School sports day help.

Phil Young

Phil Young

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Folks,

I'm taking photographs of my Niece tomorrow at her sports day (senior school) and I wanted to know the deal with the data protection act and taking shots of the other competitors.

As far as I can see, one line tells me it's a public place so permission is not needed but then there is a however that suggests otherwise!

Anyone know the deal here??
 
There in noting in the Data Protection Act that is relevant in anyway and thus is a non issue.

If your in a public place no legal permission is need at all just shoot away, but if on private land then you'll need to ask the land owner if your ok taking photos, again you do not need permission of any people you may photography.
 
Phil Young said:
Folks,

I'm taking photographs of my Niece tomorrow at her sports day (senior school) and I wanted to know the deal with the data protection act and taking shots of the other competitors.

As far as I can see, one line tells me it's a public place so permission is not needed but then there is a however that suggests otherwise!

Anyone know the deal here??
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To begin with, a school is very much not a public place, and the data protection act doesn't come into it.

Ring the school and ask what their policy is.
 
you will need to talk to the school - and it maybe you need permission from all the childrens present legal guardian - not an expert here - but i know there have been these issues with hockey matches and photos - it can get very complicated

school would be the first port of call to discuss

how old are the children

and what makes you think its a public place ?
 
If the school (ask headmaster/mistress) say its ok to take pictures that's all you need.
 
The school will have a record on their MIS (e.g. SIMS) of any students who's parents have asked not to have their photo taken at any time. Obviously this cannot be overlooked. As Jon said, you have to check with the school.

I work in a school's IT Dept. and have an increasing role in taking photos for different school activities, and the above situation does make it bloody awkward at times!
 
etaf said:
and it maybe you need permission from all the childrens present legal guardian.
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This myth must be dispelled.


The only problem you could face is if the school just says no. It's not a public place so you would have to respect their decision. (Well, you don't if you don't want too :D but you could face problems further on and it might just be good to keep them on side)

Data protection has nothing applicable to your situation.


If you ring the school and you get the go ahead but some parents object on the day, take photographs of them too* :)

*May cause excess grief later on.
 
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jon ryan said:
To begin with, a school is very much not a public place, and the data protection act doesn't come into it.

Ring the school and ask what their policy is.
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I never took part on a School sports day in a school, instead a nearby public field.
 
This myth must be dispelled.
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well it has happened for some matches that wanted to be photographed - but that may have been the organisers being difficult , i wanted to photograph my son and also my niece at different events and have been told this -
 
etaf said:
well it has happened for some matches that wanted to be photographed - but that may have been the organisers being difficult , i wanted to photograph my son and also my niece at different events and have been told this -
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I don't doubt you!

Yes, this is because the organisers are talking out of their ... :thinking: face.
 
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Thanks - I will be in a better position in the future now to push harder
 
Pieface said:
I never took part on a School sports day in a school, instead a nearby public field.
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I can pretty much guarantee you that somebody owned the field; ergo it's private land with public access.
 
etaf said:
Thanks - I will be in a better position in the future now to push harder
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The Problem is, etaf, is that they probably firmly believe this to be true when infact it is not and will not comprimise, unfortuantly.
 
yea - i thought that after i posted

If it helps, it is taking place at the local athletics track operated by Greenwich leisure limited on behalf of the council...
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i guess as its tomorrow alittle late -you may just want to turn up with the attitude that you can take images until someone tries to stop you - thats what i did with the issues i posted - nothing heavy i was just told to stop please and told why
 
Places that are open to the public but are in fact private property, such as your athletics ground, have to tell you if they don't allow photography. It's their responsibility to tell you (with a notice, or on tickets etc), not your responsibility to ask. If they ask you to stop verbally, you should do, but have done nothing wrong until you ignore their request.

Whether or not other parents want you to photograph their kids is irrelevant legally. If they take their kids somewhere where photography is allowed, they WILL end up in a photograph sooner or later.

Obviously common politeness etc aren't necessarily the same as the law; if I was asked not to photograph someone, I'd stop no matter what the law says.

It'd be a very sad world if we were no longer allowed to photograph our own, or even other people's, kids doing perfectly innocent things. I know some organisations have this policy, but I'd hope only where there are genuine reasons for it.
 
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Well I spoke to the deputy head today and he said it's ok to take photos of my niece and then (as a thank you I guess) I told him I would give the school some of my shots.

The said it was about the data protection act that I couldn't post images of anyone else but after thinking about it, I was sure so long as it's a public place it's ok, unless you are shooting the police or army.

Anyhow I researched and couldn't find anything conclusive and the law seemed a bit vague.

So here's my plan:

Take the shots, post whatever shots I take, deal with any repercussions when and if they emerge.

All those in favour say "great thinking Phil (or similar)" or forever hold your peace ;)
 
Southdowns said:
Places that are open to the public but are in fact private property, such as your athletics ground, have to tell you if they don't allow photography. It's their responsibility to tell you (with a notice, or on tickets etc), not your responsibility to ask. If they ask you to stop verbally, you should do, but have done nothing wrong until you ignore their request.

Whether or not other parents want you to photograph their kids is irrelevant legally. If they take their kids somewhere where photography is allowed, they WILL end up in a photograph sooner or later.

Obviously common politeness etc aren't necessarily the same as the law; if I was asked not to photograph someone, I'd stop no matter what the law says.

It'd be a very sad world if we were no longer allowed to photograph our own, or even other people's, kids doing perfectly innocent things. I know some organisations have this policy, but I'd hope only where there are genuine reasons for it.
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That's good enough for me, very informative, cheers!
 
post the shots where ? here and other forums or
publishing may be a different issue
 
Pieface said:
I can pretty much guarantee you, that it's public land.
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highly unlikely - even if its a public park it will be owned by the council or parks authority and thus be private land with public access.

unless its common land or a public highway the chances of a sportsground/feild being public land are slim
 
big soft moose said:
highly unlikely - even if its a public park it will be owned by the council or parks authority and thus be private land with public access.

unless its common land or a public highway the chances of a sportsground/feild being public land are slim
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Common land, funded by a charity, with maintenance being done by the council, but charity funds running it.
 
Phil Young said:
I was sure so long as it's a public place it's ok, unless you are shooting the police or army.
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Your allowed to photograph the police or army just like your allowed to photogrpah anyone else..


End of day i would ignore all advice about whats legal and what isnt... I woudlnt care if its on private or public land either... the ONLY thing you need to do is ask the school and go by whatever they say..

It seems you ahave asked the school (good) but your going to totally dissrespect what they have asked (not so good)
 
KIPAX said:
It seems you ahave asked the school (good) but your going to totally dissrespect what they have asked (not so good)
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If the school have told him something that they have no authority to decide (either because he has a legal right to do it, or because it's not under the school's jurisdiction), why is it "not so good" to ignore it?
 
Phil Young said:
Well I spoke to the deputy head today and he said it's ok to take photos of my niece and then (as a thank you I guess) I told him I would give the school some of my shots.

They said it was about the data protection act that I couldn't post images of anyone else but after thinking about it, I was sure so long as it's a public place it's ok, unless you are shooting the police or army.
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Look HERE

Does that help?

Surprised a school is still trotting out the Data Protection Act excuse, suppose this is quite low down their list of things to get right with all the legislation they have to cope with.

David
 
Hopefully this is on topic enough to warrant including it here, I don't want to start another thread that is covering the same topic. If you feel I should start a new thread please let me know.

I work for a company that owns various parks, allotments, historic houses and libraries within the borough. If i take photos of events or general day to day business in these places and the images contain children do I need a consent form of any kind to use the photos in internal publications / external publications (such as on our website).

One of the girls in events says that unless all children have a consent form their faces need to be blurred or unrecognisable. Looking above I think this may be scaremongering or just plain ignorance.
 
Willid1 said:
Look HERE

Does that help?

Surprised a school is still trotting out the Data Protection Act excuse, suppose this is quite low down their list of things to get right with all the legislation they have to cope with.

David
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David,

Thank you very much for your research.

I think it's just because it's children people get a bit funny like "if you take a photo of a child you must be a paedophile".

Thanks again, it's going well, I'll post some shots later.
 
I did one last week Phil,

They were very interested in seeing my Enhanced CRB's... especially when I met the head mistress. After that they were keen to know how secure their images would be and who would get access to them...

After explaining and showing them all they needed, they were very helpful and we had a really successful shoot.
 
Do you need a CRB to be a parent these days then? And what business is it of the school's how secure you keep your photo's?

I can understand some reluctance to allow photo's at, say, a swimming gala, and of course photo's need to be appropriate, but there is nothing that makes a photo of a child any more sensitive than a photo of his or her young Mum as far as I can see.

Do P****'s really want pictures of fully dressed kids doing the egg and spoon race? And if they do, how does preventing photography at school events stop them from getting some?

Obviously we all need to protect our kids, but that's not the same thing as hiding them away from normal activity, including taking photo's to record happy events. It should be a balance; they need to be protected from paranoia and the victim culture just as surely as they do from paedos.

I'm off to my daughter's school play tonight. I was going to take just my camera with 50mm prime, but I'm now feeling like I should take my full camera bag and get the tripod and long lens out.
 
jason7579 said:
...If i take photos of events or general day to day business in these places and the images contain children do I need a consent form of any kind to use the photos in internal publications / external publications (such as on our website).

One of the girls in events says that unless all children have a consent form their faces need to be blurred or unrecognisable. Looking above I think this may be scaremongering or just plain ignorance.
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a) No

b) Plain ignorance
 
although mark is completly correct regarding how the law stands you do also need to watch out for your own organisational policies

for example I work for the national trust, and we are required to get model releases for every 'clearly identfieable' person in shots of events and so on (or from parents/guardians if the person is under 18) if we are going to use the shots in publications internal or external- This is basically arse covering , but may be the type of thing the " girl in events" was thinking of
 
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i use a mono pod at school plays and long ish lenses - never had a problem (although for my kids that was 12years ago) but for my niece i used my Pro1 on a monopod at a local theatre group - and got some great images

go for it - the more people who do it and insist at schools they want to capture these fantastic moments in their children's history - the less chance these bureaucrats get to destroy the fun and actually come to a balance that's correct
 
big soft moose said:
although mark is completly correct regarding how the law stands you do also need to watch out for your own organisational policies
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I don't think my company has a policy in place to cover this type of thing at the moment, I will talk to the person who use to deal with marketing to make sure.

Thanks
 
I turned up at my daughters sports day for 7 to 11 year olds with a 5D3 and a Sigma 120-400 OS and started snapping away. No one looked twice and there was plenty of other parents there with dslr's, compacts and phone cameras so I wasn't worried. The school is very liberal in most respects though and common sense usually prevails. I hope the OP and other members have a similar experience.
 
There certainly is a lot of BS and infomation sorced from the papers (aka BS) and heresay flying around and forming these absurd policies.

I sometimes wonder if people actually think for themselves or are just told what to think all the time now.
 
I have loads of piccies from 15/20 years ago when my kids were at school and nobody complained as I fired away with the FA,winder and wopping great 60-300 lens.How sad that times have changed for the worse
 
jason7579 said:
I don't think my company has a policy in place to cover this type of thing at the moment, I will talk to the person who use to deal with marketing to make sure.

Thanks
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From my experience that's the worse thing you could do, you may not have a company policy now, but the moment you talk to the person in charge you soon will have.

My experience is keep your mouth shut :lol: :lol:
 
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