RIP 6 brave Heros

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Were they heroes? Obviously they were on duty over there, but what makes them heroes?
 
archamedes said:
please do not start, don't even go there.
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Believe me I wasn't trolling. I've been reading about people awarded the VC, and it's easy to apply the term "hero" to them. I was genuinely asking what makes these guys heroes. It's a legitimate question.
 
well while most of us are doing our "safe" jobs and living out our relatively mundane lives. Those boys are dodging bullets, every step they take could be their last and they live under constant attack, from an enemy that isn't afraid to die, so I would say dying for your country while doing a job most of us wouldn't have the balls for is a bit more heroic than making sure your latest excel document reaches accounts in time.
 
As insensitive as the other questions asked about peoples deaths. Many people will spout the "Who? they weren't famous" when some celebrity or other dies. But that seems more acceptable in today's society, which I find a little odd.
 
Aye, the internet is a strange place - quietly and respectfully express any wishes of condolence and "those people" suddenly appear.

Never happens in real life though, oddly.
 
hmmm... feel sorry for those they have left behind - I cannot begin to imagine the voids that have been created....

As to the debate whether heroes or not. Hmm, well I fully support the Help for heroes campaign which helps injured servicemen/women etc, so therefore by that definition i'd have to say yes.

So that's a running total of 404 British soldiers killed in Afghanistan now.... :shrug:

To try and balance it, I would suggest that each and every member of the armed forces joins willingly (no conscripts here) and joins knowing full well of the potential consequences of being in the armed forces.

I'll make it 100% crystal clear, I am not saying therefore it is right etc
 
ZoneV said:
Aye, the internet is a strange place - quietly and respectfully express any wishes of condolence and "those people" suddenly appear.

Never happens in real life though, oddly.
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I am not one of "those people" and have no idea what gives you the right to insult me when you don't know me from Adam. I haven't insulted anyone nor denigrated anyone. I asked an honest question. If you feel they belong in the same group as the VC holders that's fine by me.
 
Lynton said:
To try and balance it, I would suggest that each and every member of the armed forces joins willingly (no conscripts here) and joins knowing full well of the potential consequences of being in the armed forces.

I'll make it 100% crystal clear, I am not saying therefore it is right etc
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I think that is where I struggle. I have utmost respect for conscripts and the general public who were sent out to fight in previous wars, but I am not sure I can class every modern soldier a hero just because of their chosen occupation. Fireman, nurses & doctors save lives daily, but they aren't are immediately classed a heros, yet someone who does something I am morally apposed to I am supposed to, in today's society, class as a hero. It just doesn't sit right with me :( They are brave and they are doing a tough job, but is it always heroic?
 
Ricardodaforce said:
Were they heroes? Obviously they were on duty over there, but what makes them heroes?
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I don't disagree with the question but there's a time and a place to ask it. Just like I've said to those asking questions of people offering condolences in other RIP threads, if you want to start the discussion of brandishing all soldiers as heroes perhaps do so in a thread intended for the purpose rather than sidetracking one trying to be respectful and offering condolences in their own small gesture. Equally, it's been allowed to persist in other threads so perhaps it should stay here too :)
 
TriggerHappy said:
I don't disagree with the question but there's a time and a place to ask it. Just like I've said to those asking questions of people offering condolences in other RIP threads, if you want to start the discussion of brandishing all soldiers as heroes perhaps do so in a thread intended for the purpose rather than sidetracking one trying to be respectful and offering condolences in their own small gesture. Equally, it's been allowed to persist in other threads so perhaps it should stay here too :)
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Yeah you have a point there, and therefore I apologise for my above posts.
 
When fighting in war you can either live a legend or die a hero.
 
Jimmy_Lemon said:
Yeah you have a point there, and therefore I apologise for my above posts.
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Don't. They were well written and well thought out. Likewise Ricardo has every right to ask his question.


The vast majority of soldiers are brave ( or some of us were actually just too thick) in one way or another, but they are certainly not all heroes- which has become a massively overused word.

Most soldiers will reiterate this in one way or another as they are just doing their job; albeit a ****** one, with the occasional adrenaline rush thrown in.

Likewise most current and ex military realise that there will be a popularity fade off at some stage, and that the 'hero factor' will become wearing- especially if those in green (or MTP) push it too hard, or even at all.

It's not that long ago that we were suffering a similar attrition rate in NI, and the public perception of squaddies back then was very different.
 
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Ricardodaforce said:
I am not one of "those people" and have no idea what gives you the right to insult me when you don't know me from Adam. I haven't insulted anyone nor denigrated anyone. I asked an honest question. If you feel they belong in the same group as the VC holders that's fine by me.
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Read Triggerhappy's post above. Let me know when you figure it out.
 
I will Refrain from using the word again sorry to offend anyone. i started the thread as a sign of respect now i wish i had not. but hay ho you live and learn.
 
How about six brave soilders? Would that suit everyone? Before this thread turns into something that the OP only intended to be a respectful, emotional statement of 6 young men who have lossed there lives in war.
 
gumbo-67 said:
I will Refrain from using the word again sorry to offend anyone. i started the thread as a sign of respect now i wish i had not. but hay ho you live and learn.
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It's not your fault and I fear that even without the word "heroes" the thread would've still lost it's sentiment and purpose sooner or later (probably sooner), and found its way on to some debate or other.
 
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Vantage said:
How about six brave soilders? Would that suit everyone? Before this thread turns into something that the OP only intended to be a respectful, emotional statement of 6 young men who have lossed there lives in war.
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Someone will still find a way to have a whinge, they always do.
 
It really disappoints me that a thread of this nature can deteriorate in this way...I agree that the word hero is used far to often but in this case I see no issue in it being used so Terri please don't apologise, I've got a number of friends in different branches of the armed forces and I'm proud of each and every one of them...

I think that if there is something that this country needs to look at it's the celebration of celebrities and the hero worship or sporting stars :shake:

Matt
MWHCVT
 
Thats true.

Its easy to argue heroism against a group of soldiers you don't know, they are just more names to add to the list, I bet it would be a much different story if those soldiers were your children, brothers or best friends. Its easy to argue a point until it directly affects you.
 
archamedes said:
Thats true.

Its easy to argue heroism against a group of soldiers you don't know, they are just more names to add to the list, I bet it would be a much different story if those soldiers were your children, brothers or best friends. Its easy to argue a point until it directly affects you.
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Yet more arrogance beyond belief to add to the CoD/Airsoft approach.

I'm an ex army officer who has worked with several military charities, and one specifically which includes direct contact with Headley. I've also had my own share of unpleasant experiences.

By all means pay your respects, but telling people that they cannot voice an opinion is in direct contravention of everything that the British Armed Forces stand for.
 
Well I have said what I need to say and cannot be bothered to continue this unessesary debate, as I am clearly ignorant and wrong for caring
 
Wars are where old men talk and young men die.

I was always under the impression that the armed forces were about protecting the UK and not being sent off to invade other countries who clearly had no military potential to invade us first?

So I'd say they are heroes because they shouldn't be there in the first place putting their lives at risk for questionable motives by our Government.


The definition of hero is: a man of distinguished courage or ability. So are we saying these guys had no courage? They've got a a lot more than me, many others here
 
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They've got a a lot more than me, many others here and certainly a lot more than silly men who dress up in fancy dress and torture animals.
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Relevance?
 
Just trying to highlight the lack of grasp of the situation in that there are six sets of parents who have just lost their child all at the same time, and then you come along and start splitting hairs
That's how I feel about it; doesn't mean I'm right and do you even care what I think? So lets not say any more on this as it's not the time or place for an arguement as it would be disrespectful to say the least.



**Mod on duty**
Personal insult removed
 
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gman said:
Just trying to highlight the lack of grasp of the situation in that there are six sets of parents who have just lost their child all at the same time, and then you come along and start splitting hairs
That's how I feel about it; doesn't mean I'm right and do you even care what I think? So lets not say any more on this as it's not the time or place for an arguement as it would be disrespectful to say the least.
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I asked a legitimate question and you don't like it. Fine.
 
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As said parents, brother, sisters, uncles, aunts, nephews, nieces, dear friends, close friends, distant friends, and I knew that guy at school are all going to bereaving now. I suggest you save your argument until another time.
 
Right!!! all of you SHUT UP and take it else where please!!! For crying out loud i used the wrong word in some peoples eyes, this has really upset me today. i respect everyones opinions, will some people please respect the reason i posted in the first place. I chose the wrong word i am sorry for that..
6 families are missing loved ones and some resort to this, remind me never to post anything like this again..
 
Right you lot, stand by your beds!

I have had a tidy up around the place.
lets keep the thread civil and on track from here on in.
Thank you.
 
gumbo-67 said:
Right!!! all of you SHUT UP and take it else where please!!! For crying out loud i used the wrong word in some peoples eyes, this has really upset me today. i respect everyones opinions, will some people please respect the reason i posted in the first place. I chose the wrong word i am sorry for that..
6 families are missing loved ones and some resort to this, remind me never to post anything like this again..
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Hear, hear Terri.

I have no axe to grind and have my own opinions about the rights and wrongs of what has already been posted.

It is a pity that your original reason and sentiment when starting the thread have been, perhaps, forgotten.

You have no reason to apologise, unlike those who have chosen, perhaps - again, to turn this thread into a bickering disgrace.

Whatever your views 6 more people have been killed whose families are now in mourning. Respect costs nothing.

Bitching should be taken elsewhere.
 
Hero - person admired for their courage or actions (Oxford Dictionary).

Anyone who joins the Army and ventures into that explosive cauldron seems to fit into that description without any problem.
Heroes - yes, of course they were. Heroes among heroes.
 
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