The Next Monkey T Shirt Copyright Infringement Result and a Thank YOU!!!

Eaglesnestphoto

Eaglesnestphoto

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146
Name
Allan
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Hi All,
Firstly a Huge thanks to those on this site who advised me so well on what to do. Your input was and is appreciated and it really helped me on finding out what to do and where to go to solve this issue. As promised I have come back to give you guys the outcome, but first for those who didn't see my thread a quick run down on what happened.
I am a pro extreme sports photographer specialising in FMX. To cut a long story short http://www.dailypost.co.uk/news/north-wales-news/next-t-shirt-row-photographer-says-5775082 the link takes you to the story as it appeared in the press plus the images. Taking the advice I got from here I got a solicitor (Specialising in Copyright infringement) to take on the case.
Next to be fair worked well with my legal firm first taking the item off the rails and out from their website. There was pretty much no debate on if the shot was the shot I produced and they explained a 3rd party supplier they used had supplied them with the design and they had taken his word that he had obtained the shot legally. So all I had to do was prove the shot/copyright was mine. which was easy to do as I had hundreds of shots taken on the same day, same place and the exif showed up as it being the same camera body and lens combo etc. So all we had to do was sort it. The offers were A for me to grant them the licence and they put the stock back on sale and pay me a percent as they would have had they done it correctly. This was not an option for me My site FMX GB is to promote the sport of FMX in the UK and for me removing the riders head and replacing with a monkey/ape does not help that cause. Plus as they had left the rider recognisable the poor guy was at risk of getting a lot of leg pulling etc. Option 2 was to pay me the percentage for what had been sold and destroy All remaining stock. But I gave a 3rd option which was based on option 2 BUT instead of all stock being destroyed they donated them to Oxfam. To me this way some good comes out of the saga and it leaves me with a happy memory of the event from what was a very angry start. And I can announce that option 3 was the way it was settled with 1000's of childrens T shirts going to Oxfam and a payment to me plus they paid all my legal fees. For those who find themselves in a similar situation take legal advice and go for it. But do not expect Rihanna type money but you do get what I consider a fair amount. Next as I said once they realised the situation did their best to resolve it for which I am greatful and THANKS AGAIN!! For all the help I got from the members of this site. It truly is a great place to come for all things photographic.
Allan
 
Great outcome and thanks for letting us know he details of the results
 
Glad it worked out right for you :)
 
Glad it all worked out for, as for the 1000's of folk buying T-shirts from Oxfam, looks like the rider will soon be on your case:lol:
 
Good stuff - I personally think option 3 was the best outcome too:)
 
Mikesphotaes said:
Glad it all worked out for, as for the 1000's of folk buying T-shirts from Oxfam, looks like the rider will soon be on your case:lol:
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I had that thought myself, the shirts are still going to be sold, just in Oxfam shops rather than Next. If the rider wasn't happy about Next selling them, I would think he might still be unhappy that Oxfam is selling them :shrug:.
 
Thanks for letting us know the outcome. I remember reading the original thread with interest so pleased to find it now resolved.
 
Dave1 said:
I had that thought myself, the shirts are still going to be sold, just in Oxfam shops rather than Next. If the rider wasn't happy about Next selling them, I would think he might still be unhappy that Oxfam is selling them :shrug:.
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Hi sorry I should have made it clearer although the donation of the shirts is to Oxfam they are for what Oxfam deems best for them. Either to give away to children in countries where they are needed or for resale outside the UK so that way it won't impact on the rider further than it had done.
And thanks everyone for your comments :)
 
Good result.

I wonder what happened to the designer/design agency...?
 
That's great news! :)
Although the third party they hired is in for a serious shoeing!
 
Eaglesnestphoto said:
... they are for what Oxfam deems best for them. Either to give away to children in countries where they are needed or for resale outside the UK so that way it won't impact on the rider further than it had done.
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So ... he's NOT going to see himself as a monkey in the window of his local charity shop?? :),
although once he sets foot in Indonesia ...
 
Well done and a great outcome.

I remember reading your posting about this before, what I can't remember was where you thought they got the image from, what size it was and if it had watermarks on it?

A good friend of mine has had a lot of bother recently along the same lines as you (although not getting hit by a major high street name!) and largely the problem was caused by him posting very large, not visually watermarked or identifiable images to social media....
 
Outstanding outcome and congrats on handling the whole thing in an extremely professional manner :thumbs:
 
Yeah, as others have said "well done".
And congrats on suggesting the third option. A much better outcome than going to landfill etc.
 
desantnik said:
Well done and a great outcome.

I remember reading your posting about this before, what I can't remember was where you thought they got the image from, what size it was and if it had watermarks on it?

A good friend of mine has had a lot of bother recently along the same lines as you (although not getting hit by a major high street name!) and largely the problem was caused by him posting very large, not visually watermarked or identifiable images to social media....
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Hi sorry I have been a bit slow replying, work has been a bit manic. Ok to answer your points (and hopefully help your friend )
This shot was for a team I shoot for, and although I do post shots on FB etc this shot wasn't on Facebook or flickr etc it was on the clients website. I supplied Hi Res and lo res so I am not sure which they used on their webpage.
It wasn't visibly watermarked.
So first I had to prove it was my image. In this regard it wasn't difficult. I still had the EXIF in tact so could say exactly when and where it was shot. I then took the catalogue shot of the T shirt and in Photoshop Layered my original image over the image on the T shirt. Everything lined up perfectly considering their shot was of the T shirt. The riders suit stripes and a repair patch on the knee, His body position and arms in the air and fingers all lined up,spokes on the wheels and teeth on sprockets of the bike etc etc so for it to have been anyone else's they would have had to have stood next to me and fired a camera in the same 1000th of a second for all that to line up. So they gave up on that point pretty quick. All I had to do after that was prove I had the copyright with the exif on the image stating that and shots taken before and after it with same info again it wasn't too hard And I also supplied copies of emails between myself and the client stating at the time I supplied the image what they could use it for etc and that I retained the copyright after that it was only a matter of coming to an agreement :)
Hope this helps?
Allan
 
Interesting, thanks Allan!
 
Eaglesnestphoto said:
Hi sorry I have been a bit slow replying, work has been a bit manic. Ok to answer your points (and hopefully help your friend )
This shot was for a team I shoot for, and although I do post shots on FB etc this shot wasn't on Facebook or flickr etc it was on the clients website. I supplied Hi Res and lo res so I am not sure which they used on their webpage.
It wasn't visibly watermarked.
So first I had to prove it was my image. In this regard it wasn't difficult. I still had the EXIF in tact so could say exactly when and where it was shot. I then took the catalogue shot of the T shirt and in Photoshop Layered my original image over the image on the T shirt. Everything lined up perfectly considering their shot was of the T shirt. The riders suit stripes and a repair patch on the knee, His body position and arms in the air and fingers all lined up,spokes on the wheels and teeth on sprockets of the bike etc etc so for it to have been anyone else's they would have had to have stood next to me and fired a camera in the same 1000th of a second for all that to line up. So they gave up on that point pretty quick. All I had to do after that was prove I had the copyright with the exif on the image stating that and shots taken before and after it with same info again it wasn't too hard And I also supplied copies of emails between myself and the client stating at the time I supplied the image what they could use it for etc and that I retained the copyright after that it was only a matter of coming to an agreement :)
Hope this helps?
Allan
Click to expand...

A very thorough job well done, I wish I was as organised as that just in case it ever happens to me.
 
Eaglesnestphoto said:
The offers were A for me to grant them the licence and they put the stock back on sale and pay me a percent as they would have had they done it correctly. This was not an option for me My site FMX GB is to promote the sport of FMX in the UK and for me removing the riders head and replacing with a monkey/ape does not help that cause. Plus as they had left the rider recognisable the poor guy was at risk of getting a lot of leg pulling etc. Option 2 was to pay me the percentage for what had been sold and destroy All remaining stock. But I gave a 3rd option which was based on option 2 BUT instead of all stock being destroyed they donated them to Oxfam. To me this way some good comes out of the saga and it leaves me with a happy memory of the event from what was a very angry start. And I can announce that option 3 was the way it was settled with 1000's of childrens T shirts going to Oxfam and a payment to me plus they paid all my legal fees.
Click to expand...

I don't understand why option 3 was chosen.The T shirt is still out there and if you are promoting the sports of FMX and you felt the shirt was offensive to the sport you should have opted for option 2.

I think this was an excellent opportunity to make good money by a big high street retailer selling a T shirt possibly world wide with your photograph on and you missed it completely.

I would have snapped there hand off at option 1 to allow them selling the T shirt and take a percentage.

I fail to see how the rider could be identified by all but a few people from the world of FMX when the head was taken of the image.

I am not convinced the rider will believe you chose the right option.If you had chosen option 1 to keep selling,you could have given him a payment for all the "leg pulling" he would get.

Astounding! :thinking:
 
lol in particular post #13 where that very point was addressed , as regards making more money with option 1 it sems the OP has principles and those principles aren't for sale - good on him i say
 
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