The great TP election thread

Llamaman said:
And both the Greens and UKIP have leaders who aren't MPs, despite having MPs.
And either party could end up being part of the next government.
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yes but say we wind up with a UKIP/Conservative coalition - Farage can't be deputy prime minister if he isnt an MP correct ?- so the while he might notionally remain in charge of ukip its figurehead in the government would have to be one of their ellected MPs
 
I'm still amazed, well actually "amazed" isn't strong enough so I'll say than I'm stunned that anyone would even for a second consider voting for the Greens or for the Welsh or Scottish nationalists. These people would embarrass Arthur Daley such are their blatant misrepresentations and barmy policies.

Can anyone here put forward a reasoned argument for voting for any of these and keep a straight face?

Maybe "we" need a wake up call and 5 years Green government (if we survive it) would maybe stop "us" voting for them again.

Personally I think that the UK is now on an inevitable course to break up unless some scandal or unforeseen event occurs. We'll then have the opportunity to see if the SNP can deliver or not.
 
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big soft moose said:
yes but say we wind up with a UKIP/Conservative coalition - Farage can't be deputy prime minister if he isnt an MP correct ?- so the while he might notionally remain in charge of ukip its figurehead in the government would have to be one of their ellected MPs
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I wonder how many UKIP voters realise that Farage won't be able to join the Cabinet (*)? He's the person voters most associate with UKIP (I think the party would disappear without him) - he does all the press conferences, debates etc. People might very quickly get disillusioned if the man they they thought they were voting for has to hang outside the Downing Street gates with the tourists.

(*) assuming he loses in Thanet.
 
border_all said:
I got my postal ballot paper today its filled out and in the post back for counting now i can leave the news off everyday as i have since they started telling us what they want us to hear

Hope i am alive for 2020 if whoever forms the Government can stay in power that long i can do this all over again.

Hope you won't all be envious but i had national, local and council 3 for the price of one :(
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What's national?
 
woof woof said:
I'm still amazed, well actually "amazed" isn't strong enough so I'll say than I'm stunned that anyone would even for a second consider voting for the Greens or for the Welsh or Scottish nationalists. These people would embarrass Arthur Daley such are their blatant misrepresentations and barmy policies.

Can anyone here put forward a reasoned argument for voting for any of these and keep a straight face?

Maybe "we" need a wake up call and 5 years Green government (if we survive it) would maybe stop "us" voting for them again.

Personally I think that the UK is now on an inevitable course to break up unless some scandal or unforeseen event occurs. We'll then have the opportunity to see if the SNP can deliver or not.
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I have a better idea. You put up a reasoned argument for voting for the party of your choice.
 
Steep said:
I have a better idea. You put up a reasoned argument for voting for the party of your choice.
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Difficult but with the lot I targeted what puts me off is... Their aims, comments and manifestos and (apply as appropriate) their bending of reality as we know it... for example... repeatedly saying how wonderful the NHS would be if only they were in charge and the fact that they are doesn't seem to enter into the equation.

If this wasn't so serious it'd be even funnier.

For further mirth read the Green parties manifesto.
 
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There will be a huge issue shortly then on broken promises, like the lib dems last time. It is looking very likely there will be some form of coalition - be it Tory/Lib, Lab/Lib, Lab/SNP etc... At that stage a number of manifesto promises will have to be broken.
 
cambsno said:
There will be a huge issue shortly then on broken promises, like the lib dems last time. It is looking very likely there will be some form of coalition - be it Tory/Lib, Lab/Lib, Lab/SNP etc... At that stage a number of manifesto promises will have to be broken.
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Personally I feel no one is going to happy with the result of this election, as all the permutations of viable party collaborations aren't really that compatible.
 
stumeech said:
Personally I feel no one is going to happy with the result of this election, as all the permutations of viable party collaborations aren't really that compatible.
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I would be pretty happy with a repeat of what we have, a Tory/lib coalition. It has worked pretty well. Happy with anything that does not mean the snp are part of it.
 
Apparently the national debt is now at 1.48 trillion and rising at £5,000 a minute. According to BBC R5 this morning.

To me this is the issue. We could have the best health service in the world and we could do all of the other nice things if we could get out of this hole but instead every news report and election discussion seems to be full of everyone demanding more now and our leaders and potential leaders competing to offer the biggest bribe. And even some of those are laughable. Want an inflation rate pay rise? Er... How much is that then? £0.

We can open up the cupboards and eat all the jam today and say ***K the consequences but what are we going to leave for future generations? Actually we know what we'll leave, a credit card bill for £2 Trillion and a note saying "Good Luck. There's no more money." :(

I feel that we are stood on the edge of an abyss demanding more money now and not noticing the ground slowly giving way under our feet.
 
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cambsno said:
I would be pretty happy with a repeat of what we have, a Tory/lib coalition. It has worked pretty well. Happy with anything that does not mean the snp are part of it.
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Works for me, I am a Lib Dem voter - I don't think they are a natural fit with Torys but I'd prefer them to Labour!
 
woof woof said:
We can open up the cupboards and eat all the jam today and say ***K the consequences but what are we going to leave for future generations? Actually we know what we'll leave, a credit card bill for £2 Trillion and a note saying "Good Luck. There's no more money." :(
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That's already been done. You'll need to try harder. ;)

Liam-Byrnes-note.jpg
 
You see what I did there? :D

Babum-tish!

I'm on all week.
 
The best solution for Britain would be a minority government. No one party having a majority to force through their ideas on austerity or immigration or anything else means that only policies that are acceptable to a true majority of MPs will get through.

As for the SNP, how times change... seven months ago Scots were being told "don't leave" "Britain is only great with you in it" "Stay and be a part of the family" well we stayed, now suddenly when it looks like we might actually have a voice in WM we're the enemy, bringing disaster to Englandshire. It seems Scots are only good Scots when they know their place, keep quiet and vote for parties that are run from Westminster.
 
Steep said:
As for the SNP, how times change... seven months ago Scots were being told "don't leave" "Britain is only great with you in it" "Stay and be a part of the family" well we stayed, now suddenly when it looks like we might actually have a voice in WM we're the enemy, bringing disaster to Englandshire. It seems Scots are only good Scots when they know their place, keep quiet and vote for parties that are run from Westminster.
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I seem to recall my opinion being if you want to go the doors that way - and don't let hit you in the arse on the way out

however its not the SNP which will bring disaster per e - is the various spineless English politicians who will give up everying but mums best china in 'negotiation' if it gets them in to power
 
Steep said:
The best solution for Britain would be a minority government. No one party having a majority to force through their ideas on austerity or immigration or anything else means that only policies that are acceptable to a true majority of MPs will get through.

As for the SNP, how times change... seven months ago Scots were being told "don't leave" "Britain is only great with you in it" "Stay and be a part of the family" well we stayed, now suddenly when it looks like we might actually have a voice in WM we're the enemy, bringing disaster to Englandshire. It seems Scots are only good Scots when they know their place, keep quiet and vote for parties that are run from Westminster.
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Sturgeon has already stated SNP will get rid of Trident, now that would be a disaster for the country.

By the way, Happy St George's Day! I would be happy to buy you a pint to celebrate it !
 
big soft moose said:
I seem to recall my opinion being if you want to go the doors that way - and don't let hit you in the arse on the way out

however its not the SNP which will bring disaster per e - is the various spineless English politicians who will give up everying but mums best china in 'negotiation' if it gets them in to power
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I think most of us English were campaigning for a YES vote too - I was. I really fail to see how they have far more MPs per head of pop than us English.

I really can't see a coalition between the Tories and SNP - far too far apart. To be fair to Cameron and the Tories, they showed a spine in supporting the NO argument. The tories would be so much better off 'losing' the 49 or so seats north of the border as that would make it easier to get a majority.

I think its unfair to call them spineless - it will be people like the Libs or SNP that hold the power. Tories/labour will need to decide to have some form of power and concede on a few issues, or have no say at all. Surely some say is better than none?
 
may be she means by launching them at the french ISIS - if you want to get rid of them and one route involves a protracted discussion in parliment and expensive decomisioning and the other involves pressing a big red button and lots of explosions... its a bit of a no brainer :lol:
 
Steep said:
The best solution for Britain would be a minority government. No one party having a majority to force through their ideas on austerity or immigration or anything else means that only policies that are acceptable to a true majority of MPs will get through.
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Rubbish! Most votes are governed by the whip. I would like to see a secret ballot in place so MPs could actually vote freely. Most of the time they are told how to vote and risk being kicked out if they don't abide. This minority government has worked well, but that may not be the case next time around.

I love the fact that people are anti-austerity... how else do we pay back the debt? With SNP its a double whammy, scrapping trident will cost lots of jobs!
 
I'm not anti austerity cuts sensibly applied , I am anti cutting a load of frontline service jobs after promising not to while also commiting to spunk christ knows how much on a high speed rail link
 
Blank_Canvas said:
By the way, Happy St George's Day! I would be happy to buy you a pint to celebrate it !
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And you too, I welcome the chance to commend a Syrian immigrant to Rome who did well for himself, until he didn't. :)
 
cambsno said:
I really can't see a coalition between the Tories and SNP
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Get the word "coalition" out of your mind, think working together on a vote by vote basis with all or some of the smaller parties, the party whip is useless if you haven't got enough MPs to carry a vote which is why a minority government can do much less harm.

/Edit oh and ignore all that ^ in respect of a Tory government.
 
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big soft moose said:
I seem to recall my opinion being if you want to go the doors that way - and don't let hit you in the arse on the way out
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Just a shame 193k more Scots couldn't have been persuaded to think the same way.
 
cambsno said:
The tories would be so much better off 'losing' the 49 or so seats north of the border as that would make it easier to get a majority.
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Sorry missed that bit,the Tories only have 1 (one) seat North of the border. Labour have in the past held the majority but in very few cases have they needed them to win an election.
 
Steep said:
Just a shame 193k more Scots couldn't have been persuaded to think the same way.
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After listening to these fqwits in the SNP, so am I.
 
fracster said:
After listening to these fqwits in the SNP, so am I.
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You are of course entitled to your opinion, however poorly informed.
 
cambsno said:
I would like to see a secret ballot in place so MPs could actually vote freely.
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It's superficially attractive, but MPs are supposed to be accountable to the constituents whom they represent. Allowing them to vote in secret would seriously damage that accountability.
 
StewartR said:
It's superficially attractive, but MPs are supposed to be accountable to the constituents whom they represent. Allowing them to vote in secret would seriously damage that accountability.
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But do they? For the important votes they are told by their party how to vote and few pay attention to their constituents. In addition, do you think A labour mp would vote for a Tory policy even if his constituents supported it, or would a Tory vote to nationalise something if their constituents wanted it?
 
Personally I think people outwith Scotland just don't get why the SNP are so popular up here, the Conservative Party is dead up here as far as Westminster is concerned and association with them is what is going to kill the Lib Dems in Scotland at the election as it seems to be across the UK , Labour seem to be bearing the brunt of having sided with the Conservatives during last years referendum campaign and because they appear to be out of touch with a large proportion of the Scottish voters, policy wise though theres not much of a difference between Lab/SNP and even the difference there are (like scrapping Trident) are actually popular with large swathes of Labour MP's and voters.

I certainly don't see that their policies are any more ridiculous than Labour's considering theres very little difference...
 
cambsno said:
But do they? For the important votes they are told by their party how to vote and few pay attention to their constituents. In addition, do you think A labour mp would vote for a Tory policy even if his constituents supported it, or would a Tory vote to nationalise something if their constituents wanted it?
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Probably not. But the way it works is that MPs are there to represent their constituents' interests, and if constituents don't like they way their MPs vote in parliament then they have means of redress. They could not vote for that candidate next time, or they could agitate for the party to field a different candidate, etc.

Of course it's not a perfect system and it usually doesn't work like that. But there are organisations out there (They Work For You, etc) who make it quite easy for voters to find out exactly how their MP has been representing their interests (or not), if they are sufficiently interested. Take away the transparency of voting and you take away one of the most important checks in the system.
 
chrism_scotland said:
Personally I think people outwith Scotland just don't get why the SNP are so popular up here.............

...........I certainly don't see that their policies are any more ridiculous than Labour's considering theres very little difference...
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I think they're very popular because of how they market themselves to Scottish people.

They portray themselves as 'Scotland's Party' and dub the others the 'Westminster Parties' and it works.

They don't really have to dwell on policies as a large proportion of Scots would vote SNP regardless.
 
dinners said:
I think they're very popular because of how they market themselves to Scottish people.

They portray themselves as 'Scotland's Party' and dub the others the 'Westminster Parties' and it works.

They don't really have to dwell on policies as a large proportion of Scots would vote SNP regardless.
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They have two successful terms in government to their credit, that's worth a lot more than marketing.
 
Steep said:
They have two successful terms in government to their credit, that's worth a lot more than marketing.
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But many vote SNP simply because they're Scottish. SNP do a grand job of that.
 
That's kind of insulting to Scots Phi, or anyone else for that matter. The Scots have been inspired by last years referendum and are far more energised and active in politics than ever before.
 
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