the perfect lens ?

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knocker

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Barry
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i have a canon 300d, i have a keen interest in running dogs (greyhounds, whippets, lurchers etc ) i can't seem to get on with the standard lens or my 70 - 300 sigma, the shots i take involve fast panning as the dog runs past me at varying distances (auto focus not suitable) or static shots as the dog runs towards me.....i just can't seem to get it right....so.....what would be an affordable non canon lens (can't afford canon prices i'm afraid) for this type of work ?

ps, some of the shots are in rain as well !

advice appreciated
 
use AI servo mode and select a focus point.

I suspect its more your technique thats at fault not the equipment. Could you post some examples of your work that you're happy with and some that you're not, and also a few links to people whose work you aspire to?
 
Knocker - I live up the road from you, in Uttoxeter and I was the NCCs official photographer for 20 years. You will have seen my stuff from the coursing meets!

happy to come out with you and see where you are going wrong or what you are trying to do and advise.
 
I had the same problem with my dog (whippet) I solved it by buying a 1Ds where the autofocus can keep up! I honestly found that the autofocus on my 5D with a Canon 70-200 f4 was just not quick enough to keep up and I kept missing the focus.

Got my hands on the 1Ds and bingo!

2738630213_e92951e436.jpg


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I do hope you can solve it a lot cheaper than that though!
 
AliB said:
I had the same problem with my dog (whippet) I solved it by buying a 1Ds where the autofocus can keep up! I honestly found that the autofocus on my 5D with a Canon 70-200 f4 was just not quick enough to keep up and I kept missing the focus.

Got my hands on the 1Ds and bingo!

I do hope you can solve it a lot cheaper than that though!
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Great shots from AliB of a very difficult subject :)

Truth is the servo AF on most non-pro SLRs is just not up to it, or will be very hit and miss at best. One way around this is to pre-focus on a point you know the dogs will pass and pick them off with skillful timing, but that's pretty hit and miss as well unless you can make the dogs go exactly where you want them. This kind of technique works fine with predictable subjects like a car on a race track, but dogs I'm not so sure :eek: Sorry :(

I think you can pick up an early Canon 1D (relatively) cheaply, and don't let the low pixel count put you off. That's the least of your problems with such a difficult subject.

Richard.
 
I agree with Hoppy. In most situations the lens has more of an effect on the picture than the camera body, but this is different. You need a body with a top-notch AF system. An old 1D has such an AF system, will still take great pictures, and is virtually indestructible. It's a very good investment for you.
 
never fitted a lens on my camera before, what does it do:thinking:


with the 70-300 lens and your 300D you'll need to set it to sport mode on the dial to ge AI servo so the focus will track the subject. I'd not replace the lens but the camera.



knocker said:
i have a canon 300d, i have a keen interest in running dogs (greyhounds, whippets, lurchers etc ) i can't seem to get on with the standard lens or my 70 - 300 sigma, the shots i take involve fast panning as the dog runs past me at varying distances (auto focus not suitable) or static shots as the dog runs towards me.....i just can't seem to get it right....so.....what would be an affordable non canon lens (can't afford canon prices i'm afraid) for this type of work ?

ps, some of the shots are in rain as well !

advice appreciated
Click to expand...
 
poah....
never fitted a lens on my camera before, what does it do :thinking:
Click to expand...

is that some sort of insult/sarcasm or a dig at my need to ask for advice ? if it is indeed any of those then, might i ask the reason for such comments ?


lenseflare.....thank you for the offer, one i will probably take you up on pretty soon :D

aliB......nice looking dog....top images too....worker/racer or pet ?

hoppy,stewart.....damn, i need a 1d then, more money :'(

thank you for the advice :thumbs:
 
knocker said:
poah....

is that some sort of insult/sarcasm or a dig at my need to ask for advice ? if it is indeed any of those then, might i ask the reason for such comments ?


lenseflare.....thank you for the offer, one i will probably take you up on pretty soon :D

aliB......nice looking dog....top images too....worker/racer or pet ?

hoppy,stewart.....damn, i need a 1d then, more money :'(

thank you for the advice :thumbs:
Click to expand...

Its not a dig mate its asking you a question so they can answer truthfully :thumbs:
 
knocker said:
aliB......nice looking dog....top images too....worker/racer or pet ?

hoppy,stewart.....damn, i need a 1d then, more money :'(

thank you for the advice :thumbs:
Click to expand...

Pet who is happily snoozing on the sofa with a bellyfull of turkey!

I'll take her out for a run tomorrow to work it off. (Me, not the whippet :))
 
I agree with Knocker. We don't need sarcasm on site, it has ruined other sites for me with people whom digest the dictionary and then correct others.
It's not a spelling competition here........now ribbing someone I can take...

Lets keep it friendly Guys.....
 
Dangermouse1964 said:
Its not a dig mate its asking you a question so they can answer truthfully :thumbs:
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"never fitted a lens on my camera before, what does it do :thinking:"


is a......question ???

ok well, anyway, I don't know much about Canon stuffs and I'm sure faster af on posher models is a definite advantage, but nobody's mentioned shutter speed, and the likely shutter speeds at the thick end of 300 on that 70-300.
I think it should also be considered that not all shots will be lost due to miss-focus, some are bound to be soft at the speeds greyhounds hammer on at without sufficient shutter speed.
Even in good light, f/5.6 is gonna kill that, I dunno, never shot them but I don't think 1/500th is fast enough for a greyhound at full tilt, how often can you get 1/500th+ at 5.6 without shooting into the sun ?
 
I set mine at 1/500 on shutter priority and can get the whippet at that speed even at full tilt head on. She's got a 12 ft stride length, she's a big lass and can motor a bit :)

Greyhounds are even quicker. lol

Thanks for the kind comment Dangermouse :)
 
ali, the more i look at those images, the more she looks like a whippet/grey cross, her chest is very broad for pure whippet, cracking dog though, puts my poor little collie/whippet x bedlington to shame :) like to see some more shots of her please

instead of binning my rubbish attempts at running dog shots, i am going to have another crack at it and will post the unedited results
 
I was once told by a serious (pro) sports tog that greyhounds were actually the hardest thing to shoot sport wise.

You're going to need a body with some seriously quick AF (Canon 1D or Nikon D300/700/3) coupled with some glass that can keep up with that sort of rate of focus shift.

As with everything fast moving my suggestion is to try and shoot as long as you possible can - ie upwards of 300mm. The longer the shot, the more manageable the relative rate of subject change will be.

Additional problems will be that if you are talking normal greyhound meets, the light won't be too good either.

So I guess the tog was right when you add that lot up!

Ali - lovely shots and gorgeous dog! I love long dogs!
 
knocker said:
poah....

is that some sort of insult/sarcasm or a dig at my need to ask for advice ? if it is indeed any of those then, might i ask the reason for such comments ?
Click to expand...

it is sarcasm mainly because there is no such thing as a lens but my advice still stands replace the camera
 
POAH said:
it is sarcasm mainly because there is no such thing as a lens but my advice still stands replace the camera
Click to expand...
Dictionary.com says there is. Unless of course you know better?

Sarcasm isn't a very polite way to greet new members to TP. You knew what he meant. Why not just answer the question?
 
The weak spot is the 300D - this camera simply doesn't have good enough autofocus to keep up with a speeding canine - sighthound or otherwise.

You don't need a top notch 1 series body to keep up, I did fine for years using a 10D then a 20D and the right technique - the reason people came to me was my action shots. You need to choose your shots carefully and you will get what is needed.

061104_IMG_5611.jpg


img_5520.jpg
 
Richard, that second shot is awesome.:clap:

To the OP, you would be better off buying a faster camera, even if it is a 10D, which can be picked up very cheap. I used a 10D for 3 years shooting fast jets(dont come much faster than that) and it was fine. Obviously a faster lens will help, but, the body needs to be able to control the lens in the first place. Good luck. lets see some shots.
Dean:)
 
StewartR said:
Dictionary.com says there is. Unless of course you know better?

Sarcasm isn't a very polite way to greet new members to TP. You knew what he meant. Why not just answer the question?
Click to expand...



dictionary.com is wrong however

ask oxford
 
The 300D doesn't have AI-Servo mode if I remember correctly. Its continuous shooting abilities are limited too.

Stick it in sports mode and see if you can get decent results, if that doesn't work then try out a 40D with a USM (ring type) lens (like the 70-200 F4) The 40D has cross type periferal focus points which helps when tracking moving subjects.

You don't need a 1D/1Ds. The 1Ds is designed more for studio use anyway and would be more than what's required for basic sports shooting.
 
cmonkey you are absolutely right, the 300D only has AI focus mode, which is about as much use as a string hook

You can fool the 300D ai focus into becoming AI servo by locking on the subject and subtly changing the zoom in order to force refocussing. Or there is a hack available out there that will enable AI servo on the 300D. BUt with the price of use 10/20D cameras that hack is pretty pointless these days (UNless you have no money for a new body)
 
right, have sold the 300d and now need a camera :) i have my eye on a 1ds but i am now wondering if it may be ott ! i have kept hold of my siggy 70-300 just in case i end up with another canon. sadly, i only have around £500 to play with so i guess my choice will be limited, so, bearing in mind my requirements for shooting images of running dogs etc and the need for fast focus/tracking etc, what options do i have ?

so far, from what has been posted

nikon d300
nikon d700
canon 1ds
canon 40d

plus.....is my siggy fast enough ?

sorry about all the questions but my photographic future is in your hands as i havn't a clue ;) :thinking:
 
Knocker, I'm afraid I can't help you with your question but having read through the thread I will say that don't let the sarcasm you experienced above put you off this site and a warm welcome.

The help and information you will get on here is second to none. Enjoy.
 
From your list I'd choose either the 40D or the D300. Crop sensor bodies would probably be best for you...

The D300 will be about 800+ quid and the 40D a lot less....

But you will need some faster glass to go with the 40D and the D300 is a Nikon, so you will need completely different glass altogether.
 
Well I would say the 1Ds is not the right camera for you. Nice as they are.

The 40D is a fine camera and will work with your current lens, but if you are not looking for a new camera you can get some really good deals on a used 30D with kit lens (Or 20D) which still hold their own. Keep the Sigma lens and pick up a 50m F1.8 (Invaluable cheap lens!).

You will still have plenty of change from you £500 - I would estimate that £350 will get a used 30D and the 50mm lens. Should you decide that the SIgma lens is holding you back and want to get something that has quicker autofocus then you are well on your way to a canon 70-300 with USM autofocus.
 
knocker said:
right, have sold the 300d and now need a camera :) i have my eye on a 1ds but i am now wondering if it may be ott ! i have kept hold of my siggy 70-300 just in case i end up with another canon. sadly, i only have around £500 to play with so i guess my choice will be limited, so, bearing in mind my requirements for shooting images of running dogs etc and the need for fast focus/tracking etc, what options do i have ?

so far, from what has been posted

nikon d300
nikon d700
canon 1ds
canon 40d

plus.....is my siggy fast enough ?

sorry about all the questions but my photographic future is in your hands as i havn't a clue ;) :thinking:
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Noooo, don't go to the dark side (Nikon!). For £500, there's no way you're going to be able to get a 1Ds! Have a look at the MPB used listings, they're a reputable company who advertise on these forums. They have a 40D for £450, leaving you fifty quid to play with. Use the 70-300 for now, but I'd guess you're going to need to upgrade soon to get the best results! But hey, I'm nee to this too so who knows eh?! :thinking:
 
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