Softbox for shooting young children....

[Beardy]

A lot of my photography revolves around taking pictures of my young family and "capturing memories". With winter now here and the summer sun a distant memory I am going to be using my flash a lot more. I've been doing some reading and it seems that soft boxes give a much softer light than a shoot through umbrella which I like the sound of especially with young children.

What I am concerned about is that a lot of my photography involves mobile subjects who don't always do what you want them to do! So I am wondering if using a shoot through umbrella might be better as the light spill will might be a benefit in this case as it gives me a bit more flexibility ?

I'll be using my D7000 with an SB600 which I intend to trigger using the Nikon CLS....have been looking at the Lastolite Ezybox Hotshoe ? Is there anything else people would recommend.

One other question....I've read that the light is softer the closer you position a shoot through umbrella to the subject....can someone explain why that is ?!?!

Thanks

 

[Garry Edwards]

and it seems that soft boxes give a much softer light than a shoot through umbrella

No, softboxes don't give a softer light than a shoot through umbrella, the softness of the light is theoretically exactly the same, all things (size and distance) being equal. I think you're talking actually talking about reflective umbrellas, not shoot throughs - reflective umbrellas control the light much better than shoot throughs but can't produce such soft light because the flash head is positioned between the umbrella and the softbox, which prevents them from being close to the subject.

What I am concerned about is that a lot of my photography involves mobile subjects who don't always do what you want them to do! So I am wondering if using a shoot through umbrella might be better as the light spill will might be a benefit in this case as it gives me a bit more flexibility ?

The biggest single problem with shoot through umbrellas is that the light spills everywhere. They're fine as on-axis fill lights but you're very likely to get flare if they are in front of the camera - and anyway, you don't need soft light for kids, they have perfect skin.

One other question....I've read that the light is softer the closer you position a shoot through umbrella to the subject....can someone explain why that is ?!?!

That's true, and it applies to every single light shaper, not just umbrellas. It's all about relative size, not actual size. As you move a light closer to the subject it effectively becomes larger, and the larger it is, the softer the light.

See this article in the Lencarta Learning Centre. It explains and demonstrates exactly what the popular light shapers do.

 

[HoppyUK]

I often disagree with Garry on this, and will again. Not on the principles he's explained very well, but the application - young children.

Harder light with stronger shadows is by definition more directional. Fine if that's what you want (though I generally don't) but only workable if you can keep the subject in one position, and looking in the same direction. The moment they move, the shadows go all over the place. Kids don't behave like that, and I'm not sure you'd want them to for spontaneous pictures with a bit of natural character.

Bearing this in mind, and considering you have the one gun, I would fire it through a shoot-through brolly positioned somewhere just to one side of tghe camera. All the spill from the sides and the back bouncing around the room will work for you, softening the light further and spreading it over a wider working area. This will give you maximum flexibility in subject postitioning, and while it might lack creativity, it works well and looks good.

It's also cheap (Kood shoot-through for a tenner) and virtually foolproof. Use iTTL by all means for triggering, but I would switch to manual for exposure to stop settings shifting around as the subject moves. Auto systems are more prone to this in studio situations. Also, try not to go above half power (raise the ISO if you have to) as that will stop your recycling getting to long. Fresh batteries always.

PS Your link is to a Lastolite Quad adapter, which is great if you have four guns...

 

[JonathanRyan]

I have the Ezybox. And I shoot kids. It's OK but I find it a little small for this purpose. I like to set my lights close and it's very easy for them to move out of the killing zone area of illumination.

Wescott Apollo works really nicely - but it will block the CLS sensor. If you need CLS then Ezybox would be better.

FWIW I don't particularly like brollies when shooting kids with speedlights but that's because I like some shadows.

 

[Beardy]

Thanks for all the replies gents very helpful and informative

Sounds like some experimentation is in order. I think the truth of it is that I will l like the light/effect from a softbox but with mobile young kids (aged 1 and 3) the flexibility that the shoot through umbrella gives might help me capture more images. I like the kids looking natural especially now the three year old has started to put on a ridiculous forced smile if say Granny wants to have a photo with him.

I found this blog which whilst it's obviously only as good as the person that wrote it had some good comparisons

http://onebrightspot.com/blog/2009/01/29/umbrella-vs-softbox-a-quick-comparison/

Certainly on there the light looks softer with a softbox than an umbrella but as the write says that could be down to his ability!

 

[Flash In The Pan]

I

Wescott Apollo works really nicely - but it will block the CLS sensor. If you need CLS then Ezybox would be better.

Surprisingly the Wescott works fine with CLS as long as you are fairly close to it. I wouldn't have thought it would, but it does.....

 

[HoppyUK]

Thanks for all the replies gents very helpful and informative

Sounds like some experimentation is in order. I think the truth of it is that I will l like the light/effect from a softbox but with mobile young kids (aged 1 and 3) the flexibility that the shoot through umbrella gives might help me capture more images. I like the kids looking natural especially now the three year old has started to put on a ridiculous forced smile if say Granny wants to have a photo with him.

I found this blog which whilst it's obviously only as good as the person that wrote it had some good comparisons

http://onebrightspot.com/blog/2009/01/29/umbrella-vs-softbox-a-quick-comparison/

Certainly on there the light looks softer with a softbox than an umbrella but as the write says that could be down to his ability!

Looks like the other way round to me, but there is a difference between 'soft' and 'fill' and with the shoot-through umbrella there's tons of light bouncing around the room that's creating the fill.

Softness/hardness is the transition from highlights to shadow, and how abrupt that is, how sharp the shadow outline is. That is down to one thing only, and that's the size of the light source, relative to the subject. Relative size depends on the distance from the light and I don't think the author in the link is being clear about that. Move a small light closer and it gets softer; move a big light back and it gets harder (think of the sun).

If you have a 100cm shoot-through brolly and a 100cm octa softbox, and shoot side by side outdoors where there is zero spill or bounced light influencing the image, the two would look identical. Or very nearly identical, because in all probability the umbrella will not be filled quite 100% (you can see it's not in the link) and will have a more prominent central hot spot than a double-diffuser softbox.

But those are relatively subtle differences. The biggest change with a shoot-through is all that spill-fill, which in the case of mobile subjects like children, just gives you a much better hit rate. Maybe not the most creative lighting, but granny is unlikely to thank you for a perfectly lit shot of a grimacing child, no matter how good it might be technically. That doesn't mean Garry's advice is wrong in any way and all this is subjective, I'm just saying how I handle those kinds of subject.

 

[JonathanRyan]

Surprisingly the Wescott works fine with CLS as long as you are fairly close to it. I wouldn't have thought it would, but it does.....

Oh. I never even thought of trying I guess the trigger light goes in the same way the flash light comes out.

I found this blog which whilst it's obviously only as good as the person that wrote it had some good comparisons

http://onebrightspot.com/blog/2009/01/29/umbrella-vs-softbox-a-quick-comparison/

Hmmmmmmmmm......

Well for one thing that's a 43" umbrella against a 28" softbox. Forget design - all else being equal bigger = softer.

Also, all the pics really show me is that the softbox gives more control. I.e. shadows. An umbrella will give more even lighting especially for moving subjects. But it will be hard to create the kind of contrast you can with a softbox.