The Amazing Sony A1/A7/A9/APS-C & Anything else welcome Mega Thread!

I'm less than one week into using the A7 and it is already quite easy and instinctive. It works well with Leica Summicron 90 and 50mm and with Olympus OM macro 50mm. A Zeiss ZM Biogon 35mm looks disappointing in corners, 28mm is better for some reason, Voigtlander 15mm is a disaster, all smears and purple corners.

I'll have to decide on lenses but need to sell some Olympus OMD kit first.
 
There's a Zeiss FE55/1.8ZA for sale here in 'Other brands'. A bargain price for a supreme lens.
 
Fuji X10 orbs? Fixed by replacement sensors, wonder if Sony would do a recall, doubt it.
 
I'm not clear what the issue is and I haven't waded through all of the thread at DPR.

My impression so far is that the issue is more visible with shorter registration lenses and extreme apertures. That's not a situation I've found myself in as I'm using Rokkor and Zuiko SLR lenses and rarely venture towards f22.

As the setup is new to me I have pixel peeped at 100%+ but so far I've not encountered any problems and I'm very happy.
 
theoldman said:
There are those out there critical of the AF, the exposure system and the shutter shock of the A7r. These people have never used the camera in field. I've popped a load of pix taken with the A7r on flickr.

http://www.flickr.com/photos/112219945@N04/

There's no shutter shock and the camera worked perfectly in field with 99% correct exposure and focus.
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Lloyd Chambers had poor results from 135mm and above lenses. The 1/100th of a second was proving to be a problem with a Zeiss 135mm APO tripod mounted. Are you trying longer lenses on it?
 
Laudrup said:
Lloyd Chambers had poor results from 135mm and above lenses. The 1/100th of a second was proving to be a problem with a Zeiss 135mm APO tripod mounted. Are you trying longer lenses on it?
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I've tried a full range of lenses up to 300mm (Nikon 28-300). All spot on. I didn't find a single shutter problem and I really hammered the action in dirty, wet and horrible conditions. It was nothing less than superb. The 55/1.8 was, by far, the star of the show. Close to perfection.
 
woof woof said:
A7 blob issue at DPR...

http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3613281
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Yes, there's been a bit of discussion about it on fredmiranda.com (mine is one of the linked posts from that DPR thread) - though that was rather more the flare than the grid patterns, which I've not seen myself.

At FM, we seem to have concluded that it's mostly internal reflections on the adapters, rather than the lens/sensor. I've seen it mostly with my C/Y adapted lenses and not so much with my FDs and the design of the C/Y adapter I'm using looks like it's causing problems (chrome mount elements inside the adapter and the black paint inside not being sufficiently matt). I've been meaning to get hold of some flocking paper to try to tame it.
 
How can it be the adapter causing it, when its does it on the 24-70 and 35mm FE lenses?

The A7R doesn't seem to have the problem though.
 
robj20 said:
How can it be the adapter causing it, when its does it on the 24-70 and 35mm FE lenses?
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As I said, mostly - this was on the Alt forum where people are using a lot of adapted lenses.

Some members on FM have demonstrated the issue is much diminished when they've lined their adapters to reduce reflections.

Certainly that doesn't account for FE native lenses doing the same thing, I agree.
 
theoldman said:
I've tried a full range of lenses up to 300mm (Nikon 28-300). All spot on. I didn't find a single shutter problem and I really hammered the action in dirty, wet and horrible conditions. It was nothing less than superb. The 55/1.8 was, by far, the star of the show. Close to perfection.
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Interesting. His recommendation was to avoid the A7R if you went with longer lenses and go with the A7 due to the electronic first curtain shutter. Is there any difference in portrait mode you've noticed to blur? He was recommending at least 1/250 for a 135mm as his examples were blurred and the loss of microcontrast was turning what should be world class lenses into mediocre ones.
 
I honestly believe there is a bit of a rolling bandwagon that the naysayers are jumping on. I haven't noticed any difference between the results of the A7r and the D800e. The shutter makes a good deal more noise, but other than that, a decent adaptive technique makes the results brilliant. You may have to spend an hour getting used to the shutter but in 40 years I've never been able to pick any camera up and take perfect images from minute one.

For me the A7r is a game changer but it has it's critical foibles. The lack of lenses is the biggest issue as legacy lenses are really just a compromise and they are definitely not as good as the lenses developed for the camera. It's early days and those that have bought now will be able to grow their systems with the camera, learning along the way.

I am very positive about the camera but I wouldn't use it professionally until the system develops.
 
Brazo said:
Was reading through this and many other threads on net about this problem. Given I love shooting at night, this has helped me decide not to get an A7.
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I don't know if I'd believe everything on DPR, IMVHO over there there'll be people talking with authority and claiming they've proved lots of things when in reality they haven't even touched the kit.
 
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I took this same shot some time ago with a 50mm on my G1 and thought it looked nice.

This time I took the shot with my A7 + Rokkor 50mm f1.4 and I'm pleased that the performance seems to be good to the very corners.

 
robj20 said:
How can it be the adapter causing it, when its does it on the 24-70 and 35mm FE lenses?

The A7R doesn't seem to have the problem though.
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There are some claiming that it does. I suppose time and/or experimentation from reliable testers will tell us more.
 
theoldman said:
For me the A7r is a game changer but it has it's critical foibles. The lack of lenses is the biggest issue as legacy lenses are really just a compromise and they are definitely not as good as the lenses developed for the camera. It's early days and those that have bought now will be able to grow their systems with the camera, learning along the way.
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Legacy lenses probably aren't as good as the very latest high end lenses, but what I ask myself is when will the differences show up?

I had fun testing my Zuiko and Rokkor lenses against my Sigma 50mm f1.4 (and I don't think I could ask for a better 50mm on my 5D, 5D kit now sold BTW) and to be honest the differences were only visible when pixel peeping or comparing the bokeh, and that's got to be subjective anyway.

I'm very happy with the image quality of all of the Rokkor and Zuiko lenses I've used so far and I really have to look very closely indeed to nit pick any problems.
 
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theoldman said:
legacy lenses are really just a compromise and they are definitely not as good as the lenses developed for the camera
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Well, many of my legacy lenses (Contax-Zeiss 28/2.8 and 85/2.8, Canon FD 85/1.2L for example) are certainly a lot better than the FE 28-70 that came in the box with my A7. :D
 
those orbs could be light bouncing off the sensor then back to lens and back again.
film is less reflective, so it wasnt a issue back in the day
 
Musicman said:
Well, many of my legacy lenses (Contax-Zeiss 28/2.8 and 85/2.8, Canon FD 85/1.2L for example) are certainly a lot better than the FE 28-70 that came in the box with my A7. :D
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+1 and the sooner I can pick up an FDn 85/1.2L or SSC the better IMO :D
 
Can anyone say how FD perform optically to Rokkor and/or Zuiko?

I have been tempted to get some FD's as there seem to be a few about at reasonable prices but they seem a bit bigger than the lenses I have at the moment. Most seem to be 55mm thread whereas all my Zuiko and Rokkor lenses are 49mm.
 
pingu666 said:
those orbs could be light bouncing off the sensor then back to lens and back again.
film is less reflective, so it wasnt a issue back in the day
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That's what I've read in Fred Miranda forums, it does seem easily recreated but as Woof says best to see how this pans out.
 
parman said:
Ouch.....it obviously hasn't gone down well with Moody's
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I don't think it's a direct result of this issue :D

"Moody's (MCO) explained that the Japanese company was facing extreme pressure in its TV and PC units, due to "intense global competition, rapid changes in technology, and product obsolescence."

Ultimately, Moody's concluded that it would be difficult for Sony to improve and stabilize its profitability.

"We expect the majority of [Sony's] core consumer electronics businesses -- such as TVs, mobile, digital cameras and personal computers -- to continue to face significant downward earnings pressure," Moody's wrote."

Sony aren't alone in this. Anyway, for those interested data on the financial status of the major companies is freely available but as we've seen with recent scandals it may not be 100% honest and accurate :D

I'm sure there'll be restructuring and even complete or partial withdrawl from some sectors but the size of these companies and the Japanese culture and way of doing things will possibly stop the likes of Sony, Panasonic and others going down the plug hole. Of course, if Sony was British it would have been dead and buried long ago.
 
I think I'll try shooting some lights in the dark at f.extreme and see what results I get.

Maybe others could do the same and report back?
 
My Zeiss Planar 50/1.7 only goes to f/16 but it looks OK, other than the rain which accumulated on the front element causing some pretty cool ghosting :D There's a bit of green inside the light perhaps, but nothing like what has been demonstrated on that DPReview thread. Will do some proper testing when I have time (and it's not raining...July then...).

View attachment 4817
 
I've just tried to reproduce the pattern seen on DPR...

Kit - A7 + Novoflex adapter + Minolta Rokkor 24mm f2.8 at f22 and Minolta Rokkor 50mm f1.4 at f16.

Shots - Three LED torch photographed in a dark room with the torch in the centre of the frame, top centre, bottom centre, right and then left centre.

Result - I can't see the pattern and all I see is the flare I'd expect to see.
 
The weight of evidence is compelling though Alan - A7 sensor has a problem.

From the images I've quickly trawled through, the common denominator might be something like non-retrofocus wide-angles (ie exit pupil close to sensor) at higher f/numbers (which increases the angle the light hits the sensor, as does the FF format) with very bright light sources against darker backgrounds, towards the corners of the frame. It's basically about very bright light hitting the sensor at extreme angles of incidence. Apart from Leica, Sony A7 is the first full-frame camera that's able to use non-retrofocus wide-angles, and that may be why we've not seen it before.

It looks really bad in some example images, when deliberately provoked, but how often that particular set of conditions is likely to affect real world users is moot. It's a shame though, like the A7R's shutter vibration. A flawed gem.
 
HoppyUK said:
It's a shame though, like the A7R's shutter vibration. A flawed gem.
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What camera doesn't have flaws???

Agree the times this would be an issue are probably limited to those who spend most of their time taking night/low light shots with string light sources. Personally I'm not going looking for issues :)
 
ShrubMonkey said:
What camera doesn't have flaws???

Agree the times this would be an issue are probably limited to those who spend most of their time taking night/low light shots with string light sources. Personally I'm not going looking for issues :)
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Very true :)
 
HoppyUK said:
The weight of evidence is compelling though Alan - A7 sensor has a problem.
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woof woof said:
I'm not clear what the issue is and I haven't waded through all of the thread at DPR.

My impression so far is that the issue is more visible with shorter registration lenses and extreme apertures. That's not a situation I've found myself in as I'm using Rokkor and Zuiko SLR lenses and rarely venture towards f22.

As the setup is new to me I have pixel peeped at 100%+ but so far I've not encountered any problems and I'm very happy.
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woof woof said:
I've just tried to reproduce the pattern seen on DPR...

Kit - A7 + Novoflex adapter + Minolta Rokkor 24mm f2.8 at f22 and Minolta Rokkor 50mm f1.4 at f16.

Shots - Three LED torch photographed in a dark room with the torch in the centre of the frame, top centre, bottom centre, right and then left centre.

Result - I can't see the pattern and all I see is the flare I'd expect to see.
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I'm not saying that there isn't a problem but so far I haven't seen it either in real world shots or in my little test.

Personally I didn't buy this camera to use with Leica lenses partly because I'd read about problems with APS-C CSC's and decided I couldn't be bothered with it all and partly because, to be honest, I'm a bit careful with my money :D and I honestly get a kick out of using cheap gear and the Minolta and Olympus lenses I'm using seem to be good enough for me.

I don't know if Sony with issue a recall, maybe they'll just sit on this and maybe the next version will perform better... as it doesn't seem to affect me I'm not going to loose sleep over it or JPEG quality.
 
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Agree. It's easy to get these things out of proportion and it wouldn't put me off buying one. Assuming that theory is somewhere right (and I'm not claiming it is, just a plausible hunch based on a quick trawl) then it could be easily worked around by avoiding those lenses in situations that are prone to it. Only a problem for a few users with particular nocturnal habits.

Same with the A7R's shutter vibration. It certainly exists and looks like a bit of a blunder by Sony. It's like a high-end DSLR going out with no mirror lock-up feature - that simply wouldn't happen. And there's an easy firmware fix that would be 95% acceptable, while we wait for an electronic first curtain to sort things thoroughly like the A7. As things stand though, that's actually a deal-breaker for me because of the work I need to do, but most other users may never notice it in more normal use.
 
Shutter vibration is non existent for me using a 200mm lens. I think some people just like to find problems. People are finding problems using criteria that you 99.9% of the time just don't come across in real world shooting.

I've also found a problem where if you are shooting one handed stood on one leg while holding a spoon in your mouth you get blurry photos. If i don't see a problem in normal shooting i don't go looking for them.
It was my understanding that the shutter vibration was only when you attach to a tripod using the lens mount rather than the camera, so use the camera to mount to the tripod.
 
robj20 said:
Shutter vibration is non existent for me using a 200mm lens. I think some people just like to find problems. People are finding problems using criteria that you 99.9% of the time just don't come across in real world shooting.

I've also found a problem where if you are shooting one handed stood on one leg while holding a spoon in your mouth you get blurry photos. If i don't see a problem in normal shooting i don't go looking for them.
It was my understanding that the shutter vibration was only when you attach to a tripod using the lens mount rather than the camera, so use the camera to mount to the tripod.
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You can't have it both ways. Either there is vibration with the 7R, or there isn't.

And the fact is that there is shutter vibration, no question about it (how can there not be?) but it isn't serious enough to show up all the time, only under certain conditions - very similar to mirror-slap. Some users could shoot for years without noticing anything untoward, others will find it's problem straight away. That's not to say those users are in any way more discerning, just that they use the camera in ways that promote the problem.
 
Of course i can have it both ways, there are my findings and others im not doubting others. Not a single picture i have taken with my 200mm shows any sign even those at around 1/100.
 
Fred Miranda has just completed a great review of the Sony a7r it truly kicks IQ sand in the face of the 5d mk3! And that man can take a stunning photo!

That said Fred has also noted the shutter shake issue, it's there no doubt about it. However whether it will affect you (shutter speeds between 1/30-1/100) is down to your shooting, I rarely shoot over 1/2 sec so wouldn't be a deal breaker for me!
 
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