The New Top Gear

[odd jim]

Hmm, well IMO it's different or at least they are trying to make it different.
There is no reasonably priced car. It's a Mini Cooper. Hardly reasonably priced and its a rally cross track rather than all tarmac.

Instead of 1 guest there are several

They actually have drivers in the show (Sabine Schmit & Eddie Jordan) Neither Clarkson, Hammond or May are drivers

There is the new competition for guests First car/Best Car

The film in episode 2 was made with guests rather than just the presenters.

That's 4 differences in a show with, at most, 8 articles.

But I get what you are saying, they seem to be trying to make it different by adding or embellishing articles. It will come. Those that love Clarkson and hate Evans will never like it and will be watching re runs on Dave or getting themselves an amazon fire stick.
Those that are a little more open minded and a little less critical will take it for what it is, an entertainment show.

Ok but it's not a rally car, it's just a standard Mini Cooper (still very much an 'everyman' car) with a roll cage... Same concept though.

There is more than one guest but, same concept. The first / best car is one of the lamest parts of the new show IMO and 'first cars' is always something Clarkson talked about in his guest interviews so other than the childish classroom style studio "voting" it's been directly ported over.

The film had the presenters as well as the guests but it was still the same concept, the guests weren't there for any particular reason.

All these things are just minor additions to what was already there and my fear is (other than the presenting aspects) the writing team simply don't have the talent to pull this off and be as creative and interesting as they key staff that have now left.

 

[viv1969]

Problem is neither Jensen, Matt or Sabine are presenters,
.

Neither was Sue Barker, Gary Lineker, Damon Hill.....etc. etc.

 

[odd jim]

Neither was Sue Barker, Gary Lineker, Damon Hill.....etc. etc.

Or Eddie Jordan before his F1 presenting skit. Or MLB...

 

[MFlip]

But they're employed mainly as sports pundits and commentators, not lead presenters of mainstream entertainment shows. Closest there would be Sue in Question if Sport but again that's a different setup.

Even though I like him I don't think MLB is cutting it as a studio presenter..... yet.

 

[ianp5a]

Do you think, with all these complaints, that Jeremy Clarkson,... Jeremy Mr. Smug Clarkson will be even more smug now? Do you think he can handle all this smugness?
I think he'll be smugger than a smuggler, smuggling mugs into Smugistan he will be!

 

[viv1969]

But they're employed mainly as sports pundits and commentators, not lead presenters of mainstream entertainment shows. Closest there would be Sue in Question if Sport but again that's a different setup.

Even though I like him I don't think MLB is cutting it as a studio presenter..... yet.

Yes, but no one is the presenter of a mainstream entertainment show (which I don't think TG is) until they actually become one.

 

[Gremlin]

Passing a local charity shop on the way home saw a book in the window
"Top Gear - The Alternative Highway Code" Published in 2010
Thought it might be a giggle so paid the massive sum of £2
Just flicked through and found this

Do you reckon they knew back then

 

[Cobra]

Do you reckon they knew back then

LOL Brilliant

 

[viv1969]

Passing a local charity shop on the way home saw a book in the window
"Top Gear - The Alternative Highway Code" Published in 2010
Thought it might be a giggle so paid the massive sum of £2
Just flicked through and found this



Do you reckon they knew back then

Clear proof of clairvoyance

 

[Blank_Canvas]

Just watched episode two. It was a train smash. I think the thing that most people forget is that a lot of people watched top gear (particularly women ) for the general buffoonery and the winning format that was Clarkson, Hammond and May, many viewers were not necessarily petrol heads. That's why the show was so successful. The BBC know this and that's why they have kept the format. What doesn't work are the current presenters - there is no chemistry and the fake enthusiasm (Evans) on one hand and the dull monotone monologue on the other (MLB) is causing people to turn TG off. Most people are only watching it out of idol curiosity now to see what happens.

 

[viv1969]

Just watched episode two. It was a train smash. I think the thing that most people forget is that a lot of people watched top gear (particularly women ) for the general buffoonery and the winning format that was Clarkson, Hammond and May, many viewers were not necessarily petrol heads. That's why the show was so successful. The BBC know this and that's why they have kept the format. What doesn't work are the current presenters - there is no chemistry and the fake enthusiasm (Evans) on one hand and the dull monotone monologue on the other (MLB) is causing people to turn TG off. Most people are only watching it out of idol curiosity now to see what happens.

What makes you think that?

 

[Blank_Canvas]

What makes you think that?

From conversations with women, comments in the media, chatting with other friends with wives girlfriends etc, etc.

 

[Ricardodaforce]

From conversations with women, comments in the media, chatting with other friends with wives girlfriends etc, etc.

Very scientific.

 

[Blank_Canvas]

Very scientific.

But still an accurate snapshot in time and a valid observation even in academic proportions.

 

[viv1969]

Not really valid academically without references, numbers.
How many women?
What media references?
The secondhand opinions of friends with wives hardly count.

 

[MFlip]

Well that just proves my wife's special then. She laughed at quite a few sections of the last episode and liked the inclusion of the celebrities throughout, Jensen, Tiny Tempah, etc.... Oh and she likes Chris

 

[Blank_Canvas]

Not really valid academically without references, numbers.
How many women?
What media references?
The secondhand opinions of friends with wives hardly count.

Of course it is, observation is perfectly accepted in academia, particularly science. Even a PhD comes down to an informed opinion. But that said I'm not writing a freeking Master's thesis ! Been, there done that, got the t-shirt and time out !

I should add whilst references etc as you point out are important you still get a feeling for what's going on even before you record the details. Ipso facto.

 

[viv1969]

Of course it is, observation is perfectly accepted in academia, particularly science. Even a PhD comes down to an informed opinion. But that said I'm not writing a freeking Master's thesis ! Been, there done that, got the t-shirt and time out !

I should add whilst references etc as you point out are important you still get a feeling for what's going on even before you record the details. Ipso facto.

Observation is fine.
But observation of perhaps one case is useless pub talk.

 

[Blank_Canvas]

Observation is fine.
But observation of perhaps one case is useless pub talk.

Who said anything about one case ?

 

[odd jim]

Very scientific.

It's not science, it's entertainment, which is wholly dependant on whether someone is entertained or not.

A pretty good way of assessing it

Anyway, if you want numbers and opinions attached to those number, look at the TG FB page discussing the first episode. 12,000 comments and about only 100 or so stating they enjoyed it.

Then look at the viewing figures... It's pretty clear what the majority think.

 

[Blank_Canvas]

It's not science, it's entertainment, which is wholly dependant on whether someone is entertained or not.

A pretty good way of assessing it

Anyway, if you want numbers and opinions attached to those number, look at the TG FB page discussing the first episode. 12,000 comments and about only 100 or so stating they enjoyed it.

Then look at the viewing figures... It's pretty clear what the majority think.

Exactly Jim, and reading many of those comments confirm my (considered) opinion / assessment, but that's just one source.

 

[Ricardodaforce]

It's not science, it's entertainment, which is wholly dependant on whether someone is entertained or not.

A pretty good way of assessing it

Anyway, if you want numbers and opinions attached to those number, look at the TG FB page discussing the first episode. 12,000 comments and about only 100 or so stating they enjoyed it.

Then look at the viewing figures... It's pretty clear what the majority think.

Yes yes all very interesting. It will either work or it won't. Time will tell. And talking of time, only a muppet would right a program off after it's first episode of a new series. I may be in the minority, but I am interested to see how the show develops with its new team.

 

[odd jim]

Yes yes all very interesting. It will either work or it won't. Time will tell. And talking of time, only a muppet would right a program off after it's first episode of a new series. I may be in the minority, but I am interested to see how the show develops with its new team.

Just the facts, just the facts...

 

[Ricardodaforce]

Just the facts, just the facts...

Well using Facebook as a source of stats is worrying! Do you believe that Britain First is the UK's most popular political party just because it has more "likes" than the others?

 

[viv1969]

2 episodes.
And will take muppets of equal stature to continue watching on the remote possibility of improvements with the current lineup and derivative format.

 

[Ricardodaforce]

2 episodes.
And will take muppets of equal stature to continue watching on the remote possibility of improvements with the current lineup and derivative format.

We have already seen improvement haven't we? Ep 2 was better than Ep 1.

 

[odd jim]

Well using Facebook as a source of stats is worrying! Do you believe that Britain First is the UK's most popular political party just because it has more "likes" than the others?

What on earth are you talking about? It's not just Facebook, that's a single example, but a good one that illustrates what the fans think - and it is Top Gears social media outlet - it's their page.

The new show is not popular. It's lost a third of its viewing audience and was beaten, by all things, by the Antiques Roadshow that evening, people and fans as a majority don't want to watch it anymore, they've lost them. That's a fact.

What the hell has Britain's First got to do with anything? They're a right wing group who post propaganda. I'm not sure you could describe Top Gear's page in the same way and the comments and opinions are from genuine long time fans. Please credit fellow members with a bit more intelligence, and stop posting such banal crap as a retort to something factual you don't like to read or agree with.

 

[odd jim]

We have already seen improvement haven't we? Ep 2 was better than Ep 1.

Not by much. And still far below the par of the last 12 series.

 

[Bobsyeruncle]

Not by much. And still far below the par of the last 12 series.

Are there any figures for episode 2? Any change on Facebook?
I thought it was a lot better than episode 1. Not even close to the old TG though.
Just read that the opening show got more viewers than the first opening show of the old top gear, so maybe there is hope.

 

[odd jim]

Are there any figures for episode 2? Any change on Facebook?
I thought it was a lot better than episode 1. Not even close to the old TG though.
Just read that the opening show got more viewers than the first opening show of the old top gear, so maybe there is hope.

Yes, 2.8 million live viewers on the night compared to last weeks 4.3 million. The last series averaged 5-8 million for comparison (live views).

Consolidated figures are a moot point as these were also relevant with previous series but were never highlighted (as they didn't need to be).

 

[Bobsyeruncle]

Yes, 2.8 million live viewers on the night compared to last weeks 4.3 million. The last series averaged 5-8 million for comparison.

Consolidated figures are a moot point as these were also relevant with previous series but were never highlighted (as they didn't need to be).

It figures though, if live viewing figures are higher, then non live figures would be lower. In this case, the live figures were lower, and the none live figures higher?
I feel It's still far to early to know how it's going to pan out. I loved the old TG, and the banter etc, and am not a big Chris Evans fan, but I love cars, so I hope it succeeds.

 

[odd jim]

It figures though, if live viewing figures are higher, then non live figures would be lower. In this case, the live figures were lower, and the none live figures higher?
I feel It's still far to early to know how it's going to pan out. I loved the old TG, and the banter etc, and am not a big Chris Evans fan, but I love cars, so I hope it succeeds.

For the first week show the non live views were lower than the live views (they accounted for about 2 -3 million views, the BBC embellished these figures though on their reporting). And it's worth remembering that a lot of people would have watched it on iplayer to see how bad it really was after its public mauling, so will be watching it for the opposite reason the BBC would like to think

The consolidated figures for last weeks episode haven't been released as far as I can see, possibly because Evans is shouting about it from the rooftops given that last weeks episode was watched by half the amount that watched the Antiques Roadshow? Relative to the live views, I'd expect them to be lower than week one and only a mere top up in figures, but over time it will naturally increase. I expect they'll wait until the end of the week when the consolidated figures have reached their peak before they say anything as a way of damage limitation. You could do that with any programme for higher figures, which is why the only real test is to see how many watch it live, and it's all relative anyway.

No one talks of the 'consolidated' figures of the 'old' Top Gear because they didn't need to, but they would be in the 10 million plus and that doesn't even include people watching them again on Dave, which they still do in the millions.

They're paying Evans £50 million over three years for this output, some of which is public money, and wont want to look like they're failing.

 

[odd jim]

Just read that the opening show got more viewers than the first opening show of the old top gear, so maybe there is hope.

Going back to this, remember they are talking about new TG's first episode's consolidated figures. iPlayer and trackable digital recording wasn't around back in 2002 so it's not a realistic comparison. Neither is it via content, as it was yet to establish a fan base (this new TG was supposed to keep that fan base). And don't trust the BBCs figures for consolidated views

 

[srichards]

Views is also open to interpretation. Does the bbc count a view as someone that started a programme and didn't watch most of it? Does it count as a view someone that started it, fast forwards through a lot of it but reaches the end? Or just those that actually watch it properly?

 

[odd jim]

Views is also open to interpretation. Does the bbc count a view as someone that started a programme and didn't watch most of it? Does it count as a view someone that started it, fast forwards through a lot of it but reaches the end? Or just those that actually watch it properly?

It's anyone that tunes in during the programme, it does include those who switch off on both live and non live and records peaks and low points. It's worked out from a panel of 5100 households and averaged out.

It's interesting that Evans is back tracking on his comments that “If we had to guess about the number of viewers we are going to get on Sunday night, you have got to say you would be disappointed if it was under 5 million,” It was well below that so now he's said Sunday night figures "have never been less relevant". Toys and pram spring to mind.

 

[dejongj]

From conversations with women, comments in the media, chatting with other friends with wives girlfriends etc, etc.

3x more by my last sample. So yes I agree.

 

[nilagin]

Just watched the episodes on iplayer over the last couple of days and found it just as enjoyable as the previous series. Can't see what everyone is whinging about.

 

[odd jim]

Just watched the episodes on iplayer over the last couple of days and found it just as enjoyable as the previous series. Can't see what everyone is whinging about.

Chris Evans mainly.

 

[dejongj]

Chris Evans mainly.

True but so were people about JC...I happen to prefer JC over CE but can appreciate that others are the other way around, or don't like either of them, or like both of them

I'm now happy that we have hopefully two car entertainment shows, well three if you include Fast and Loud

 

[odd jim]

True but so were people about JC...I happen to prefer JC over CE but can appreciate that others are the other way around, or don't like either of them, or like both of them

I'm now happy that we have hopefully two car entertainment shows, well three if you include Fast and Loud

But the difference was JC could present the show, knew his subject and audience, had charisma and could be bloody funny, no matter what you thought of him. All these things, CE lacks.

Those who disliked JC were, generally speaking, not TG fans.