Sigma 120-300mm f/2.8 EX APO DG HSM woes

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tigerimages

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I bought this from Digital Rev last week and it's going back. Coupled with my new 50D at football yesterday I took a load of shots which looked nice and sharp on the camera screen but back home on the monitor they're awful.

I am absolutely gutted that this hasn't worked out :(
 
tigerimages said:
I bought this from Digital Rev last week and it's going back. Coupled with my new 50D at football yesterday I took a load of shots which looked nice and sharp on the camera screen but back home on the monitor they're awful.

I am absolutely gutted that this hasn't worked out :(
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Hi,

this thread is useless without images as they say ;) :D

Do you shoot RAW, the images on camera screen will be jpeg and will have all the settings incorporated ie: colour, WB and sharpness etc, where-as the RAW images will be exactly that, RAW images with nothing added.

Are the lacking in sharpness or are they out of focus.

Mike.
 
Sorry, I should've added an example.

Example

I'm not sure whether it's the lens or the new 50D but there seems to be a little looseness where the lenses is attached to the camera. Is that normal?

The light wasn't particularly great yesterday and I was shooting at ISO 1000 after 4pm but it shouldn't make that much of a difference. Is it simply down to camera shake as I was handheld, I tried a monopod but didn't like it.

I can guarantee that that kind of shot would've been pin sharp on my 70-200mm lens.
 
tigerimages said:
Sorry, I should've added an example.

Example

I'm not sure whether it's the lens or the new 50D but there seems to be a little looseness where the lenses is attached to the camera. Is that normal?

The light wasn't particularly great yesterday and I was shooting at ISO 1000 after 4pm but it shouldn't make that much of a difference. Is it simply down to camera shake as I was handheld, I tried a monopod but didn't like it.

I can guarantee that that kind of shot would've been pin sharp on my 70-200mm lens.
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Hi,

considering the light, handheld and 800 iso it looks pretty good to me especially for F2.8

Mike.
 
:agree: the fact that you were using it handheld isn't going to have helped, any miniscule movement will introduce blur on a lens of that length
 
tigerimages said:
I can guarantee that that kind of shot would've been pin sharp on my 70-200mm lens.
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I'm pretty sure the 70-200 would have nailed this shot better too. There are a couple of reasons that seem pertinent to me;

The players are clearly moving away from you at the time the shot was taken and the 120-300 AF is slower than the 70-200....this will be a disadvantage when shooting like this (I'm assuming AIservo mode?). If the players were moving perpendicularly across you then the result would have been far better.

The second issue is the focal length of the shot.....you're right on the wide limit at 120mm....no zooms are particularly sharp at the limits of their range. Add in the f2.8 (ask Mike stated) and you've got a real challenging shot in this example.

Looking closely at the image and enlarging a portion of it seems to indicate that the focus was slightly infront of the players....I don't think camera shake is an issue when I look at the infocus grass in ths region.

The slow AF may make the combination useless to you but all the additional factors add up to a slightly optimistic user ambition IMO....sorry.

Bob
 
Canon Bob said:
I'm pretty sure the 70-200 would have nailed this shot better too. There are a couple of reasons that seem pertinent to me;

The players are clearly moving away from you at the time the shot was taken and the 120-300 AF is slower than the 70-200....this will be a disadvantage when shooting like this (I'm assuming AIservo mode?). If the players were moving perpendicularly across you then the result would have been far better.

The second issue is the focal length of the shot.....you're right on the wide limit at 120mm....no zooms are particularly sharp at the limits of their range. Add in the f2.8 (ask Mike stated) and you've got a real challenging shot in this example.

Looking closely at the image and enlarging a portion of it seems to indicate that the focus was slightly infront of the players....I don't think camera shake is an issue when I look at the infocus grass in ths region.

The slow AF may make the combination useless to you but all the additional factors add up to a slightly optimistic user ambition IMO....sorry.

Bob
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I have to :agree: here
 
Canon Bob said:
ll the additional factors add up to a slightly optimistic user ambition IMO....sorry.

Bob
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Maybe you're right Bob, but I see it as a step up from my Canon 70-200mm, an expensive one too and I can't hide my disappointment having looked at my haul from yesterday.

Here is an ISO100 example from this afternoon. Should I be happy with this?

link
 
tigerimages said:
Maybe you're right Bob, but I see it as a step up from my Canon 70-200mm, an expensive one too and I can't hide my disappointment having looked at my haul from yesterday.

Here is an ISO100 example from this afternoon. Should I be happy with this?

link
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Certainly not a good shot but 1/80 at 300mm on a crop body is pushing it further than I can (unless you used a tripod).

Again, you're at the end of the range (albeit the other end this time).

I'm not sure why you think the Siggy is a step up from the 70-200 (which version?)....Sigma aren't renowned for churning out identical copies time after time and the AF speed limitation of this lens is well documented...it's not a lens I'd choose for field sports when the action can go in any direction.

Bob
 
It's funny how that when I asked for opinions on it on here people were saying was A OK. I spoke to another tog yesterday with an identical lens and he loves his!

I've emailed Digital Rev and said that I'd be sending it back. I think I will :(
 
tigerimages said:
It's funny how that when I asked for opinions on it on here people were saying was A OK. I spoke to another tog yesterday with an identical lens and he loves his!

I've emailed Digital Rev and said that I'd be sending it back. I think I will :(
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I've just looked at the Digital-Picture review.....
Unfortunately, the Sigma 120-300mm f/2.8 EX DG HSM Lens has a significant shortcoming that affects action sports photography - Autofocus can't keep up with action rapidly moving toward or away from the camera. People running to be more specific. I missed a significant number of shots when tracking action in AI Servo mode (on a Canon 1-Series body) - all focused behind the direction of the action....

Seems to hit the nail on the head as far as your intended usage goes and that was on a 1-series body....probably has better focus tracking than a 50D.

Bob
 
So...

What do people here recommend for packaging up a £1600 lens and sending it back to Hong Kong???!!!!!!!
 
What it came in would be good.

Ring Digital Rev on their UK no. and ask
 
Both shots look like user error to me. Using f2.8 when there is enough light for 1/3200s shutter and 1/80th @ 300m are two very extreme cases both asking for carp results. I've always been told that you've got to learn how to use a lens properly, no matter the price range.
 
andrewc said:
Lots of motorsport togs love this lens and they move faster than a footballist
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Motorsport is far easier on AF. In servo mode the focus will track a constant change in distance and panning generally doesn't require any unpredictable moves....cars don't weave around and stop/start like Cristiano Ronaldo (on a good day).

A very different requirement IMO Andrew.

Bob
 
Before hastily packing up the beast, I'd be tempted to try a few things.

Don't shoot at f/2.8, remove the filter (if you've put one on), try it between 140-270 and keep the shutter speed within limits considered "normal". Finally, and this isn't meant to be insulting, let someone else try with it.

Bob
 
Canon Bob said:
Motorsport is far easier on AF. In servo mode the focus will track a constant change in distance and panning generally doesn't require any unpredictable moves....cars don't weave around and stop/start like Cristiano Ronaldo (on a good day).

A very different requirement IMO Andrew.

Bob
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Never shot football so I can't really comment. Kipax used one of these lenses for a while before getting a prime, so he's probably the best person to comment regards football & 120-300.
 
Has your lens been re chiped already? I rekon that your sigma lens needs rechipped to take the new canon sensor? It happened when the 40D came out, some of the sigma lenses need to have the new sensor to focus properly. I rekon thats whats wrong with yours. If if you bought it new you don't know how long its been in the digital rev store room :shrug: If you look at the grass the front is totally in focus. Sigma do it for free I believe?
 
Its brilliant for football... however I had to ahve mine calibrated to the mkII and when I did everything perfect... before that.. all pics had a fine not quite clear or sharp fuzzy effect is all i could explain it... when it came back from sigma it was a joy to use :)

I took thousands upon thousands of pics with it... this was the last set I used it for before selling it.. http://othersports.fotopic.net/c1524208.html
 
I use the 120-300 almost daily to take images in football, ice hockey, basketball... you name it. And I can't fault the lens.
I would not enjoy having it handheld... poor lightning conditions and stuff I find it works for me with a monopod.

I know my images ain't perfect, but if there is fault to be found on my images... it is due to the person holding the camera.

It must be agreed that the AF is slower than on 70-200 ... but I knew that when I bought the lens...
 
GooGaBu said:
I use the 120-300 almost daily to take images in football, ice hockey, basketball... you name it. And I can't fault the lens.
I would not enjoy having it handheld... .
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i always used a monopod with mine. also dont try to focus AND zoom at same time :)
 
I had the previus non DG version and it was a superb bit of glass.

Looking at your images, I don't think you had light to stop motion blur, and if landholding 300mm is a big ask.

I bet if you put it on a tripod it'll sharpen up :)
 
:agree: both shots you've posted look like you are moving.
As with any bit of new kit there is always a learning curve. You are damn lucky if you get great results first time.

Keep the shutter speed up, use a tripod and practice on stationary things.
 
Are you sure its the lens ?, I have both the 120-300 sigma, and 70-200 canon, when shooting motorsport, I get the same "fuzziness", with both, on my 40d.
If I shoot a burst of 4 shots at a bike or car, most of the time one or two of them are slightly out of focus, (I have tried with both lenses), sometimes slightly in front, sometimes slightly behind.
I could understand this if the subject was coming towards me or going away, but it also happens when the bikes are on a race track, crossing at 90 degrees to me, at a constant distance.
I thought at first it was my fault, but I can not remember getting as many wrong on the 20d I had before, and there are now many users complaining on various forums about this problem with the 40d. Some have sent their cameras back to have the focusing re calibrated, some successfully, but some are reporting no improvement.
As the 50d uses a similar focusing system to the 40d, the "problem" may still be there.
I was going to send my 40d to be re calibrated, but when I finaly decided to send it, it was 4 days out of warranty, so I will probably have to pay to get it done.
This cuts down on choices for my next upgrade, in a few months, I was thinking of going for a 1dmk3, for the improved focusing, but now people are reporting problems with some of them (something to do with the magnets in the shutter assembly, no problem if it fails in the warranty period, but expensive after), the 5d mk2 also seems to have the same focusing system as the 40d/50d so it remains to be seen if that suffers the same issues.
I have been seriously considering changing to Nikon because of this, but it would cost a hell of a lot to replace my lenses, ( or even the new sony alpha 900, it also looks interesting).
Alwyn
 
sgotwr said:
This cuts down on choices for my next upgrade, in a few months, I was thinking of going for a 1dmk3,
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you can calibrate the mkIII for the lens and i am guessing you will find a BIG improvement..

nikon arnt trouble free you know :)
 
KIPAX said:
nikon arnt trouble free you know :)
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:D yes, after a lot of "googling", there I have found that Nikon have their problems as well.

I have decided to try to get the money together for a upgrade by focus on imaging in february, by then I hope that all the various problems will have been resolved.
I do feel a little peeved at Canon though, they are very reluctant to admit to a problem, remember the shutter assembly fault that "never existed" on the 300d, luckily mine failed after 8 months, so was replaced under warranty, a lot of people were not as "lucky"

alwyn
 
OK, picking up this thread from yesterday, thanks, there is some useful advice here.

I'm interested in the theory that it might need calibrating to my camera because something just isn't right. As for using a tripod (or monopod), I started the game with one and struggled with it to be fair but it's clear to me that handheld isn't easy either.

I've already done the email to digital rev and they will take it back and refund me, but not the carridge costs or import duties (£200ish!), is there a way that I can reclaim this elsewhere?

I just spoke to their customer services and well, I know their a foreign company but if they've a UK number they should have an English person on the end because that was a painful conversation that was going nowhere fast. I politely said thanks and put the phone down.
 
If you've paid import duties / vat then Sigma UK will handle any problems (so I've been told )
 
mrgubby said:
If you've paid import duties / vat then Sigma UK will handle any problems (so I've been told )
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Hi,

a good chance mrgubby is correct, I think as long as you have the receipt for the duty paid it will be worth giving them a call.

Try 01707 32999 for their Service Centre.

Mike.
 
Slightly off topic, the reason above is why I bought my Sigma from a UK company.

No help now, I know, but I wanted peace of mind.
 
Make sure when you are holding the lens, that your palm is not resting on the manual focus ring, I had similar issues when I first started using mine, solved by by holding the hood.
 
Xup said:
Make sure when you are holding the lens, that your palm is not resting on the manual focus ring, I had similar issues when I first started using mine, solved by by holding the hood.
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never a good time to kick in manual over ride :bang:
 
I wouldn't send it back just yet, persevere with it a bit longer, I shot this through glass at chester zoo with a 120-300mm, if you still feel you have a problem and have paid the vat get sigma uk to sort it out before throwing £200 away

DSC_1006.jpg
 
I googled for Sigma UK and they seem to have a "shop" in Welwyn Garden City (or nearby), is that right?
 
tigerimages said:
I googled for Sigma UK and they seem to have a "shop" in Welwyn Garden City (or nearby), is that right?
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That's where Sigma UK is based. Just give them a call, the techy guys are good on the phone :thumbs:
 
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