Should Driver like this face tougher sentencing and Lifetime Driving Ban

PaulF said:
Define 'mistake' then as that seems a very fuzzy statement.
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Driving too fast resulting in accidentally causing death/injury/property damage. Minor drink driving offences even if the driving results in injurt/death (say 10mg above the limit).

Just my view, probably a minority one. I always favour lienieny if the resultant consequence was not intended.
 
simonblue said:
So my point being is this driver killed some little boy,let's look at the facts of this case.
1/ He didn't even have the guts to admit he was anyway in the wrong over this boys death,he put in an not guilty plead.
2/He didn't even attempt to brake after he hit the boy,he lost control of the car further down the road and cashed into an parked car,which to me mean he was trying to do an hit and run.

I still think at least 10years an a lifetime driving ban.
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....and lets not forget that he had his own parents in the car! :rolleyes:
 
ST4 said:
Driving too fast resulting in accidentally causing death/injury/property damage. Minor drink driving offences even if the driving results in injurt/death (say 10mg above the limit).

Just my view, probably a minority one. I always favour lienieny if the resultant consequence was not intended.
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But it's not a mistake,it's a choice you make when you drive to fast or drink & drive etc,or do you really believe drivers are above the law

I think a little stint of putting people into body bags or maybe seeing your loved ones dying in front of your eyes,because someone thought the laws about driving we're not made for them their above them.
But maybe not just give the diver a good old cuddle,tell him it's just a mistake as someone taking of somebody you love in a body bag
 
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ST4 said:
Driving too fast resulting in accidentally causing death/injury/property damage. Minor drink driving offences even if the driving results in injurt/death (say 10mg above the limit).

Just my view, probably a minority one. I always favour lienieny if the resultant consequence was not intended.
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No such thing.
 
simonblue said:
But you did,and that person died because of your actions that under the law you weren't suppose to be doing.
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Unintended though. Big difference between deliberately running someone over by mounting a pavement to strike them with the car, stabbing them etc than hitting them after driving too fast and losing control.
 
ST4 said:
Driving too fast resulting in accidentally causing death/injury/property damage. Minor drink driving offences even if the driving results in injurt/death (say 10mg above the limit).

Just my view, probably a minority one. I always favour lienieny if the resultant consequence was not intended.
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:thinking: you need help, possibly professional.
 
ST4 said:
Unintended though. Big difference between deliberately running someone over by mounting a pavement to strike them with the car, stabbing them etc than hitting them after driving too fast and losing control.
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Just one ? do you speed or drink & drive
 
ST4 said:
What don't tell me you didn't wind up that lambo a bit ;)
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I'll be honest, I didn't. It was like sitting on a rumbling volcano with flappy paddles. It looks like the starship enterprise in there. It's about forty feet wide and you're so low it feels like there's just a thin bitof orange leather between your arse and the tarmac.

Yes I can honestly say I've driven it...BUT I'm in no hurry to do so again.

And let's not even talk about getting in and out of it :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
 
viv1969 said:
I'll be honest, I didn't. It was like sitting on a rumbling volcano with flappy paddles. It looks like the starship enterprise in there. It's about forty feet wide and you're so low it feels like there's just a thin bitof orange leather between your arse and the tarmac.

Yes I can honestly say I've driven it...BUT I'm in no hurry to do so again.

And let's not even talk about getting in and out of it :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
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It sounds just great. Really great despite your best attempts to make it sound bad, I just think they are bad ass cars. I'd love one for fun and just to have.

I am thinking this sort of thing for post ban life, quiet, comfortable and spacious.

http://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/audi/a8/audi-a8-tdi-quattro-dpf-sport/2336523
 
viv1969 said:
And let's not even talk about getting in and out of it :ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO::ROFLMAO:
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Not changed a a lot since my youth then Ruth and I struggled then too.
Turned down the offer to go for a spin in gorgeous ice blue countach with matching leather
interior as I think I would have had to stay in it for life :LOL::ROFLMAO:
 
ST4 said:
I assume that is meant to be offensive. However, I do not need a bloke on the web to validate my sanity.
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Not meant to be offensive, just my opinion based on what you portray to be your opinion/beliefs in this thread.
Ie. it's ok to drink and drive provided it's not by too much (about 30% over the limit in your example). Doesn't matter how over the limit someone is they are deemed not capable of driving, that translates to not safe, a danger to themselves and others, etc etc. But no, according to you it would just be a 'mistake' when said drink driver kills another person be that another driver/occupant of car/pedestrian and a quick pat on the back or a bit of a hug and all we be well, just sleep it off and carry on again tomorrow as everyone makes mistakes now and then, right.

What was the drivers mistake here, driving at over 60mph in a 30mph zone? failing to brake? crashing before he could get away (hit and run maybe)? not paying enough attention to what was happening around/ahead of him?
The decision he made to drive double the limit was not a mistake, he chose to do that. Also appears he chose to try and keep on driving away from the scene before he crashed further down the road.

Did he know the risk of driving at that speed in a built up area, can't be sure that he did but ignorance is no defence.

Perhaps you'll appreciate the risks others take with your children more if you ever have your own and at that point your opinion may change.
 
Listen, he sped, lost control. That is the crime. Dangerous driving, he caused a death by driving dangerously so was charged with causing death by dangerous driving.

Everyone has a right to a second chance, it was not a deliberate killing. I hope the driver learns from his mistakes and when they drive again they do safely. If they do, what is the harm done?
 
PaulF said:
Not meant to be offensive, just my opinion based on what you portray to be your opinion/beliefs in this thread.
Ie. it's ok to drink and drive provided it's not by too much (about 30% over the limit in your example). Doesn't matter how over the limit someone is they are deemed not capable of driving, that translates to not safe, a danger to themselves and others, etc etc. But no, according to you it would just be a 'mistake' when said drink driver kills another person be that another driver/occupant of car/pedestrian and a quick pat on the back or a bit of a hug and all we be well, just sleep it off and carry on again tomorrow as everyone makes mistakes now and then, right.

What was the drivers mistake here, driving at over 60mph in a 30mph zone? failing to brake? crashing before he could get away (hit and run maybe)? not paying enough attention to what was happening around/ahead of him?
The decision he made to drive double the limit was not a mistake, he chose to do that. Also appears he chose to try and keep on driving away from the scene before he crashed further down the road.

Did he know the risk of driving at that speed in a built up area, can't be sure that he did but ignorance is no defence.

Perhaps you'll appreciate the risks others take with your children more if you ever have your own and at that point your opinion may change.
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I just said they should be non jailable offences, not ok, just non jailable. Fines/bans/community service are IMHO fine for drink drivers/dangerous drivers. Prison is for nonces/rapists/murderers IMHO not speeding/drunk motorists.
 
ST4 said:
Listen, he sped, lost control. That is the crime. Dangerous driving, he caused a death by driving dangerously so was charged with causing death by dangerous driving.

Everyone has a right to a second chance, it was not a deliberate killing. I hope the driver learns from his mistakes and when they drive again they do safely. If they do, what is the harm done?
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He has still killed a five year old child, an ordeal that the parents will likely never recover from.

You are a complete jackass trying to justify his low sentence. He deserves a lot longer. Leniency only send one message: "In the UK, you get off lightly"... He'll be back out on the roads doing the same thing again in no time.
 
ST4 said:
I just said they should be non jailable offences, not ok, just non jailable. Fines/bans/community service are IMHO fine for drink drivers/dangerous drivers. Prison is for nonces/rapists/murderers IMHO not speeding/drunk motorists.
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Yep, I can see that working.
The threat of jail didn't make him think it was a bad idea but you think a fine/ban/community service would prevent him, at least while he's locked away he can't hurt any other innocent people.
I hope he spends his time away reflecting on what he did and the pain that has caused, and will keep on causing for the rest of the family's lives, and come out a better person. Judging by his attitude outside court I'm not putting any money on it.
 
Eddzz!! said:
He has still killed a five year old child, an ordeal that the parents will likely never recover from.

You are a complete jackass trying to justify his low sentence. He deserves a lot longer. Leniency only send one message: "In the UK, you get off lightly"... He'll be back out on the roads doing the same thing again in no time.
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Huh. So the court and judges are all wrong. He IMHO didn't get off lightly, jail (2 years) and ban for a moment of silliness.

The sentence fits the crime of causing a death, un-intentionally, through bad driving.

Would you say if he was caught speeding at 61mph in a 30mph limit he deserves 2 years in Jail or is just because he hit a child?
 
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PaulF said:
Yep, I can see that working.
The threat of jail didn't make him think it was a bad idea but you think a fine/ban/community service would prevent him, at least while he's locked away he can't hurt any other innocent people.
I hope he spends his time away reflecting on what he did and the pain that has caused, and will keep on causing for the rest of the family's lives, and come out a better person. Judging by his attitude outside court I'm not putting any money on it.
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If the threat of jail doesn't work, why use it. What makes you think a) he will hurt innocent people - the driving ban see's to that. b) he'd drive like that again. He has got 2 minor motoring convictions and a minor drug one, this isn't Fred West.
 
For this offense, the sentence he received isn't low. Yes it's way below the maximum possible, but the majority are.
 
ST4 said:
Huh. So the court and judges are all wrong. He IMHO didn't get off lightly, jail (2 years) and ban for a moment of silliness.

The sentence fits the crime of causing a death, un-intentionally, through bad driving.

Would you say if he was caught speeding at 61mph in a 30mph limit he deserves 2 years in Jail or is just because he hit a child?
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Silliness? 'Just' because he hit a child (and killed him)? i can't decide whether you are on a wind up mission or you really are a ..... (I'll leave that for others to fill in with a suitable description).
 
ST4 said:
Listen, he sped, lost control.
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No, he didn't lose control, he didn't even brake. He crashed after he'd hit the boy while trying to leave the scene possibly.
 
Those poor parents lost their beloved child. It wouldn't matter if you burned the speeding waste of oxygen at the stake, this little boy remains dead.

Should this man have received a custodial sentence? Absolutely.

In my opinion he should never drive again. Permanent ban...accompanied by the stipulation that if he is ever caught driving while banned, then he's back to prison for a considerably more lengthy stretch. That way, if hw winds up back inside, it is 100% by his own choice.
 
ST4 said:
Would you say if he was caught speeding at 61mph in a 30mph limit he deserves 2 years in Jail or is just because he hit a child?
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Seriously?
Can you not see the grief and anguish which he has caused through his totally selfish inconsiderate actions?

You do need help!
 
ST4 said:
Would you say if he was caught speeding at 61mph in a 30mph limit he deserves 2 years in Jail or is just because he hit a child?
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If it was just speeding he deserves a long ban. The fact he took someone else's life through his selfishness and stupidity he should get a long jail sentence and a ban after he comes out.
 
simonblue said:
Maybe ST4 reaction is down to the fact that he himself is serving an disqualification for speeding.
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Right because none of us knew that :rolleyes:
 
viv1969 said:
Right because none of us knew that :rolleyes:
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Ruth, when my next door neighbour tried to destroy my car after he had been drinking down the club (4 times over the limit), he was in total denial after the event, but so was his entire family (no longer living next to us thank goodness). They went so far as to defame our reputations to neighbours and other people in the village, making up stories about him being on medication, about me "dobbing him in" to the police and not giving him a chance.
Fortunately most of the neighbours had seen what had happened, and knew the true chain of events.
I have no sympathy with criminals, but some people who break the law and are never caught, see the law abiding people as "self righteous" or "goody goodies".
 
Yes we all know its a very emotive subject.
But please can we attack the words not the poster?
Some of you are starting to get a little personal.

This has been a public service announcement,
thank you for your time.
And as you were :thumbs:

(mostly anyway ;) )
 
andy700 said:
Seriously?
Can you not see the grief and anguish which he has caused through his totally selfish inconsiderate actions?

You do need help!
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But that is not the point. His intention was to drive too quickly, not to take a child's life. You cannot prove, but I'd like it if you could present the proof, that he set out in that car intending on taking someone's life.

Therefore the crime is dangerous driving (its obvious to a careful competent driver than 61mph in a 30mph limit is dangerous) and it has to be punished as such.

It ain't rocket science this. What we are seeing is hysterical daily mail style rants not rational thinking.
 
ST4 said:
Driving too fast resulting in accidentally causing death/injury/property damage. Minor drink driving offences even if the driving results in injurt/death (say 10mg above the limit).

Just my view, probably a minority one. I always favour lienieny if the resultant consequence was not intended.
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None of those are "mistakes". They are all cases of the driver selfishly putting their own comfort/convenience before other people's safety. To me a car is a dangerous piece of machinery and people do not have some god given right to drive even if they have shown themselves to be selfish/careless drivers.
 
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