The Amazing Sony A1/A7/A9/APS-C & Anything else welcome Mega Thread!

Meanwhile Sony is focusing on car imaging tech at CES.... perhaps because there is no competition for them in their camera segments? :D lol
 
jonneymendoza said:
Can't they focus on both DSLR and mirrorless?
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They probably have a finite amount of research and manufacturing resources available. Canon found that out last year when they decided to stop EF lens production to concentrate on mirrorless.

I think it’s the right thing for Nikon to do in developing new DSLR’s, it’s F mount lenses they probably shouldn’t be developing.
 
woof woof said:
What's up with the Z50?
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Almost pointless.
Not a single APS-C lens beyond the couple kit lens and none in the near future. It's pretty clear their resources in this area isn't unlimited, they'd be better off focusing one thing i.e. FF mirrorless. The rest is just noise. It might keep some people from leaving F-mount but it's not really winning many new users.
Sony I dislike them in many ways and not happy with a-mount support which made a lot of people leave inc. me. But they did in the end attract a lot more people for e-mount. So business wise it's a better decision.
 
rob-nikon said:
They probably have a finite amount of research and manufacturing resources available. Canon found that out last year when they decided to stop EF lens production to concentrate on mirrorless.

I think it’s the right thing for Nikon to do in developing new DSLR’s, it’s F mount lenses they probably shouldn’t be developing.
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Why should they develop new DSLR cameras and not F mount lenses?

There are enough F mount cameras and lenses around, they should be concentrating and putting resources towards Z mount IMO. This hybrid approach is a waste and I hope consumers see through it (esp at this pricepoint!), all they are trying to do is keep people buying their F mount lenses, they were slow off the mark and are still trying to use the same approach.
 
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The Nikon DSLR lens compatibility issues have always phased me. Thankfully I had no issues with my SLR but these days or even going back a few years in DSLR times having to think what lenses fitted what camera would put me off their DSLR's. Sony's e mount allowing APS-C and FF lenses to work on either format cameras makes the most sense to me.

Are Canons APS-C and FF mirrorless lenses interchangeable?
 
nandbytes said:
Almost pointless.
Not a single APS-C lens beyond the couple kit lens and none in the near future. It's pretty clear their resources in this area isn't unlimited, they'd be better off focusing one thing i.e. FF mirrorless. The rest is just noise. It might keep some people from leaving F-mount but it's not really winning many new users.
Sony I dislike them in many ways and not happy with a-mount support which made a lot of people leave inc. me. But they did in the end attract a lot more people for e-mount. So business wise it's a better decision.
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I think for Sony while a tough decision to drop A mount (have they even officially said its dropped yet lol!) for Nikon its more difficult, they have a much larger user base and have a lot more to lose, especially in their current financial state. Nikon is trailing behind, even Canon had hybrid cameras out years ago which used DP in live view.
 
woof woof said:
The Nikon DSLR lens compatibility issues have always phased me. Thankfully I had no issues with my SLR but these days or even going back a few years in DSLR times having to think what lenses fitted what camera would put me off their DSLR's. Sony's e mount allowing APS-C and FF lenses to work on either format cameras makes the most sense to me.

Are Canons APS-C and FF mirrorless lenses interchangeable?
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No, Canon has a lot of mounts, EF, EFS, EFM, RF.
 
twist said:
Why should they develop new DSLR cameras and not F mount lenses?

There are enough F mount cameras and lenses around, they should be concentrating and putting resources towards Z mount IMO. This hybrid approach is a waste and I hope consumers see through it (esp at this pricepoint!), all they are trying to do is keep people buying their F mount lenses, they were slow off the mark and are still trying to use the same approach.
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There are many who don’t want to move to mirrorless just yet but don’t want to keep using 3-5 year old tech.

It’s definitely a hard one for Nikon and Canon as they have a huge amount of lenses already out there because of a 40yr + lifespan of the Nikon F mount. The biggest problem with mirrorless is needing a new mount. Adapters are a stop gap.
 
rob-nikon said:
There are many who don’t want to move to mirrorless just yet but don’t want to keep using 3-5 year old tech.

It’s definitely a hard one for Nikon and Canon as they have a huge amount of lenses already out there because of a 40yr + lifespan of the Nikon F mount. The biggest problem with mirrorless is needing a new mount. Adapters are a stop gap.
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They fitted the old 51pt system, so really the only benefit of the d780 over far cheaper d750 is for people who shoot live view. I think an adapted Z6 is a better and far cheaper option. I think the hybrid approach is more of a stop gap than the adapted approach, people will still be buying into old technology and a lens system that will be phased out.

An A7iii is £450 less and will get cheaper.
 
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rob-nikon said:
There are many who don’t want to move to mirrorless just yet but don’t want to keep using 3-5 year old tech.

It’s definitely a hard one for Nikon and Canon as they have a huge amount of lenses already out there because of a 40yr + lifespan of the Nikon F mount. The biggest problem with mirrorless is needing a new mount. Adapters are a stop gap.
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Canon went from FD to eos and upset a lot of people but it didn't kill the marque, so it can be done.

Years back Kodak wanted digital to just go away. I don't suppose either Canon or Nikon will share Kodaks fate but the same thinking must be there to an extent about mirrorless.
 
Trying to decide between an A73 and an A7r3 - what’s the going rate for a second hand A7r3 on here ? Has anyone bought or sold one on here ?

Just trying to decide if it’s worth the extra outlaw - I would prefer the nicer EVF...
 
twist said:
They fitted the old 51pt system, so really the only benefit of the d780 over far cheaper d750 is for people who shoot live view. I think an adapted Z6 is a better and far cheaper option. I think the hybrid approach is more of a stop gap than the adapted approach, people will still be buying into old technology and a lens system that will be phased out.

An A7iii is £450 less and will get cheaper.
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Just been pointed out in another thread the D850 is only £300 more than the D780, why would you choose the D780 over this unless you wanted video. I think the D780 looks a great camera, just way overpriced.
 
Jesus, £2k for the D780 is not a pretty price tag.

Edit - @nandbytes haha I was been generous to them.
 
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Canon EOS 1Dx Mark III = £6499 :o

Sony really are way in front of the rest.....
 
Riz_Guru said:
Canon EOS 1Dx Mark III = £6499 :eek:

Sony really are way in front of the rest.....
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I'm sure there are people who'll need their DSLR's to be prised from their cold dead hands. There'll be others who'll buy them because they say Canon on the front. They'll never buy a Sony because they don't say Canon on the front.
 
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woof woof said:
I'm sure there are people who'll need their DSLR's to be prised from their cold dead hands. There'll be others who'll buy them because they say Canon on the front. They'll never buy a Sony because they don't say Canon on the front.
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im sure there will be those professional canon shooters with big heavy primes that have had no need whatsoever to switch system to lap up the new camera.
 
addicknchips said:
im sure there will be those professional canon shooters with big heavy primes that have had no need whatsoever to switch system to lap up the new camera.
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I'm sure you're right and it'll be a niche camera that'll sell in ever more tiny numbers as those users decline over time.

Good luck to Canon and their users.
 
TGphoto said:
Nikon D780, I do wonder what planet Nikon are on. Should have been out 2 years ago. If they want their mirrorless to succeed they need to go all in on it.
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Thing to remember is they still have a large (most?) base all still happily using f mount, I think it makes a lot of sense to keep supporting them.

However I can't ignore the price, how many customers want it at that price? Who wants to get a new body which won't support new lenses especially when you can get a Z6 for considerably less? Anyone driven by price isn't going to have think long about buying a used D750 at a quarter of the price or a used A73 at half the price (who knows how cheap it'll get once the A74 lands too).
 
One thing I looked for and still do is a 1/8000 shutter speed as 1/4000 or Gosh forbid 1/2000 means you can't take pictures at f1.x is decent light without ND's. Not having to faff on with ND's would make me pay more. So there's that at least :D
 
justa1972 said:
Trying to decide between an A73 and an A7r3 - what’s the going rate for a second hand A7r3 on here ? Has anyone bought or sold one on here ?

Just trying to decide if it’s worth the extra outlaw - I would prefer the nicer EVF...
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I’d guess probably around £1300-1350 but that’s a massive guess. You could search (keyword search to filter the results) the archived sales to find what previous sales went for.

The differences between the two are more than just the EVF.
 
snerkler said:
I disagree, would be suicide to go all in on mirrorless and neglect DSLR
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I also agree, considering DSLR was 34% of the overall market and mirrorless 22% (as of the beginning of 2019), so they'd be daft to walk away from it...
 
mdpF2 said:
I also agree, considering DSLR was 34% of the overall market and mirrorless 22% (as of the beginning of 2019), so they'd be daft to walk away from it...
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Thinking about all this... DSLR's may be a road to nowhere in the medium term and for now mirrorless may be the growing way forward but I do wonder what future there is for dedicated cameras and lenses.

I read a while ago that DSLR buyers are overwhelmingly male and older and if all the younger use is their phone maybe photography with cameras as we know them today including mirrorless will be increasingly marginalised and niche. Canon and Sony and Nikon too if they survive (hehe, only joking) will be niche Leicas likes of the future.
 
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mdpF2 said:
I also agree, considering DSLR was 34% of the overall market and mirrorless 22% (as of the beginning of 2019), so they'd be daft to walk away from it...
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recent figures showed the only two manufactures with positive sales were sony and fuji. There are a lot more DSLRs because they have been around forever not because the market is growing. poor choice to invest in a shrinking segment of a already shrinking market space.
 
nandbytes said:
recent figures showed the only two manufactures with positive sales were sony and fuji. There are a lot more DSLRs because they have been around forever not because the market is growing. poor choice to invest in a shrinking segment of a already shrinking market space.
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Correct..... DSLR technology is very old..... it was only a matter of time before companies like Sony & Fuji would start moving into positive profits etc.
 
nandbytes said:
recent figures showed the only two manufactures with positive sales were sony and fuji. There are a lot more DSLRs because they have been around forever not because the market is growing. poor choice to invest in a shrinking segment of a already shrinking market space.
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I wasnt referring to existing cameras, it was 2018 sales figures, so DSLR sales are still quite a bit in front of mirrorless, surprisingly. DSLR sales in 2018 declined by 12%, but mirrorless only grew by 2%..
 
mdpF2 said:
I wasnt referring to existing cameras, it was 2018 sales figures, so DSLR sales are still quite a bit in front of mirrorless, surprisingly. DSLR sales in 2018 declined by 12%, but mirrorless only grew by 2%..
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even still by those figures DSLRs is clearly a shrinking segment in a shrinking market.
I wonder how of those DSLR buyers actually bought FF vs. cheaper beginner level bodies.

Going by money made the two big DSLR brands have made less profit than previous years. last time I saw one of those graphs on dpreview, I remember the only two brands making an increasing profit over previous years was Sony and Fuji.
 
Profit is KING!
Bye bye Nikon & Canon if they don't get their act together :D lol
 
nandbytes said:
recent figures showed the only two manufactures with positive sales were sony and fuji. There are a lot more DSLRs because they have been around forever not because the market is growing. poor choice to invest in a shrinking segment of a already shrinking market space.
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I believe last years figures show that DSLR still outsold mirrorless, and that mirrorless sales have also fallen like DSLRs have. This is one of the reasons that Nikon have struggled with the Z's as mirrorless take up across the board has not been as big as expected (statistician's words not mine ;))
nandbytes said:
even still by those figures DSLRs is clearly a shrinking segment in a shrinking market.
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All interchangeable lens markets are shrinking :(
 
snerkler said:
I believe last years figures show that DSLR still outsold mirrorless, and that mirrorless sales have also fallen like DSLRs have. This is one of the reasons that Nikon have struggled with the Z's as mirrorless take up across the board has not been as big as expected (statistician's words not mine ;))
All interchangeable lens markets are shrinking :(
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you are basically repeating what I said.

All sales are falling and DSLRs sales falling faster as I said "a shrinking segment in a shrinking market". But it was pointed out above that mirrorless sales grew 2%. The profits are going down year by year and two that companies that managed to increase their profits over previous years was Sony and fuji.

Also as I mentioned above I wonder how many of those DSLR buyers actually bought FF vs. cheaper beginner level bodies. You can see Sony have basically got rid of the 3 and 5 series bodies because I am guessing they aren't very profitable. Just as with consoles where is money is in games not the console itself, money is in lenses and just the body. if DSLRs buyer are simply buying the base model with a single kit lens and nothing else they won't be making much money.
 
Sorry but that camera is ridiculous and ridiculously priced. Nikon are trying to spread their focus too wide. If they continue to focus on both DSLR and mirrorless, one of them, or the whole business is likely to fail. Until they go full on and focus on mirrorless, I can’t see them competing with Sony. Also why bother with the investment in mirrorless if they are going to continue to invest in DSLR? They’ll end up with two directly competing systems.

The majority of real serious photographers are going to move to mirrorless sooner or later. If they continue their desire to keep DSLR users happy, they might as well forget mirrorless.
 
nandbytes said:
you are basically repeating what I said.

All sales are falling and DSLRs sales falling faster as I said "a shrinking segment in a shrinking market". But it was pointed out above that mirrorless sales grew 2%. The profits are going down year by year and two that companies that managed to increase their profits over previous years was Sony and fuji.

.
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That's odd, the report I saw showed mirrorless sales went down by something like 20% :confused:
 
TGphoto said:
Sorry but that camera is ridiculous and ridiculously priced. Nikon are trying to spread their focus too wide. If they continue to focus on both DSLR and mirrorless, one of them, or the whole business is likely to fail. Until they go full on and focus on mirrorless, I can’t see them competing with Sony. Also why bother with the investment in mirrorless if they are going to continue to invest in DSLR? They’ll end up with two directly competing systems.

The majority of real serious photographers are going to move to mirrorless sooner or later. If they continue their desire to keep DSLR users happy, they might as well forget mirrorless.
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Its like history repeating itself except Nikon hasnt looked at Sonys past at all, anybody remember SLT and A mount! Sony were advancing the MILC tech on their own, so they had an excuse.
 
twist said:
Its like history repeating itself except Nikon hasnt looked at Sonys past at all, anybody remember SLT and A mount! Sony were advancing the MILC tech on their own, so they had an excuse.
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SLT was clearly their attempt of bridging the two worlds. They lost so many customers. They stuck to it and moved on with the mirrorless tech more seriously once they had cracked on-sensor PDAF.
Canon did the same with DPAF.
 
nandbytes said:
SLT was clearly their attempt of bridging the two worlds. They lost so many customers. They stuck to it and moved on with the mirrorless tech more seriously once they had cracked on-sensor PDAF.
Canon did the same with DPAF.
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Exactly, Sony was working towards good milc ospdaf, Nikon already have it, likely from Sony efforts, so they have no excuse for a overpriced hybrid.
 
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