The General Drone-Related Thread

You’d think police with helicopters and drones equipped with thermal imaging cameras would find the perpetrators easily, especially as they’d have to repeatedly land and recover them to change batteries. It’s hard to hide in the modern world so very surprising this is still going on.
 
cambsno said:
To those wanting more controls on drones, you do realise that these idiots will just ignore them - all it will do is penalise the normal person who abides by the current rules.

Perhaps we should have more controls on public photography as someone could be a p****???
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Oh OK, let's not bother then. The fact that thousands of people have been inconvenienced, and potentially hundreds could die in one incident is irrelevant as long as you can use your drone? Lets just allow anyone to have guns then shall we? It seems to work well in the USA. Unfortunately most rules are there to stop the tiny minority, rather than those obeying them. For example we have jut had to spend £1.5 million on new security scanners, which I assume is not to stop those boarding aircraft following the rules, but maybe it's a waste of time trying to control the risk...
 
cambsno said:
To those wanting more controls on drones, you do realise that these idiots will just ignore them - all it will do is penalise the normal person who abides by the current rules.

Perhaps we should have more controls on public photography as someone could be a p****???
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Nicely put. The thing is so many drone hobbyists do break the rules, I see so many images where people have overflown towns or are ignoring minimum distances. I’m not in favour of more regulation but surely it’s inevitable
 
Scirocco_09 said:
You’d think police with helicopters and drones equipped with thermal imaging cameras would find the perpetrators easily, especially as they’d have to repeatedly land and recover them to change batteries. It’s hard to hide in the modern world so very surprising this is still going on.
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They can fly for 30+ minutes I think, enough to be very annoying and possibly simply abandon the drone and start another.
Or they may be modded to fly longer somehow, I don't know but yes it is incredibly shocking that they have not been caught yet I totally agree.
 
Scirocco_09 said:
You’d think police with helicopters and drones equipped with thermal imaging cameras would find the perpetrators easily, especially as they’d have to repeatedly land and recover them to change batteries. It’s hard to hide in the modern world so very surprising this is still going on.
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The problem they have is, they could be flying from inside a car, off a balcony, a roof top, a garden, in a field anywhere from 1-7 miles away.

These have automatic home points and wey points, technically you could take off from the the south of Gatwick, set a way point north and have the home point set east, so you could take off, hit a button and go sit down and have a cup of tea, it would run low on battery, head home and automatically land where you told it.

Done right I would say it was almost impossible to find the pilot, unless they were stupid.
 
need to ban the sale and ownership of all drones
 
boyfalldown said:
What’s a drone and what’s a model aircraft & the difference between them? Also what’s stopping someone reasonably capable just building from scratch
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Not much, those of us who flew model aircraft outside of the appalling BMFA club orientated scene model flying have stopped. Lots of bad publicity caused by drone operators changed the public attitude to model flyers.
 
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rick448 said:
https://www.caa.co.uk/Consumers/Unmanned-aircraft/Model-aircraft/

Nothing to stop anyone building from scratch, like nothing to stop anyone building a gun.
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Building a gun is beyond the ability of most people. Obtaining ammunition with appropriate certification is problematic at best. Building a working model isn't.

I'm aware of the rules - but am unsure as to why you've posted a link for me?

Bearair said:
Not much, those of us who flew model aircraft outside of the appalling BMFA club orientated scene model flying has stopped. Lots of bad publicity caused by drone operators changed the public attitude to model flyers.
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I'm sorry you've lost a hobby because of an irresponsible few. It reenforces my point that you can't legislate against drones without catching modellers to
 
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IANAL but could the perpetrators be held personally liable for any/all costs due to their antics?
 
boyfalldown said:
Building a gun is beyond the ability of most people. Obtaining ammunition with appropriate certification is problematic at best. Building a working model isn't.

I'm aware of the rules - but am unsure as to why you've posted a link for me?
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I posted the link because you asked the question. Nevermind.

I'll go back in my shed to knock together a remote control aircraft before breakfast.
 
boyfalldown said:
I'm sorry you've lost a hobby because of an irresponsible few. It reenforces my point that you can't legislate against drones without catching modellers to
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It is a pity, but its no use blaming drone operators in general IMO the vast majority stick by the rules. More legislation will not help.
 
Nod said:
but could the perpetrators be held personally liable for any/all costs due to their antics?
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The last I heard, I don't know if there has been an up date, but it seems, one way or another, it falls out side the criteria for compensation ( to the travelers)
 
The airlines still have to transport the passengers and must have incurred huge costs. They have to find accommodation for strandees too, although some try to wriggle out of their liabilities.
 
Nod said:
They have to find accommodation for strandees too,
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I've not really been following it, but aren't people just being sent home or sleeping in the terminal buildings?
 
Nod said:
The airlines still have to transport the passengers and must have incurred huge costs. They have to find accommodation for strandees too, although some try to wriggle out of their liabilities.
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But surely the airlines are only responsible for cost incurred within their control? They may well choose to pay as a PR exercise, but I think it's unreasonable to expect them to cough up for the whole coast when they are not responsible for the closures. When delays are incurred on a normal day there are always debates around who is at fault, is it the airline, the ground handlers, the refuellers, the airport as a whole etc etc. As with most things which involve money, especially with the almost non existent margins for some airlines, it's never simple.
 
Surely if anybody should pay it should be the airport, ultimately they are responsible for ensuring the airlines can operate safely from their airport?
 
Bearair said:
Surely if anybody should pay it should be the airport, ultimately they are responsible for ensuring the airlines can operate safely from their airport?
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I think you may find that the airline/airport is only responsible if it can proven that they are negotiable is some way.

I’m thinking they would riggle out of this fairly easily if they can demonstrate the took ‘reasonable’ Measures to avoid such a thing.
 
Bearair said:
Surely if anybody should pay it should be the airport, ultimately they are responsible for ensuring the airlines can operate safely from their airport?
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So how do you propose an airport does this? If the Police and Military can't manage the situation, and the rules are unenforceable, I'd say it's unreasonable to expect the airport to be able to enforce this. Unfortunately aviation has gone the way of road haulage with a culture of undercutting to the point that it is hardly sustainable. Yes the big airports will always prevail, but others will go under and then prices will begin to rise. It is not sustainable to be able to fly to Spain for less than it costs for a taxi ride for 20 miles, and that is what is happening at the moment. Yes it's great for the traveller in the short term, but i fear for the long term sustainability of the industry.

Maybe this incident will kick off some higher level discussions around all of this, and maybe the Government will finally finish an aviation strategy...
 
rick448 said:
So how do you propose an airport does this? If the Police and Military can't manage the situation, and the rules are unenforceable, I'd say it's unreasonable to expect the airport to be able to enforce this. Unfortunately aviation has gone the way of road haulage with a culture of undercutting to the point that it is hardly sustainable. Yes the big airports will always prevail, but others will go under and then prices will begin to rise. It is not sustainable to be able to fly to Spain for less than it costs for a taxi ride for 20 miles, and that is what is happening at the moment. Yes it's great for the traveller in the short term, but i fear for the long term sustainability of the industry.

Maybe this incident will kick off some higher level discussions around all of this, and maybe the Government will finally finish an aviation strategy...
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It is not my problem to ensure airports can run safely is it? Personally if I had been in the airport business 10 years ago I would of been protesting and having talks with the government to find out why they allowed the import and use of aircraft capable of guided autonomous flight.
 
Bearair said:
It is not my problem to ensure airports can run safely is it? Personally if I had been in the airport business 10 years ago I would of been protesting and having talks with the government to find out why they allowed the import and use of aircraft capable of guided autonomous flight.
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I know it's not "your" problem, but if the Government , CAA, EASA, ICAO, DfT etc. can assist an airport in operating safely within the rules set out by them I'm sure airports will happily oblige.

Do you honestly think airport operators haven't been doing that? I can assure you they have.

I think I'll shut up about this now and leave it to people who know more about the situation. :)
 
Looks like they've arrested a couple of people, hope it's the right ones and it stops the disruption. However, hearing the figures on how many people are travelling from just one airport brings it home about how many flights are happening each day. No wonder the planet is warming up with all that CO2 and vapour entering the atmosphere. The human race really can't carry on like it is doing without reaping some pretty dire consequences.

If this was some sort of environmental protest then I don't condone direct action of this sort, but I do believe it's time to face up to the pollution the human race is causing. Who knows, perhaps jet air travel will eventually become about as socially acceptable as buying a mink coat is these days? Perhaps nothing will change until it's too late and the human race ends up more or less back in the stone age trying to survive in a hostile environment?
 
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Nod said:
IANAL but could the perpetrators be held personally liable for any/all costs due to their antics?
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Not in the UK. I knew a guy who racked up £30K of debt gambling and he never had to pay a penny back. They said he had mental health problems. Nothing wrong with the guy lol. My point is they are soft here on criminals.
 
lets hope those if proved guilty of the Gatwick Airport UK drone incident get at least 20 years in prison without parole and their faces posted up everywhere in the town they live in. They cause not only misery to thousands of people but also put lives at risk

Link

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46657505
 
realspeed said:
lets hope those if proved guilty of the Gatwick Airport UK drone incident get at least 20 years in prison without parole and their faces posted up everywhere in the town they live in. They cause not only misery to thousands of people but also put lives at risk

Link

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-46657505
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They can only be charged with the laws they have broken, it may well be that these will be reviewed following this incident, as well as the sentencing guidelines. Let's see :)
 
they can also be charged with endangering lives let alone the restrictions on drones around airports
 
realspeed said:
they can also be charged with endangering lives let alone the restrictions on drones around airports
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Yes, the laws they have broken. :)
 
cambsno said:
To those wanting more controls on drones, you do realise that these idiots will just ignore them - all it will do is penalise the normal person who abides by the current rules.

Perhaps we should have more controls on public photography as someone could be a p****???
Click to expand...


But to passify public perception legislation offers peace of mind to the populus. Look at the law which prohibited the ownership and use of pistols. Our Olympic team have to go to Belgium in order to practice and train because even their pistols are prohibited - so there have been no shootings with pistols since then have there? I agree with you, laws only work if people abide by them, criminals rarely do!
 
rick448 said:
I know it's not "your" problem, but if the Government , CAA, EASA, ICAO, DfT etc. can assist an airport in operating safely within the rules set out by them I'm sure airports will happily oblige.

Do you honestly think airport operators haven't been doing that? I can assure you they have.

I think I'll shut up about this now and leave it to people who know more about the situation. :)
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Not sure what you are getting so mad about, I clearly stated IF anybody is responsible, I did not blame anyone. Suggest you go grind that axe with someone who wants an argument.
 
Lensflare said:
But to passify public perception legislation offers peace of mind to the populus. Look at the law which prohibited the ownership and use of pistols. Our Olympic team have to go to Belgium in order to practice and train because even their pistols are prohibited - so there have been no shootings with pistols since then have there? I agree with you, laws only work if people abide by them, criminals rarely do!
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Lets not have any laws then, I'm fine with that :D
 
Bearair said:
Not sure what you are getting so mad about, I clearly stated IF anybody is responsible, I did not blame anyone. Suggest you go grind that axe with someone who wants an argument.
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I'm not getting mad mate, Im just saying that it's not as easy as saying IF anyone should pay it should be the airport. (which is what you actually said) I was just saying that I don't think that is necessarily the case. I have no axe to grind, sorry for not agreeing with you and putting an alternative view on the subject.
 
Mr Bump said:
need to ban the sale and ownership of all drones
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Haha, I think that would be about as effective as Australia's encryption "ban". People with malicious intent will still carry on unimpeded, while innocent, legitimate users will be at best inconvenienced.

boyfalldown said:
What’s a drone and what’s a model aircraft & the difference between them? Also what’s stopping someone reasonably capable just building from scratch
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Quite, I've been an aeromodeller on and off for 20 odd years, it's a great hobby and journey that taught me a tremendous amount in all manner of subjects. It got me into photography for one thing. I'm pretty sure I would be capable of building something rather troublesome from scratch without even using any drone specific components ;)

Regarding the Gatwick incident it's pretty pointless to speculate without all the facts to hand. But I will say if it turns out to be just some joker with just a basic "off the shelf" drone managing to evade the authorities for such a considerable amount of time, I think it's a pretty poor indictment of said authorities. If it is that straight forward, with the tools, resources and expertise the authorities should have at their disposal I can't see why they wouldn't be able to nip that in the bud fairly quickly. The writing has been on the wall for things like this to happen for a long time and they should of trained for it. If however it's a more sophisticated setup, for instance, involving multiple custom built drones dispatched from different locations, guided by waypoints and triggered/controlled over GSM, then fair play that's going to much harder to tackle.
 
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rick448 said:
I'm not getting mad mate, Im just saying that it's not as easy as saying IF anyone should pay it should be the airport. (which is what you actually said) I was just saying that I don't think that is necessarily the case. I have no axe to grind, sorry for not agreeing with you and putting an alternative view on the subject.
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As I said go grind your axe elsewhere, and I am not your mate.
 
rick448 said:
Lets not have any laws then, I'm fine with that :D
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What we actually need, and someone just above has alluded to the same, is proper sentencing and prisons thate are not seats of learning. Go to prison in Madeira (Portuguese and so part of EU and under the European Civil Rights Act), they give you a solid bed, basic rations of water and 'porridge', only it isn't Quaker Oats! If you want better food and bedding your family have to supply you with it. Guess what, there is very little crime in Madeira!
 
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