has our education system become so crap that we can't train people to do any sort of skill jobs.
 
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whiteflyer said:
But it blows out the water your argument that all non-UK are doing low paid jobs the UK people don't want .

Yes extreme examples but to think that all non-UK are only doing jobs we don't want to do, is just burying your head in the sand.

Now on the radio today it said that in some parts of London, in some hospitals a 1/4 of all the staff from cleaners right up to the top doctors are non-UK.

If we Brit don't have the skills then why the hell not, has our education system become so crap that we can't train people to do any sort of skill jobs.
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Well let's see.

9k per year in university fees start this year and you can't see why this will continue or get worse? £54k in uni fees alone to become a doctor from September.
 
Carl & Wendy, instead of contributing to this fine dibate, shudnt you bofe be marking buks?
 
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