The Amazing Sony A1/A7/A9/APS-C & Anything else welcome Mega Thread!

f/2.8 said:
Why not just get the Sony?
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Because it’s nearly twice the price ;) I do prefer the rendering from the Samyang too.
 
snerkler said:
Because it’s nearly twice the price ;) I do prefer the rendering from the Samyang too.
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Didn't realise the Samyang was that cheap, have seen the Sony 35mm f/1.8 for around £350 used.

It's not a bad little lens, the bokeh isn't the nicest but then the Samyang isn't much better and it has very fast a.f and it focuses quite close for a 35 which is useful.
 
snerkler said:
The Samyang 35mm’s gone back and they’re sending another, 3rd time lucky? If this one’s a dud I’m giving up on this lens and will consider other options, and maybe not even bothering with a 35mm.
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Why do you need a 35mm prime ! ?
 
Just on gas.

I mentioned earlier I was looking at the Panasonic G100 as it's small and reviewers say it has a nice VF. I have small RF style cameras but hey don't have nice VF's so I though... hmmm. That might be nice. I've just finished my monthly banking and expenses tot up and I've had a good month so I thought I might buy myself a toy :D but when I took another look at the G100 I saw there's only one top dial and you're back to using the control wheel on the back of the camera as your second control. Urgh. I don't like that. Oh well. The money stays in the bank.

Anyone else lusting after any new camera or lens?
 
woof woof said:
Just on gas.

I mentioned earlier I was looking at the Panasonic G100 as it's small and reviewers say it has a nice VF. I have small RF style cameras but hey don't have nice VF's so I though... hmmm. That might be nice. I've just finished my monthly banking and expenses tot up and I've had a good month so I thought I might buy myself a toy :D but when I took another look at the G100 I saw there's only one top dial and you're back to using the control wheel on the back of the camera as your second control. Urgh. I don't like that. Oh well. The money stays in the bank.

Anyone else lusting after any new camera or lens?
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I'm deeply impressed on the way you can talk yourself out of any new purchase (a sort of reverse GAS) - if and when a suitable camera does come on the market you have no excuse not to buy it :D
 
Mr Perceptive said:
I'm deeply impressed on the way you can talk yourself out of any new purchase (a sort of reverse GAS) - if and when a suitable camera does come on the market you have no excuse not to buy it :D
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If a camera is only going to have one top of camera control they should at least make it clickable so aperture and shutter speed can be controlled with the same control although that does leave the question of how you dial in exposure compensation. One way to allow it is to have a custom button which when pressed toggles the use of the one clickable control to allow exposure compensation. So, all three of those functions could be controlled with one clickable dial and a toggle button and that would be doable for me but the back wheel just isn't. I have tried using the back wheel as I fancied the A7c but I just find it too fiddly and easy to knock and I just don't like it. Good luck to those who either like it or just don't care but it is a deal beaker for me and I can't imagine anything else making up for that.
 
woof woof said:
If a camera is only going to have one top of camera control they should at least make it clickable so aperture and shutter speed can be controlled with the same control although that does leave the question of how you dial in exposure compensation. One way to allow it is to have a custom button which when pressed toggles the use of the one clickable control to allow exposure compensation. So, all three of those functions could be controlled with one clickable dial and a toggle button and that would be doable for me but the back wheel just isn't. I have tried using the back wheel as I fancied the A7c but I just find it too fiddly and easy to knock and I just don't like it. Good luck to those who either like it or just don't care but it is a deal beaker for me and I can't imagine anything else making up for that.
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Unfortunately I think we are starting to see an era where seperate buttons/controls wheels are starting to disappear on mid-level camera products.
 
f/2.8 said:
Didn't realise the Samyang was that cheap, have seen the Sony 35mm f/1.8 for around £350 used.

It's not a bad little lens, the bokeh isn't the nicest but then the Samyang isn't much better and it has very fast a.f and it focuses quite close for a 35 which is useful.
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I only buy “as new” used and the Sony’s are going For £524 which is bonkers considering they’re £529 new. The Samyang is currently £329 new but has been less.
Tysonator said:
Why do you need a 35mm prime ! ?
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I don’t need a 35mm prime I just fancied one for when I could do with something a bit wider than the 50mm but not so wide it brings in too much distortion.
 
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Mr Perceptive said:
I'm deeply impressed on the way you can talk yourself out of any new purchase (a sort of reverse GAS) - if and when a suitable camera does come on the market you have no excuse not to buy it :D
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We look for any reason to buy, Alan looks for any reason not to buy ;)
 
Bobsyeruncle said:
We look for any reason to buy, Alan looks for any reason not to buy ;)
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Unfortunately it's in my nature to spot the tiniest little thing and then obsess over it and using that back wheel would have me ranting so it really is better that I don't buy it.
 
As it's still a bit quiet.

Mrs WW on the footie pitch. A7 and 35mm f1.8 at f1.8.

wClqdZO.jpg
 
Tysonator said:
Why do you need a 35mm prime ! ?
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Because it's super for street type situations, wide enough but not too wide or distorting. Usually also small and light for discreet work or easy carrying. I have the Sammy 35 f2.8 and it's tiny. The look some primes give an image is also magical, and I'd trade the edge sharpness of the Sony primes for the smooth render and subtle subject separation of a Samyang lens, even if they may be a bit decentered.
 
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ancient_mariner said:
Because it's super for street type situations, wide enough but not too wide or distorting. Usually also small and light for discreet work or easy carrying. I have the Sammy 35 f2.8 and it's tiny. The look some primes give an image is also magical, and I'd trade the edge sharpness of the Sony primes for the smooth render and subtle subject separation of a Samyang lens, even if they may be a bit decentered.
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In a perfect world I’d like an f1.4 but they tend to be too big and heavy for my wants, even the GM is heavier than I’d like. The Sammy f1.8 hits the perfect balance of size/weight vs aperture for me.
 
I googled the Samyang v the Sony f1.8 and this is the first review I saw...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvcWbZLFlWQ

I wouldn't say that the Sony lens has the best bokeh a 35mm f1.8 could have, I think it's par for the course for a sharp 35mm and nothing more, but in that review the Sony does seem to have the better / softer bokeh performance and less fringing.
 
woof woof said:
I googled the Samyang v the Sony f1.8 and this is the first review I saw...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MvcWbZLFlWQ

I wouldn't say that the Sony lens has the best bokeh a 35mm f1.8 could have, I think it's par for the course for a sharp 35mm and nothing more, but in that review the Sony does seem to have the better / softer bokeh performance and less fringing.
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I don’t worry too much about fringing as it’s easily corrected in LR, I just tend to look at the character of the lens and the Sony just looks a bit flat in comparison to my eyes. It’s really difficult to quantify, a bit like trying to quantify the elusive Leica look.
 
snerkler said:
I don’t worry too much about fringing as it’s easily corrected in LR, I just tend to look at the character of the lens and the Sony just looks a bit flat in comparison to my eyes. It’s really difficult to quantify, a bit like trying to quantify the elusive Leica look.
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You're lucky, ticking the box in CS5 does a grand total of absolutely nothing, it has no effect at all.

Maybe it's the engineer in me but I don't buy into the Leica look or that these are things are somehow magical and escape definition. The look a lens gives is a fundamental result of the design and materials used and we should be able to describe what we're seeing and perhaps even begin to understand why. For example in recent years we've seen Sigma do something different with lenses under corrected for aberrations and we've seen the results and I have my Voigtlander lenses which share some of these properties and I'd guess that Fred Miranda is pretty much spot on when he speculates that Sony went for resolution and contrast and spherical aberration correction. Again, this doesn't involve magical fairy dust it's just result of the design decisions made.

I don't see the Sony 35mm f1.8 as flat at all, not from a colour and contrast point of view but I do think that the rendering could be better but if it was maybe something else would have to give. I tend to take a lot of pictures with messy backgrounds and these will not be ideal for showing off the bokeh of 35mm lenses and I do have worse rendering 35's than the Sony f1.8 but I've also read several reviews which praise the Sony f1.8's bokeh. If you can bare to look at photographs of beautiful women take a look at what Manny Ortiz does with the Sony f1.8.

I agree with a lot of what's said here...

phillipreeve.net

Review: Sony FE 1.8/35 - versatile but a bit expensive - phillipreeve.net

Review of the Sony FE 35mm F1.8 which covers real world use as well as in-depth technical analysis and contains many full resolution samples.
phillipreeve.net phillipreeve.net
 
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snerkler said:
I don’t worry too much about fringing as it’s easily corrected in LR, I just tend to look at the character of the lens and the Sony just looks a bit flat in comparison to my eyes. It’s really difficult to quantify, a bit like trying to quantify the elusive Leica look.
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I would agree based on that video - it was like they were processed differently with almost a lack of contrast from the Sony.
 
@F2.8 And other owners.
Tommy, have you noticed any problems with eye af on A7iv ?
 
trevorbray said:
@F2.8 And other owners.
Tommy, have you noticed any problems with eye af on A7iv ?
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No, haven't had any issues with either of the 2 bodies we have.

My missus got one first, she wasn't having issues even before the firmware update. It seemed even then that not all bodies had issues. Since the firmware update the amount of people saying they have issues is even less.

Read quite a long boring discussion on social media about it, some were saying that its only with certain lenses there are issues, others were saying that its only if you shoot manual with auto I.S.O that there is issues, others were saying they were only having problems with third party lenses and all sorts of other weird stuff.

We have now used ours with 14GM, 24GM,35GM,50GM,85GM,135GM, 55 and the Tamron 17-28, 28-75, 70-180, not experienced eye a.f issues with any of them regardless of what settings we have used on the camera. Maybe we have just been lucky not to have the issue.

I have seen some example photos posted online and I don't doubt that some people are definitely having problems.

Like I have mentioned before on here the A7IV is a good camera, I just hate the flippy screen. My missus loves them.
 
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woof woof said:
You're lucky, ticking the box in CS5 does a grand total of absolutely nothing, it has no effect at all.

Maybe it's the engineer in me but I don't buy into the Leica look or that these are things are somehow magical and escape definition. The look a lens gives is a fundamental result of the design and materials used and we should be able to describe what we're seeing and perhaps even begin to understand why. For example in recent years we've seen Sigma do something different with lenses under corrected for aberrations and we've seen the results and I have my Voigtlander lenses which share some of these properties and I'd guess that Fred Miranda is pretty much spot on when he speculates that Sony went for resolution and contrast and spherical aberration correction. Again, this doesn't involve magical fairy dust it's just result of the design decisions made.

I don't see the Sony 35mm f1.8 as flat at all, not from a colour and contrast point of view but I do think that the rendering could be better but if it was maybe something else would have to give. I tend to take a lot of pictures with messy backgrounds and these will not be ideal for showing off the bokeh of 35mm lenses and I do have worse rendering 35's than the Sony f1.8 but I've also read several reviews which praise the Sony f1.8's bokeh. If you can bare to look at photographs of beautiful women take a look at what Manny Ortiz does with the Sony f1.8.

I agree with a lot of what's said here...

phillipreeve.net

Review: Sony FE 1.8/35 - versatile but a bit expensive - phillipreeve.net

Review of the Sony FE 35mm F1.8 which covers real world use as well as in-depth technical analysis and contains many full resolution samples.
phillipreeve.net phillipreeve.net
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There are certain things on lenses that we can quantify for sure, sharpness, colour, aberrations, distortion etc, but some lenses have a 'character' that is very difficult to explain with technical details imo. Classic Leica lenses have a particular look that I like, modern ones for the SL etc not so much. I did read somewhere that Leica deliberately did not make the technical perfect lens in order to give it a unique character, what they did I've no idea. The lenses I like seem to have more 'pop' that is not solely down to DOF, so I can only assume it's micro contrast and transitions but I'm not knowledgeable enough to know how and why these things make a difference.
ancient_mariner said:
I would agree based on that video - it was like they were processed differently with almost a lack of contrast from the Sony.
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I thought they looked like they were processed differently too, but I've watched several videos and overall I think the Sony looks flatter somehow. I also prefer the colours from the Samyang in the cases I've seen. For example at 2:44 and 3:04 in this video I prefer the skin tones of the Samyang. This video's not great for comparing DOF though as the camera to subject distance is quite different.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPpt8_nB9n4&t=256s&ab_channel=OmaGhomrawi
 
f/2.8 said:
No, haven't had any issues with either of the 2 bodies we have.

My missus got one first, she wasn't having issues even before the firmware update. It seemed even then that not all bodies had issues. Since the firmware update the amount of people saying they have issues is even less.

Read quite a long boring discussion on social media about it, some were saying that its only with certain lenses there are issues, others were saying that its only if you shoot manual with auto I.S.O that there is issues, others were saying they were only having problems with third party lenses and all sorts of other weird stuff.

We have now used ours with 14GM, 24GM,35GM,50GM,85GM,135GM, 55 and the Tamron 17-28, 28-75, 70-180, not experienced eye a.f issues with any of them regardless of what settings we have used on the camera. Maybe we have just been lucky not to have the issue.

I have seen some example photos posted online and I don't doubt that some people are definitely having problems.

Like I have mentioned before on here the A7IV is a good camera, I just hate the flippy screen. My missus loves them.
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:plus1: for flippy screens :banana: (Tongue-In-Cheek comment by the way ;) )

I've had flippy screens since 2002 on my Canon G2
Now I only have one on my 7c
 
f/2.8 said:
No, haven't had any issues with either of the 2 bodies we have.

My missus got one first, she wasn't having issues even before the firmware update. It seemed even then that not all bodies had issues. Since the firmware update the amount of people saying they have issues is even less.

Read quite a long boring discussion on social media about it, some were saying that its only with certain lenses there are issues, others were saying that its only if you shoot manual with auto I.S.O that there is issues, others were saying they were only having problems with third party lenses and all sorts of other weird stuff.

We have now used ours with 14GM, 24GM,35GM,50GM,85GM,135GM, 55 and the Tamron 17-28, 28-75, 70-180, not experienced eye a.f issues with any of them regardless of what settings we have used on the camera. Maybe we have just been lucky not to have the issue.

I have seen some example photos posted online and I don't doubt that some people are definitely having problems.

Like I have mentioned before on here the A7IV is a good camera, I just hate the flippy screen. My missus loves them.
Click to expand...
Thanks Tommy. It’s a bloody minefield trying to find actual use cases. YouTube can be very discouraging.
 
snerkler said:
There are certain things on lenses that we can quantify for sure, sharpness, colour, aberrations, distortion etc, but some lenses have a 'character' that is very difficult to explain with technical details imo. Classic Leica lenses have a particular look that I like, modern ones for the SL etc not so much. I did read somewhere that Leica deliberately did not make the technical perfect lens in order to give it a unique character, what they did I've no idea. The lenses I like seem to have more 'pop' that is not solely down to DOF, so I can only assume it's micro contrast and transitions but I'm not knowledgeable enough to know how and why these things make a difference.
Click to expand...

I still don't see it :D but you have to remember I'm a recovering mega geek and to me everything about the final image boils down to the vision and intent of the people involved and the materials and abilities available to them. Of course there's the photographers vision and the light on the day but two different lenses pointed at the same thing at the same time will give different results, it's just that I believe that those different results can be measured and recorded and the maker of lens A if given the recipe and enough recourses could make lens B.

If we take a perhaps rather extreme by todays standards lens, the Sigma 45mm f2.8, and if we believe what Sigma has said we know a little about the thought processes which produced the final lens and we can begin to understand why people report focus issues with that lens. Some people see difficult to define character, I see a series of decisions leading to a final product with perfectly predictable performance parameters and abilities and potential issues, just like I saw when I repaired stuff or did product approvals :D
 
f/2.8 said:
Read quite a long boring discussion on social media about it, some were saying that its only with certain lenses there are issues, others were saying that its only if you shoot manual with auto I.S.O that there is issues, others were saying they were only having problems with third party lenses and all sorts of other weird stuff.

We have now used ours with 14GM, 24GM,35GM,50GM,85GM,135GM, 55 and the Tamron 17-28, 28-75, 70-180, not experienced eye a.f issues with any of them regardless of what settings we have used on the camera. Maybe we have just been lucky not to have the issue.

I have seen some example photos posted online and I don't doubt that some people are definitely having problems.

Like I have mentioned before on here the A7IV is a good camera, I just hate the flippy screen. My missus loves them.
Click to expand...

I think if there are real issues it's possibly due to a combination of factors and if so that could explain why some people hit problems whilst some others don't. I suppose one issue with multiple interconnecting things is that it can become difficult to make sure that everything always works with everything in every usage. Going back again to the days when I was involved with stuff there were times when a thing could pass every bench test but predictably and repeatedly show a problem in what should be a normal usage. As this can happen and I do understand that not everything can be picked up and fixed in development and testing I think it's very important that companies listen to what customers are saying and act fast to identify and correct issues.
 
Ai firmware update.

New Sony A1 firmware update 1.30 released: Adds the 4:2:2 10bit selection when shooting XAVC HS 8K and lossless RAW in L/W/S | sonyalpharumors

Sony A1 at BHphoto. Adorama. Amazon. Focuscamera. FotoErhardt DE. Calumet DE. Fotokoch DE. Park UK. WexUK. Sony issued a major firmware update for the A1 (download it here). New Alpha 1 Firmware Update Enables 8K 4:2:2 10bit Recording and Lossless RAW File Options SAN DIEGO, CA – June 13, 2022 –...
www.sonyalpharumors.com www.sonyalpharumors.com

"New Alpha 1 Firmware Update Enables 8K 4:2:2 10bit Recording and Lossless RAW File Options"
 
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woof woof said:
I still don't see it :D but you have to remember I'm a recovering mega geek and to me everything about the final image boils down to the vision and intent of the people involved and the materials and abilities available to them. Of course there's the photographers vision and the light on the day but two different lenses pointed at the same thing at the same time will give different results, it's just that I believe that those different results can be measured and recorded and the maker of lens A if given the recipe and enough recourses could make lens B.

If we take a perhaps rather extreme by todays standards lens, the Sigma 45mm f2.8, and if we believe what Sigma has said we know a little about the thought processes which produced the final lens and we can begin to understand why people report focus issues with that lens. Some people see difficult to define character, I see a series of decisions leading to a final product with perfectly predictable performance parameters and abilities and potential issues, just like I saw when I repaired stuff or did product approvals :D
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Oh don’t get me wrong, I’m sure there’s a technical/engineering reason lens A has different character to Lens B, it’s just some (maybe most) don’t understand what those processes are and how to describe them. I talk about ‘pop/3D’ effects of lenses, some might refer to this as micro contrast, fall off, transitions etc but which of these give the look I talk about I’ve no idea. That’s why I don’t get too bogged down with the technical perfections of a lens, technical perfections don’t always lead to the nicest rendering.

The look I like from a lens is that almost slightly miniature or Brenizer appearance, not all of which is purely down to DOF (y)
woof woof said:
I think if there are real issues it's possibly due to a combination of factors and if so that could explain why some people hit problems whilst some others don't. I suppose one issue with multiple interconnecting things is that it can become difficult to make sure that everything always works with everything in every usage. Going back again to the days when I was involved with stuff there were times when a thing could pass every bench test but predictably and repeatedly show a problem in what should be a normal usage. As this can happen and I do understand that not everything can be picked up and fixed in development and testing I think it's very important that companies listen to what customers are saying and act fast to identify and correct issues.
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Have Sony not admitted an issue with the A7IV AF?
 
snerkler said:
Have Sony not admitted an issue with the A7IV AF?
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I don't know as I haven't really followed this. Someone here may know.

This just made me think of working past and how difficult it can be to stop things sliding as no one makes the whole thing and components and sub assemblies from suppliers can change at any time and they don't always tell you.

I remember one camera maker, I forget who, but they had a problem when one of the guys on the production line went on holiday and the stand in either tightened the screws too much or not enough, again I forget the details, so when the cameras got out into the field people found problems. It just shows that things can change quickly and a bad batch can easily get through. Not that that ever happened when I was involved :D
 
woof woof said:
Ai firmware update.

New Sony A1 firmware update 1.30 released: Adds the 4:2:2 10bit selection when shooting XAVC HS 8K and lossless RAW in L/W/S | sonyalpharumors

Sony A1 at BHphoto. Adorama. Amazon. Focuscamera. FotoErhardt DE. Calumet DE. Fotokoch DE. Park UK. WexUK. Sony issued a major firmware update for the A1 (download it here). New Alpha 1 Firmware Update Enables 8K 4:2:2 10bit Recording and Lossless RAW File Options SAN DIEGO, CA – June 13, 2022 –...
www.sonyalpharumors.com www.sonyalpharumors.com

"New Alpha 1 Firmware Update Enables 8K 4:2:2 10bit Recording and Lossless RAW File Options"
Click to expand...

It's been a long time since 1.2 so I had hoped for more from this release. Hopefully it's more stable than 1.2 as I had some issues with that.
 
Jase said:
It's been a long time since 1.2 so I had hoped for more from this release. Hopefully it's more stable than 1.2 as I had some issues with that.
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Historically Sony updates haven't been great just incremental updates and bug fixes. That being said, I'm not sure what they can improve on the A1 anyway except the LCD screen and that's obviously not a firmware thing.
 
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