The Amazing Sony A1/A7/A9/APS-C & Anything else welcome Mega Thread!

snerkler said:
I’m intrigued by Canon’s focus by eye tech, I wonder how good it is in the real world and at fast apertures.
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yeah seems like it works fairly well too.
I quite like everything I see about the R3 apart from the silly large body (and the price tag).
 
nandbytes said:
yeah seems like it works fairly well too.
I quite like everything I see about the R3 apart from the silly large body (and the price tag).
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The Canon system does look good,..... until you see the prices :eek:
 
nandbytes said:
Its certainly amazing but Sony is still missing a lot on some features a lot of other brands provide these days like focus stacking/bracketing, decent touch interface, etc etc
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Yeah they do still lack in some areas. Features like focus stacking for me are a mute point as I'd say they're features more aimed at amateurs than the intended audience for an A1.
 
TGphoto said:
Yeah they do still lack in some areas. Features like focus stacking for me are a mute point as I'd say they're features more aimed at amateurs than the intended audience for an A1.
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how is focus stacking/bracketing for amateurs?
It is very useful for both macro and landscape photography.
Feels a bit like when canonikon folks were claiming eyeAF was for amateurs and they didn't need it in their pro bodies.
Any feature that makes taking photos easier is a good feature to have no such thing as "amateur" feature.
 
nandbytes said:
how is focus stacking/bracketing for amateurs?
It is very useful for both macro and landscape photography.
Feels a bit like when canonikon folks were claiming eyeAF was for amateurs and they didn't need it in their pro bodies.
Any feature that makes taking photos easier is a good feature to have no such thing as "amateur" feature.
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Because anyone spending £6k on a camera should be competent enough to blend a couple of images in photoshop. At the end of the day, how much of the work do you want to camera to do? All these extra features just suck the skill and fun out of it.
 
TGphoto said:
Because anyone spending £6k on a camera should be competent enough to blend a couple of images in photoshop. At the end of the day, how much of the work do you want to camera to do? All these extra features just suck the skill and fun out of it.
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exactly what canonikon fans claimed about eyeAF:
"Sucks the skill out of it"
"People have been good taking picture for XX years without it etc"
etc etc

till they got it in their cameras or a bunch of them moved to Sony for it after they realised how useful it was.

If you think focus stacking is "blend a couple of images in photoshop" you are seriously mistaken.

I have spent £6K on that camera and I am competent enough to focus stack without that feature just as I was competent enough to get people in focus without eye AF.
That is really a not a good reason not to provide a feature.
Why not just shoot with a manual lenses then, that requires a lot of skill :p
there is no skill or fun in wasting time in post processing because your camera couldn't perform a certain function.
 
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snerkler said:
I’m intrigued by Canon’s focus by eye tech, I wonder how good it is in the real world and at fast apertures.
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It is only for initial acquisition at the moment. I think it will be far more useful when it can be used to track and object while moving and with the camera in servo. IT is so easy with teh Sonys to have a point in the middle aim and then let tracking take over. No doubt the eye focussing will give a tiny advantage but if they could get it real time and tracking it would be a game changer.
 
Raymond Lin said:
"Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer.

The camera might give a boost to your talent, but you still need to see the photo.
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indeed, photography is still an art. any tool that helps you achieve your vision is a good tool. the less it gets in your way the better it is.
 
nandbytes said:
exactly what canonikon fans claimed about eyeAF:
"Sucks the skill out of it"
"People have been good taking picture for XX years without it etc"
etc etc

till they got it in their cameras or a bunch of them moved to Sony for it after they realised how useful it was.

If you think focus stacking is "blend a couple of images in photoshop" you are seriously mistaken.

I have spent £6K on that camera and I am competent enough to focus stack without that feature just as I was competent enough to get people in focus without eye AF.
That is really a not a good reason not to provide a feature.
Why not just shoot with a manual lenses then, that requires a lot of skill :p
there is no skill or fun in wasting time in post processing because your camera couldn't perform a certain function.
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It's completely different, eye af is actually going to help massively by giving you sharper shots where it counts, that cannot be done in post. Focus stacking has always been a post production technique, it's not a natural thing and cameras aren't able to achieve this without internally processing the images.

I've done focus stacking loads of times, it's literally what it is. In macro terms, obviously there are more than a couple of shots.

It's just like that terrible feature they used to have for long exposures, people moaned when that was taken away but it was literally just a terrible and lazy way of getting a shot and always just produced a computerised looking image from the examples I saw.

Why does this forum always end in debate haha, I literally said I tried a camera out and it was good.
 
nandbytes said:
how is focus stacking/bracketing for amateurs?
It is very useful for both macro and landscape photography.
Feels a bit like when canonikon folks were claiming eyeAF was for amateurs and they didn't need it in their pro bodies.
Any feature that makes taking photos easier is a good feature to have no such thing as "amateur" feature.
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And here, you've interpreted what I said as you please and not as I clearly meant it.

Focus stacking is a very useful technique used by many professionals, but it is a POST PRODUCTION technique, not something cameras should be doing.
 
TGphoto said:
And here, you've interpreted what I said as you please and not as I clearly meant it.

Focus stacking is a very useful technique used by many professionals, but it is a POST PRODUCTION technique, not something cameras should be doing.
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Why not, if a camera can do it internally great, might be useful for some.
 
TGphoto said:
And here, you've interpreted what I said as you please and not as I clearly meant it.

Focus stacking is a very useful technique used by many professionals, but it is a POST PRODUCTION technique, not something cameras should be doing.
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I'd love the Sony camera I have to have the ability to do focus stacking, in terms of moving focus a pre determined distance for a number of shots or until infinity. The processing may be best done post but the automatic adjustment of focus is a feature Sony misses. ProCapture in Olympus where a constant number of images are buffered and available at a shutter press is massively useful and there is no reason that couldn't be an option. Sony has a few features missing imo
 
TGphoto said:
And here, you've interpreted what I said as you please and not as I clearly meant it.

Focus stacking is a very useful technique used by many professionals, but it is a POST PRODUCTION technique, not something cameras should be doing.
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Why shouldn't a camera be doing it if it can do it?
All the camera does is take a bunch of shots buy changing lens focus slightly and give RAW files I can stack in PP. Right now I need a tripod to achieve this on Sony camera with likes of canon could probably do it handheld. With fast readout speeds Sony cameras could easy focus bracket a LOT of shots quickly to enable handheld focus bracketing.
By this logic exposure bracketing is something a camera shouldn't do either.
 
You'd always want the camera to process internally anyway for the jpegs.
 
nandbytes said:
Why shouldn't a camera be doing it if it can do it?
All the camera does is take a bunch of shots buy changing lens focus slightly and give RAW files I can stack in PP. Right now I need a tripod to achieve this on Sony camera with likes of canon could probably do it handheld. With fast readout speeds Sony cameras could easy focus bracket a LOT of shots quickly to enable handheld focus bracketing.
By this logic exposure bracketing is something a camera shouldn't do either.
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Or auto ISO, how dare the camera choose my ISO.
All Pro cameras should only have M on the dial and manual lenses only as well, after all it's skill that makes a photo.
 
nandbytes said:
Why shouldn't a camera be doing it if it can do it?
All the camera does is take a bunch of shots buy changing lens focus slightly and give RAW files I can stack in PP. Right now I need a tripod to achieve this on Sony camera with likes of canon could probably do it handheld. With fast readout speeds Sony cameras could easy focus bracket a LOT of shots quickly to enable handheld focus bracketing.
By this logic exposure bracketing is something a camera shouldn't do either.
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I've had my fun now. Replied because you can't just say you liked something on this forum without having a critic. Even so much as saying something was good is enough to draw out the critics.

Quite amusing watching it unravel.

I'm not actually against any of these features :LOL:
 
TGphoto said:
Why does this forum always end in debate haha, I literally said I tried a camera out and it was good.
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TGphoto said:
I've had my fun now. Replied because you can't just say you liked something on this forum without having a critic. Even so much as saying something was good is enough to draw out the critics.

Quite amusing watching it unravel.

I'm not actually against any of these features :LOL:
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Welcome to the internet
duty_calls.png


But the debate has really gone down a path I didn't intend to... my point wasn't just focus bracketing/stacking but there's bunch of stuff Sony are missing
Long exposure composite view
Pentax uses its IBIS and GPS to make a in built star tracker
Canon's animal eye AF is actually better (even works on insects sometimes!)
Touch screen implementation isn't all that good especially for controlling the camera and video preview
in body focus limiter which actually existed in their own a-mount cameras
IBIS has really not improved since it was introduced. Canon on their first try are capable of doing 1-2s long exposures!

..... I could go on for a day.

Well yes I am critical about it because I paid £6K for it and cheaper bodies are doing things I'd expect this to do. Of course I don't expect Sony to implement/improve everything but they just seems to be ignoring all these usability features which IMO is important. Only a matter of time before canon catches up (though I'd never buy the silly large body).
 
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I was quite surprised how behind Sony are in certain areas, especially the touch screen (considering they are a major phone manufacturer). I honestly couldn't believe there was no touch shutter on the A9, or tha fact you can't navigate the menus with it.
 
Mike.P said:
I was quite surprised how behind Sony are in certain areas, especially the touch screen (considering they are a major phone manufacturer). I honestly couldn't believe there was no touch shutter on the A9, or tha fact you can't navigate the menus with it.
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you can't change setting with touch screen even on A1/A7SIII. you also cannot do things like scrub through videos etc.
It's really poor.
Touch screen is not a huge deal breaker for me personally (I don't even use it!) but its just the attitude of Sony towards all these usability features that gets me.
 
Mike.P said:
Personally I don't even have the touch screen turned on because there is so little you can do with it. Didn't Sony do a load of paid for apps for their cameras in previous bodies?
(I'm sure I read that years ago)
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they did and I even own a couple which I can't use now :mad:
they were actually really good apps. Smooth reflection app was one of my favourites.
In fact their time lapse app is better than the crappy time lapse functionality they provide now.
 
They definitely need a better time lapse/intervalometer function.
I also have the touch screen turned off, my nose was constantly changing the focus point, plus im a centre spot focus point kind of person.
 
I've said it before but one feature I don't understand many cameras don't have is sweep panorama. Sure you can do it in post, but sometimes it's nice to be able to do a fast pano shot. I've sometimes wondered if you can do this using burst shooting and move the camera, or whether you'd end up with motion artefacts. I'll have to try it one day with a fast shutter.
 
snerkler said:
I've said it before but one feature I don't understand many cameras don't have is sweep panorama. Sure you can do it in post, but sometimes it's nice to be able to do a fast pano shot. I've sometimes wondered if you can do this using burst shooting and move the camera, or whether you'd end up with motion artefacts. I'll have to try it one day with a fast shutter.
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yet another feature Sony removed from their cameras (pretty sure original A7 had it). Its a "amateur feature" not worthy of pro-cameras apparently :p
 
nandbytes said:
yet another feature Sony removed from their cameras (pretty sure original A7 had it). Its a "amateur feature" not worthy of pro-cameras apparently :p
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Got it on my RX100 as well, where it shows you the outline of the previous photo, you roughly line it up and it auto takes the next photo and so on.
 
I'm doing a lot of research into Fuji Medium format. Particularly the GFX 100s.
Thing is I need to evaluate it for my needs. I'm a fan of eye af. Sony's is astonishing.
Shots like this are made so easy. And I love the shallow depth of field available to me.
Yes I've posted this elsewhere on the forum.

MV and Owner.jpg by Trevor, on Flickr
 
Just on the subject of the kit doing or not doing stuff for you. Auto ISO is wonderful and even more so when it's available in all modes. It is IMO a real Game Changer. Ditto eye and even just face detect as they allow you to position your main subject just about anywhere in the frame and take the picture quickly without the need to move the focus point or focus and recompose. Couple these two things together and even with my slow to operate A7 I can take pictures that would have been just about impossible without these features. Without them the spontaneous moment would be missed and instead pictures would need to be posed or taken using smaller apertures and prefocused.
 
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woof woof said:
Auto ISO is wonderful and even more so when it's available in all modes. It is IMO a real Game Changer. Ditto eye and even just face detect as they allow you to position your main subject just about anywhere in the frame and take the picture quickly without the need to move the focus point or focus and recompose. Couple these two things together and even with my slow to operate A7 I can take pictures that would have been just about impossible without these features. Without them the spontaneous moment would be missed and instead pictures would need to be posed or taken using smaller apertures and prefocused.
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Yep, all these aids help us get shots that otherwise would have been impossible to get previously without making compromises. It's an example of why I hate comments on another thread on this site when someone's asked what gear got a particular shot only to receive multiple comments about how it's nothing to do with the gear and all about the photographer. Yes I get the photographer is key, but there are times when a certain feature allows you to get a shot that would have otherwise not been possible/compromised. Also, we all know that certain lenses give certain looks which is diddly squat to do with the tog. Moan over, as you were :exit:
 
trevorbray said:
I'm doing a lot of research into Fuji Medium format. Particularly the GFX 100s.
Thing is I need to evaluate it for my needs. I'm a fan of eye af. Sony's is astonishing.
Shots like this are made so easy. And I love the shallow depth of field available to me.
Yes I've posted this elsewhere on the forum.

MV and Owner.jpg by Trevor, on Flickr
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well if you ever decide to sell that 50GM I'd be interested ;)
GFX100s is very tempting. May even get it one day when I win the lottery :ROFLMAO:
 
nandbytes said:
well if you ever decide to sell that 50GM I'd be interested ;)
GFX100s is very tempting. May even get it one day when I win the lottery :ROFLMAO:
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It's the 50GM that's one of my sticking points.
Just so good, along with the 35.
 
snerkler said:
Yep, all these aids help us get shots that otherwise would have been impossible to get previously without making compromises. It's an example of why I hate comments on another thread on this site when someone's asked what gear got a particular shot only to receive multiple comments about how it's nothing to do with the gear and all about the photographer. Yes I get the photographer is key, but there are times when a certain feature allows you to get a shot that would have otherwise not been possible/compromised. Also, we all know that certain lenses give certain looks which is diddly squat to do with the tog. Moan over, as you were :exit:
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When I look at some of my Canon DSLR pictures I remember how the focus system limited composition, if I wanted a sharp result, but of course I could place the subjects face smack on the middle and crop later and I did that. With film I didn't have the option to crop unless of course I wanted to pay for a big print and cut it down to get the composition I wanted.

Sometimes it is the gear. It just is :D
 
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