softbox vs umbrella softbox

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looneytunez1024

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Been looking at the above and was wondering would they both do the same job or is one better than the other?

Sorry guys bet your getting fed up of me now
 
What do you mean by an umbrella softbox?
There are softboxes that fold up like umbrellas, which are true softboxes, and there are reflective umbrellas with a piece of diffusion material over the front, which are not true softboxes and which can't produce soft lighting because they can't be placed close to the subject.
 
looneytunez1024 said:
by umbrella softboxs i mean one of these http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Umbrella-Soft...graphy_StudioEquipment_RL&hash=item2a07fb99f5
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That's a reflective umbrella covered with diffusion material. It's a good price, but it isn't a softbox.

That doesn't mean that it isn't any use, it's just that because it fits the 'wrong way' with the flash head facing away from the subject, it can't be placed close to the subject and so can't produce the same effect as a softbox.
 
Like Garry says above, its more difficult to place a brolly box close to the subject due to the umbrella shaft, which will in turn reduce the 'softness' of the light produced. Also the light produced from a brolly box is very difficult to control because it gets bounced around a lot, rather than focussed on a specific place.

You may as well get a nice big 60" shoot-through brolly, or a softbox in my opinion :)

Hope that helps

EDIT: sorry crossed a few posts there.
 
I got a couple of those 43" bounce brolly boxes from FiTP and I have to say I really do like them. But, as others have mentioned, the shaft sticking out as much as it does can cause distance problems.

Usually though I use it on-axis above the camera so the shaft isn't a big deal. You can see in the image below how much the shaft sticks through.

4498295558_07426415a9.jpg
 
I use one too, a Lastolite Umbrella Box. It works very well.

It's not a softbox, can't be used close etc, but it's better than a bare brolly because the diffusion front does at least ensure that you get even light right to the edges, making the most of the area for softness and the catchlights are nice and clean without the brolly frame showing - even if there's a darker patch in the middle cos of the head, but that's v easy to shop out.

I find it quite controllable and there's not much spill. It's nothing like a shoot-through.

Basically it's like a glorified white brolly. I got it mainly because it's cheap and very quick to put up/down. I've been meaning to swap it for (another) proper softbox but the good ones are expensive and, well, I just haven't yet because this one does the job and I've got a nice square proper softbox.

I'll replace it when it falls to bits which, like most brollies, probably won't be long.
 
I've only had them fall to bits when they fall to the ground. ;)

Already had 2 bend on me, and a 43" convertible brolly.
 
I have 1 x brolley and 2 x softboxes but I have never really got on with the brolley and prefer the softboxes. I am buying some new Lencarta lights at the end of the month (or so) and will only be getting softboxes.
 
Rob_Ashton said:
You may as well get a nice big 60" shoot-through brolly, or a softbox in my opinion
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Theirs a nice 95cm octa softbox for sale HERE :D if your interested i would also throw in a free 85cm shoot through umbrella too ;)
 
That's nonsense! Umbrella softbox's do produce soft lighting IF they're big enough. Also it's a really easy job to chop the last 6 inches off the pole to get in closer.
 
TG. said:
Theirs a nice 95cm octa softbox for sale HERE :D if your interested i would also throw in a free 85cm shoot through umbrella too ;)
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I would be interested but 1 cant afford £60 and 2 cant do bt as dont have the funds in my bank it would need to be my credit card so would have to do paypal sorry
 
The23rdman said:
That's nonsense! Umbrella softbox's do produce soft lighting IF they're big enough. Also it's a really easy job to chop the last 6 inches off the pole to get in closer.
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It's not so much the shaft that's the problem, but the flash head that's right in the middle.

Vulkan75 said:
The answer is Spill.

Umbrella's spread the light everywhere....a soft box has a a more focused and directional beam of light which is easier to control depending on your purpose.
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I don't think umbrellas are too bad for spill. Although a deep softbox is obviously better.

It's shoot-through brollies that are bad for that, as 50% of the light is blasted out of the back all over the place. On the other hand, if you want a bit of 'auto-fill' in some situations, a shoot-through is just the job :D
 
HoppyUK said:
It's not so much the shaft that's the problem, but the flash head that's right in the middle.
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I've never seen that as being a problem.
 
Kaouthia said:
I've never seen that as being a problem.
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Me neither, and it makes zero difference to how hard or soft the light is. Chop that top 6 inches off the shaft and you can get in pretty close. It's not big softbox cose, but it's not bad for 20 quid.

I'm actually looking at Bessel's range of speedboxes right now. Pop up like a brolly, but solid as a studio sfotbox. Much stronger than the Ezybox.
 
I've not seen the Bessel ones, but I believe Westcott make some softboxes like that too.
 
Westcott do, but they ain't 40 quid!
 
Kaouthia said:
I've never seen that as being a problem.
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If you use it close with a studio head, you get a slight shadow cast in front of the head. You do have to be pretty close for it to be noticeable though, like maybe only a couple of feet. It's hard to spot with portraits even then. Not a problem at normal distance, say over 3-4ft etc.

Like I say, I quite like umbrella boxes for regular portrait stuff :thumbs: Not for products shots, table-top, still life etc where you sometimes have the light very close and often with plain backgrounds . I've got a square Rotalux softbox for that. Sweet :)
 
I don't use them with studio heads, but I don't see how it would really be any different to something like an Alien Bees ringflash with the moon unit for a similar sort of effect. There's no light coming from the center of that either. :)
 
Kaouthia said:
I don't use them with studio heads, but I don't see how it would really be any different to something like an Alien Bees ringflash with the moon unit for a similar sort of effect. There's no light coming from the center of that either. :)
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You might be right John ;)

I thought I'd try it - Lastolite UmbrellaBox, Elinchrom D-Lite (which is small for a studio unit). Sekonic 308 with Lumidisc attached.

The worst I could get was about 0.2-0.3 stops of light reduction in the centre, with the diffusion surface exactly one foot away from the meter. This is impossibly close, and even then the light reduction relatively insignificant. You could argue that the quality of the light in that position is different, ie coming from the sides, not straight on, but that would be pedantic.

Moving just six inches further away (18ins from the surface) still crazy close, there was no measureable light reduction at all. Zilch.

Fitting a regular white umbrella yielded a greater light reduction in the centre, almost half a stop measured in exactly the same way, one foot away from the plane of the near edge. You'd never want to use one as close as that either.

I'd say that was a victory for the UmbrellaBox :thumbs:

The main problem, if there is one, is that whatever sort of flash head you've got, it just gets in the way a bit when working very close. And you can see the reflection in catchlights. But at normal portrait shooting distances, zero problems in terms of positioning or light quality.

Because they are reverse firing (most of them) unlike a regular softbox, the light output is very even across the diffusion surface. You don't need a double-diffusion layer.
 
Yes, I had noticed that catchlight issue first hand. Not so much with people, as the reflection in the eyes was really far too small to tell in relation to the image as a whole, but with some product shots I've seen it very clearly.

They were model radio controlled helicopters, with big reflective windows covering 3 sides. Was definitely time to switch out to the regular softboxes there. :)
 
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