Should i buy a light meter?

scottduffy

scottduffy

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I have just purchased some off camera flash gear and i was wondering how difficult it will be to learn to expose my shots correctly. Should i purchase a light meter or should i just get the head down and learn to use the flashes correctly? I had a play about last night on full manual and some of the results were horrific. :lol:
 
You need to learn how to use the gear!
A meter is very handy though - I use one - but it's no substitute for knowledge!
 
I think some of the problems last night were due to the fact i had my flash on my tripod so was forced to hand hold my camera. My stands are due this week so hopefully i'll have some better results. I plan to learn how to use the flashes without the meter to begin with but wondered if i would need one anyway. I don't really have £100 + just now for something i could get by without.
 
It's difficult to say that most photographers actually need a meter these days with the accuracy of modern metering systems and the histogram at your disposal, which is far more convenient than any meter.

The exception is for studio and multi flash use, where a flash meter is very convenient for setting up lights and can save you a lot of time and headaches. Having said that though, I agree with AWP, you ouight to make an effort to understand and get to grips with using your flash manually first - you'll learn far more, and you'll really appreciate the meter when you do start using it.

Make sure when you get one that it does reflected and incident light readings as well as flash. A spot meter function would be nice.
 
Have a look at MPB or get one second hand. :)

It's not a case of learning how to use your flashes "properly" using a light meter IS doing it properly, doing it without is using trial and error till you get to something acceptable ;)
 
Matt989 said:
You can get away with out one, a mixture of experience and trial & error will get you there. Light meters were invaluable in the days of film but now you can check the histogram to see how your exposure is!
Click to expand...

Except it does not always work because your histogram is a reflected reading and not an incident one and since your camera is trying to make everything 18% grey your exposure can easily be very wrong. A histogram is only a graph made up from the tones in an image and a classic bell curve might be completely wrong for an image. Can you actually tell from a scene in front of you what your histogram should look like? Or are you only judging clipped highlights?

Have a read.

http://www.sekonic.com/classroom/classroom_2.asp

http://www.sekonic.com/images/files/HistogramsLightmetersWorkTogether.pdf
 
Looking for clipped highlights...although I have a rough idea of what to expect from the histogram. A combination of looking at the shot and the histogram should get you pretty close.

I actually use a light meter, it takes the trial and error out of setting up. Which you need when you have a client sitting waiting but I started with out one.
 
Get a Sekonic L-308s - basic yet invaluable and tweak slightly from there. Some pro's I know do use the histogram as there is 'no correct exposure' and they shoot to get the over/under exposure effect they want. Low-key / high-key etc. Some don't ever look at the histogram. However, starting out you'l find it much easier having the meter determining a 'correct exposure' as a constant and with repeated use / looking at the histogram you will develop your ability to read a histogram and your results will improve.

Learn to use one light first with maybe reflectors / blockers (gobo's) and light modifiers (brolly, soft box etc) then move on when you are really familiar with the light and its effects. Amazing things can be achieved with a single light and most people think 'more' is better! If you can't use one light you defo cant use 2 etc!

There's a few good books out there if that's the way you learn. For me I did a couple of lighting courses and it sorted out the basics for me. It's not that difficult to get reasonable. Moving on is!
 
scottduffy said:
I have just purchased some off camera flash gear and i was wondering how difficult it will be to learn to expose my shots correctly. Should i purchase a light meter or should i just get the head down and learn to use the flashes correctly? I had a play about last night on full manual and some of the results were horrific. :lol:
Click to expand...

Using a light meter is the correct way to set up flashes... I use one all the time.
 
Gordon Scott said:
Using a light meter is the correct way to set up flashes... I use one all the time.
Click to expand...

Using a light meter used to be the correct way to set up flashes...

I have a Minolta flash-meter - since I bought a DSLR it's never been used...
It takes me about three exposures to sort the studio flashes out, if that...it's what the histogram is for...
 
awp said:
You need to learn how to use the gear!
A meter is very handy though - I use one - but it's no substitute for knowledge!
Click to expand...

But the knowledge comes from learning correctly, so a meter is a must.

AliB said:
Have a look at MPB or get one second hand. :)

It's not a case of learning how to use your flashes "properly" using a light meter IS doing it properly, doing it without is using trial and error till you get to something acceptable ;)
Click to expand...

Absolutely agree.


To the OP as others have said look at a sekonic 308 or the kenko range which are good.
 
Arkady said:
Using a light meter used to be the correct way to set up flashes...

I have a Minolta flash-meter - since I bought a DSLR it's never been used...
It takes me about three exposures to sort the studio flashes out, if that...it's what the histogram is for...
Click to expand...
And it still is.

The meter needs to be recognised as a tool, which will tell you what the theoretically correct exposure is, and you then use that info to set whichever aperture is needed to get the result that YOU want onto your camera
The histogram is another tool and it has its uses, but it's nowhere near as quick, informative or precise as a meter
 
Meters - waste of time - rarely used one in the studio and never with OCF outdoors. Just takes a couple of test shots and you're away - oh, and forget the histogram where other bright lights are about, just use the blinkies instead

Once you've used them a few times you get to know what distances & what f-stops they give so it's all fine tuning after that

There - saved you £100 or more :D

But I'm guessing you'll go buy one anyway and then we'll have a new thread entitled "Got a flash meter, how the Hell do I use it?" :lol:

DD
 
DiddyDave said:
Meters - waste of time - rarely used one in the studio and never with OCF outdoors. Just takes a couple of test shots and you're away - oh, and forget the histogram where other bright lights are about, just use the blinkies instead

Once you've used them a few times you get to know what distances & what f-stops they give so it's all fine tuning after that

There - saved you £100 or more :D

But I'm guessing you'll go buy one anyway and then we'll have a new thread entitled "Got a flash meter, how the Hell do I use it?" :lol:

DD
Click to expand...

Yup...:thumbs:

Seriously - I had one - used it all the time when shooting film.
With a DSLR it's pretty much redundant.
If you want to waste time and money on one, fine, go ahead - it's your bank-balance...
 
Arkady said:
Using a light meter used to be the correct way to set up flashes...

I have a Minolta flash-meter - since I bought a DSLR it's never been used...
It takes me about three exposures to sort the studio flashes out, if that...it's what the histogram is for...
Click to expand...

Garry Edwards said:
And it still is.

The meter needs to be recognised as a tool, which will tell you what the theoretically correct exposure is, and you then use that info to set whichever aperture is needed to get the result that YOU want onto your camera
The histogram is another tool and it has its uses, but it's nowhere near as quick, informative or precise as a meter
Click to expand...

Two voices of experience and two totally opposing views on metering. Pretty typical stuff when it comes to this subject and I don't think there is one right answer here. You can use either method and get good results and I bet if I hosted 50 images metered and 50 set from the image/histogram no-one would be able to tell them apart.

My light meter is in the same drawer as my loupe and neither have seen any use with a digital camera. In the studio I shoot tethered and the histogram is useful but more so is the ability to see instantly where on the graph any pixel in the shot is sitting.
 
AliB said:
Except it does not always work because your histogram is a reflected reading and not an incident one and since your camera is trying to make everything 18% grey your exposure can easily be very wrong. A histogram is only a graph made up from the tones in an image and a classic bell curve might be completely wrong for an image. Can you actually tell from a scene in front of you what your histogram should look like? Or are you only judging clipped highlights?

Have a read.

http://www.sekonic.com/classroom/classroom_2.asp

http://www.sekonic.com/images/files/HistogramsLightmetersWorkTogether.pdf
Click to expand...

A histogram is derived from an actual exposure. Of course it's of reflected light - that's what a photograph is. Checking the LCD image, with blinkies enabled, and reviewing the histogram is a far more accurate way of assessing exposure.

All any light meter can ever do is make a guess, based on a set of assumptions about any number of variables it knows nothing about. The LCD is fact.

Arkady said:
Yup...:thumbs:

Seriously - I had one - used it all the time when shooting film.
With a DSLR it's pretty much redundant.
If you want to waste time and money on one, fine, go ahead - it's your bank-balance...
Click to expand...

That I agree with DD is not such a surprise, but with Rob too?!? :D

Having said that, for multiple flash (ie three or more heads) a meter does make the job of setting ratios a lot easier (ie balancing the lights up differently).

But I still use the LCD/histogram to set the final exposure.
 
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AliB said:
...... and since your camera is trying to make everything 18% grey your exposure can easily be very wrong.
Click to expand...

Alison, that's very misleading and not at all helpful to the OP. Old cameras with full frame average metering did exactly that - mixed all the tones down to a single tone and labelled them 18% grey. Even fairly simple centre weighted camera meters are better than that, and modern multi segment camera meters are far more sophisticated as I'm sure you're aware.
 
For one light a flash meter isn't needed you can dial it in without even using the histogram or taking a single photo.

Personally I hardly ever have less than 2 lights in use at any one time so a meter is essential to save time fing about.

As AliB said using a light meter is the correct way of doing it.

CT your right its not 18% grey, its 12% grey at say 11 points for matrix metering, The camera then works out the average of the readings and says thats the correct exposure. But all the readings are taken using one photo sensitive sensor all at the same time as reflective readings. Yes there are some extra calculations like when it sees things that are brighter than 12% gray and will ignore really bright segments but thats what you do when working out any average dropping the lowest and the highest value.

Granted the photo is created from reflected light, but you get a more accurate exposure when you meter the light falling on your subject. Unless you are going to be a large distance away from the subject of course.

Thats my experience anyway, yours my differ depending on your cognitive state.
 
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Diadem said:
For one light a flash meter isn't needed you can dial it in without even using the histogram or taking a single photo.

Personally I hardly ever have less than 2 lights in use at any one time so a meter is essential to save time fing about.

As AliB said using a light meter is the correct way of doing it.

CT your right its not 18% grey, its 12% grey at say 11 points for matrix metering, The camera then works out the average of the readings and says thats the correct exposure. But all the readings are taken using one photo sensitive sensor all at the same time as reflective readings. Yes there are some extra calculations like when it sees things that are brighter than 12% gray and will ignore really bright segments but thats what you do when working out any average dropping the lowest and the highest value.

Granted the photo is created from reflected light, but you get a more accurate exposure when you meter the light falling on your subject. Unless you are going to be a large distance away from the subject of course.

Thats my experience anyway, yours my differ depending on your cognitive state.
Click to expand...

There's a bit more to matrix/evaluative metering than that. A typical system takes dozens of readings from all over the frame. From that, it not only knows the average brightness, it also knows the dynamic range, where the light and dark places are, and what area of the frame they occupy.

From that information they can usually estimate an accurate exposure instantly that would take a skilled photographer a very long time with a narrow-angle spot meter.

An incident meter reading works well for slide film, but is certainly not the best way to expose negative film, or digital. When I compare incident readings to the exposure I ultimately set from checking the histogram and blinkies, I always get under exposure. With some subjects, and using expose to the right technique, I have found it to be up to three stops adrift :eek:
 
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Light / flash meters are an invaluable tool for measuring flash consistency and drop off, not something you are really going to notice unless you shoot tethered

Light/ Flash meters are also useful for knowing you lit the background 1 or 2 stops brighter than the subject.

light / Flash meters are also useful in the situation where you are using studio lighting to illuminate a large room, or the speakers position at a conference...

Light meters are really useful at helping you untangle exposure issues. if you have a tool where you can actually go measure - you then have the info to start to sit and calculate

Yes there is the histogram, yes there is chiming.. but sometimes - bright sunny day, abysmal weather - that's not an option
 
HoppyUK said:
There's a bit more to matrix/evaluative metering than that. A typical system takes dozens of readings from all over the frame. From that, it not only knows the average brightness, it also knows the dynamic range, where the light and dark places are, and what area of the frame they occupy.

From that information they can usually estimate an accurate exposure instantly that would take a skilled photographer a very long time with a narrow-angle spot meter.

An incident meter reading works well for slide film, but is certainly not the best way to expose negative film, or digital. When I compare incident readings to the exposure I ultimately set from checking the histogram and blinkies, I always get under exposure. With some subjects, and using expose to the right technique, I have found it to be up to three stops adrift :eek:
Click to expand...

Yes I know there is a little more maths than just an average reading, there is also readings take for each part of the RGB spectrum for example was just keeping things simple. The point was more to do with that all the readings are taken at the same time on a single censor and thus it can get fooled.

Anyway Its a personal choice, when I started shooting I used one and so I still do when in the studio now.

What the OP might want to do is get a loan of one and try it out before buying.
 
Well, after five months of thinking I'd lost it, I just found my Minolta Flash Meter V.
So, next week I'm going to do some studio tests and see if it's any better than using the 'histogram and adjust' method I've happily employed since 2002.
 
I have a flash meter (basic Sekonic), but I never used manual flash with film so no experience there. I've used the flash meter numerous times to meter for an exposure with flash, and most of the time it's spot on. Sometimes I need to dial in a bigger aperture as it's under-exposing a bit (I think mostly due to the a reflective subject etc special cases).

Have it, use it, could easily live with out it. Not sure how fast I would have LEARNED to work with studio flash without one though.
 
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