Swimming Lessons for Children...how long should they take?

[Marcel]

Our son is taking swimming lessons at the local Council leisure centre. 10 Week Courses for about £40 quid.

He's been going for over a year now, and has just got his second certificate (10 metres). He got his 5 metres in October last year.
He goes for half an hour lessons, one a week. With us swimming as a family too.

My problem is that our daughter did the same lessons. They follow the NPTS
http://www.swimming.org/parents/npts/ teaching plan (Kellogs ASA Awards).
We recently stopped them as she reached level 7 and wasn't really learning anything new. The amount of time between certificates / levels was crazy. They really seemed to 'drag it out' between them (funnily enough usually handing certificates out just after we complain about lack of progress to the teachers, and just before rebooking time).

Many many other parents that we have spoken to over the years feel the same too, and as we are now sending our son it seems history is repeating itself.
He's just been moved up, after about a year of lessons to the '5 to 10 metre class, and has just got his 10metre certificate (on his back I believe).

So, after a year, can he swim? Sort of.
Would I be comfortable leaving him in water where he can't stand up? Most definitely not. He has quite a bit of confidence most days, but when he cant stand up he needs to grab onto me / something to stay afloat. He can't swim front crawl properly (he could before christmas a little, but seems to not do it at all now).
He knows how to, but certainly doesnt know how to breathe properly.
Looking at the stages of the plan I would make an assumption he is at Level 3
http://www.swimming.org/parents/the-10-stages-of-the-plan/the-10-stages-of-the-plan-1-to-7/198/


Im just thinking that after a year of weekly lessons he should be able to 'swim'

I know the NPTS is concerned with long term development, and teaches proper stroke development etc, but my problem is that he is 5 years old. I'm not bothered about raising a potential olympic swimmer (until he is old enough to want that of course), and he certainly isn't fussed about it. I just want him to be able to swim.

Am I asking too much? Any idea of what sort of time frame I should be looking at? I understand everyone is different, but surely he should be able to swim better by now? (And his teacher assures me he's one of the best in the group because she can tell we take him swimming)

It's renewal this week, and I'm not sure whether to renew or not. Whether I'm just throwing good money after bad.

 

[KIPAX]

Any idea of what sort of time frame I should be looking at? I understand everyone is different,

Sorry but for my money the question is asked and answered above..

But to go a step furthur.. is he enjoying going? if yes then so what.. if no then find another way..

just my thoughts

 

[munch]

Marcel, the question is what are you sending your son to do? learn to swim and be confident in the water or get lots of certificates?

A friend of ours sent their daughter to a private pool and almost every week she had a new certificate. But she was not what I would call either confident or competent in the water.

 

[Marcel]

He does enjoy going.
We sent him to learn to swim, I just want him to be competent enough in the water to handle himself.

I know the phrase 'be able to swim' is a bit of a wide-ranging one but that's what I want. I don't want an olympic swimmer who can do two strokes of the perfect breast stroke and no more, I want a 5/6 yr old who I can take to the pool and not have to keep my eyes fixed on him. I understand proper stroke technique is central to the ability to swim though....

When my daughter went, we sent her to a private swim school locally, and they had her worked up to 25 metres of 'good enough' swimming in quite a short time frame (few months). They concentrated on the ability to swim, not olympic-perfect hand and arm positions with each stroke.
We then moved to the local Council leisure centre (they were teaching similar methods), and after a few months they changed to this Kellogs ASA plan, and everything seemed to start dragging out.

The thing is, we're going on holiday in 3 months, and I want him to be able to swim then too.

Hope all that makes sense.

 

[wack61]

It's a confidence thing, you either have it or you don't, I can swim if drowning is the only other option but i'm not comfortable out of my depth, my wife was a lifeguard when she was younger and has no problem swimming in 30ft of water, my daughter picked it up really quickly, it took my son 18 months, horses for courses.

 

[RobertP]

Guess I'm a bit old fashioned. I learnt to swim by going with my mates to the swimming baths. You want to join in so you learn to do what they do and with it comes the confidence. I went from not swimming to diving off of high boards in a couple of years. Think I'd have been about 10 by then.
So I'd suggest more fun and less formality. Got any friends that can go with him as a group thing?

 

[RobertP]

The thing is, we're going on holiday in 3 months, and I want him to be able to swim then too.

Let him do his own thing. Having a pool to hand all day every day will bring him on fast.

I realise we live in a different world now but when I was learning there was no one there but my mates. Same as anything really, if you like what you are doing you learn without being pushed.

 

[Nikon Ken]

A lot of good comments to date. For me the key issues are is he having fun and is he making progress - the answer appears to be "yes" so I would let sleeping dogs lie.

I asked my wife for her opinion. She was a swimming teacher until about 4 years ago when short term memory problems forced her to stop. She felt progress was a little slow, compared to the scheme they followed at the time. Her opinion is that the main focus should be on water confidence and breathing. Breathing doesn't seem to be mentioned in the scheme until Stage 6! She would expect the target at the moment to be nearer 25 metres.

I think you have a problem in so far as I would guess the scheme would be used by all your local pools and someone has decreed this is the best scheme. So you're between a rock and a hard place. I think it's better that he continues as long as he continues to enjoy it. Having said that, I would speak to the teacher and manager and querry the progress - however, there must be a balance between pushing too hard and allowing him to learn and get confident at a steady pace. He will cease to enjoy it if pushed beyond his comfort level.

Hope this helps.

Ken

 

[barneyrubble]

Well, I think the saying "Everyone is different" is perfect for my 2.

My Son is 10. He's a club swimmer, just failing to qualify for the county championships this year by less than half a second. In a timed swim recently over a period of an hour he swum 3350 metres. He started swimming with the local council, then went on to private one to one lessons, then club.

My Daughter has just turned 9. She's had exactly the same chances with both council swimming lessons and private (at great cost I might add), yet when she swims a length of freestyle it looks like she's drowning.

Some people are destined to be good swimmers, some not. Me - I can't even float, I'm negatively bouyant which can be a real nuisance, so he didn't get it from me.

 

[whitewash]

i failed my 5 metre swimming certificate, it had no correlation to the fact that i could swim and i think im a relatively strong swimmer, having sailed dinghies for years ive needed to be!

 

[wegotitugetit]

i used to swim all the time i got my gold certificate took me about 1 year to get there as i was fast tracked most of time got all the badges but i was a very strong swimmer

i suppose it depends on 2 things how strong they are at swimming and if they just want as much money as they can out of you i think i did something like 8 courses at a guess all were about 6 weeks at a time

i even did bt swimathon in a 25 meter pool 300 lenth's in total in less than 3 hours i did that 3 times on my own

this was going back about 12 or so years ago

butterfly stroke was one of the taks something like 10 lenths and it was bloody hard

 

[Edward Bancroft]

First of all it is confidence in the water, then being able to swim in a way which comes naturally without the need have perfect strokes and timed breathing. When they have mastered that and if they are still happy with it, you can begin competitive swimming training and styles.

Like others in this post, I started swimming in fun groups, and only when I got to secondary school did I consider swimming as a main sport. I eventually went on to swim at Uni. and county level.

Ed

 

[david1701]

When I was little I did those but never massively got on with it. My sister taught me to swim in the pool because we went once a week (or maybe fortnight whatever). I'm not brilliant at it, but plenty confident out of my depth and swim in the sea when I can, not great distances but because I enjoy it.

Mostly stopped sea swimming after we moved, might move back then I'll go again

Something else to consider is a wetsuit for open water swimming, makes you loads more buoyant but doesn't make it a pain to swim like a life jacket does

 

[Samphire]

If you want him to be more confident and able for holidays it maybe worth taking him once or twice a week so he gets more practice and water confidence.

 

[mich66]

A lot of good comments to date. For me the key issues are is he having fun and is he making progress - the answer appears to be "yes" so I would let sleeping dogs lie.

I asked my wife for her opinion. She was a swimming teacher until about 4 years ago when short term memory problems forced her to stop. She felt progress was a little slow, compared to the scheme they followed at the time. Her opinion is that the main focus should be on water confidence and breathing. Breathing doesn't seem to be mentioned in the scheme until Stage 6! She would expect the target at the moment to be nearer 25 metres.

I think you have a problem in so far as I would guess the scheme would be used by all your local pools and someone has decreed this is the best scheme. So you're between a rock and a hard place. I think it's better that he continues as long as he continues to enjoy it. Having said that, I would speak to the teacher and manager and querry the progress - however, there must be a balance between pushing too hard and allowing him to learn and get confident at a steady pace. He will cease to enjoy it if pushed beyond his comfort level.

Hope this helps.

Ken

I agree, I was a swimming instructor.. at a pool near you Marcel, not the one you are referring to I think.. changed jobs in 98' so their schemes might have changed quite a bit since then.. It does seem slow progress though to me, I know from experience that all the teachers were/are different.. the more 'old school' ones took things at a slower pace back then and didn't take too kindly to parents querying progress.. or weren't too stringent in how 'badges' were achieved (IMO) for example giving distance badges for 100m sculling on their back, I think a 'proper' stroke should be used for distance awards..

anyway, am waffling.. I would have thought that after a full course of lessons a child should be able to attempt their next 'distance' and if they weren't ready or didn't manage it then again at the end of the next etc.. thats how I used to work anyway, of course all kids progressed differently so it depended entirely on their ability.. but I would have hoped to see that development?

I helped start the under 5's lessons and we spent a lot of time encouraging confidence and learning how to breathe/blow bubbles etc, this gave a good stepping stone for starting the more structured lessons at 5

of course its entirely up to you if you carry on the lessons, its not cheap and can understand the frustration (i've been the parent on the balcony too - both my kids swam for clubs and squads) it seems your little 'un is enjoying it and you dont appear to be the nightmare 'pushy parent' - that used to be awful to see such pressure put on some to keep up or better their peers in the class..

taking him yourself is great.. am sure the time in the pool on holiday will be a good thing too..

 

[bindex]

Everyone is different Marcel. My daughter was just "so so", she could swim OK and wasn't likely to drown, but no-one would ever have described her as a "good" swimmer.
My son, on the other hand, although not a sprinter just seemed to be able to go on for ever, length after length after length. But if your son is enjoying it, £4 a week isn't a huge cost. Personally I wouldn't put any pressure on him, just let him enjoy it. If it gets to the stage that he no longer wants to go, then I guess thats the time to pull him out.

cheers

 

[mich66]

Everyone is different Marcel. My daughter was just "so so", she could swim OK and wasn't likely to drown, but no-one would ever have described her as a "good" swimmer.
My son, on the other hand, although not a sprinter just seemed to be able to go on for ever, length after length after length. But if your son is enjoying it, £4 a week isn't a huge cost. Personally I wouldn't put any pressure on him, just let him enjoy it. If it gets to the stage that he no longer wants to go, then I guess thats the time to pull him out.

cheers

I came back intending to add something similar to my post.. but you've said it perfectly

 

[Defiance]

Marcel, to answer you question on how long it takes - it does depend on the child as much if not more than the instruction in my opinion. Each child develops at a different rate and will have different strengths and weaknesses at different times (as you will already know of course).

I have 2 boys and they have been taking swimming lessons at the local council pool. By the end of year one they could 'swim' although not particularly far or well. 3+ years on and both are very competent swimmers who can swim very well and with good technique and a variety of strokes as well.

If they learn good technique and more strokes then they will be able to swim better and further in my opinion and they will be more capable of getting themselves out of any trouble they may encounter.

While they are this young they are more receptive for learning and I think that the more you can teach them now, the less they have to learn later in life when it's harder. There is nothing worse than wanting to be good at something when you're older only to find out you have to go back to classes to learn.

If he enjoys it, stick with it.

 

[Arkady]

Forget the certificates - if you throw him in the water and he doesn't drown then he's good to go...

There's a reason we have the expression: Sink or Swim...

 

[Marcel]

LOL Thanks for all the replies.
The certificates I couldn't honestly care less about, I only use them as a measure of how well he's doing. We don't ever get to speak to the teacher (usually) so only know he's progressing when he comes out with a voucher for a new certificate.
I will admit he did start as a non swimmer.
Now if he's in water that he can stand up, he will be able to show all sorts of strokes and kicking.

But after his lessons, he joins me and his sister in the big pool (and jumps in ), and he can't seem to swim when he's not near the edge / really shallow end, not properly anyway (doing the strokes he can show us otherwise).

I think my query was that it's been a year now, and I would have thought I'd seen more progress than this by now. I mean when they teach swimming in primary schools, they do it over a term to a distance of 25m (OK admittedly its not the best stroke technique). What with my daughters teacher dragging it out between levels, and other parents saying the same, it had me wondering.

He does really enjoy it though. Even after the mishap that happened a couple of weeks into his lessons last year. At the end of the lesson she used to take their armbands off for a couple of minutes then hold their head and get them to float on their back kicking. She did it with my son and then turned to get the next one......

He sunk lol
But because he couldnt get his footing, he went under the water and couldnt regain standing...and the instructor didn't see it happening.
My wife who was waiting near the changing rooms just saw what was happening and ran and dived in (fully clothed, handbag n all lol) to get him.
He did lose a bit of confidence for a couple of weeks after that but seemed to bounce back (He used to hover his hand above the side rail whenever he went on his back, he doesn't anymore).

Thanks for all your opinions, it looks like I'm going to renew.

 

[mich66]

aww bless him, that does knock confidence when you go under and cant regain your footing.. good he's still keen to go.. its a bit of a culture shock in the big pool after the little 'un, its much colder, noiser and far more choppy so takes a bit of time getting used to when not near the edge.. had plenty of scary moments having to 'rescue' a few pupils that found that out when intoduced to it

certificates may not be that important in the grand scheme of things but are always a good confidence boost and as you say an indication of how kids are progressing.. hope it goes well and he continues to enjoy

 

[lazym]

Im just thinking that after a year of weekly lessons he should be able to 'swim'

.

Well let me tell you my experience, i used to train for 12 years i also worked as a lifeguard on the baltic and mediterranean coast
when i started age 6 i was doing for 3 years 3 times a week 45 min each time, and after 3 years i was able to do distance of 500 meters. then i was allowed to swim in the lakes, sea and only under strict supervision.
My point is one year of 1 sesion a week is no way enough to think that your child can swim, the child can flow on the water for some time and that is it.
My point is that because ive seen few dead so called swimmers, people who thought they could swim but apparently they were mistaken. So i strongly recommend to keep your child on the swimming pool to learn as much as possible, doesnt matter the costs or the time it takes (it takes a while), it will pay in the future.

btw opinions such as .......There's a reason we have the expression: Sink or Swim.......are just silly.

 

[whitewash]

Well let me tell you my experience, i used to train for 12 years i also worked as a lifeguard on the baltic and mediterranean coast
when i started age 6 i was doing for 3 years 3 times a week 45 min each time, and after 3 years i was able to do distance of 500 meters. then i was allowed to swim in the lakes, sea and only under strict supervision.
My point is one year of 1 sesion a week is no way enough to think that your child can swim, the child can flow on the water for some time and that is it.
My point is that because ive seen few dead so called swimmers, people who thought they could swim but apparently they were mistaken. So i strongly recommend to keep your child on the swimming pool to learn as much as possible, doesnt matter the costs or the time it takes (it takes a while), it will pay in the future.

btw opinions such as .......There's a reason we have the expression: Sink or Swim.......are just silly.

so the only way to learn to swim is to take lessons? you cant learn outside that?


i think Arkadys response was purely in jest

 

[u8myufo]

Hard to tell Marcel but it seems to me they are playing on the money side of things :shrug:
I learnt to swim at the age of about 6 it was in the old Hot Cross Bath which was situated in Bath. After a few lessons of paddling about with a rubber ring, the lady that taught swimming one day left the valve open for the ring to deflate, upon realisng this I doggy paddled like mad to reach the side, she would then push you back out again with her stick You learnt to stay afloat
From that point on swimming was part of not only the junior school but senior as well. But I was also going most weekends to the local pool by myself.
As far as I can remember one of the first Olympic size swimming pools was built in Plymouth at the age of 9 I swam a complete length of the pool none stop, the other end seemed like a bloody mile away

By the age of about 11 I had gained bronze silver and gold certificates, also one for life saving. Representing the school was a great thing in the swimming gala`s, but hey ho! cutbacks have stopped all that
I am just wondering when you say about not worrying when you go swimming. Dont get me wrong Marcel but when I took my kids swimming that is what it was, you should be encouraging him to swim further and build up his confidence, if it is just you who wants a relaxing swim or play about then go on your own

 

[lazym]

so the only way to learn to swim is to take lessons? you cant learn outside that?

No, its not the only way but by far its the best way, obviously you can learn without the lessons, but then you are no match for those who took the training. Additionaly when in difficult situations (strong currents, muscle problems and others) correct and proper movement skills often make the difference, it doesnt occur often in life but it does sometimes.