The Football Thread - Season 2012/2013

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Arsenal's website has confirmed the Nacho Monreal deal as done. Great that we have cover for Gibbs now, for the PL and FA cup at least. There's still big questions over how we've loaned out so many players and not replaced them. I never thought we'd end January with a lighter squad than we began. I may write a longer post on it all later.
 
That's the one I posted in the post above yours but decided to remove LOL

To be honest I think it applies equally to all clubs - it is a little on the harsh side of course!
 
Worth mentioning that Afobe has been recalled from loan too. He's a tidy player but not exactly the David Villa so many fans were crying out for!
 
akr said:
I've always liked Villa park and the Villa fans - for obvious reasons this season I hope they go down so we stay up. Appointing Mcleish was the worst decision ever, I'm not sure what the issue with Warnock and Bent is, it's strange. They've tried to change to squad too quickly and it shows (that may be somewhat ironic coming from me!)

That's reminded me. Appointing MacLeish was a joke so they deserve everything they get!
 
TriggerHappy said:
Arsenal's website has confirmed the Nacho Monreal deal as done. Great that we have cover for Gibbs now, for the PL and FA cup at least. There's still big questions over how we've loaned out so many players and not replaced them. I never thought we'd end January with a lighter squad than we began. I may write a longer post on it all later.

Because wenger is clueless???

Ok, frimpong may not be the greatest mid but he is the best defensive holding mid we have, and what are we crying out for (aside from a rb and cb or 3)???
 
cambsno said:
Because wenger is clueless???

Ok, frimpong may not be the greatest mid but he is the best defensive holding mid we have, and what are we crying out for (aside from a rb and cb or 3)???

Coquelin is leagues ahead of Frimpong.

What we're really crying out for is consistency and reliability. When we play well I'd genuinely fancy our chances against any team in Europe and beyond. The problem is the individual errors and the way players go missing at times. Sadly you can't buy a jar of consistency in January.

There is a question of spending. It's genuinely concerning that it took an injury to Gibbs to bring forward the transfer of Munreal from summer to now. The real question is why money isn't being spent?...To be honest I've started typing out this long winded post that I've had in my head for a while but I just can't be bothered because it won't change anything for anyone.
 
Weird deadline day. A bit of an anticlimax, though the Odemwingie saga brought some humour and bemusement. :lol: :thinking: :lol: Who was advising him? :shrug: :lol:



Just read a good article about Suarez for a change.

Nice video of his daughter, Delfina. Coincidentally an anagram of Anfield. :lol:
[YOUTUBE]bRFnceotIog[/YOUTUBE]
 
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clint-eastwood-disgusted-gif.gif


;)
 
Allow me to start on a positive note. An interesting stat is that prior to the Liverpool game (23 games into the season) we had exactly the same number of points as we did last season at the same stage (37), but this season we have scored 7 more goals and conceded 6 fewer goals than we had the previous season resulting in a goal difference improved by 13. I bring this up because it highlights the argument that we have the quality in the side to produce great results, despite the oft raised issue of losing our 'best' players.

Furthering the positive vibe, let's give praise to Wenger and the club for adding strength where we need it most with a very talented individual for a very reasonable price.

this isn't a panic purchase, despite the need for speed this week. There was a deal in principle for Monreal to arrive at the Emirates this summer, and he has already been taking English lessons in anticipation of the move. Gibbs' injury simply pushed things along

The 26-year-old Monreal will fit seamlessly at Arsenal. He has an elegant blend of being a tough tackler and a technically gifted player on the ball. His positioning is excellent, while his decision-making has placed him firmly on the radar of Spain's "big two" for a number of years. 

Good in the air, difficult to knock off the ball, with an eye for a killer ball – that sums up Monreal.

Link

This isn't to say we are without our issues. It's worrying that it took an injury to Gibbs for the club to decide to bring in cover for him this season. These concerns are perfectly articulated in a quotation from a statement issued by the Arsenal Shareholders Trust below.

The January transfer window is an opportunity for teams to strengthen for the future and provide a boost to the squad for the season run-in.
Once again, despite poor league form by our own high standards, we see extremely limited activity by Arsenal, who have decided that there is just one player, at a price deemed acceptable, capable of strengthening the first team squad.
We can only assume this is purely a footballing decision taken by the manager, and that across the squad he feels there were no other options better than the 'two per position' he maintains are both important and available to him.
The fact that there is money available for squad strengthening is not disputed. The AST's independent analysis suggests that the amount is somewhere between £50m-£70m. Ivan Gazidis confirmed recently that considerable funds were available to the manager.
Failure to qualify for the Champions League will cost the club in the region of £30m to £40m in lost revenue in the 2013-14 season, but this will be compensated for by increased TV and commercial monies that are due as well as income from the sale of the Queensland Road site. On this basis the financial 'hit' is manageable and the AST does not believe there is any case for the present financial austerity.
The AST believes that there remain important questions about the way player identification, recruitment and remuneration processes are managed at Arsenal. They seem to be a long way from what would be expected and we intend to raise these issues again with the club.
Arsenal supporters pay some of the highest ticket prices in world football, providing the club with considerable financial resources but the ambition and ability to use them appear to be missing.
Continued missed opportunities to strengthen are detrimental to the club and are causing long term damage to the squad's competitiveness, evidenced by the ever-increasing points gap between Arsenal and the top of the table.
The AST hopes that Arsenal's distant owner and its Board are looking at this situation as critically as its supporters.

Link

And that leads us perfectly on to a look at our January transfer activity. Here's a simple summary of the comings and goings.

Out:

Chuks Aneke (Loan)

Emmanual Frimpong (Loan)

Johan Djourou (Loan)

Marouane Chamakh (Loan)

In:

Nacho Monreal (approx. £8.5m)

Benik Afobe (Returned from loan)

Despite the addition of a quality alternative at left back, we're still 2 players lighter than we were at the start of the window. This begs the question what is happening with regards investment in the team?

Based on the quotes Ivan Gazidis feeds the media it would be easy to jump to the assumption that it's Arsene Wenger who's completely unwilling to open the purse strings and of course at least some of the blame is with Wenger.

“All of the money we make is made available to our manager and he has done an unbelievable job in managing that spend.”

“I want to be clear that the money we generate is available to our manager,*Arsène Wenger, and that he quite rightly makes the decisions regarding how to invest those funds.”

Assuming Gazidis is correct then it's undoubtedly Wenger who's responsible. To make that assumption, though, is to forget that Gazidis' boss is owner Stan Kroenke - the man who stands to benefit most from the vast cash reserves Arsenal currently hold. Calculations range wildly across the web but anywhere from £50m to upwards of £100m is the range you can find across the internet.

Ultimately though, we know from his other sports teams that Kroenke is a cold, hard business man who has no passion in Arsenal and his only pursuit in sporting ventures is profit. With such a large - and still growing - balance our enterprise value is substantially higher than it would be if said money was spent. This, in turn, means that share prices are worth considerably more and with the monumentally rich Alisher Usmanov waiting in the wings for an opportunity to buy more of our club it's unsurprising that Kroenke is pursuing a strategy that maximises the share price with little regard to the overall success of the club. As a businessman I can't criticise what Kroenke is doing, but as a fan who wants success not riches it makes my tummy turn. It's my interpretation that the purse strings are held tight by Kroenke, that the club is restricted in its investment towards the best talent, and that Arsene Wenger is being made a scapegoat for all that is going on behind the scenes and away from public knowledge.

Let's not forget where we were prior to the Wenger era. Wenger made us who we are more than any other manger. Kroenke's takeover of Arsenal in 2008 coincided conveniently with the move to the Emirates (I hate having to call it that) a couple of years earlier. A spell of financial austerity following that move meant that we would have to tighten our belts for a spell, although a rights issue could have cleared those debts far earlier than now if the club wished to spend money freely. It also occurred during a decade where investment in other clubs blew transfer fees and wages sky high, and made the very best few players unaffordable to all except a handful of clubs. All this provides reasonable excuses for why to be sensible, but not why we need tens, maybe even a hundred million, pounds held in cash reserves whilst year on year we allow talent to leave either in pursuit of the greater wages available elsewhere or because they perceive there to be a lack of ambition in the club.

There's more problems too, at Arsenal. This month we've played 5 home games and won just one. That's a terrible home record. It's my belief that the invincibles era attracted a lot of fans who felt trophies were a right and not a reward at Arsenal. Fans who have absolutely no understanding of how far we've come under Wenger. Now the home support is vastly different to the old Highbury way. Fans boo and jeer at players after 20 minutes. They berate the staff and players in the dugout. That's disgusting behaviour for fans of any side. Then you have the black scarf brigade who organise pre-match marches against the club, or the people who hold a 'Wenger out' banner high in the stands. By all means voice concerns towards the ownership/management of the club, but you best be damn careful to do it in a way that isn't detrimental to our performances. Currently the fans' negativity is perpetuating mental problems within the team. The sooner we lose the fans who think it's acceptable to organise pre-match marches, wave dissenting banners, and boo a player when they slip up the more quickly this club will get back on track. Right now it's a self-fulfilling prophecy and certain segments of the Arsenal fan-base seem to relish the fact that bad performances support their stance.

Ramsey, Walcott and Santos have all come in for a lot of stick over the past 12 months. They've not always played well, but they're players that never hide, never stop trying their best and that is commendable. In the case of Santos he simply is being asked to play at a level beyond his ability. He just isn't good enough to play in the Premier League for Arsenal, but that's not his fault. When he's asked to play he tries hard. There's absolutely no justification for the abuse he's been on the receiving end of both pitch-side and on twitter recently. That unsupportive voice needs to vanish, and vanish fast.

I think I've ranted and rambled enough. I could go on forever!
 
Not only is the transfer deadline day a goonfest, there are some folk on here with obsessive tendencies too!
 
tiler65 said:
Not only is the transfer deadline day a goonfest, there are some folk on here with obsessive tendencies too!

Another valuable contribution :thumbs:
 
Allow me to start on a positive note. An interesting stat is that prior to the Liverpool game (23 games into the season) we had exactly the same number of points as we did last season at the same stage (37), but this season we have scored 7 more goals and conceded 6 fewer goals than we had the previous season resulting in a goal difference improved by 13. I bring this up because it highlights the argument that we have the quality in the side to produce great results, despite the oft raised issue of losing our 'best' players.

Furthering the positive vibe, let's give praise to Wenger and the club for adding strength where we need it most with a very talented individual for a very reasonable price.



Link

This isn't to say we are without our issues. It's worrying that it took an injury to Gibbs for the club to decide to bring in cover for him this season. These concerns are perfectly articulated in a quotation from a statement issued by the Arsenal Shareholders Trust below.



Link

And that leads us perfectly on to a look at our January transfer activity. Here's a simple summary of the comings and goings.

Out:

Chuks Aneke (Loan)

Emmanual Frimpong (Loan)

Johan Djourou (Loan)

Marouane Chamakh (Loan)

In:

Nacho Monreal (approx. £8.5m)

Benik Afobe (Returned from loan)

Despite the addition of a quality alternative at left back, we're still 2 players lighter than we were at the start of the window. This begs the question what is happening with regards investment in the team?

Based on the quotes Ivan Gazidis feeds the media it would be easy to jump to the assumption that it's Arsene Wenger who's completely unwilling to open the purse strings and of course at least some of the blame is with Wenger.





Assuming Gazidis is correct then it's undoubtedly Wenger who's responsible. To make that assumption, though, is to forget that Gazidis' boss is owner Stan Kroenke - the man who stands to benefit most from the vast cash reserves Arsenal currently hold. Calculations range wildly across the web but anywhere from £50m to upwards of £100m is the range you can find across the internet.

Ultimately though, we know from his other sports teams that Kroenke is a cold, hard business man who has no passion in Arsenal and his only pursuit in sporting ventures is profit. With such a large - and still growing - balance our enterprise value is substantially higher than it would be if said money was spent. This, in turn, means that share prices are worth considerably more and with the monumentally rich Alisher Usmanov waiting in the wings for an opportunity to buy more of our club it's unsurprising that Kroenke is pursuing a strategy that maximises the share price with little regard to the overall success of the club. As a businessman I can't criticise what Kroenke is doing, but as a fan who wants success not riches it makes my tummy turn. It's my interpretation that the purse strings are held tight by Kroenke, that the club is restricted in its investment towards the best talent, and that Arsene Wenger is being made a scapegoat for all that is going on behind the scenes and away from public knowledge.

Let's not forget where we were prior to the Wenger era. Wenger made us who we are more than any other manger. Kroenke's takeover of Arsenal in 2008 coincided conveniently with the move to the Emirates (I hate having to call it that) a couple of years earlier. A spell of financial austerity following that move meant that we would have to tighten our belts for a spell, although a rights issue could have cleared those debts far earlier than now if the club wished to spend money freely. It also occurred during a decade where investment in other clubs blew transfer fees and wages sky high, and made the very best few players unaffordable to all except a handful of clubs. All this provides reasonable excuses for why to be sensible, but not why we need tens, maybe even a hundred million, pounds held in cash reserves whilst year on year we allow talent to leave either in pursuit of the greater wages available elsewhere or because they perceive there to be a lack of ambition in the club.

There's more problems too, at Arsenal. This month we've played 5 home games and won just one. That's a terrible home record. It's my belief that the invincibles era attracted a lot of fans who felt trophies were a right and not a reward at Arsenal. Fans who have absolutely no understanding of how far we've come under Wenger. Now the home support is vastly different to the old Highbury way. Fans boo and jeer at players after 20 minutes. They berate the staff and players in the dugout. That's disgusting behaviour for fans of any side. Then you have the black scarf brigade who organise pre-match marches against the club, or the people who hold a 'Wenger out' banner high in the stands. By all means voice concerns towards the ownership/management of the club, but you best be damn careful to do it in a way that isn't detrimental to our performances. Currently the fans' negativity is perpetuating mental problems within the team. The sooner we lose the fans who think it's acceptable to organise pre-match marches, wave dissenting banners, and boo a player when they slip up the more quickly this club will get back on track. Right now it's a self-fulfilling prophecy and certain segments of the Arsenal fan-base seem to relish the fact that bad performances support their stance.

Ramsey, Walcott and Santos have all come in for a lot of stick over the past 12 months. They've not always played well, but they're players that never hide, never stop trying their best and that is commendable. In the case of Santos he simply is being asked to play at a level beyond his ability. He just isn't good enough to play in the Premier League for Arsenal, but that's not his fault. When he's asked to play he tries hard. There's absolutely no justification for the abuse he's been on the receiving end of both pitch-side and on twitter recently. That unsupportive voice needs to vanish, and vanish fast.

I think I've ranted and rambled enough. I could go on forever!

Whatever Tommy says that's a good post, mate.
 
Agree but fans pay a lot of money so are entitled to boo. Wenger builds expectations by saying we can win league, have a good squad and don't need to add to it, which is rubbish and every fan knows it. If he came out and said that we have no chance of competing with Manchester and Chelsea, then expectations fall and fans are more tolerant.

The problem is that we have 2 very good defs in mets and vermalen who seem to have lost the ability to defend. Either improve them or get rid. The fans were probably booing Ramsay as they could not believe he was playing effectively left or right winger!!!!
 
Agree but fans pay a lot of money so are entitled to boo. Wenger builds expectations by saying we can win league, have a good squad and don't need to add to it, which is rubbish and every fan knows it. If he came out and said that we have no chance of competing with Manchester and Chelsea, then expectations fall and fans are more tolerant.

i dont get this. If wenger says it it doesnt mean anyone has to believe it. Clearly you don't believe it so what difference does it make that you disagree with him?

You have your expectations which are not affected either way by what wenger says - what difference would it make to your following oof your team if wenger said they could win, or come 4th?

Surely you expectations are your own?
 
cambsno said:
Agree but fans pay a lot of money so are entitled to boo. Wenger builds expectations by saying we can win league, have a good squad and don't need to add to it, which is rubbish and every fan knows it. If he came out and said that we have no chance of competing with Manchester and Chelsea, then expectations fall and fans are more tolerant.

The problem is that we have 2 very good defs in mets and vermalen who seem to have lost the ability to defend. Either improve them or get rid. The fans were probably booing Ramsay as they could not believe he was playing effectively left or right winger!!!!

Are you forgetting Wenger saying that 4th is our trophy? That's as clear a statement as any for our ambitions.

In a side ravaged by confidence issues he can't publicly deny them the belief that they can compete with the best. In fact, in all the years of watching his press conferences I don't think he's ever criticised one of his players for their performance. That's just not the man he is.

You seem to talk about his job as though it's easy when in fact it's anything but.

As for booing, I don't agree that it's ever wise to boo your own team. If a result is sufficiently disgraceful after the final whistle then I can understand the motive behind it but to boo whilst there's still even a second on the clock is disgusting behaviour from fans in my opinion. Whilst the game is being played you should get behind your own team no matter what. That's why I love our away fans but cringe at some of what goes on at home. The two groups are worlds apart in attitude.
 
Oldham Police are reporting that Paul Scholes has just tried to tackle the car thieves.
 
Sounds like Remy has torn a groin muscle. That's going got to be a big blow!
 
tiler65 said:
That's rich (no pun intended) coming from somebody who uses the exploitation of females to earn a crust.

This guy built the biggest house built in the UK during the 20th century, is he saying he has never tried to earn a fast buck (pun intended)

Please elaborate, I know nothing about the man himself...
 
Nacho Monreal just made himself an instant crowd favourite with that accidental clash of heads on Walters!
 
tiler65 said:
That's rich (no pun intended) coming from somebody who uses the exploitation of females to earn a crust.

This guy built the biggest house built in the UK during the 20th century, is he saying he has never tried to earn a fast buck (pun intended)

Publishing porn is hardly exploitation of women, unless your a feminist!!! If anything it exploits men as we buy the stuff!!
 
Simon, are you honestly saying the porn industry does not exploit women? If you believe that then you might need to do some research before jerking off next.
 
TriggerHappy said:
Are you forgetting Wenger saying that 4th is our trophy? That's as clear a statement as any for our ambitions.

In a side ravaged by confidence issues he can't publicly deny them the belief that they can compete with the best. In fact, in all the years of watching his press conferences I don't think he's ever criticised one of his players for their performance. That's just not the man he is.

You seem to talk about his job as though it's easy when in fact it's anything but.

As for booing, I don't agree that it's ever wise to boo your own team. If a result is sufficiently disgraceful after the final whistle then I can understand the motive behind it but to boo whilst there's still even a second on the clock is disgusting behaviour from fans in my opinion. Whilst the game is being played you should get behind your own team no matter what. That's why I love our away fans but cringe at some of what goes on at home. The two groups are worlds apart in attitude.

He has no alternative gameplan. 9 or 10 of the team play every game if available. No pressure on people like sagna fearing being dropped. Same with subs, podolski comes off 90% of the time!!!

The defence make basic mistakes game after game, the 2 goals v Liverpool were primary school stuff. Do they train, do they practice??? Earlier this season he was saying we could challenge for league before conceding we couldn't. I don't see moyes doing that. We cringe when Benitez comes out saying Torres is great, same with wenger. Defending the performance against Bradford was taking the pee. No shot on target till 70 mins against a league 2 side. From what I saw there was little in the way of passion. A good manager would have slated the team.
 
cambsno said:
He has no alternative gameplan. 9 or 10 of the team play every game if available. No pressure on people like sagna fearing being dropped. Same with subs, podolski comes off 90% of the time!!!

The defence make basic mistakes game after game, the 2 goals v Liverpool were primary school stuff. Do they train, do they practice??? Earlier this season he was saying we could challenge for league before conceding we couldn't. I don't see moyes doing that. We cringe when Benitez comes out saying Torres is great, same with wenger. Defending the performance against Bradford was taking the pee. No shot on target till 70 mins against a league 2 side. From what I saw there was little in the way of passion. A good manager would have slated the team.

Have you seen the team that's playing today? Diaby, Arteta, the Ox, Nacho and Koscielny all start. That's 5 changes to address the strengths of Stoke.

You don't seem to appreciate the difference between smashing the team on camera and doing so in private in the changing room. Wenger is a loyal man, he'd never air the club's issues publicly. However, there were reports that you could hear Wenger giving the team both barrels right down the corridor from the changing room after that Bradford game.

I'm sorry, but I have a lot of difficulty understanding your opinion when it's flawed and misinformed on so many levels.

Edit: as for Poldi coming off, the stats clearly show his performance tails off hugely after 70 minutes because he works so hard up and down the field when he's on the left. Asking him to do more would be stupid both for him and the team.
 
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Terrible reffing for this arsenal game. Clear red for a two handed push to the face missed by the ref.

But credit to the ref there for ignoring the linesman and the hopeless claims by Stoke!
 
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The23rdman said:
Simon, are you honestly saying the porn industry does not exploit women? If you believe that then you might need to do some research before jerking off next.

Well, most brands we wear like Nike exploit kids yet we all turn a blind eye. As far as I know, most (as there are always exceptions) women are not forced into porn, they choose to do it.
 
TriggerHappy said:
Have you seen the team that's playing today? Diaby, Arteta, the Ox, Nacho and Koscielny all start. That's 5 changes to address the strengths of Stoke.

You don't seem to appreciate the difference between smashing the team on camera and doing so in private in the changing room. Wenger is a loyal man, he'd never air the club's issues publicly. However, there were reports that you could hear Wenger giving the team both barrels right down the corridor from the changing room after that Bradford game.

I'm sorry, but I have a lot of difficulty understanding your opinion when it's flawed and misinformed on so many levels.

Edit: as for Poldi coming off, the stats clearly show his performance tails off hugely after 70 minutes because he works so hard up and down the field when he's on the left. Asking him to do more would be stupid both for him and the team.

Hadn't seen team but I know koscielny and nacho are natural changes due to injuries.

I am not exoecting him to go on tv and say so and so was s@@t But He could have just said we played badly, but to say we played well was IMO disrespectful to the fans and so far removed from truth it was laughable.

I manage people and generally will always back them especially in public but at times I will publicly bash them if needed.
 
And that was a stone wall red for Shawcross. To think I defended him for that Ramsey tackle a few years ago. I have no problem admitting I wad wrong, I misjudged his character, and have since learnt better!
 
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