Redundancy advice

levihaynes

levihaynes

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Levi
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I've been told my current post is being made redundant. They are doing a re-structure which is essentially the same job description, less money, more hours.

I have to apply and go through an interview process for the new job.

If I don't apply for the new job will it effect my redundancy. I mean is there any way it could be taken as a '"you've put your notice in" and we aren't paying you redundancy?? Do I have to say I want the job but do a really bad job in the interview??

Advice appreciated!!
 
Levi,

1st off, sorry to hear the bad news.

You say your position is being made redundant, do you have this in writing? If so, you are entitled to all the redundancy benefits available to you without further need for worry.

It sounds to me like what they are saying is that you are redundant and through the restructure they can only employ a fraction of their staff which will be selected through interview.

If you are happy to cut and run, do so. If you wish to work for the same people for longer for less remuneration then simply go through the interview process and good luck.
 
I went through this just under two years ago.

The company line was that if I didn't apply for it I was making myself redundant, therefore no payout. The fact that it's for less money may help you though. When I spoke to a solicitor he impied they were doing everything correctly. Might be worth asking the question of your HR department.

Personally I would consult a solicitor, most give a free consultation first.
 
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First off.. get some proper advice - I am not an employment lawer, use ACAS or CAB, your employer should provide you with access to advice and the time neccessary to get it. Many solicitors will offer a 30 minute consultation for free, and if you're a member of a union then now is the time to use the full range of services and support it offers.

I have been in the same situation, the first time I applied for thr new position and got it, then a couple of years later it happened again but without the new position to apply for. I made the decision that the first time it was best to stay in paid employment due to my financial situation (it had also been made known to me the job was mine for the taking - so I made them sweat and left handing in my application until the closing day).. the second time I took the opportunity to strike out and go self-employed. You have to weigh up what redundancy you are being offered, the t's & c's of the new position, the prospects available locally or in your area of expertise, and your existing financial commitments.

As I understand it (but as I said, get some proper advice) the redundancy is seperate from the offer to apply from the new position. If you apply for the new position and get it there will probably be continuity of service so you go from one job to the other without receiving redundancy payment but retaining your existing benefits (e.g. pension arrangements and continuity of employment for any future redundancy, etc). If you don't apply for the job you will go through the normal redundancy process and entitlements.

You have not put your notice in (please say that's the case..) it's your employer that has given you notice. Whatever you do, do not quit or walkout before the process has run its course. Make sure you keep up with at least the bare minimum of what your current job requires.

Other than that.. it's time to brush up the CV to get it into shape to adapt easily to any positions that come up and get the feelers out through every contact you know to find out what's available. Speak to the Job Centre and see what the local employment position is like and what benefits you might be entitled to. The Job Centre gets a slagging in the media, but you get out of it whatever you go in looking for. Even if you're a specialist in an oddball field they'll work with you to simplify the process of claiming benefit - if you're a specialist they won't make you wade through the cannon-fodder lists on the terminals providing that you are confident in asserting that you're checking the specialist trade press independently.

Good luck, it's a ****** position to be in but you'll come through it.
 
levihaynes said:
I've been told my current post is being made redundant. They are doing a re-structure which is essentially the same job description, less money, more hours.

I have to apply and go through an interview process for the new job.

If I don't apply for the new job will it effect my redundancy. I mean is there any way it could be taken as a '"you've put your notice in" and we aren't paying you redundancy?? Do I have to say I want the job but do a really bad job in the interview??

Advice appreciated!!
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I went through the same 3 years ago. If the position is truly being made redundant then you are entitled to all the benefits that entails. There are lots of places for free advice on this.

In the end I took the option to run - the company wasn't my cup of tea any longer and when they can do this to people with 13 years of service I figured I deserved the hefty payout it was going to cost them.

Acas is a good place to start. Citizens advice - CAB. And there is lots of support available from organisations to help find further jobs etc. Any company worth its salt will already have put you in touch with them as part of your statutory consultation period.
 
My understanding (having gone through about 5 rounds of redundancy malarky since 2004) is that there is a big difference between voluntary redundancy and "enforced" redundancy.

If they force you to go, they have to (by law) pay a statutory amount but it's pathetic. If you've been with your employer for less than two years, they don't have to pay you a thing. there are other rules and regs about statutory redundancy, but I'd start with the (Statutory Redundancy Calculator) and go from there.

So what our lot do, is ask for volunteers and offer a nice sum. Then they co-erce people who didn't volunteer telling them that if they don't take the voluntary package, they'll be forced to go and will only get the statutory amount (which could be nothing if they've been there less than 2 years). Most people grab the cash and run.

Either way, it sounds to me like they will force redundancy on you if you don't apply for your existing post. They should be clear about whether redundancy is voluntary, or compulsory for you if either
a) choose not to apply for the new role, or
b) apply for it, and are unsuccessful

It is a bit of a minefield, but your HR department (who should be impartial), Union (who won't be impartial), boss (definitely not impartial), should have more information. Failing that, looking at external bodies (solicitors, ACAS) might be your only course of action.

Hope things work out for you...

Ian.
 
Thanks for all you kind comments.

I just don't want to forfeit my redundancy because of not applying for the new job. I don't want the job.. but want to be carefull where I tell them they can put it!!

LoL
 
barneyrubble said:
I went through this just under two years ago.

The company line was that if I didn't apply for it I was making myself redundant, therefore no payout. The fact that it's for less money may help you though. When I spoke to a solicitor he impied they were doing everything correctly. Might be worth asking the question of your HR department.

Personally I would consult a solicitor, most give a free consultation first.
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I'm thinking that that would be a prime case for a constructive dismissal claim.

To the OP:

Keep your chin up, as mentioned consult with ACAS and the CAB, or a specialist Employment Solicitor or advisor, plenty of people will offer advice, not all of it will be accurate or helpful.

If you are happy to go through the humiliating process of reapplying for your post at a lower salary and longer hours then do so, it will be good experience if nothing else.

Edit - You can always tell them where to stick it at the end of the application/interview process!

Your are entitled to at least a colleague, possibly even a union rep or outside advisor, at all consultations you have with your management/HR dept. throughout the process, this is highly recommended, even if its just another pair of ears and set of notes to refer to.

Your current employers are also obliged to allow you reasonable time during your working week to seek alternate employment once notice of intended redundancy has been given.

Stick the process out, don't quit, jack it in or walk out, unless of course your dream job at the right salary is offered to you starting before your leaving date, even then you may be able to negotiate with one or both employers.

Best advice though is to stay positive, be aware of and use what resources are available to you.
 
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Harlequin565 said:
My understanding (having gone through about 5 rounds of redundancy malarky since 2004) is that there is a big difference between voluntary redundancy and "enforced" redundancy.

If they force you to go, they have to (by law) pay a statutory amount but it's pathetic. If you've been with your employer for less than two years, they don't have to pay you a thing. there are other rules and regs about statutory redundancy, but I'd start with the (Statutory Redundancy Calculator) and go from there.

So what our lot do, is ask for volunteers and offer a nice sum. Then they co-erce people who didn't volunteer telling them that if they don't take the voluntary package, they'll be forced to go and will only get the statutory amount (which could be nothing if they've been there less than 2 years). Most people grab the cash and run.

Either way, it sounds to me like they will force redundancy on you if you don't apply for your existing post. They should be clear about whether redundancy is voluntary, or compulsory for you if either
a) choose not to apply for the new role, or
b) apply for it, and are unsuccessful

It is a bit of a minefield, but your HR department (who should be impartial), Union (who won't be impartial), boss (definitely not impartial), should have more information. Failing that, looking at external bodies (solicitors, ACAS) might be your only course of action.

Hope things work out for you...

Ian.
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They have already offered voluntry redundancy. I didn't take it. I've now got to go into an interview and thats where things get grey. I'm happy to continue on my current contract but don't want to take the now one.

I think reading the comments so far I should be safe.. especially if I say I'm willing to take the job but not at the salary advertised. If they are willing to negotiate (I know they won't) then I'll happily take it.
 
Harlequin565 said:
So what our lot do, is ask for volunteers and offer a nice sum. Then they co-erce people who didn't volunteer telling them that if they don't take the voluntary package, they'll be forced to go and will only get the statutory amount (which could be nothing if they've been there less than 2 years). Most people grab the cash and run
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Sounds like a compromise agreement. - which is often a get-out.

How many people are 'at-risk'?
If you have been told that your position is 'at risk' of redundancy, and have it in writing, it's pretty clear-cut.
Do you have any reason to think they're going to weasel out of paying up? they could potentially land in a huge vat of smelly brown stuff if they don't follow the line. :rules:
 
RacingSnake said:
Sounds like a compromise agreement. - which is often a get-out.

How many people are 'at-risk'?
If you have been told that your position is 'at risk' of redundancy, and have it in writing, it's pretty clear-cut.
Do you have any reason to think they're going to weasel out of paying up? they could potentially land in a huge vat of smelly brown stuff if they don't follow the line. :rules:
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I haven't received any vibes to indicate they will squirm out but I still don't trust them. I'm employed by ***********. I think that makes things harder for them to play funny.

The reduction is from 2 persions to 1
 
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levihaynes said:
I haven't received any vibes to indicate they will squirm out but I still don't trust them. The reduction is from 2 persions to 1
Click to expand...

The only advise I will give you is to stop this thread almost immediately. Seek advice from either a solicitor or ACAS.

Quit the thread and seek some free legal advice, they will give you the best advise possible to help you reach an outcome you are happy with.
 
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