Rollei Superpan 400

ChrisR

ChrisR

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I "finished" my Rollei single use b&w camera (or at least thought I had). It cracked open very easily, and with a changing bag would be easy to reload with another film. There was a lot of film still wound out, so I reckon there were probably a couple more shots in it. I had stopped after the "shots left" passed below 1, as I wanted a little leader left out for my Rondinax tank.

It turns out the film is not Rollei Retro 400 as I had expected, but Superpan 400. This film is not listed in the massive dev chart (an unspecified Superpan is listed, but is 200 ISO). A post I found somewhere said it was rebadged Agfa AviPhot aerial photography film, specially low contrast. Can't find any dev times for that either. The post linked, written by "gzinsel", says in part:

well, this film is aviphot 400, made by Agfa rebranded by Rollei. For the aviphot 80 I have been using a semi-stand development in pyro-cat HD. my personal experience is these films loose a full stop in speed, so over-expose your negs. BUT you need to compress your highlights with minimal agitation and use a soft working developer. for the aviphot 80 I develop in pyro-cat HD @ 1:1: 200 at 68 degrees. for 25.5 minutes, agitate for first minute then two inversions every 8 minutes after that. MY advise is buy 3 or 4 rolls to experiment with before processing your friends film> it is SOOOOO SOOOOO EASY TO BLOW OUT HIGHLIGHTS WITH THIS FILM WHEN PROCESSING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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I only have Ilfosol 3, so any ideas what to do? And if there are times, should I extend them to increase contrast? Or reduce to avoid blowing highlights? Massive Dev Chart gives 5 minutes in 1+9 for the Superpan 200, but if it's a completely unrelated film that's not much help!

I guess I could post it off, and will do if I can't find more info, but I'd prefer to do it myself if I can.
 
You could add to your developing options by buying some Rodinal and giving it an hour in 1/100 :)
 
joxby said:
You could add to your developing options by buying some Rodinal and giving it an hour in 1/100 :)
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Don't fancy winding my Rondinax for a hour...:eek::sleep: ;)
 
Well, its a stand development no agitation, or semi stand if you want to give it a jiggle at halftime.
I'm not sure a Rodinax level of developer actually covers the entire film, don't you have to run the film through the developer continuously, hence the non stop knob twiddling....:D
Is that your only method of soup ?
 
Yes, it's all I've got right now. You're right, the chems in the Rondinax only half fill the tank, hence the nearly continuous turning (for 85% of the normal dev time though). I want to get this done for the end of September, so It's either do it myself with the Rondinax, or post it off tomorrow or Saturday morning.
 
I've sent an email to Maco, but I'm not hopeful of a timely (or any) response, based on my previous experiences. Hoping to be pleasantly surprised, however.

I did find a couple of times for Superpan 400, not for Ilfosol 3 but D-76 1+1: 10 minutes. Superpan 200 in D-76 1+1 is 14 minutes. I noted that Superpan 200 in Ilfosol 3 1+9 is 7.5 minutes. Would it be appropriate to try the same ratio of times for Ilfosol? Ie about 5 minutes for 1+9?

I have found other information suggesting that Rollei Superpan 400 is the same as Rollei Retro 400S. However the time for D-76 1+1 at 20 is 11 minutes, which is not quite the same as the Superpan 400 times above. MDC gives times for Rollei Retro 400S in Ilfosol3 1+14 as 12 minutes.

Confused!
 
[QUOTE="ChrisR, post: 7060382, member: 52669"I did find a couple of times for Superpan 400, not for Ilfosol 3 but D-76 1+1: 10 minutes. Superpan 200 in D-76 1+1 is 14 minutes. I noted that Superpan 200 in Ilfosol 3 1+9 is 7.5 minutes. Would it be appropriate to try the same ratio of times for Ilfosol? Ie about 5 minutes for 1+9?
[/QUOTE]

Anyone care to comment on my logic in extrapolating times for Superpan 400 in Ilfosol 3, based on the two D-76 times, and the one Ilfosol 3 time for Superpan 200? Is that sort of thing reasonable logic?

Or should I just post it off to Peak?
 
have you found this ->.......For Asia it's called Super pan 400, for Europe it's Retro 400S. Both films are packed in the new single use cameras

maybe it is retro after all but imported from Asia

and this on a French film suppliers site..



Disposable Camera Rollei B & W SUPERPAN 400iso 27poses With Flash

Disposable Camera Rollei B & W SUPERPAN 400iso 27poses With Flash
Contains film Rollei Retro 400S

Development advised Kodak D-76 Stock 12 minutes
 
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Yes I think I found that this afternoon. Meanwhile the Massive Dev Chart says RR 400S in D-76 stock takes 10.5 minutes at 20C! (And also give two times for D-76 1+1: at 20C, 11 minutes, at 19C, 24 minutes!)

MDC for Retro 400S has Ilfosol 3 1+14 for 15 minutes, which seems quite long.

I found numerous other articles saying both Superpan 400 and RR 400S are aerial photo films, sometimes naming Agfa Aviphot 400. I also found some articles about almost complete development failure, with Microphen, on two separate occasions with a Pro lab (but did eventually get it to work with another lab). It's all very confusing.
 
ChrisR said:
MDC for Retro 400S has Ilfosol 3 1+14 for 15 minutes, which seems quite long.
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I dunno, I used to use Ilfosol S, I got in to a routine a settled method of processing at around the 13 minute mark, it gave me plenty of time to sort my fixer out, clean jugs and whatever while the film was souping.
Then when I changed developer, the timing was significantly shorter which buggered up the leisurely method I was used to, had me rushing about like a div, so 15 mins may seem like a long time if you aren't used to it.
Incidentally, MDC gives 20 minutes @1-14 for Rollei RPX 400

What have you got on this film anyway Chris, just bang it in a tank an stop fannying about, if it doesn't come out right......so what...shoot another...:D
 
joxby said:
What have you got on this film anyway Chris, just bang it in a tank an stop fannying about, if it doesn't come out right......so what...shoot another...:D
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You'll laugh even harder when I point out it's from a single-use Rollei camera, plastic lens and all! However, it's for the "Numpty" challenge which ends next week, and it's travelled a bit. I'd do it myself if I hadn't read all those posts about how unforgiving it is, and many folk getting clear film etc. I think I'm getting Peak to do this one!
 
Well, I changed my mind, took @joxby 's sage advice and gave it a go. Mind you, I regretted it for a while, as after loading the cassette into the tank, and winding the film in as far as it would go (with the lid on), I could not get the cutter to cut the film. I have no idea why; on inspection afterwards it was clear the cutter was going up properly. However, after half an hour or so I had to give up, improvise a darkroom, remove the lid of the tank and cut the film with scissors!

12:45 (85% of 15 minutes because of the Rondinax continuous rotation) in Ilfosol 3 1+14. I did a pre-wash, plain water for 2 minutes, having read somewhere that it was advisable (and of course, somewhere else that it wasn't needed). The pre-wash came out black! Twelve minutes is a very long time to be twiddling the Rondinax knob!

I did remember to whisper "it's magic" when I saw there were actually images on the film! Now hanging up to dry...
 
abdoujaparov said:
The "S" in Rollei Retro S is "synthetic" , aka polyester, aka tougher than normal acetate base, AIUI.
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Didn't know that, but it is supposed to be aviation film, so I suppose it makes sense (you wouldn't want your extremely long roll to break in mid flight). OTOH it felt extremely thin when I sleeved it just now. It has quite a curl on it.
 
Despite saying "Rollei Superpan 400" on the cassette, the film edge is indeed labelled "Rollei Retro 400S". Quite hard to get it in the scanner, as it just wanted to curl into hoops. The numbering was a bit weird; ranging from around 20 up to 47! Looks like a random pice cut off something larger.
 
ChrisR said:
Didn't know that, but it is supposed to be aviation film, so I suppose it makes sense (you wouldn't want your extremely long roll to break in mid flight). OTOH it felt extremely thin when I sleeved it just now. It has quite a curl on it.
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Actually, you'd want the film to break! Polyester film is so strong that it'll break a part of the camera mechanism before the film itself (Rollei do actually warn about this if a camera jams), and aerial cameras are incredibly expensive! Because of this it's somewhat rare for most films to be on a polyester base, although cinema projection film print stock is usually polyester as it doesn't wear out as quickly. IMAX 70mm taking and projection film is also polyester as the film is under a great deal of tension in the camera/projector to ensure flatness and stability (practically 6x7 format 24 times a second!).

This can lead to unusual cases though as the film is so strong (I heard this story from a projectionist online, this is how I remember it going): some cinemas used to use a bit of kit to allow the same print to be shown on 2 screens at once by running the print through one projector and then through another before going onto the take up reel. This worked very well, until the first projector decided to jam, and of course the second one kept pulling... as the film refused to break this actually resulted in the first projector being physically ripped off its base and pulled halfway across the room before anyone had chance to react, until somewhat fortunately the motor in the second projector burnt out; ironically the print itself was found to be fine afterwards.
 
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