Silly me

[2blue4u]

Doing someone a favour. I agreed to call in to the local high street computer retailer from hell. Yes, you know the one.

Quite a simple job really. I needed to buy the one component that is common to all computers. The bios battery. What could be simpler? I've purchased bios batteries in there before and the only complication in the past has been finding them as they keep moving around the store.

I wandered around a bit without luck. Found one standard Mk I Pimply Geezer commonly found in this store and asked if they knew where the bios batteries were this week. I'm not convinced he knew what I was talking about. But he eventualy suggested that they may be on the Computer Components rack. Although I've never seen them there before, it did make a sort of sense so we moved over to that aisle. It was then apparent that my little helper didn't know where the batteries were and was aimlessly wandering - something I was quite capable of doing myself.

On my travels I spied a more senior little helper who looked as if he knew what he was talking about so I waited for him to complete his advice to another customer before I asked him the question. His answer completely threw me. They haven't stocked bios batteries for months!!! When I recovered my composure I put my cynical head back on and asked if this was a ploy to get customers to bring in their computers for repair. Nope - the repair team can't get the batteries either :bang:

Twenty minutes later I was in a DIY store buying a twin-pack which cost about 60% of the previous cost of a single battery when they were sold in PC Hell.

If they don't stock such a basic item as bios batteries then i can't see the need to visit them in future.

I thought I'd share...... :shrug:

 

[Joe T]

I thought they were the same batteries you can buy in watch shops, jewellers, B&Q etc etc?

 

[WetSparks]

I thought they were the same batteries you can buy in watch shops, jewellers, B&Q etc etc?

Yep, your ordinary, common old coin cells. I can see the plan though. A cell will usually last some 5 years or so, why sell a 50p battery when you can tell the customer the machine is dead and sell them a whole new PC

 

[McMav]

What really annoys me is their current advery advertising the 320GB external Hard Drive.

Well thats alot of?? woman says Memory and the assistant agrees. Err its not f'kin memory ok. :bang: :bang: :bang:

Though I suppose thats the kind of answer you expect from that store.

 

[Kasalic]

Doing someone a favour. I agreed to call in to the local high street computer retailer from hell. Yes, you know the one.

Quite a simple job really. I needed to buy the one component that is common to all computers. The bios battery. What could be simpler? I've purchased bios batteries in there before and the only complication in the past has been finding them as they keep moving around the store.

I wandered around a bit without luck. Found one standard Mk I Pimply Geezer commonly found in this store and asked if they knew where the bios batteries were this week. I'm not convinced he knew what I was talking about. But he eventualy suggested that they may be on the Computer Components rack. Although I've never seen them there before, it did make a sort of sense so we moved over to that aisle. I was then apparent that my little helper didn't know where the batteries were and was aimlessly wandering - something I was quite capable of doing myself.

On my travels I spied a more senior little helper who looked as if he knew what he was talking about so I waited for him to complete his advice to another customer before I asked him the question. His answer completely threw me. They haven't stocked bios batteries for months!!! When I recovered my composure I put my cynical head back on and asked if this was a ploy to get customers to bring in their computers for repair. Nope - the repair team can't get the batteries either :bang:

Twenty minutes later I was in a DIY store buying a twin-pack which cost about 60% of the previous cost of a single battery when they were sold in PC Hell.

If they don't stock such a basic item as bios batteries then i can't see the need to visit them in future.

I thought I'd share...... :shrug:

As a Manager in 'PC Hell' (and no, I'm not a pimply geezer either), I can confirm that we do indeed sell the batteries, most motherboards take 2032's if I remember correctly.

Over the last few months all stores will have had a reorganisation and the batteries have been moved to near the laptops/GPS units. (And yes you can buy them almost anywhere)

Out of interest would you care to let me know which store you visited, that way I can pass the message on to the Manager, feel free to PM me if you'd rather not post here and I'm sorry you weren't treated in the way that you should have been.

Well thats alot of?? woman says Memory and the assistant agrees. Err its not f'kin memory ok.

And technically Hard disk space IS memory, in the same way that USB pen drives are memory and that SD/XD/Compact Flash etc are memory.

And bear in mind that the adverts are aimed at the mass market, which ranges from people who refer to the whole computer as 'the Hard Drive' right through to the most technical people.

In this case the advert has been successful as it has attracted your interest by being vague.

signed - Mr Devil

 

[2blue4u]

As a Manager in 'PC Hell' (and no, I'm not a pimply geezer either), I can confirm that we do indeed sell the batteries, most motherboards take 2032's if I remember correctly.

Over the last few months all stores will have had a reorganisation and the batteries have been moved to near the laptops/GPS units. (And yes you can buy them almost anywhere)

Out of interest would you care to let me know which store you visited, that way I can pass the message on to the Manager, feel free to PM me if you'd rather not post here and I'm sorry you weren't treated in the way that you should have been.

Hi, Mr D

The person who told me there were none in the store appeared most confident. I think he was a manager of sorts. He was adamant that their store had not been sent any batteries for several months. I'm pretty sure he mentioned "4 or 5 months".

 

[HIMUPNORTH]

As a Manager in 'PC Hell'

Oops! Shouldn't have said that :nono:

 

[oldgit]

As a Manager in 'PC Hell' (and no, I'm not a pimply geezer either),

And technically Hard disk space IS memory, in the same way that USB pen drives are memory and that SD/XD/Compact Flash etc are memory.

:bang: :bang:
!!!WRONG!!!
:bang: :bang:

All the devices/media you quoted are "storage".
I'll explain... if the words are too long I'll have another go... :shake:

- You have a brain (ok - I'll skirt around that one). It can remember things. This is your memory. When it gets full or you have too much to do you forget things. So in order that you dont lose info you write them down - you can then read them later to retrieve the info. That is storage.

- A computer has a CPU (this is a brain). It remembers things in RAM. When you turn it off or Microsoft (other operating systems are available) gets in the way things get lost or forgotten. To avoid losing info it writes it to Disk (or other devices, as instructed) so that it can get it back later.

By your WRONG definition every book in the world is memory. It is as simple as the difference between inteligence and wisdom.

My Mum understands this (ok I did have to explain it first).

Nuf sed.

 

[WetSparks]

Hope you don't get too much of a headache from all the head banging :nuts:

A lot of the confusion comes from the old 'a little knowledge being a dangerous thing', in that a hard drive is used as virtual memory during the operation of the PC. But it ain't really and too many people are a) confused by this, and b) mislead by those who ought to know better.

 

[oldgit]

Hope you don't get too much of a headache from all the head banging :nuts:

A lot of the confusion comes from the old 'a little knowledge being a dangerous thing', in that a hard drive is used as virtual memory during the operation of the PC. But it ain't really and too many people are a) confused by this, and b) mislead by those who ought to know better.

Thanks.
I can do ryhme and verse, but is it worth it...

Sometimes I think we are DOOOMED!

 

[Kasalic]

:bang: :bang:
!!!WRONG!!!
:bang: :bang:

All the devices/media you quoted are "storage".
I'll explain... if the words are too long I'll have another go... :shake:

- You have a brain (ok - I'll skirt around that one). It can remember things. This is your memory. When it gets full or you have too much to do you forget things. So in order that you dont lose info you write them down - you can then read them later to retrieve the info. That is storage.

- A computer has a CPU (this is a brain). It remembers things in RAM. When you turn it off or Microsoft (other operating systems are available) gets in the way things get lost or forgotten. To avoid losing info it writes it to Disk (or other devices, as instructed) so that it can get it back later.

By your WRONG definition every book in the world is memory. It is as simple as the difference between inteligence and wisdom.

My Mum understands this (ok I did have to explain it first).

Nuf sed.

Nice analogy, and the contempory descriptions are indeed that the term memory is used for fast access devices whilst the term storage is used for slower devices.

This doesn't change the fact that both RAM and Hard Drives are still both types of memory, one is volatile, the other non-volatile.

Oh, and by the way there really isn't any need for the sarcastic comments, they only serve to detract from what was in fact a very good point.

Oops! Shouldn't have said that

I'm assuming that by this you mean I should be ashamed of who I work for? I don't recall reading anywhere that it was against forum rules to mention companies, unlike certain other forums.

Sorry, but having worked for the company for 11 years I'm fully aware of the perception that many people have of us, especially those who are quite knowledgeable. Whilst I wish we could change this overnight, examples such as this, however common or rare, do not help.

 

[Joe T]

I'm assuming that by this you mean I should be ashamed of who I work for? I don't recall reading anywhere that it was against forum rules to mention companies, unlike certain other forums.

I think what he meant was that he shouldnt have used such a derogatory term. He was in fact apologising for it.

 

[mrgubby]

This doesn't change the fact that both RAM and Hard Drives are still both types of memory, one is volatile, the other non-volatile.

Spent the last 27 years designing digital electronic systems and have to agree with that , whether it is semiconductor , magnetic or optical it's still memory . You could even say that punch-tape is memory but that would be showing my age


Ps. Never thought I'd see the day when I would agree with somebody from PC:bang: :bonk:

 

[2blue4u]

Fight! Fight!

OK you lot. It's both storage and memory. OK?

If you worked on mainframes and mini computers (as I did) then you can be excused for saying 'storage'. Otherwise try to placate the youngsters by using 'memory'.

 

[HIMUPNORTH]

I'm assuming that by this you mean I should be ashamed of who I work for? I don't recall reading anywhere that it was against forum rules to mention companies, unlike certain other forums.

Sorry, but having worked for the company for 11 years I'm fully aware of the perception that many people have of us, especially those who are quite knowledgeable. Whilst I wish we could change this overnight, examples such as this, however common or rare, do not help.

I was trying to make light of a situation that could of gone a bit "heavy". I should have related some of my experiences of my visits to PC W*** - now they ARE funny!

 

[PaulBoy]

Great thread - I like a good argument sorry discussion - we had the old memory / storage discussion on another thread recently - I gave up & don't intend fanning any more flames here!
Just a thought but there is only one place in the High Street now to buy PC stuff (certainly the case in my area) In the PCW do a good job IMO but all shops have employees who don't know their rectum from their olecranon process

 

[minimeeze]

 

[GfK]

I got my CR2032 batteries from a PC Shop (DCS) in Doncaster. Duracell ones, £1 each.

I bought them for my car key remote c/l but as has been mentioned, they'll fit the majority of motherboards too.

Slightly off topic: I was once 'escorted off the premises' at PC World for accusing them of price fixing (and threatening to floor the manager as well), after I picked up a new mouse priced at £9.99, and it was tilled up at £39.99.

I don't go to that shop any more.

 

[Hacker]

My recent experience of PCW was excellent, as I mentioned here.

 

[Matt]

Kasalic you are a brave man for admitting to working in PCworld, but we welcome you with open arms(until the next time i go to my local at any rate...)

 

[Witch]

Kasalic you are a brave man for admitting to working in PCworld,......

Yeah, but it could've been worse - it might have been Jessops he worked for!

The last two computers we've had from PC World have gone wrong JUST out of warranty. A chap I work with has also had one go kaput just out of warranty, and I've heard of a lot of others saying the same thing. The common factor between all of them is that the machines have tended to be the low-end (in our case e-machines) type brands which seem to be mainly exclusive to that particular store. As a result we've decided that we wouldn't buy another effectively Own Brand machine from there. When this went wrong the other week we basically ended up simply buying the bits it needed and rebuilding. I'm guessing that we will upgrade it as and when required in the same way. I did however cheerfully take them up on their cheap deal on that Seagate ext HD last weekend - and have been most impressed so far!

 

[Glen]

I've had both good and bad episodes with PC World. I think with places like these (Jessops, Currys, Dixons etc..) is for average Joe they are good places to get 85% of your electrical goodies. But there are more specialist, smaller places that satisfy the needs of the other 15%.

I just think sometimes you have to switch off and expect that when entering these stores you'll come across some person who is/can be a complete dodo when serving/helping you.

Some of the frustration I come across is random pricing between the same stores.

 

[Steep]

This doesn't change the fact that both RAM and Hard Drives are still both types of memory, one is volatile, the other non-volatile.

I agree, you are correct, oldigt is wrong, plain wrong.

 

[Marcel]

Well I can see where they are both right and both wrong...it depends from which school of thought you were taught.

I was taught that media is simply non volatile, and RAM is volatile, although still both types of memory.

Mind you this was when things in the computing world was much simpler, and storage was simply to take a backup of what was in the RAM...lol

 

[dazzajl]

Good thread.

It's not just PCW where service is plain awful these days. Go into any shop where complicated devices are sold in a great variety and it's always the same old story.

Wander round and try and make the best deductions possible from the little plastic info cards. Decide you need a little more detail or clarification so you wander round for half an hour looking for said pimply youth. When you do finally get hold of one and put your question, they amble over to the appropriate section slower than a dead granny and read you the same bloody card you started with in the first place. :bang:

The sad fact is that shops need geeks and these days they're all on the internet arguing over stuff that doesn't really matter in the real world.

 

[apodo]

I'll explain... if the words are too long I'll have another go... :shake:

If you want to use human analogies, RAM is short term memory, a hard disk is long term memory, and the BIOS is procedural memory.

Storage and memory are synonyms. Computer memory is anything part of a computer or a connected device which stores information for later recall. Whether volatile or non-volatile, whether access is random or sequential, whether stored optically, magnetically or in semi-conductors. It always has been and always will be.

That there may be a difference in common usage makes it no more right than those who think the system unit is the CPU or hard drive, or the common notion that a Mac is distinct from a PC.

Michael.

 

[2blue4u]

What about the coffee cup holder?

 

[Kasalic]

I did have a customer (admittedly quite old) who bought a PC back after 14 months of owning it, he handed me a CD and asked where it went. I plugged the PC in and pressed the button to open the CD Drive (it had one of those curved false fascia).

He looked at me and said 'I never knew it did that!'

I've also had the 'I bought this Stainless Steel case and it's blue' discussion too.

 

[Arkady]

The Public is a strange and stupid creature...
As Tommy Lee Jones said in MIB "A Person may be smart, but People are Dumb!!!"

I got my fill of dealing with the public when I worked part-time in a bike shop.
One bloke came in complaining that the bike shorts he'd bought (real-chamois-lined in those days) were causing, shall I say 'irritation' to his nether regions...
When he held them up, we could see why...
"errr.. you have to wash them after you wear them, you know..."
He'd had them 6 months and wore them every day...

 

[Joe T]

The Public is a strange and stupid creature...
As Tommy Lee Jones said in MIB "A Person may be smart, but People are Dumb!!!"

I once quoted that in a GCSE English essay. Didint get me many marks.

Its true though!

 

[kamion]

Since we're on about BIOS batteries, anyone tell me how I can change the little battery that helps keep the HP 4150 PDA memory when quickly swapping battery? Every time I swap the battery now, I lose everything and have to use a backup from the SD card to get everything back on the PDA. Thanks.

 

[Kasalic]

I've had a quick look at the HP website and it would appear that you cannot actually change the backup battery, which seems a bit strange to me.

I remember on my old HP handheld there was a little battery tray that slid out and held a 2032 or 2016 battery.

Sounds like you may have to send it to HP to have this done